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Author Topic: Forthcoming-ish Archival Releases ?  (Read 19513 times)
HeyJude
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« Reply #25 on: July 29, 2015, 07:31:40 AM »

Howie’s right; there’s so much stuff available that could be put together in no time. Maybe there are even more gems they haven’t uncovered yet, but they have already uncovered a ton of stuff that they could pull together and have ready for release at any time. Studio or live stuff. I could think of a dozen different themes/packages/variations for them to do, studio and live, individual discs and multi-disc sets, the list goes on. And that’s just going off of the stuff we *know* about; they no doubt have other material few if any of us know about.

As far as the “futzing” thing, I think some of the work on the studio stuff can get a bit excessive (the take of “California Feeling” on MIC is probably more listenable, but *a lot* of futzing going on with that one, flown-in Brian vocal, re-arranged order of segments, drums dropped out intermittently, etc.)

I don’t think they’ve done anything too heinous with the limited live material they’ve released on archival releases so far, other than obviously only giving us scattered tracks. I think the only thing they should do with that stuff is simply mix down or mix out any little bits that sound off. Not like single bass guitar notes that are off, but if there’s a song where Brian was noodling on the piano in another world, or if a harmony part is flat for a whole song, I don’t mind mixing that out if the performance otherwise still warrants release.

I’d love full, uncut live recordings. But unless they do some sort of online club/membership format, we’ll never get something like that. If they do some sort of fancy boxed set of live recordings, it would have to be highlights and stuff pulled from a ton of different shows. I’d of course snap up dozens and dozens of full, uncut live shows. But in a boxed set format, I don’t need eight versions of “California Girls.”
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« Reply #26 on: July 29, 2015, 07:34:07 AM »

Howie’s right; there’s so much stuff available that could be put together in no time. Maybe there are even more gems they haven’t uncovered yet, but they have already uncovered a ton of stuff that they could pull together and have ready for release at any time. Studio or live stuff. I could think of a dozen different themes/packages/variations for them to do, studio and live, individual discs and multi-disc sets, the list goes on. And that’s just going off of the stuff we *know* about; they no doubt have other material few if any of us know about.

As far as the “futzing” thing, I think some of the work on the studio stuff can get a bit excessive (the take of “California Feeling” on MIC is probably more listenable, but *a lot* of futzing going on with that one, flown-in Brian vocal, re-arranged order of segments, drums dropped out intermittently, etc.)

I don’t think they’ve done anything too heinous with the limited live material they’ve released on archival releases so far, other than obviously only giving us scattered tracks. I think the only thing they should do with that stuff is simply mix down or mix out any little bits that sound off. Not like single bass guitar notes that are off, but if there’s a song where Brian was noodling on the piano in another world, or if a harmony part is flat for a whole song, I don’t mind mixing that out if the performance otherwise still warrants release.

I’d love full, uncut live recordings. But unless they do some sort of online club/membership format, we’ll never get something like that. If they do some sort of fancy boxed set of live recordings, it would have to be highlights and stuff pulled from a ton of different shows. I’d of course snap up dozens and dozens of full, uncut live shows. But in a boxed set format, I don’t need eight versions of “California Girls.”


In a boxset, I'd like to see a couple of full shows, preferably from eras that haven't seen official live recordings (ie.  The GV boxset tour in 1993 and a good unaltered full concert from 2012).  Other than that, a nice collection of different tracks that have been done over the years. 
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guitarfool2002
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« Reply #27 on: July 29, 2015, 10:35:16 AM »

But there is precedent going back years for making full, uncut soundboard concerts available to an artist's fan base that were essentially "official" bootlegs but not full-on, major-label releases. I remember back in 2002 or so, a friend and former co-worker contacted me wanting to take some guitar lessons, and he was a major Pearl Jam fan. At his place, he shows me this collection of Pearl Jam concerts, full uncut shows that if I remember had been made available for sale or download to their fans by the band. Of course others have done and are still doing this, naturally The Dead and Phish and related bands come to mind, but when I saw the way Pearl Jam had organized this distribution setup, I was really impressed and thought I wish more bands would do this for their fans, it's a really cool idea and it also gives the fans basically a guarantee of good sound and a quality product without having to deal with bootleggers and half-assed dealers selling bad dubs and low-generation copies. These shows were coming direct from the band, so there is a level of quality for your money that the boots couldn't guarantee.

