Why do you hate Mike Love?

[KDS]

The most extreme level on this sort of fan debate occurred on December 8, 2004, oddly enough 24 years to the day that John Lennon was killed.

Damageplan, featuring Dimebag Darrell and Vinnie Paul from the defunct band Pantera were playing a club show in Ohio. 

A disgruntled and mentally ill Pantera fan showed up and killed Dimebag Darrell right on the stage in front of a horrified crowd because he "blamed him for breaking up Pantera." 

An extreme incident like this goes to show that these band members we all discuss are real people with real lives. 

I sincerely doubt that anyone on this board would go to those extremes, but it's just some food for thought.  Life is way too short. 

[Marty Castillo]

Iian Lee. Thread originator (his 4th post on this board)

No posts since.

Last active August 6 (about page 4 of this thread, now 25 pages)

Is this some kind of board record?

This is probably the most ridiculous part. Brand new member, drops a bomb, doesn't engage in the conversation. Basically, sitting back maniacally laughing, "Yes, yes, fight amongst yourselves."

[The Cincinnati Kid]

I second that - life's too short for this sh*t. Toodle loo!

15 pages too late.

You guys knew very well where this thread was going to go.  It should have been locked up after the first post. 

Armchair quarterbacking? It's an open forum and will be kept that way. Should the "Negative Reviews Of NPP" thread have been deleted too when it first appeared? Funny that there are and were some legitimate discussions and some historical info put out in this topic that it seems wasn't widely known, on the years 88-97. Some wanted to throw dirt instead. If the issue was with the author's original post, call him out on it.

No armchair quarterbacking, I made the third post in this thread.  Threads made to call out specific members of the band are useless and idiotic.  Yeah there was some good info in this thread, maybe a couple pages worth?  Someone could have made a separate thread like you did with that lawsuit Mike had. 

As mentioned, some would say devoting a thread to reposting negative reviews the weeks after a new album got released and including such journalistic powerhouses as a student newspaper from Australia among them was useless and idiotic as well, should that have been stopped before it got started as well? Maybe so.

No, because that is about the material, not the person.  If Ian wanted to come back and create a thread titled "Why do you hate SIP" I'd be have no problem with it.

Oh, so there is a difference? Do you really think the purpose of dredging up negative reviews and reposting them here was about the material more than it was about the person who made the album?

As far as Ian's original intent, let's take it further and see if he gets the benefit of the doubt. What if there was a music writer who was researching an article about The Beatles and wanted to know why fans hate Yoko Ono? Or why KISS fans hate Gene Simmons? How would that writer go about addressing it to a community of fans who would most likely be the best sources of information, if the purpose was to actually find out why from the fans themselves?

There was a story about a fan of Slash who went to one of Axl Rose's GnR shows wearing a Slash t-shirt, Axl spotted him and went berzerk on the guy. Again, benefit of the doubt, what if a writer doing an article wanted to find out where that hostility came from, or why some fans either hate Slash or Axl, who better to ask than the fans if you want to hear opinions?

That thread was created three days after the album came out, but nice try.  Billy even agreed with the OP.  There were a lot of no name sites that gave it good reviews, too.  

There's plenty of stuff out there that he can use for research to see why people might hate Mike.  There's plenty of objectionable things he's done that have received bad press.  You don't ask a forum, especially one where people claim there's an agenda almost anytime something negative is said about Brian.  

  

[Mike's Beard]

Context? Your exact words were "I mentally do this whenever I read someone say they love Brian Wilson.". A grain of logic would tell me the word "whenever" then applies to whenever you read such a statement, and that whenever you read it you roll your eyes (a physical expression of disbelief or disapproval) at the thought of someone feeling a strong connection/attachment to Brian because of his music. The context of Lana's post has nothing to do with it, sport.

Err, it did because I happened to be the one who wrote it and knew exactly what I was addressing. The love of Brian's music is not the same as someone who feels they REALLY LOVE Brian Wilson. That whole post had a creepy Mark David Chapman vibe going for it.

Err, so you write the term "whenever" yet claim you're only talking about that one specific instance with Lana? Gotcha. And I specifically made clear was talking about a love for Brian, not his music.

I'm guessing you are being obtuse 'cos you can't be that dense. I   when I see people write such as what Lana did. However that post in question was directly pointed at Lana.

[guitarfool2002]

I second that - life's too short for this sh*t. Toodle loo!

15 pages too late.

You guys knew very well where this thread was going to go.  It should have been locked up after the first post. 

