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Author Topic: 2012 She Believes In Love Again  (Read 8374 times)
NateRuvin
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« on: July 22, 2015, 11:04:23 PM »

It has been reported that during the sessions for TWGMTR, the BBs recorded Bruce's classic She Believes In Love Again. I sure hope it'll be released someday, perhaps on (another...  Huh) future compilation. Since the sessions were led by Brian Wilson (with help from Joe Thomas and Jeff Foskett), I'd love to hear Brian's take on arranging the song.
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CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2015, 11:22:52 PM »

It has been reported that during the sessions for TWGMTR, the BBs recorded Bruce's classic She Believes In Love Again. I sure hope it'll be released someday, perhaps on (another...  Huh) future compilation. Since the sessions were led by Brian Wilson (with help from Joe Thomas and Jeff Foskett), I'd love to hear Brian's take on arranging the song.

Wasn't there some brief clip of this version of the song released? Or perhaps it was a brief clip of another song that was worked on during this era? I seem to recall seeing it on a video of behind – the – scenes footage.

It's a killer song, with a part in the bridge that's a clear nod to Carl's Full Sail. This version needs releasing.
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Andrew G. Doe
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« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2015, 02:22:52 AM »

Different song.
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« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2015, 02:37:07 AM »

I'm sure everyone is poised to ask Andrew this, but can't quite bring themselves to do it. I'll bite, however!

So: Andrew, do you mean that the band recorded *another* song called 'She Believes In Love Again' — just like Bruce's song on the 85 album, but NOT that song — which subsequently went unreleased on the 2012 album?

Stupid question, I know: but it just seems so unlikely that there would be another song called exactly that during the TWGMTR sessions...

(Stranger things have happened in BB land, however, so I'm not pre-judging either way!)

Alternatively, did you mean that the song in the bridge to which She Believes In Love Again allegedly nods is NOT Full Sail, but a different song...?

In short, were you replying to NateRuvin or CenturyDeprived?

Thanks!

PS I ask because Bruce's 1985 'She Believes In Love Again' is a real guilty pleasure of mine. It is, admittedly, *arch*-80s fermented curd, prime gorgonzola — but I like it. There, I said it. And I would love to hear a slightly 'de-eightiesed' version, which is what I had thought the unreleased 2012 recording might be until Andrew's comment. I have a feeling a simpler performance (maybe just Bruce and a piano?) would sound better, and wondered it it was an out-take in that style that we might get to hear one day. But of course, if the 2012 track is a completely different song, that puts paid to that idea...
« Last Edit: July 23, 2015, 02:59:59 AM by Matt Bielewicz » Logged
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« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2015, 02:57:00 AM »

Or maybe he meant it was a different song playing in the background of the Doin' It Again DVD?
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Matt Bielewicz
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« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2015, 03:01:39 AM »

Oh — yeah. That's another possible interpretation of what Andrew meant, too!
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« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2015, 03:47:31 AM »

This is like watching a bunch of Dylanologists having a post-gig drink on a night after he changed one line in a song.  Cheesy
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« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2015, 03:56:43 AM »

We'll just need to wait for the man himself to explain!  Grin
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« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2015, 04:02:26 AM »

I'm sure everyone is poised to ask Andrew this, but can't quite bring themselves to do it. I'll bite, however!

So: Andrew, do you mean that the band recorded *another* song called 'She Believes In Love Again' — just like Bruce's song on the 85 album, but NOT that song — which subsequently went unreleased on the 2012 album?

Stupid question, I know: but it just seems so unlikely that there would be another song called exactly that during the TWGMTR sessions...

(Stranger things have happened in BB land, however, so I'm not pre-judging either way!)

Alternatively, did you mean that the song in the bridge to which She Believes In Love Again allegedly nods is NOT Full Sail, but a different song...?

In short, were you replying to NateRuvin or CenturyDeprived?

Thanks!

