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Author Topic: Brian's Voice Change  (Read 15994 times)
Mikie
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« on: April 27, 2015, 10:27:29 AM »

I’ve always been somewhat fascinated about Brian’s voice change in the early to mid 70’s. To me, it was one of the biggest losses in the group, other than Carls’ and Dennis’ death of course. After Brian’s voice changed, it affected the group (and solo) vocals forever.

Brian Wilson’s voice changed dramatically in 1975. His vocal chords had already started to decline as early as 1970 when it was evident that his voice was starting to get a little thinner, especially on the high parts. On Mt. Vernon & Fairway it was different. On the intro to “California Saga” you can tell the voice wasn’t as strong as it was before. If you listen to the interview with Jim Pewter in the Fall of 1974 and the interview with the Australian DJ, he still talked with a clear voice. Then, in 1975, you can hear a distinct difference (example: In The Back Of My Mind demo). In this song you hear the last remaining clear voice transitioning to the raspy one. There have been many theories over the years as to why Brian lost his clear singing voice. To me the obvious cause was a combination of hash, cocaine and a 5 pack a day cigarette habit. But on occasion after 1975, Brian could still sing in his trademark falsetto when he forced it. *

One time a poster (BJL) posted here on the Smiley that he’d heard or read that Marilyn Wilson-Rutherford said that Brian “changed his voice on purpose”. Someone else said that he damaged his voice on purpose to “sound more manly”. I’d never heard or read about this before. Did it mean that he abused his vocal chords with drugs and cigs on purpose, knowing it would permanently give him a deeper, raspier voice? I just have a hard time with that. My opinion is that the voice change happened inadvertently, by accident.

I don’t think this subject has ever been put to rest with a cast in stone conclusion. We haven’t had a poll in awhile and I’d like to get a consensus on what the board members think about Brian’s voice change in the 70’s. Brian some evidence if you can. Let's see what we come up with!

*Caveat  Matchpoint Of Our Love, and Wontcha Come Out Tonight - 1978
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« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2015, 10:38:36 AM »

Didn't Al go on the record as saying Brian intentionally chainsmoked to get a deeper voice?
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« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2015, 10:46:47 AM »

Mikie...I recall reading somewhere...a long, long time ago that Brian was very self conscious about his voice...particularly his falsetto.  He thought that the girls were laughing at him especially at live shows.  Yet...there were enough falsetto voices back when the group first started to roll [Frankie Vallie, Lou Christie, the Tokens etc] that he decided to soldier on.  In coming off the road Brian would have lost touch with fan appreciation.  Also by 1965-66 it became pretty clear that Carl was at least as good at it as Brian was.

Reading some of that Jack Rieley material reposted the other day also suggested that Brian was pissed off about the lack of success and acceptance as it pertained to Heroes and Villains and that his multiple reactions may well have included some kind of payback or revenge motive.  To who?  Everybody.  The band, the record company and the fans who seemingly weren't ready for his creative 'times'.

I think that it may well be that a disillusioned/disiillusional Brian decided to render all of his talents useless.  He stopped composing.  Stopped looking after his physical well-being.  Virtually stopped participating.  I'm sure he regrets THAT self sustained abuse now as he has spent a LOT of time trying to get it back vocally...taking voice lessons and no doubt eating and drinking things which might help.  He's clearly better at singing on note and sweetly now than he was say around the OCA period.

The smoke and booze abuse had loads to do with it...but I'm afraid that Brian had a sense of purpose and a goal in mind with the volume of that abuse.  Seems like it was a 'plan'.
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« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2015, 10:51:37 AM »

Didn't Al go on the record as saying Brian intentionally chainsmoked to get a deeper voice?

I believe Jon Stebbins confirmed this in Beach Boys FAQ.  I believe it's the chapter on Beach Boys career missteps.  And there's a segment called "Brian's Back-But His Voice Isn't"  

As Stebbins wrote, Brian's voice improved once he got clean, but it was never the same.  
« Last Edit: April 27, 2015, 11:11:18 AM by KDS » Logged
Paul J B
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« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2015, 11:16:11 AM »

Really glad you started this topic and I hope it leads to something concrete. 48 years of speculation and arguing about Smile is bad enough but this issue should not be so puzzling.
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« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2015, 11:26:06 AM »

Also by 1965-66 it became pretty clear that Carl was at least as good at it as Brian was.


Are you sure Carl was? He rarely sang falsetto, especially during the live shows of this time in which Al or Bruce covered the Brian parts.  Sidenote, Al did a hell of a job.
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« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2015, 11:56:46 AM »

I sort of felt Brian's voice was even less appealing on the BB85 album, kind of nasal, whiny and slurry, except on Getcha Back. I could listen to a whole album of Brian's In the Back Of My Mind '75 ultra soulful vocals.
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Mikie
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« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2015, 12:30:17 PM »

Mikie...I recall reading somewhere...a long, long time ago that Brian was very self conscious about his voice...particularly his falsetto. He thought that the girls were laughing at him especially at live shows.