Armchair quarterbacking? It's an open forum and will be kept that way. Should the "Negative Reviews Of NPP" thread have been deleted too when it first appeared? Funny that there are and were some legitimate discussions and some historical info put out in this topic that it seems wasn't widely known, on the years 88-97. Some wanted to throw dirt instead. If the issue was with the author's original post, call him out on it.

No armchair quarterbacking, I made the third post in this thread.  Threads made to call out specific members of the band are useless and idiotic.  Yeah there was some good info in this thread, maybe a couple pages worth?  Someone could have made a separate thread like you did with that lawsuit Mike had. 

As mentioned, some would say devoting a thread to reposting negative reviews the weeks after a new album got released and including such journalistic powerhouses as a student newspaper from Australia among them was useless and idiotic as well, should that have been stopped before it got started as well? Maybe so.

No, because that is about the material, not the person.  If Ian wanted to come back and create a thread titled "Why do you hate SIP" I'd be have no problem with it.

Oh, so there is a difference? Do you really think the purpose of dredging up negative reviews and reposting them here was about the material more than it was about the person who made the album?

As far as Ian's original intent, let's take it further and see if he gets the benefit of the doubt. What if there was a music writer who was researching an article about The Beatles and wanted to know why fans hate Yoko Ono? Or why KISS fans hate Gene Simmons? How would that writer go about addressing it to a community of fans who would most likely be the best sources of information, if the purpose was to actually find out why from the fans themselves?

There was a story about a fan of Slash who went to one of Axl Rose's GnR shows wearing a Slash t-shirt, Axl spotted him and went berzerk on the guy. Again, benefit of the doubt, what if a writer doing an article wanted to find out where that hostility came from, or why some fans either hate Slash or Axl, who better to ask than the fans if you want to hear opinions?

That thread was created three days after the album came out, but nice try.  Billy even agreed with the OP.  There were a lot of no name sites that gave it good reviews, too.  

There's plenty of stuff out there that he can use for research to see why people might hate Mike.  There's plenty of objectionable things he's done that have received bad press.  You don't ask a forum, especially one where people claim there's an agenda almost anytime something negative is said about Brian.  

  

So you think the negative reviews thread had nothing to do with the man whose album was released and everything to do with...what exactly? Sharing information? Sure. Ask the guy who started that one.

[Mike's Beard]

We can't, he quit not long after the NPP Police gave him endless sh*t for the thread.

[guitarfool2002]

We can't, he quit not long after the NPP Police gave him endless sh*t for the thread.

That's what he told you, I assume?

[rab2591]

Context? Your exact words were "I mentally do this whenever I read someone say they love Brian Wilson.". A grain of logic would tell me the word "whenever" then applies to whenever you read such a statement, and that whenever you read it you roll your eyes (a physical expression of disbelief or disapproval) at the thought of someone feeling a strong connection/attachment to Brian because of his music. The context of Lana's post has nothing to do with it, sport.

Err, it did because I happened to be the one who wrote it and knew exactly what I was addressing. The love of Brian's music is not the same as someone who feels they REALLY LOVE Brian Wilson. That whole post had a creepy Mark David Chapman vibe going for it.

Err, so you write the term "whenever" yet claim you're only talking about that one specific instance with Lana? Gotcha. And I specifically made clear was talking about a love for Brian, not his music.

I'm guessing you are being obtuse 'cos you can't be that dense. I   when I see people write such as what Lana did. However that post in question was directly pointed at Lana.

Dense? Billy posted the quote initially for a reason. Had you not been so vague in the first place (even in the context of the initial thread) this conversation wouldn't be taking place.

[SMiLE Brian]

There is no NPP police.

[Mike's Beard]

We can't, he quit not long after the NPP Police gave him endless sh*t for the thread.

That's what he told you, I assume?

I'm guessing he quit.

[guitarfool2002]

We can't, he quit not long after the NPP Police gave him endless sh*t for the thread.

That's what he told you, I assume?

I'm guessing he quit.

So you're not sure on whether he quit, yet you knew what happened enough to post why he quit, because the "NPP Police" gave him endless sh*t for his thread?

[Mike's Beard]

Or maybe he woke up one morning after being a poster on here for many years and just randomly decided he didn't like The Beach Boys no more?

[guitarfool2002]

Or maybe he woke up one morning after being a poster on here for many years and just randomly decided he didn't like The Beach Boys no more?

So your claim that he was driven off by the NPP police was false? Which one was it, or don't you know and are just guessing randomly? It would be good to get the actual story first before making claims on why something happened.

[Mike's Beard]

Unless you know anything to the contrary.