PS I ask because Bruce's 1985 'She Believes In Love Again' is a real guilty pleasure of mine. It is, admittedly, *arch*-80s fermented curd, prime gorgonzola — but I like it. There, I said it. And I would love to hear a slightly 'de-eightiesed' version, which is what I had thought the unreleased 2012 recording might be until Andrew's comment. I have a feeling a simpler performance (maybe just Bruce and a piano?) would sound better, and wondered it it was an out-take in that style that we might get to hear one day. But of course, if the 2012 track is a completely different song, that puts paid to that idea...

Andrew meant that the song playing during the video was not She Believes.

As for the re-recording of the song, it was Bruce who mentioned it in an interview back then.
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« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2015, 04:28:17 AM »

It has been reported that during the sessions for TWGMTR, the BBs recorded Bruce's classic She Believes In Love Again. I sure hope it'll be released someday, perhaps on (another...  Huh) future compilation. Since the sessions were led by Brian Wilson (with help from Joe Thomas and Jeff Foskett), I'd love to hear Brian's take on arranging the song.

My understanding is that is was not a "Brian-led" arrangement of the song, but rather a Bruce re-arrangement that was recorded in Studio B at Ocean Way while other production work was going on in Studio A, but it does indeed include the other BBs' singing. Bruce himself commented on it a year later: "We now have a very recent Beach Boys recording of "She Believes In Love Again" about 180 degrees opposite our 1985 released version. It was a possible track for our BB 50 studio album but it now lives in the BB/Capitol Records music vault. The track is completely mixed down to a stereo two track mix." and "As there was time available for me to record during the the recording of the 'That's Why God Made The Radio' album, I gave "She Believes In Love Again" another shot.It's very close to the more resent demo that I sent to Rowie. It's a sweet recording hearing our Beach Boys voices wrapped around my song but most likely it does not really work for our BB 50th album. Hmmmmmm......Perhaps someone will break into the music vaults as they usually do and create a Beach Boys bootleg version."
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« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2015, 04:34:16 AM »

"... the more resent demo that I sent to Rowie"?
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« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2015, 06:39:00 AM »

I’m trying to recall the details of the “She Believes…” re-make that were mentioned back then. My vague recollection is that I got the impression that they used Bruce’s original 1985 lead vocal track, then had Foskett re-sing Carl’s lines (if they’re using 1985 vocal tracks, why not just keep Carl’s then?), and then re-recorded the backing and presumably added new group backing vocals.

I recall the mention of the song elicited mostly groans from fans back in 2012, considering we had been waiting 20 years for *new* BB music. I figured part of the reason (beyond the obvious, that it was a remake of a song they had already released) the track may have been dropped from consideration is that it featured a non-BB on prominent lead vocals. Obviously, Jeff was prominent throughout the album on harmonies and even some solo lines here and there. But nothing as out-front prominent as singing all the choruses to “She Believes…”

The backing track heard in the “Doin’ It Again” documentary is indeed different. I’m not sure how anyone determined this, but at some point someone claimed or deduced it was a track called “I’d Go Anywhere” (or “I’ll Go Anywhere”). It certainly sounds interesting (certainly moreso than a remake of a 1985 track).
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NateRuvin
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« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2015, 09:06:51 AM »

It has been reported that during the sessions for TWGMTR, the BBs recorded Bruce's classic She Believes In Love Again. I sure hope it'll be released someday, perhaps on (another...  Huh) future compilation. Since the sessions were led by Brian Wilson (with help from Joe Thomas and Jeff Foskett), I'd love to hear Brian's take on arranging the song.

My understanding is that is was not a "Brian-led" arrangement of the song, but rather a Bruce re-arrangement that was recorded in Studio B at Ocean Way while other production work was going on in Studio A, but it does indeed include the other BBs' singing. Bruce himself commented on it a year later: "We now have a very recent Beach Boys recording of "She Believes In Love Again" about 180 degrees opposite our 1985 released version. It was a possible track for our BB 50 studio album but it now lives in the BB/Capitol Records music vault. The track is completely mixed down to a stereo two track mix." and "As there was time available for me to record during the the recording of the 'That's Why God Made The Radio' album, I gave "She Believes In Love Again" another shot.It's very close to the more resent demo that I sent to Rowie. It's a sweet recording hearing our Beach Boys voices wrapped around my song but most likely it does not really work for our BB 50th album. Hmmmmmm......Perhaps someone will break into the music vaults as they usually do and create a Beach Boys bootleg version."