Yes, I read about that too, Lee. Brian even said as much during concerts a few years ago, that he "use to sing like a girl."

I'm sure he regrets THAT self sustained abuse now as he has spent a LOT of time trying to get it back vocally...taking voice lessons and no doubt eating and drinking things which might help.  He's clearly better at singing on note and sweetly now than he was say around the OCA period. The smoke and booze abuse had loads to do with it...but I'm afraid that Brian had a sense of purpose and a goal in mind with the volume of that abuse.  Seems like it was a 'plan'.

I gotta think he regrets it too, Lee. You bring up some good points here -still not 100% convinced that he did his voice in on purpose, knowing it would damage his vocal chords forever. Brian's book is coming out - hopefully he'll touch on the subject.
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« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2015, 12:40:01 PM »

Didn't Al go on the record as saying Brian intentionally chainsmoked to get a deeper voice?

I believe Jon Stebbins confirmed this in Beach Boys FAQ.  I believe it's the chapter on Beach Boys career missteps.  And there's a segment called "Brian's Back-But His Voice Isn't"  

As Stebbins wrote, Brian's voice improved once he got clean, but it was never the same.  

Thanks. I somehow missed that. Will have to go back and read it again. He definitely didn't go cold turkey right away on the smokes, and continued on into the early 80's. "Night Was So Young" and "Sheri She Needs Me" were two examples where he managed to get that falsetto out again in 1976. 

But if he had already "succeeded" in changing his voice on purpose in 1975, why did he continue smoking into the early 80's? The damage was done, but the nicotine habit obviously hit him hard. Did he ever stop after Landy took over? Maybe briefly, but not again until many years later.
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I, I love the colorful clothes she wears, and she's already working on my brain. I only looked in her eyes, but I picked up something I just can't explain. I, I bet I know what she’s like, and I can feel how right she’d be for me. It’s weird how she comes in so strong, and I wonder what she’s picking up from me. I hope it’s good, good, good, good vibrations, yeah!!
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« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2015, 12:41:34 PM »

Really glad you started this topic and I hope it leads to something concrete. 48 years of speculation and arguing about Smile is bad enough but this issue should not be so puzzling.

That's what I was thinking, Paul.
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I, I love the colorful clothes she wears, and she's already working on my brain. I only looked in her eyes, but I picked up something I just can't explain. I, I bet I know what she’s like, and I can feel how right she’d be for me. It’s weird how she comes in so strong, and I wonder what she’s picking up from me. I hope it’s good, good, good, good vibrations, yeah!!
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« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2015, 12:50:07 PM »

I'd love to hear more about this.

Also, I don't think anyone has been able to touch the "amazingness" of Brian's falsetto.
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« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2015, 12:50:57 PM »


But if he had already "succeeded" in changing his voice on purpose in 1975, why did he continue smoking into the early 80's? The damage was done, but the nicotine habit obviously hit him hard. Did he ever stop after Landy took over? Maybe briefly, but not again until many years later.

When you're suffering from undiagnosed bipolar disorder you will do just about anything to avoid the crazy peaks and valleys.
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« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2015, 12:52:49 PM »


But if he had already "succeeded" in changing his voice on purpose in 1975, why did he continue smoking into the early 80's? The damage was done, but the nicotine habit obviously hit him hard. Did he ever stop after Landy took over? Maybe briefly, but not again until many years later.

When you're suffering from undiagnosed bipolar disorder you will do just about anything to avoid the crazy peaks and valleys.

Sadly, I can personally vouch for this.
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« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2015, 12:56:55 PM »

We only hear the anecdotal stuff from the books and interviews, and what Brian feels like talking about. The way the man felt personally is a thought I dare not have because I fear it will end up depressing me way too much. All one needs to know is that when you're feeling THAT empty and THAT worthless, you will do anything in your power to remove that feeling, even if it's only a few seconds. Some turn to smoking, some turn to food, some turn to drugs. Brian, unfortunately, turned to all three.
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« Reply #14 on: April 27, 2015, 12:59:29 PM »

Some turn to smoking, some turn to food, some turn to drugs. Brian, unfortunately, turned to all three.

