So Tough question:

[Alan Boyd]

On the original 16 track of FALLIN' IN LOVE, just before the master take begins, Dennis (who was singing live during the basic tracking) quietly announces, "'So Tough' by Carl and the Passions."

[JakeH]

Anyone know how the title "So Tough" came about. Sounds like a Sha-Na-Na type of thing.

There's a good chance the phrase "so tough" is a reference to the teenage slang that was thrown around back in Hawthorne (and probably other nearby locales). See also, "cool head." Some of these phrases are listed here for your edification:

http://cougartown.com/slang.html

[SBonilla]

Anyone know how the title "So Tough" came about. Sounds like a Sha-Na-Na type of thing.

There's a good chance the phrase "so tough" is a reference to the teenage slang that was thrown around back in Hawthorne (and probably other nearby locales). See also, "cool head." Some of these phrases are listed here for your edification:

http://cougartown.com/slang.html

I always took So Tough to be a reference to the song by the Casuals.

[JakeH]

I always took So Tough to be a reference to the song by the Casuals.

Interesting. This is a song I didn't know about; thanks for the heads up. You're probably right.

[CenturyDeprived]

On the original 16 track of FALLIN' IN LOVE, just before the master take begins, Dennis (who was singing live during the basic tracking) quietly announces, "'So Tough' by Carl and the Passions."

Wow, that is fascinating. Must have been a double-take moment when you first heard that on the tape!

[drbeachboy]

It's also worth pointing out that the respect for CATP is pretty recent.  If you read books and articles about the BBs from the time of its release up into the '80s, it was mostly talked about in critical terms comparable to SUMMER IN PARADISE.  People at the time really reacted badly to the album's shift in sound direction.

and a lot of those reviews also compared it with Pet Sounds which did it no favors.

[adamghost]

It's also worth pointing out that the respect for CATP is pretty recent.  If you read books and articles about the BBs from the time of its release up into the '80s, it was mostly talked about in critical terms comparable to SUMMER IN PARADISE.  People at the time really reacted badly to the album's shift in sound direction.

and a lot of those reviews also compared it with Pet Sounds which did it no favors.

Yup, also absolutely true.  It was really a baffling move all 'round, particularly after the relative success of SURF'S UP.

[kookadams]

I dont literally think every BB album after holland is crap but its widely agreed that they were weak. And there were earlier albums that weren't thar strong either like friends...but so tough without marcella is undeniably weak any by no means essential. Its not a crucial collectible like all summer long-summer days-pet sounds-wild honey etc. Is that a better clarification?

[Custom Machine]

On the original 16 track of FALLIN' IN LOVE, just before the master take begins, Dennis (who was singing live during the basic tracking) quietly announces, "'So Tough' by Carl and the Passions."

This is really fascinating.  Could Dennis have been contemplating that Fallin' In Love would be on the next BB album following Sunflower, and thinking at the time, I guess some time in late 1970, that the next album would be titled Carl and the Passions So Tough (or some derivation thereof)?

And exactly why did Sound of Free/Lady see release under the name Dennis Wilson and Rumbo, and was not released in the US?  And why is the sound quality so poor on the single, especially on Sound of Free, which comes across sounding like it's being played through a small inexpensive transistor radio, with virtually no low end or high end, just a bunch of tinny midrange?

[Andrew G. Doe]

Carl and the Passions was either a group Carl dabbled with prior to the Beach Boys OR a name the Beach Boys considered before someone else named them instead.  

Allegedly, and I stress the allegedly, the name originated in highschool when Brian wanted Carl to sing in an ad-hoc band he was putting together for a school assembly. Carl said no, so Brian threatened to call the band Carl & The Passions. Daft enough to be true.  

As for the album itself, been saying for decades, it's more four singles* than an album... and seriously, how bad did some of the outtakes have to be that they had to beg Dennis for two cuts from his solo album then in progress ?

[* - the BW/JR single, the TM single, the DW single and the Flame single]

[TMinthePM]

I bought Carl and the Passions off the wrack back in, what - '72. Loved the cover art from the first. In fact I'd say it's the best cover art they ever put out. It got into a heavy rotation in my gang of n'er-do -wells, along with Stevie Wonder, Argent and the Moody Blues - Art Rock I suppose. It sounds just like Holland.  I think of them as being essentially the same album and have mixed them together with a couple of Charles Lloyd tracks. Don't think I ever listened to the copy of Pet Sounds that came packaged with it.