And then there was Rhino Handmade and The Monkees catalog. I bought a single disc called "Live 1967" when it came out on Rhino, it was a compilation of several shows that had been recorded on a '67 tour that they edited into one imaginary setlist pulling out the best of the live tapes they had in the vaults. So you got an "official" release that was giving casual fans what amounted to a greatest live hits compilation, a fantasy setlist based on the real thing, but it was a mix of different shows.

Then Handmade did a neat thing. They took the full live tapes from several venues and boxed them up in a multi-disc set, limited run and kind of pricey, but here for the hardcore fans was a set of full shows from the '67 tour, no comping or anything else, apart from the usual mixing and sound balancing to present a good product.

That was the difference between knowing your demographic and fan base and offering different products for those only willing to get their feet wet versus those who want to jump off the high dive board and get the collector-type material. I don't think there were many complaints.

And those examples from over a decade ago are what I think I have in mind whenever live archival material is discussed. There are templates that have been in place a long time that have worked. Sure, there are the various legalities like fees and licenses and permissions and all of that stuff to work out that may be different from artist to artist, but there can be releases of full live shows getting to the fan base who wants to buy them without having to go the "Knebworth" route via labels and all of that. Or so it would seem.
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« Reply #28 on: July 29, 2015, 11:22:02 AM »

But there is precedent going back years for making full, uncut soundboard concerts available to an artist's fan base that were essentially "official" bootlegs but not full-on, major-label releases. I remember back in 2002 or so, a friend and former co-worker contacted me wanting to take some guitar lessons, and he was a major Pearl Jam fan. At his place, he shows me this collection of Pearl Jam concerts, full uncut shows that if I remember had been made available for sale or download to their fans by the band. Of course others have done and are still doing this, naturally The Dead and Phish and related bands come to mind, but when I saw the way Pearl Jam had organized this distribution setup, I was really impressed and thought I wish more bands would do this for their fans, it's a really cool idea and it also gives the fans basically a guarantee of good sound and a quality product without having to deal with bootleggers and half-assed dealers selling bad dubs and low-generation copies. These shows were coming direct from the band, so there is a level of quality for your money that the boots couldn't guarantee.

And then there was Rhino Handmade and The Monkees catalog. I bought a single disc called "Live 1967" when it came out on Rhino, it was a compilation of several shows that had been recorded on a '67 tour that they edited into one imaginary setlist pulling out the best of the live tapes they had in the vaults. So you got an "official" release that was giving casual fans what amounted to a greatest live hits compilation, a fantasy setlist based on the real thing, but it was a mix of different shows.

Then Handmade did a neat thing. They took the full live tapes from several venues and boxed them up in a multi-disc set, limited run and kind of pricey, but here for the hardcore fans was a set of full shows from the '67 tour, no comping or anything else, apart from the usual mixing and sound balancing to present a good product.

That was the difference between knowing your demographic and fan base and offering different products for those only willing to get their feet wet versus those who want to jump off the high dive board and get the collector-type material. I don't think there were many complaints.

And those examples from over a decade ago are what I think I have in mind whenever live archival material is discussed. There are templates that have been in place a long time that have worked. Sure, there are the various legalities like fees and licenses and permissions and all of that stuff to work out that may be different from artist to artist, but there can be releases of full live shows getting to the fan base who wants to buy them without having to go the "Knebworth" route via labels and all of that. Or so it would seem.

I was hoping Brian would do this for his 2015 Tour. 

I remember The Who did it in 2002 because I was able to purchase a CD of the show I attended in Hershey. 
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Howie Edelson
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« Reply #29 on: July 29, 2015, 01:24:46 PM »

http://www.elvispresleyftd.com/follow-that-dream.html
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« Reply #30 on: July 29, 2015, 04:17:07 PM »

Ugggh. If the BB's had put together even 10% of the sort of thing like that Elvis program, it would be amazing.

Seriously, it's free money for them! Nobody has to go back into the studio and overdub anything. It apparently has even mostly been cataloged now. Now they just have to let Alan Boyd loose. If they went with a digital-only release (again, I'd prefer physical CDs, but if the "copyright extension" stuff has been digital-only, that's the most likely scenario for future releases), they wouldn't even have to pay for the relatively small overheard manufacturing costs.