That's interesting. And it's nice to know Bruce still has an interest in arranging. Here's a question:
Had She Believes In Love Again ended up on the album would Bruce be credited as producer, or would the production credit still go to BW?
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Matt H
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« Reply #13 on: July 23, 2015, 09:13:07 AM »

It has been reported that during the sessions for TWGMTR, the BBs recorded Bruce's classic She Believes In Love Again. I sure hope it'll be released someday, perhaps on (another...  Huh) future compilation. Since the sessions were led by Brian Wilson (with help from Joe Thomas and Jeff Foskett), I'd love to hear Brian's take on arranging the song.

My understanding is that is was not a "Brian-led" arrangement of the song, but rather a Bruce re-arrangement that was recorded in Studio B at Ocean Way while other production work was going on in Studio A, but it does indeed include the other BBs' singing. Bruce himself commented on it a year later: "We now have a very recent Beach Boys recording of "She Believes In Love Again" about 180 degrees opposite our 1985 released version. It was a possible track for our BB 50 studio album but it now lives in the BB/Capitol Records music vault. The track is completely mixed down to a stereo two track mix." and "As there was time available for me to record during the the recording of the 'That's Why God Made The Radio' album, I gave "She Believes In Love Again" another shot.It's very close to the more resent demo that I sent to Rowie. It's a sweet recording hearing our Beach Boys voices wrapped around my song but most likely it does not really work for our BB 50th album. Hmmmmmm......Perhaps someone will break into the music vaults as they usually do and create a Beach Boys bootleg version."

That's interesting. And it's nice to know Bruce still has an interest in arranging. Here's a question:
Had She Believes In Love Again ended up on the album would Bruce be credited as producer, or would the production credit still go to BW?

I think Bruce would have been credited, just like Paul Faursco (sp) was for DBOTO.
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Andrew G. Doe
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« Reply #14 on: July 23, 2015, 10:48:33 AM »

Or maybe he meant it was a different song playing in the background of the Doin' It Again DVD?

'Xactly.
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« Reply #15 on: July 23, 2015, 12:52:10 PM »

Or maybe he meant it was a different song playing in the background of the Doin' It Again DVD?

'Xactly.

 Grin
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NateRuvin
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« Reply #16 on: July 23, 2015, 03:34:53 PM »

Do you all think this version will ever be released?
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« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2015, 03:38:08 PM »

I’m trying to recall the details of the “She Believes…” re-make that were mentioned back then. My vague recollection is that I got the impression that they used Bruce’s original 1985 lead vocal track, then had Foskett re-sing Carl’s lines (if they’re using 1985 vocal tracks, why not just keep Carl’s then?), and then re-recorded the backing and presumably added new group backing vocals.

I recall the mention of the song elicited mostly groans from fans back in 2012, considering we had been waiting 20 years for *new* BB music. I figured part of the reason (beyond the obvious, that it was a remake of a song they had already released) the track may have been dropped from consideration is that it featured a non-BB on prominent lead vocals. Obviously, Jeff was prominent throughout the album on harmonies and even some solo lines here and there. But nothing as out-front prominent as singing all the choruses to “She Believes…”

The backing track heard in the “Doin’ It Again” documentary is indeed different. I’m not sure how anyone determined this, but at some point someone claimed or deduced it was a track called “I’d Go Anywhere” (or “I’ll Go Anywhere”). It certainly sounds interesting (certainly moreso than a remake of a 1985 track).

I asked Bruce during the C50 tour about the lead vocals and he said that he himself sang the entire song, including Carl's part.
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« Reply #18 on: July 23, 2015, 03:49:22 PM »

I’m trying to recall the details of the “She Believes…” re-make that were mentioned back then. My vague recollection is that I got the impression that they used Bruce’s original 1985 lead vocal track, then had Foskett re-sing Carl’s lines (if they’re using 1985 vocal tracks, why not just keep Carl’s then?), and then re-recorded the backing and presumably added new group backing vocals.