[Smilin Ed H]

Over the years, I've grown to like it, but it still seems a little lacking. I would have liked Out in the Country on it too. To be honest, I'm not a great fan of Mess of Help. I like Marcella, Cuddle Up and All This Is That, Don't mind Hold On. I think it's their weakest album between Pet Sounds and Holland. By far.  What were the other tracks in contention? Ten Years of Harmony?

[Mike's Beard]

I'm guessing if Bruce had remained in the band Ten Years of Harmony would have been on the record. Rooftop Harry was from around this time. I always wish Brian had offered up Sweet Mountain for the guys.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Over the years, I've grown to like it, but it still seems a little lacking. I would have liked Out in the Country on it too. To be honest, I'm not a great fan of Mess of Help. I like Marcella, Cuddle Up and All This Is That, Don't mind Hold On. I think it's their weakest album between Pet Sounds and Holland. By far.  What were the other tracks in contention? Ten Years of Harmony?

Ask and ye shall recieve...:

gigs & sessions 1971

gigs & sessions 1972

[Smilin Ed H]

I know, I know, I( know. I should've looked it up but I was in a hurry. I feel guilty. Sorry!!!!!

I can only comment on what I've heard, and I'm not familiar with Beatrice (which morphed into Mess of Help) or Body Talk or Spark in the Dark. I have heard It's a New Day, Out in the Country and Bruce's Ten Years of Harmony* the first two of which I wouldn't have minded on the album - it's a pretty short album anyhow - but I would still peg it as their weakest between Pet Sounds and Holland

* Or was it Brand New Old Friends? About the Marx Brothers but sentimental and sappy, but I'd have it on the album

[Custom Machine]

On the original 16 track of FALLIN' IN LOVE, just before the master take begins, Dennis (who was singing live during the basic tracking) quietly announces, "'So Tough' by Carl and the Passions."

This is really fascinating.  Could Dennis have been contemplating that Fallin' In Love would be on the next BB album following Sunflower, and thinking at the time, I guess some time in late 1970, that the next album would be titled Carl and the Passions So Tough (or some derivation thereof)?

And exactly why did Sound of Free/Lady see release under the name Dennis Wilson and Rumbo, and was not released in the US?  And why is the sound quality so poor on the single, especially on Sound of Free, which comes across sounding like it's being played through a small inexpensive transistor radio, with virtually no low end or high end, just a bunch of tinny midrange?

Checking Bellagio, which I should have done in the first place, I see that Lady/Fallin' In Love was recorded in Dec 1969.  So if Dennis was somehow seriously making reference to the title of the next BB album, it would have been for Sunflower rather than Surfs Up.

[bgas]

On the original 16 track of FALLIN' IN LOVE, just before the master take begins, Dennis (who was singing live during the basic tracking) quietly announces, "'So Tough' by Carl and the Passions."

This is really fascinating.  Could Dennis have been contemplating that Fallin' In Love would be on the next BB album following Sunflower, and thinking at the time, I guess some time in late 1970, that the next album would be titled Carl and the Passions So Tough (or some derivation thereof)?

And exactly why did Sound of Free/Lady see release under the name Dennis Wilson and Rumbo, and was not released in the US?  And why is the sound quality so poor on the single, especially on Sound of Free, which comes across sounding like it's being played through a small inexpensive transistor radio, with virtually no low end or high end, just a bunch of tinny midrange?

Checking Bellagio, which I should have done in the first place, I see that Lady/Fallin' In Love was recorded in Dec 1969.  So if Dennis was somehow seriously making reference to the title of the next BB album, it would have been for Sunflower rather than Surfs Up.

Which means Dennis deserves Sole credit for the LP title as someone subsequently used his voiced thought

[adamghost]

The more I think about it, the album almost seems like something they needed to come up with to hang on/pair with the rerelease of PET SOUNDS, rather than vice versa.  I'm not saying that's what it was, but it would explain a lot.

They really were kind of in a tight spot because Carl didn't really write (I mean of course he did, but he was probably the least prolific writer in the whole band, with only two songs under his belt as of CATP), so he couldn't really spearhead the band without songs to work with, and that meant cadging them out of Brian or Dennis or molding what Mike and Al brought to the table, which probably didn't jibe with where he thought the band should go in 1972.  No surprise in that situation that Ricky and Blondie were brought in and given two songs straightaway.