They all have active Facebook pages and whatnot too, easy cross promotion would be easy. All of those fans who thank Mike on Facebook for performing "Barbara Ann" and "All I Wanna Do" and all the fans who "Like" a random photo of Brian from 1967 could instead be given links to where they will GLADLY fork over serious coin to buy the full Carnegie Hall show, or "Sunflower" sessions, or the full 1993 Paramount Theater show, or an uncut 2012 show, or vocals-only mixes, and so on.

They could then even cross promote all of their solo stuff too. Maybe somebody needs to pitch Mike on piggybacking a new solo album on top of a world-class Beach Boys archival release program.
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« Reply #31 on: July 29, 2015, 07:16:14 PM »

Why on earth would anything from the archives like we're talking about need to be piggybacked on a Mike Love solo album or anything of the sort, I mean...

speechless...
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« Reply #32 on: July 29, 2015, 07:50:26 PM »

Why on earth would anything from the archives like we're talking about need to be piggybacked on a Mike Love solo album or anything of the sort, I mean...

speechless...

I think you have it backwards.
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guitarfool2002
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« Reply #33 on: July 29, 2015, 08:05:42 PM »

Why on earth would anything from the archives like we're talking about need to be piggybacked on a Mike Love solo album or anything of the sort, I mean...

speechless...

I think you have it backwards.

Nope, I meant exactly what I wrote replying to this:

They could then even cross promote all of their solo stuff too. Maybe somebody needs to pitch Mike on piggybacking a new solo album on top of a world-class Beach Boys archival release program.

So would this be like piggybacking Mike's NASCAR album to getting a fill-up at the local 76 gas station like they did in 1998? Buy Carnegie Hall, get a free solo album? That's just cheap gimmickery.
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« Reply #34 on: July 29, 2015, 08:13:00 PM »

Why on earth would anything from the archives like we're talking about need to be piggybacked on a Mike Love solo album or anything of the sort, I mean...

speechless...

I think you have it backwards.


Nope, I meant exactly what I wrote replying to this:

They could then even cross promote all of their solo stuff too. Maybe somebody needs to pitch Mike on piggybacking a new solo album on top of a world-class Beach Boys archival release program.

So would this be like piggybacking Mike's NASCAR album to getting a fill-up at the local 76 gas station like they did in 1998? Buy Carnegie Hall, get a free solo album? That's just cheap gimmickery.

Ok, then you wrote your response backwards.  LOL

At this point we don't even know what exactly would be on his album (or if it will really happen, for that matter).  I don't really see what the big deal is.  Right now we're talking about a theoretical scenario of a theoretical release...
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guitarfool2002
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« Reply #35 on: July 29, 2015, 08:35:58 PM »

Why on earth would anything from the archives like we're talking about need to be piggybacked on a Mike Love solo album or anything of the sort, I mean...

speechless...

I think you have it backwards.


Nope, I meant exactly what I wrote replying to this:

They could then even cross promote all of their solo stuff too. Maybe somebody needs to pitch Mike on piggybacking a new solo album on top of a world-class Beach Boys archival release program.

So would this be like piggybacking Mike's NASCAR album to getting a fill-up at the local 76 gas station like they did in 1998? Buy Carnegie Hall, get a free solo album? That's just cheap gimmickery.

Ok, then you wrote your response backwards.  LOL

At this point we don't even know what exactly would be on his album (or if it will really happen, for that matter).  I don't really see what the big deal is.  Right now we're talking about a theoretical scenario of a theoretical release...

I do things backwards sometimes, I'll admit to that.  Smiley

It's not about whatever is or isn't on the hypothetical album(s), but more about assuming the release of some stellar vintage live material would be tied to anything else at all, even as a theoretical or hypothetical it sounds like an absurd notion. A concert like Carnegie or any other notable show from the past stands on its own, if you attach something to it or vice versa or whatever the case, it becomes a marketing gimmick that cheapens the whole thing. Just my opinion. Although a free NASCAR album with a tank of gas seemed appropriate.  LOL
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« Reply #36 on: July 29, 2015, 08:36:28 PM »

That Beach Boys/Grateful Dead live set would've been something relevant to piggyback on a month or so ago.   Cool Guy