..........and I guess he hit the sauce pretty good for awhile too.
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I, I love the colorful clothes she wears, and she's already working on my brain. I only looked in her eyes, but I picked up something I just can't explain. I, I bet I know what she’s like, and I can feel how right she’d be for me. It’s weird how she comes in so strong, and I wonder what she’s picking up from me. I hope it’s good, good, good, good vibrations, yeah!!
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« Reply #15 on: April 27, 2015, 01:00:11 PM »

Well said TRBB.
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« Reply #16 on: April 27, 2015, 01:26:50 PM »

The deterioration of Brian's and Dennis' voices is one of the saddest things in all of Beachboydom. On the flip side, Carl apparently smoked like a chimney for many years, and yet his voice remained clear and strong all  of his all too brief life.
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« Reply #17 on: April 27, 2015, 02:08:32 PM »

If Brian was trying to destroy his falsetto, why did he keep singing in falsetto during those years?
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« Reply #18 on: April 27, 2015, 02:13:03 PM »

I dunno, but "Getcha Back" in '85 was another one that sounded pretty good with his falsetto!
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I, I love the colorful clothes she wears, and she's already working on my brain. I only looked in her eyes, but I picked up something I just can't explain. I, I bet I know what she’s like, and I can feel how right she’d be for me. It’s weird how she comes in so strong, and I wonder what she’s picking up from me. I hope it’s good, good, good, good vibrations, yeah!!
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« Reply #19 on: April 27, 2015, 02:49:22 PM »

The deterioration of Brian's and Dennis' voices is one of the saddest things in all of Beachboydom. On the flip side, Carl apparently smoked like a chimney for many years, and yet his voice remained clear and strong all  of his all too brief life.

The difference: Brian and Dennis did a lot of cocaine. (And Brian snorted heroin, too.) That'll even ruin your voice worse than tobacco smoke. I'm sure Carl did some blow too but undoubtedly not nearly as much as his brothers.

I dunno, but "Getcha Back" in '85 was another one that sounded pretty good with his falsetto!

IIRC, they got one good take of Brian and they dropped that vocal line in where necessary.

BTW, didn't I read somewhere in this forum that someone once overheard Brian some time in 1978 in a room by himself with a piano, playing and singing --- with his 1963 voice?
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« Reply #20 on: April 27, 2015, 02:58:11 PM »

I remember a guy on the Cab board who once said that the coke wouldn't have caused Brian's vocals to get raspy.

I said, bullllll sh*t, massive amounts of coke over time would hit the vocal chords (and sinuses) like shrapnel and tear it to shreds!!

He didn't believe me, but 4 or 5 other people did. Smoking a lot of hash didn't help matters either. Burns like a mofo.
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I, I love the colorful clothes she wears, and she's already working on my brain. I only looked in her eyes, but I picked up something I just can't explain. I, I bet I know what she’s like, and I can feel how right she’d be for me. It’s weird how she comes in so strong, and I wonder what she’s picking up from me. I hope it’s good, good, good, good vibrations, yeah!!
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« Reply #21 on: April 27, 2015, 03:00:11 PM »

IIRC, they got one good take of Brian and they dropped that vocal line in where necessary.

BTW, didn't I read somewhere in this forum that someone once overheard Brian some time in 1978 in a room by himself with a piano, playing and singing --- with his 1963 voice?


I remember that post! It was someone talking about going to the recording of MIU and finding Brian alone in a room with a piano playing a really happy sounding song, although they were too nervous to approach him about it.
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« Reply #22 on: April 27, 2015, 03:03:54 PM »

IIRC, they got one good take of Brian and they dropped that vocal line in [Getcha Back] where necessary.

I read that Jeff Foskett doubled it.  But unmistakeably, I hear Brian a LOT more than Jeff on that part.  I still think it's all Brian. [/quote]

BTW, didn't I read somewhere in this forum that someone once overheard Brian some time in 1978 in a room by himself with a piano, playing and singing --- with his 1963 voice?

I'm sure you've heard Brian and the piano on "I Sleep Alone" where he switches back and forth between voices.
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I, I love the colorful clothes she wears, and she's already working on my brain. I only looked in her eyes, but I picked up something I just can't explain. I, I bet I know what she’s like, and I can feel how right she’d be for me. It’s weird how she comes in so strong, and I wonder what she’s picking up from me. I hope it’s good, good, good, good vibrations, yeah!!
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« Reply #23 on: April 27, 2015, 03:49:40 PM »

IIRC, they got one good take of Brian and they dropped that vocal line in [Getcha Back] where necessary.

I read that Jeff Foskett doubled it.  But unmistakeably, I hear Brian a LOT more than Jeff on that part.  I still think it's all Brian.

BTW, didn't I read somewhere in this forum that someone once overheard Brian some time in 1978 in a room by himself with a piano, playing and singing --- with his 1963 voice?

I'm sure you've heard Brian and the piano on "I Sleep Alone" where he switches back and forth between voices.
[/quote]

Great vocal.

The thing is Brian also sounded good when he started putting more vibrato on his voice to sound manly.  Was it Largo or Jimmy Carter's Inauguration where Brian warms up his 'manly' voice at the mic as if he's 'some kind of an opera star?'  Hilarious stuff and obviously a Brian 'put on'.
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« Reply #24 on: April 27, 2015, 04:35:10 PM »

I don't think we should put the deterioration of Brian's voice in the same category as the deterioration of Dennis's voice. Well Brian's voice was definitely a case of cigarettes and drug abuse, I have always felt that Dennis' changes came about from being punched in the throat and his inability to baby his voice as it recovered.
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