[Moon Dawg]

 Warner wanted CARL & THE PASSIONS as part of a double set with the version of SMILE assembled by Carl Wilson around this time. When SMILE '72 wasn't forthcoming, they made PET SOUNDS record two of the set. I think that's the case anyway.


  It's the least of the four early 70s Beach Boys' albums but never offensive and sometimes rather good. Agree that "Sweet Mountain" would have been a nice addition. 

[Andrew G. Doe]

The Reprise contract called for a master for Smile to be delivered no later than May 1973. Another clause included the rights to all post-Party ! Capitol albums, and seemingly someone had the bright idea of pairing them with new Reprise releases. It's an area I'd like to know more about...

[Jason Penick]

C&TP reminds me of the Mothers of Invention album Cruising with Ruben & the Jets, which actually spawned a band of that name, led by one Ruben Guevara...

I think this insight is on the money. I read a Beach Boys interview where a few members of the group were hyping up this album.

[Custom Machine]

The Reprise contract called for a master for Smile to be delivered no later than May 1973. Another clause included the rights to all post-Party ! Capitol albums, and seemingly someone had the bright idea of pairing them with new Reprise releases. It's an area I'd like to know more about...

I'd like to know more about this as well.  For sure Capitol owned the rights to Pet Sounds, so what type of recompense were they given for the allowing Brother/Reprise to release that album?  Smiley Smile was released on the Brother Record label, but the BBs went back to Capitol for Wild Honey, Friends, and 20/20.  Since the rights for everything thru 20/20 reverted to Capitol many years ago, I'm assuming the rights for Brother/Reprise to release these albums either had a set end date or ended when the BBs were no longer signed to Warner Reprise.

It would have been interesting to see how the track listing for Endless Summer and Spirit of America would have changed if Capitol still had the rights to tracks such as Wouldn't It Be Nice, Sloop John B, God Only Knows, Darlin, and Do It Again.  Personally, I liked it better the way it played out, with the earlier stuff appearing on Endless Summer and Spirit of America in 1974 and 75, and Pet Sounds (single LP by itself), Wild Honey & 20/20 (double LP), and Friends & Smiley Smile (double LP) all seeing re-release on Brother/Reprise during the BBs resurgence of 1974, followed by a "Best of" in 1975 featuring songs from every BB album from Pet Sounds thru Holland except for CATP-ST.

At what point after the Warner Reprise contract was signed did the guys start lobbying Brian to finish Smile?  Had he agreed to the original deadline of May 1973, or was he initially unaware of it's presence in the Warner Reprise contract?  And at what point did it become very apparent that Brian had no desire to revisit the Smile tracks and it's release at that time wasn't gonna happen?  Being a huge fan back then, I don't recall any PR saying that a release of Smile was forthcoming, or even being considered.

I remember hearing two theories as to why Pet Sounds was coupled with CATP-ST in the US back in 1972.  The first was the claim, as Andrew mentioned, that each of the five albums from Pet Sounds thru 20/20 would be paired with a new BB release, which seems like an idiotic idea, but it did in fact happen with CATP in the US (but not elsewhere where EMI still owned the rights to the five albums in question), and I do recall reading somewhere in print back then that that was why Pet Sounds was coupled with CATP.  The second was the claim that Warner Reprise found CATP to be such a weak album that they felt compelled to add Pet Sounds to CATP-ST to either (1) offer the consumer more for their money, or (2) show Brian and the BBs what they were once capable of, or (3) a combination of both.

[srealist]

I always assumed it was packaged with Pet Sounds because it would have needed a mess of help to stand alone.

Ahem.  I'll show myself out now.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Pray do. The door is over there.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I always assumed it was packaged with Pet Sounds because it would have needed a mess of help to stand alone.

Ahem.  I'll show myself out now.

 Good one!



Unpopular opinion time....this is one of my favorite BB albums, period, and some days I prefer it to Surf's Up, although it still falls below Sunflower and Holland to me. It could've used a couple of more songs, though, and I run hot and cold with 'Make it Good'. Also, the mix leaves a bit to be desired at times...although instrumentally it is ace, sometimes the vocals are buried a bit. Other than that, though, the album is tits. And despite the prevalent belief that Brian is nowhere to be found, he's actually present on three.... Mess of Help and He Come Down were at least partially produced by him, and is audible vocally on the backups for Mess, He Come Down, and Marcella (the latter two sounding suspiciously like his 1975 self....)