Why do I feel like we're just going to get something Pet Sounds-related next year? Another repackage of the box set, etc. .....or the group reunites, performs the album in full in 10 cities, there's a TV special, a live album, a DVD...
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« Reply #37 on: July 29, 2015, 08:53:55 PM »

We do have the "Pet Sounds " Blu-Ray audio DVD on August 28th. Buying it 5 times already is not enough.

http://ultimateclassicrock.com/august-2015-new-music-releases/

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00P11J888/ref=tmm_bry_new_olp_sr?ie=UTF8&condition=new&qid=&sr=
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« Reply #38 on: July 29, 2015, 09:38:51 PM »

ghostly mentioned the Dead.   Wouldn't It B Nice if the Beachboys would have encouraged taping like the Dead?   We could have had a treasure trove to explore like the dead heads do........maybe even a Beachboys satellite radio program..
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« Reply #39 on: July 30, 2015, 05:53:30 AM »

That Beach Boys/Grateful Dead live set would've been something relevant to piggyback on a month or so ago.   Cool Guy

Why do I feel like we're just going to get something Pet Sounds-related next year? Another repackage of the box set, etc. .....or the group reunites, performs the album in full in 10 cities, there's a TV special, a live album, a DVD...

If the Beach Boys reunite and do Pet Sounds, and film it, I can see the full DVD listing now:

Do It Again
Catch a Wave
Surfin Sufari
409
Shut Down
Little Deuce Coupe
I Get Around
Wouldn't It Be Nice
Sloop John B
God Only Knows
California Girls
Good Vibrations
Help Me Rhonda
Surfin USA
Kokomo
Barbara Ann
Fun Fun Fun

Running time 51 minute. 

Sorry BB fans, you'll have to look at the bootleg market for a complete show.
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« Reply #40 on: July 30, 2015, 06:30:30 AM »

Why on earth would anything from the archives like we're talking about need to be piggybacked on a Mike Love solo album or anything of the sort, I mean...

speechless...

As someone else mentioned, it would be the opposite: Piggybacking a solo release on the back of a high-profile archival release program. And the reason for this idea was *very* simple: To get Mike Love (or any member who might be indifferent otherwise to archival releases) to warm to the idea.

I've heard that some of these guys have been pitched various sorts of archival releases, and they really just don't care. I don't know how opposed they are to it, but they clearly aren't motivated enough to push such a project forward. So the idea would be to sweeten the pot and pitch it to any or all of them by pointing out they can cross-promote whatever solo project that they actually may have *more* enthusiasm for. Clearly Mike is more interested in putting out "Pisces Brothers" than he is actively pushing for a release of, say, "Carry Me Home" (and no, I'm not implying he blocked that one from MIC; the point is that he's not, unprompted, calling up Elliott Lott and pushing hard for BB archival releases; nor are probably any of the guys).

Just as the Beatles, rather stunningly (in light of how it was, say, 20 or 30 years ago), are cross-promoting group and solo stuff up the wazoo, the BB's could do the same. I'm sure Ringo, for instance, might warm more to whatever Beatles release when he can also get promotion for his otherwise largely-ignored new solo album via the e-mail list and Facebook page for the "BEATLES", which has a buttload of followers and readers.
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« Reply #41 on: July 30, 2015, 06:43:43 AM »

Why on earth would anything from the archives like we're talking about need to be piggybacked on a Mike Love solo album or anything of the sort, I mean...

speechless...

I think you have it backwards.

Nope, I meant exactly what I wrote replying to this:

They could then even cross promote all of their solo stuff too. Maybe somebody needs to pitch Mike on piggybacking a new solo album on top of a world-class Beach Boys archival release program.

So would this be like piggybacking Mike's NASCAR album to getting a fill-up at the local 76 gas station like they did in 1998? Buy Carnegie Hall, get a free solo album? That's just cheap gimmickery.

Just like QVC in 1993 - bit the box set, get SIP free.
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« Reply #42 on: July 30, 2015, 06:47:51 AM »

I'd like to throw down a request: Release any live archival material from 40+ years ago warts-and-all, in other words no editing and fixing and tinkering. Anything that got played on stage gets put on the release, audio verite style. That to me is the only way to handle such material. The post-production fixes on too many live releases tend to destroy the appeal of certain products in the name of polishing up things for the wrong reasons or the wrong people. The people buying the greatest hits CD's and downloads are not the target demographic for this kind of material. Off soapbox.
Yes!

