The Wrecking Crew Today...

[shelter]

Jim Gordon (musician)
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James Beck Gordon (born 1945), known as Jim Gordon, is an American-born musician active during the 1960s and 1970s.

Gordon began his career as a session drummer in Los Angeles. During this period, he performed on many famous recordings including Gene Clark with The Gosdin Brothers by Gene Clark and The Notorious Byrd Brothers by The Byrds; he remained an in-demand session drummer well into the seventies.

In 1969 and 1970, he toured as part of the backing band for the group Delaney & Bonnie, which at the time included Eric Clapton. Clapton subsequently took over the group's rhythm section — Gordon, bassist Carl Radle and keyboardist-singer-songwriter Bobby Whitlock. They formed a new band which was eventually called Derek & The Dominos. Gordon played on the group's acclaimed 1970 double album Layla and Other Assorted Love Songs and composed and played the elegiac piano coda for the title track, Layla. He also toured with the band on a subsequent U.S. tour, but the group split in spring 1971 before having completed the recording of their second LP.

In 1970, Gordon was part of Joe Cocker's famous Mad Dogs and Englishmen tour. In 1971, he toured with Traffic, appearing on two albums with them, including The Low Spark of High Heeled Boys. Later in 1972, Gordon was part of Frank Zappa's 20-piece "Grand Wazoo" big band tour, and the subsesequent 10-piece "Petit Wazoo" band. Perhaps his most well-known recording with Zappa was the title track of the 1974 LP Apostrophe ('), a jam with Zappa and Tony Duran on guitar and Jack Bruce on bass, for which both Bruce and Gordon received a writing credit. He worked with Chris Hillman again when he was the drummer in the Souther Hillman Furay Band from 1973 to 1975.

During his career, Gordon played with (or for) a long list of top musicians and producers, including Phil Spector, The Beach Boys, Jackson Browne, The Byrds, The Carpenters, Alice Cooper, Crosby, Stills, Nash & Young, John Denver, Neil Diamond, George Harrison, Dr John, Carole King, John Lennon, The Monkees, Linda Ronstadt, Leon Russell, Glen Campbell (Wichita Lineman), Carly Simon ("You're So Vain"), Steely Dan, Gordon Lightfoot and Traffic.

In the late 1970s, Gordon complained of hearing voices in his head. He was later diagnosed with acute paranoid schizophrenia, and in 1981 it ended his music career.

In 1983, Gordon was convicted of murdering his mother and was sentenced to 16 years to life in prison. He currently spends most of his time at Atascadero State Hospital.

[shelter]

The American metal band MOD even wrote a song about him:

Jim Gorden, the man who was insane
Jim Gorden, had Glaxo in his brain

Jim Gordon was insane
He took his mother's life
He used the hammer first
So she wouldn't feel the knife
He's gone insane
He's lost his mind

The voices in his head
Prove the bastard nuts
He bashed his mother's head in
Because she killed Paul Lynd

He couldn't play the drums
Cause people moved his hand
Was he just a mad man
We may never understand
He's gone insane
He's lost his mind

The voices in his head
Prove the bastard nuts
He bashed his mother's head in
Because she killed Paul Lynd

MOSH

Jim Gorden was insane
He took his mother's life
He used the hammer first
So she wouldn't feel the knife

He's gone insane, he's lost his mind
He couldn't play his drums
Cause people moved his hands
Was he just a mad man
We may never understand

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

What is Glaxo?

[Aegir]

I think that's a reference to the pharmaceutical company.

[Jeff Mason]

I have my own Carol story.  One time someone posted on Usenet that Billy Strange was opening his website, and advertised it saying that Billy Strange played on many BB songs (true) including lead guitar on Surfin USA (I vehemently deny this).  I objected saying that all evidence did (and does) point to the four BBs playing the instruments.  This was forwarded over to Carol who posted a rebuke against me on her website (which the original poster gleefully posted on my Usenet post), basically accusing me of being a romantic fan who wished that his idols could play like they were supposed to.  She went on to basically say that Carl was incapable of playing SUSA in 1963 and made me sound like an idiot.  I posted a reply to her saying that if someone is documented as playing I will be happy to give them credit but there is no reason to think that Carl and Dave weren't the guitar players on SUSA, but of course that wasn't posted.