[guitarfool2002]

Unless you know anything to the contrary.

I do.

[The Cincinnati Kid]

I second that - life's too short for this sh*t. Toodle loo!

15 pages too late.

You guys knew very well where this thread was going to go.  It should have been locked up after the first post. 

Armchair quarterbacking? It's an open forum and will be kept that way. Should the "Negative Reviews Of NPP" thread have been deleted too when it first appeared? Funny that there are and were some legitimate discussions and some historical info put out in this topic that it seems wasn't widely known, on the years 88-97. Some wanted to throw dirt instead. If the issue was with the author's original post, call him out on it.

No armchair quarterbacking, I made the third post in this thread.  Threads made to call out specific members of the band are useless and idiotic.  Yeah there was some good info in this thread, maybe a couple pages worth?  Someone could have made a separate thread like you did with that lawsuit Mike had. 

As mentioned, some would say devoting a thread to reposting negative reviews the weeks after a new album got released and including such journalistic powerhouses as a student newspaper from Australia among them was useless and idiotic as well, should that have been stopped before it got started as well? Maybe so.

No, because that is about the material, not the person.  If Ian wanted to come back and create a thread titled "Why do you hate SIP" I'd be have no problem with it.

Oh, so there is a difference? Do you really think the purpose of dredging up negative reviews and reposting them here was about the material more than it was about the person who made the album?

As far as Ian's original intent, let's take it further and see if he gets the benefit of the doubt. What if there was a music writer who was researching an article about The Beatles and wanted to know why fans hate Yoko Ono? Or why KISS fans hate Gene Simmons? How would that writer go about addressing it to a community of fans who would most likely be the best sources of information, if the purpose was to actually find out why from the fans themselves?

There was a story about a fan of Slash who went to one of Axl Rose's GnR shows wearing a Slash t-shirt, Axl spotted him and went berzerk on the guy. Again, benefit of the doubt, what if a writer doing an article wanted to find out where that hostility came from, or why some fans either hate Slash or Axl, who better to ask than the fans if you want to hear opinions?

That thread was created three days after the album came out, but nice try.  Billy even agreed with the OP.  There were a lot of no name sites that gave it good reviews, too.  

There's plenty of stuff out there that he can use for research to see why people might hate Mike.  There's plenty of objectionable things he's done that have received bad press.  You don't ask a forum, especially one where people claim there's an agenda almost anytime something negative is said about Brian.  

  

So you think the negative reviews thread had nothing to do with the man whose album was released and everything to do with...what exactly? Sharing information? Sure. Ask the guy who started that one.

Why does it have to be about Brian?  Why couldn't he just be concerned that it was getting bad reviews?  Again, your fellow moderator even agreed with him.  That OP's posting history shows there is no agenda at all.  

[Mike's Beard]

Unless you know anything to the contrary.

I do.

Which you could have said 4 posts ago.

[guitarfool2002]

I second that - life's too short for this sh*t. Toodle loo!

15 pages too late.

You guys knew very well where this thread was going to go.  It should have been locked up after the first post. 

Armchair quarterbacking? It's an open forum and will be kept that way. Should the "Negative Reviews Of NPP" thread have been deleted too when it first appeared? Funny that there are and were some legitimate discussions and some historical info put out in this topic that it seems wasn't widely known, on the years 88-97. Some wanted to throw dirt instead. If the issue was with the author's original post, call him out on it.

No armchair quarterbacking, I made the third post in this thread.  Threads made to call out specific members of the band are useless and idiotic.  Yeah there was some good info in this thread, maybe a couple pages worth?  Someone could have made a separate thread like you did with that lawsuit Mike had. 

As mentioned, some would say devoting a thread to reposting negative reviews the weeks after a new album got released and including such journalistic powerhouses as a student newspaper from Australia among them was useless and idiotic as well, should that have been stopped before it got started as well? Maybe so.

No, because that is about the material, not the person.  If Ian wanted to come back and create a thread titled "Why do you hate SIP" I'd be have no problem with it.

Oh, so there is a difference? Do you really think the purpose of dredging up negative reviews and reposting them here was about the material more than it was about the person who made the album?

As far as Ian's original intent, let's take it further and see if he gets the benefit of the doubt. What if there was a music writer who was researching an article about The Beatles and wanted to know why fans hate Yoko Ono? Or why KISS fans hate Gene Simmons? How would that writer go about addressing it to a community of fans who would most likely be the best sources of information, if the purpose was to actually find out why from the fans themselves?

