-->
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
March 29, 2024, 07:50:18 AM

Login with username, password and session length
Search:     Advanced search
News: peteramescarlin.com
Home Help Search Calendar Login Register
+  The Smiley Smile Message Board
|-+  Non Smiley Smile Stuff
| |-+  The Sandbox
| | |-+  Campaign 2016
Pages: 1 ... 46 47 48 49 50 [51] 52 53 54 55 56 ... 81   Go Down
Print
Author Topic: Campaign 2016  (Read 523229 times)
0 Members and 9 Guests are viewing this topic.
♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
Pissing off drunks since 1978
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11844


🍦🍦 Pet Demon for Sale - $5 or best offer ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1250 on: July 24, 2016, 11:06:03 AM »



NBC poll (which I voted in) has it...

Quote
Donald Trump   11940   30%
Hillary Clinton   9945   25%
Jill Stein   6528 17%
Gary Johnson   10792   27%
Other   244 1%


Of course, the system is rigged to keep the archaic two party system alive, so no way in hell that would happen in the 'real' world.

Quote
But in my view voting for Clinton could very well be the most ethical decision in some cases

I will not vote for someone I despise just because I despise the other guy more. I'm going to vote for someone I actually support. If more people thought like that, this country would be in so much better shape.
Logged

Need your song mixed/mastered? Contact me at fear2stop@yahoo.com. Serious inquiries only, please!
♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
Pissing off drunks since 1978
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11844


🍦🍦 Pet Demon for Sale - $5 or best offer ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1251 on: July 24, 2016, 11:12:08 AM »

Also, there are some 'joke' votes in the other section...write in votes included 4 for Adolph Hitler.  Funny....I thought he already had 11940 votes in the poll already.
Logged

Need your song mixed/mastered? Contact me at fear2stop@yahoo.com. Serious inquiries only, please!
Emily
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2022


View Profile
« Reply #1252 on: July 24, 2016, 11:26:28 AM »

There are significant differences between Clinton and Trump.
-My main concern is Supreme Court justices. The next president will clearly have 1 seat to fill, most likely 3. Those appointments will be on the bench for 20-30 years, easily.
Some of the issues they will face will be voter suppression laws; gerrymandering; the voting rights act; the right to discriminate based on religion; gay marriage; abortion rights; Citizen's United; gun control. If you supported Sanders, and understand the issues, you would agree with Clinton's Supreme Court picks on these issues, not Trump's.
-Second, foreign policy: while all US foreign policy is always heinous, some policies are unethical and deadly and based on corporate greed, while others could easily lead to WWIII. Letting Putin know that he doesn't take NATO seriously and does not commit to supporting NATO countries if they are invaded is a very dangerous message. For Trump's ties to Putin, see:
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/trump-putin-yes-it-s-really-a-thing
Trump's general idea that the US is not beholden to its treaties and his support for nuclear proliferation and his support for dictators should be extremely troubling. I don't support the bulk of Clinton's foreign policies, but it's our traditional evil, while Trump's is a whole other level of dangerous.
-Third, Trump plays footsie with white supremacists. Check them out on his twitter feed acknowledging to each other that Trump is tacitly encouraging them. Trump has a long documented history of racism. http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/24/opinion/sunday/is-donald-trump-a-racist.html?_r=0 I guarantee there will be increased street violence against minorities if he's elected.
-Fourth, misogyny.
-Fifth, authoritarianism and his complete lack of respect for, and apparent ignorance of, our system of governance.
-Sixth, lies - check the record.
-Seventh - Trump business plan: get loans to purchase something; hire contractors to upgrade it, but don't pay them; suck as much income out of it for himself while the business dies; declare bankruptcy for the business, stiffing the creditors, but keeping his personal income safe; declare himself a success.
 And despite all those shenanigans, he STILL hasn't made any more profit than the interest on an index fund would've made them.
He's a complete failure in everything except fooling fools..
-Eighth, the disaster his trade wars and tax cuts will visit on the economy.


Clinton supports policies that encourage grossly unequal income distribution and she is a hawk. That, a racist comment in the '90s and her response to Bill Clinton's sexual harassment, are her negatives.
Trump's negatives are so very much worse.