In addition to Jamerson, she also claims many Elvis tracks including Suspicious Minds, when according to session info Carol NEVER played on an Elvis session (the one she was booked for in 1968 was cancelled), and the Monkees' Last Train to Clarksville (when that was the Boyce/Hart regular set), and the Doors' first album (including Light My Fire).  THAT ought to set Andrew off again, Doors fan that he is....   

[Daniel S.]

She claimed the Doors didn't play on their albums  , but didn't Larry Knechtel play bass on Light My Fire?

The Doors did use session bass players on their albums, but I doubt she was one of them.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I'm 99.9% certain she wasn't, considering she was performing on other bands' albums at that time. Of course, maybe she discovered the secret to being in 2 places at once. I mean, she is the great almighty Carol Kaye, you know.

I have my own Carol story.  One time someone posted on Usenet that Billy Strange was opening his website, and advertised it saying that Billy Strange played on many BB songs (true) including lead guitar on Surfin USA (I vehemently deny this).  I objected saying that all evidence did (and does) point to the four BBs playing the instruments.  This was forwarded over to Carol who posted a rebuke against me on her website (which the original poster gleefully posted on my Usenet post), basically accusing me of being a romantic fan who wished that his idols could play like they were supposed to.  She went on to basically say that Carl was incapable of playing SUSA in 1963 and made me sound like an idiot.  I posted a reply to her saying that if someone is documented as playing I will be happy to give them credit but there is no reason to think that Carl and Dave weren't the guitar players on SUSA, but of course that wasn't posted.

Billy Strange himself said he didn't play on that track. Gee, I wonder who would be right on that one?

[Andrew G. Doe]

She claimed the Doors didn't play on their albums  , but didn't Larry Knechtel play bass on Light My Fire?

The Doors did use session bass players on their albums, but I doubt she was one of them.

Listen to "Light My Fire".

You hear any bass guitar on it ?

Me neither.

The Doors used a session bass player after the first album, because the Fender Rhodes bass recorded like merda.

Re; "Surfin' USA", as with the Motown tracks, the concensus is that she played on A version of it (maybe the Hot Doggers) but not THE version of it. It's strange how she'll tout the AFM sheets as proof of who played on what, yet for such disputed tracks as "SUSA" and the Jamerson stuff, the contracts have no-one called Kaye on them.

Want to make one thing abundantly clear - I have the utmost respect for Carol's musical achievements in the 60s and 70s: they are substatial, hugely influential and irrefutable. But her attitude towards being questioned is deplorable, as is her habit of making personal attacks on her highly-moderated forum, where rebuttal, or even reply, is 99% of the time impossible. If anyone should doubt this, try registering and then raising the subject of either Jamerson, Slutsky, or simply mentioning my name. Her response is bordering on the irrational, the moreso considering her standing in the LA musical fraternity and my total lack of same. Simply, she isn't doing herself any favors.

[Sheriff John Stone]

She claimed the Doors didn't play on their albums  , but didn't Larry Knechtel play bass on Light My Fire?

The Doors did use session bass players on their albums, but I doubt she was one of them.

Listen to "Light My Fire".

You hear any bass guitar on it ?

Me neither.

With a couple of Doors' threads popping up on the various message boards, I dug out the James Riordan/Jerry Prochnicky book to re-read. They wrote this, regarding the first album:

"According to Rothchild the entire album was done on a four-track recorder, and for the most part, they only used three of those. He recorded bass and drums on one track, guitar and organ on another, and Morrison's vocals on the third, leaving the fourth track open for a few extras. Rothchild brought in an uncredited bass player named Larry Knechtel because he felt Ray's piano-bass sound lacked definition".

[Andrew G. Doe]

Bass guitar is credited on one track on The Doors - I forget which one, but it isn't "LMF".