There was a story about a fan of Slash who went to one of Axl Rose's GnR shows wearing a Slash t-shirt, Axl spotted him and went berzerk on the guy. Again, benefit of the doubt, what if a writer doing an article wanted to find out where that hostility came from, or why some fans either hate Slash or Axl, who better to ask than the fans if you want to hear opinions?

That thread was created three days after the album came out, but nice try.  Billy even agreed with the OP.  There were a lot of no name sites that gave it good reviews, too.  

There's plenty of stuff out there that he can use for research to see why people might hate Mike.  There's plenty of objectionable things he's done that have received bad press.  You don't ask a forum, especially one where people claim there's an agenda almost anytime something negative is said about Brian.  

  

So you think the negative reviews thread had nothing to do with the man whose album was released and everything to do with...what exactly? Sharing information? Sure. Ask the guy who started that one.

Why does it have to be about Brian?  Why couldn't he just be concerned that it was getting bad reviews?  Again, your fellow moderator even agreed with him.  That OP's posting history shows there is no agenda at all.  

That's hilarious.

[guitarfool2002]

Unless you know anything to the contrary.

I do.

Which you could have said 4 posts ago.

So now it's on me when you're claiming to know things you don't even know about? So first it was the NPP police driving someone off the board, but now it's different? You really don't know, so why try to make an issue out of something in the first place? If you didn't mention this "NPP Police" nonsense, none of it would have happened 5 posts ago or whatever.

[Mike's Beard]

Unless you know anything to the contrary.

I do.

Which you could have said 4 posts ago.

So now it's on me when you're claiming to know things you don't even know about? So first it was the NPP police driving someone off the board, but now it's different? You really don't know, so why try to make an issue out of something in the first place? If you didn't mention this "NPP Police" nonsense, none of it would have happened 5 posts ago or whatever.

I never actually said anyone drove anybody off the board.

[guitarfool2002]

Unless you know anything to the contrary.

I do.

Which you could have said 4 posts ago.

So now it's on me when you're claiming to know things you don't even know about? So first it was the NPP police driving someone off the board, but now it's different? You really don't know, so why try to make an issue out of something in the first place? If you didn't mention this "NPP Police" nonsense, none of it would have happened 5 posts ago or whatever.

I never actually said anyone drove anybody off the board.

What was this?

We can't, he quit not long after the NPP Police gave him endless sh*t for the thread.

[The Cincinnati Kid]

I second that - life's too short for this sh*t. Toodle loo!

15 pages too late.

You guys knew very well where this thread was going to go.  It should have been locked up after the first post.  

Armchair quarterbacking? It's an open forum and will be kept that way. Should the "Negative Reviews Of NPP" thread have been deleted too when it first appeared? Funny that there are and were some legitimate discussions and some historical info put out in this topic that it seems wasn't widely known, on the years 88-97. Some wanted to throw dirt instead. If the issue was with the author's original post, call him out on it.

No armchair quarterbacking, I made the third post in this thread.  Threads made to call out specific members of the band are useless and idiotic.  Yeah there was some good info in this thread, maybe a couple pages worth?  Someone could have made a separate thread like you did with that lawsuit Mike had.  

As mentioned, some would say devoting a thread to reposting negative reviews the weeks after a new album got released and including such journalistic powerhouses as a student newspaper from Australia among them was useless and idiotic as well, should that have been stopped before it got started as well? Maybe so.

No, because that is about the material, not the person.  If Ian wanted to come back and create a thread titled "Why do you hate SIP" I'd be have no problem with it.

Oh, so there is a difference? Do you really think the purpose of dredging up negative reviews and reposting them here was about the material more than it was about the person who made the album?

As far as Ian's original intent, let's take it further and see if he gets the benefit of the doubt. What if there was a music writer who was researching an article about The Beatles and wanted to know why fans hate Yoko Ono? Or why KISS fans hate Gene Simmons? How would that writer go about addressing it to a community of fans who would most likely be the best sources of information, if the purpose was to actually find out why from the fans themselves?

There was a story about a fan of Slash who went to one of Axl Rose's GnR shows wearing a Slash t-shirt, Axl spotted him and went berzerk on the guy. Again, benefit of the doubt, what if a writer doing an article wanted to find out where that hostility came from, or why some fans either hate Slash or Axl, who better to ask than the fans if you want to hear opinions?

That thread was created three days after the album came out, but nice try.  Billy even agreed with the OP.  There were a lot of no name sites that gave it good reviews, too.  

There's plenty of stuff out there that he can use for research to see why people might hate Mike.  There's plenty of objectionable things he's done that have received bad press.  You don't ask a forum, especially one where people claim there's an agenda almost anytime something negative is said about Brian.  