I recall the mention of the song elicited mostly groans from fans back in 2012, considering we had been waiting 20 years for *new* BB music. I figured part of the reason (beyond the obvious, that it was a remake of a song they had already released) the track may have been dropped from consideration is that it featured a non-BB on prominent lead vocals. Obviously, Jeff was prominent throughout the album on harmonies and even some solo lines here and there. But nothing as out-front prominent as singing all the choruses to “She Believes…”

The backing track heard in the “Doin’ It Again” documentary is indeed different. I’m not sure how anyone determined this, but at some point someone claimed or deduced it was a track called “I’d Go Anywhere” (or “I’ll Go Anywhere”). It certainly sounds interesting (certainly moreso than a remake of a 1985 track).

I asked Bruce during the C50 tour about the lead vocals and he said that he himself sang the entire song, including Carl's part.

Someone mentioned back in 2012 that Jeff was singing Carl's part (or least sang *a* version during the sessions), but I can't dig through the 166-page thread on the 2012 album and find if that's where I read it.

There's also a random old post I did find where someone claimed that Bruce had previously mentioned on the BB Britain board an idea to re-record "She Believes in Love Again" with Chris Farmer singing Carl's part. I would presume this was back during the era when Farmer was still in the touring band.
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« Reply #19 on: July 23, 2015, 07:07:14 PM »

I would so love to hear a TWGMTR treatment of "She Believes In Love Again"....It's a very special song to me. Dedicated it to my now wife back when we were 16 in 1986...and here we are today. It would be special to me to hear it recorded in recent times.
For me, it's the Surfer Girl/God Only Knows of the 80s.....the decade I grew up in.
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« Reply #20 on: July 23, 2015, 07:30:33 PM »

I would so love to hear a TWGMTR treatment of "She Believes In Love Again"....It's a very special song to me. Dedicated it to my now wife back when we were 16 in 1986...and here we are today. It would be special to me to hear it recorded in recent times.
For me, it's the Surfer Girl/God Only Knows of the 80s.....the decade I grew up in.

I totally agree with you! I think this song is an absolute classic. The chord progression is brilliant, as is Steve Levine and Bruce's arrangement. But best of all, are the awesome vocals by Bruce and Carl, and of course Mike, Brian, and Al are in there too.
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« Reply #21 on: July 23, 2015, 07:38:44 PM »

Perplexing. Totally perplexing. Anything is possible, but it's hard to believe that a 2012 version of "She Believes In Love Again" could be an improvement after removing/substituting Carl Wilson's lead vocal, especially when Carl was singing as spectacularly as he was on The Beach Boys 1985, one of Carl's best albums vocally. And, it's also hard to believe that Bruce Johnston didn't have one single new(er) song to offer for consideration for TWGMTR, other than a re-recorded one.
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NateRuvin
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« Reply #22 on: July 23, 2015, 07:58:52 PM »

Perplexing. Totally perplexing. Anything is possible, but it's hard to believe that a 2012 version of "She Believes In Love Again" could be an improvement after removing/substituting Carl Wilson's lead vocal, especially when Carl was singing as spectacularly as he was on The Beach Boys 1985, one of Carl's best albums vocally. And, it's also hard to believe that Bruce Johnston didn't have one single new(er) song to offer for consideration for TWGMTR, other than a re-recorded one.

I agree. (Correct me if I'm wrong) But I don't think he's written a tune since his track on the SIP album.
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« Reply #23 on: July 23, 2015, 09:13:00 PM »

I would like to hear the re-recorded track.
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« Reply #24 on: July 23, 2015, 10:07:38 PM »

Perplexing. Totally perplexing. Anything is possible, but it's hard to believe that a 2012 version of "She Believes In Love Again" could be an improvement after removing/substituting Carl Wilson's lead vocal, especially when Carl was singing as spectacularly as he was on The Beach Boys 1985, one of Carl's best albums vocally. And, it's also hard to believe that Bruce Johnston didn't have one single new(er) song to offer for consideration for TWGMTR, other than a re-recorded one.
Or it may be that he was not allowed to contribute one new song. Al didn't write anything on the album, either, and Mike probably had to fight to get his one song on this otherwise Wilson/Thomas dominated record.
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