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

There's a bass player named Harvey Brooks that did some Doors LPs as well, particularly Soft Parade.

[NHC]

There's a bass player named Harvey Brooks that did some Doors LPs as well, particularly Soft Parade.

Perhaps best known as the bass player in Electric Flag and similar 60's-70's jazzbluesrock ensembles.  Great jazz-tinged lines.  Check out "Harvey's Tune" with the Flag. In either Densmore's or Manzarek's book, one or the other or maybe both talk about the bass in the Doors.  Without looking, seems like Manzarek said he used the Rhodes for most of it in the studio, with limited actualbas guitar, but I may be wrong. Great band.  I wore out the record, a guitar, an electric organ, a drum set, half my friends, a sister and both parents in 1967 with that first one.

[Mark A. Moore]

For a good while, Carol was very helpful to me, in my research on Jan Berry . . . and she provided me with some very useful commentary on Jan, and the business in general.

But I ran afoul of Carol when it came to our Jan Berry / Jan & Dean Tribute album . . . and the fact that we're basing our album directly upon my transcriptions of Jan Berry's original music scores (which are in my possession, as his authorized biographer . . . and yes, I can actually read these scores, as well).

While I thought Carol (as a champion of studiuo musicians) would be enthusiatic about this project, I was dead wrong. She accused me of trying to make money off Jan . . . and further stated that Jan had never written his own music scores . . . and that he didn't have those kinds of skills. And that, folks, is as far from the truth as you can get. I have Jan's personal and original music archive . . . his own handwritten scores, and the charts that were generated by copyists from those original scores. I also have Jan's official school (college) transcripts, and can cite the music theory classes he took (not to mention the lessons he took as a kid on piano and guitar).

It goes without saying that Jan Berry (and Brian Wilson) consulted and worked with other Hollywood arrangers (neither one of them was Mozart) . . . but Carol would hear none of the facts in the case. You can't have a debate and discuss facts with Carol, because she'll ban you from her board before any rational discussion can take place.

Carol even got me banned from Billy Strange's board . . . another guy who had previously been very helpful to me on Jan's behalf.

These are the pitfalls of doing this kind of research. You have to be prepared to cite chapter and verse . . . and so I showed both of them examples of Jan's original  scores . . . then POOF!! Account delete-age.

When this all went down, there was a very large thread on this board about it . . . but it disappeared when the board was reconfigured.

Nothing can take away from the history and fame of these great studio musicians. And it makes me sad . . . for guys like Jan . . . when those old associates want to denigrate and put them down erroneously . . . and without really knowing what they're saying.

They played on too many sessions. And like Carol says, they didn't care for rock 'n roll anyway. They were all Jazz people, right? . . . So there's no way that Carol's memory can keep up with so many sessions and artists after more than 40 years . . . even though she was "there" . . . in some cases.

Ask Hal Blaine about Jan's drum charts . . . which Hal often played in unison with Earl Palmer. Hal will tell you about them . . .

Mark A. Moore

[Ebb and Flow]

It's kind of sad really.  There has to be an element of bitterness and resentment for being "used" on recordings and recieving one paycheck for it.  Session musicians have every right to seek credit and recognition for their work, but when there are such blatant examples of untruths, sometimes their memories and motives should be questioned. 

What I don't understand is why she would lie about session dates.  Isn't California Girls enough for her?

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Oddly enough, when Robert Palmer died, I asked her about what he was like to work with. She claimed she never worked with him or even met the guy. I then informed her that I had a copy of his 1976 album "Some People Can Do What They Like" and she is listed as playing guitar. She admitted that was her, then proceeded to block my email address.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Morrison-era Doors studio bass players, corrections welcomed:

Strange Days - Doug Lubahn
Waiting For The Sun - Doug Lubahn, Kerry Magness, Leroy Vinegar
The Soft Parade - Doug Lubahn, Harvey Brooks
Morrison Hotel - Ray Neapolitan
L. A. Woman - Jerry Scheff