  

So you think the negative reviews thread had nothing to do with the man whose album was released and everything to do with...what exactly? Sharing information? Sure. Ask the guy who started that one.

Why does it have to be about Brian?  Why couldn't he just be concerned that it was getting bad reviews?  Again, your fellow moderator even agreed with him.  That OP's posting history shows there is no agenda at all.  

That's hilarious.

Is it?  Or do you mean for me because you keep digging yourself a bigger hole. Show me his posts that show he has a history of an agenda against Brian.  Feel free to pm it to me instead.  But nice job of deflecting from my original point to make it about someone you think has an agenda against Brian.  

btw I'm about to leave for work, so I probably won't respond for a few hours.

[guitarfool2002]

I second that - life's too short for this sh*t. Toodle loo!

15 pages too late.

You guys knew very well where this thread was going to go.  It should have been locked up after the first post. 

Armchair quarterbacking? It's an open forum and will be kept that way. Should the "Negative Reviews Of NPP" thread have been deleted too when it first appeared? Funny that there are and were some legitimate discussions and some historical info put out in this topic that it seems wasn't widely known, on the years 88-97. Some wanted to throw dirt instead. If the issue was with the author's original post, call him out on it.

No armchair quarterbacking, I made the third post in this thread.  Threads made to call out specific members of the band are useless and idiotic.  Yeah there was some good info in this thread, maybe a couple pages worth?  Someone could have made a separate thread like you did with that lawsuit Mike had. 

As mentioned, some would say devoting a thread to reposting negative reviews the weeks after a new album got released and including such journalistic powerhouses as a student newspaper from Australia among them was useless and idiotic as well, should that have been stopped before it got started as well? Maybe so.

No, because that is about the material, not the person.  If Ian wanted to come back and create a thread titled "Why do you hate SIP" I'd be have no problem with it.

Oh, so there is a difference? Do you really think the purpose of dredging up negative reviews and reposting them here was about the material more than it was about the person who made the album?

As far as Ian's original intent, let's take it further and see if he gets the benefit of the doubt. What if there was a music writer who was researching an article about The Beatles and wanted to know why fans hate Yoko Ono? Or why KISS fans hate Gene Simmons? How would that writer go about addressing it to a community of fans who would most likely be the best sources of information, if the purpose was to actually find out why from the fans themselves?

There was a story about a fan of Slash who went to one of Axl Rose's GnR shows wearing a Slash t-shirt, Axl spotted him and went berzerk on the guy. Again, benefit of the doubt, what if a writer doing an article wanted to find out where that hostility came from, or why some fans either hate Slash or Axl, who better to ask than the fans if you want to hear opinions?

That thread was created three days after the album came out, but nice try.  Billy even agreed with the OP.  There were a lot of no name sites that gave it good reviews, too.  

There's plenty of stuff out there that he can use for research to see why people might hate Mike.  There's plenty of objectionable things he's done that have received bad press.  You don't ask a forum, especially one where people claim there's an agenda almost anytime something negative is said about Brian.  

  

So you think the negative reviews thread had nothing to do with the man whose album was released and everything to do with...what exactly? Sharing information? Sure. Ask the guy who started that one.

Why does it have to be about Brian?  Why couldn't he just be concerned that it was getting bad reviews?  Again, your fellow moderator even agreed with him.  That OP's posting history shows there is no agenda at all.  

That's hilarious.

Is it?  Or do you mean for me because you keep digging yourself a bigger hole. Show me his posts that show he has a history of an agenda against Brian.  Feel free to pm it to me instead.  But nice job of deflecting from my original point to make it about someone you think has an agenda against Brian.  

Your original point was addressed, I'll say again this is an open forum, if you don't like something just challenge it or ignore it and it will fade away eventually. If you have an issue with the topic, ask the original writer what he's trying to get at with the post.

The other topic: Ask him why he quit if you're a pal. Simple as that. Then ask what happened afterward.

[Mike's Beard]

I said he quit not long after the thread in question, not because of the thread. And why bother to tell a fellow poster to ask Nico why he started a thread when you know that he is no longer a member?

[guitarfool2002]

I said he quit not long after the thread in question, not because of the thread. And why bother to tell a fellow poster to ask Nico why he started a thread when you know that he is no longer a member?

Oh, I get it. So what you said isn't what you meant, is it parsing words, or what? Or do you still want to claim that this imaginary NPP Police as you called it caused someone to leave when you know nothing about it? I'm saying if you're pals with him, ask him.