And, Amen!  Wink
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« Reply #43 on: August 02, 2015, 03:36:35 PM »

The "holy grail" for me is the release of all the individual multi-tracks, thus allowing the listener to create his own mix and, more importantly, really delve into the details of how each song was created.

The technology certainly exists today to do this. Does anyone think there is even a remote chance of this ever happening?   
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« Reply #44 on: August 03, 2015, 06:38:52 AM »

I’d love to have multitracks to dissect; I’ve had great fun pulling apart the stems from the Beatles “RockBand” game. But I’d much rather have outtakes and songs and recordings we haven’t heard as far as the Beach Boys goes. The holy grail for me would be 1-2 discs per album of unreleased material (the amount of available material varies of course from album to album). The priority for me is and has always been in this order: Fully unheard, unreleased songs (compositions), then alternate takes/versions/recordings of songs we know (including demos and studio takes), then a capella mixes, then backing tracks, and then miscellaneous remixes, etc. Live stuff is totally separate thing for me, although I wouldn’t mind live stuff on expanded album reissues if they didn’ t have alternate plans for all-live releases.

The multi-tracks idea is great and I’d buy it in a heartbeat, but it would hold a bit less interest and easy playability. At the end of the day, I’m going to pull out discs of immediately listenable stuff like “Carry Me Home” much more often than I’ll whip out a multi-track session of “I’m Waiting for the Day” to do my own mix. In fact, I have less interest in making my own mixes than I would just extracting all the tracks and isolating them to listen to. What I’d probably end up doing most often is dropping the instruments out and doing a vocals-only mix, which I think is something expanded album reissues need anyway.
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« Reply #45 on: August 03, 2015, 03:05:55 PM »

ghostly mentioned the Dead.   Wouldn't It B Nice if the Beachboys would have encouraged taping like the Dead?   We could have had a treasure trove to explore like the dead heads do........maybe even a Beachboys satellite radio program..

That would have been nice but it was a completely different scenario with The Dead. Their setlists changed every single night and they would improv making the same song sound different from one night to the next. That is why they gained such a loyal following that would record and attend as many shows as possible. It would be great to have more live recordings from the late 60s - early 70s but recording every show during the late 70s to present would have been rather pointless. I personally don't need 50 different live recordings of Barbara Ann and Be True To Your School from the 1985 tour. With those later shows, it's best to just hand pick some of the standout shows (like a '93 box set show, an '88 show with This Whole World and Forever, etc.) Having said that, I do think if they had recorded every show of the C50 that it would have been worthwhile. I think if they would have released them for download or on cd (like Pearl Jam) during 2012 or shortly after, a good amount of people would have bought those as souvenirs of the show/shows they attended.
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« Reply #46 on: August 03, 2015, 04:14:17 PM »

I'm pretty sure that I am not the only one here who would rather hear an audience recording of a 1972 show versus a pristine FM radio recording of a 1985 show. There was a time when our favorite band took chances and was far more adventurous in a live setting before eventually going on auto-pilot. Even if we're talking about studio outtakes here, would you rather hear the complete version of WIBNTLA or an alt take of "Da Doo Ron Ron"? There must be a cut-off point somewhere.

EDIT: Count me in as one who would love to play around with the multitracks!
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« Reply #47 on: August 03, 2015, 07:23:56 PM »

I would love to see some of the concerts recorded for the "In Concert" album released.  Or at the very least, a version of each song played on those tours.
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« Reply #48 on: August 03, 2015, 11:31:28 PM »

I would love to see some of the concerts recorded for the "In Concert" album released.  Or at the very least, a version of each song played on those tours.

I wish they'd release the lot. Pure and simple…
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« Reply #49 on: August 04, 2015, 06:25:43 AM »

I hope they finally release what must be hours and hours and hours of candid recordings of the Boys resisting and complaining and defying and bullying Brian during the Pet Sounds and SMiLE sessions.  Roll Eyes
Its the B-side to the hours and hours and hours of candid recordings of the Boys embracing and praising and loving and encouraging Brian during the Pet Sounds and SMiLE sessions.

That B Side is already out.

Yawn.
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