Regarding third-party candidates. The fact is that a third party will never succeed in our country. It's built into the structure.

"Progressives", "Liberals", "the left" whatever you want to call them, gave us Nixon, more Nixon, a brief shining moment of Jimmy Carter just because they were lucky Nixon screwed up so badly, Reagan, Reagan, Bush, Clinton, Clinton, Bush, Bush, Obama, Obama.
How? By refusing to hold their noses and play within the system. They sat it out or fought it out while liberals were nominated time after time and lost. Bill Clinton won because liberals failed to deliver for more left candidates.

Ralph Reed, with the Christian Coalition, announced in the early '90s that they were going to move their focus from lobbying congress to funding and organizing local campaigns for right-wing Christians; they got them onto school boards and town councils across the country. Remember when "intelligent design" became a school thing? A few years after the Christian Coalition moved focus.

Then they organized and funded campaigns to get those same local candidates into state legislatures. Remember when states started tinkering with abortion laws? A few more years after the Christian Coalition moved focus.

Then they organized and funded campaigns to get those same local candidates into governorships and the US House. Remember when Michele Bachmann, Sarah Palin, Scott Walker and Mike Pence, etc. showed up? A few years more years later.

The Tea Party was planned and organized and funded for two decades and over-ran the Republican Party. The party is barely recognizable now.

If progressives want to be serious, they should stop complaining about not getting their way this one year they decided to show up, and get organized and focused on building a cohort of Democrats to change the party I'm hoping this is what Sanders' planned organizations will do.

Voting for a third party just contributes to progressives being ignored. They scatter around, some vote here, some vote there, some don't vote, they blog about their anger, but they don't organize. Sanders made a good start, but as usual, his messy followers are too protest-oriented to be effective.

I'm so tired of watching the American left fail decade after decade. And Sander's supporters are indicating they will be no different. Register your protest vote and you can feel good about your conscience, while the Democratic Party keeps moving right, and the Republican Party moves right off the spectrum, because progressives render themselves irrelevant to the process.

But I don't think the consciences of progressives should feel so good, because their failures are what got us here.




Logged
Chocolate Shake Man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2871


View Profile
« Reply #1253 on: July 24, 2016, 11:41:17 AM »

I will not vote for someone I despise just because I despise the other guy more. I'm going to vote for someone I actually support. If more people thought like that, this country would be in so much better shape.

In my view though, I agree with Chomsky's essential point which is that the country would be in better shape if it cared less about who they voted for and more about creating the circumstances that would allow for activist communities that have a genuine impact. And the fact is that Clinton being in power allows for that far more than Trump does, whether or not one agrees with her policies (and I, for the most part, do not).
Logged
♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
Pissing off drunks since 1978
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11844


🍦🍦 Pet Demon for Sale - $5 or best offer ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1254 on: July 24, 2016, 12:07:52 PM »

Quote
Clinton supports policies that encourage grossly unequal income distribution

For me, that's a major issue, as is the fact that just about every 'final 2' presidential candidate  support said policies. More of the same at a time when this country needs far better.

Quote
Regarding third-party candidates. The fact is that a third party will never succeed in our country. It's built into the structure.

As is this. If more of us got organized (as you pointed out, and yes I definitely agree), there would be legitimate change. But too many of us just waste time pissing and moaning.

My major issue is that when one's chosen candidate loses , it becomes more about stopping the other guy than getting their beliefs out there. I wish more would stand up for the convictions rather than turn tail and run. That's why I long for the days when a 3rd party candidate can be truly viable, rather than this illusion of choice.

So yeah, between the two, I'd rather Clinton than Trump, but...I'd rather neither.
Logged

Need your song mixed/mastered? Contact me at fear2stop@yahoo.com. Serious inquiries only, please!
Chocolate Shake Man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2871


View Profile
« Reply #1255 on: July 24, 2016, 12:11:04 PM »

So yeah, between the two, I'd rather Clinton than Trump, but...I'd rather neither.

I agree. Again, though, the best way to get to a point in time where neither is a possibility is if Clinton wins now.
Logged
♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
Pissing off drunks since 1978
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11844


🍦🍦 Pet Demon for Sale - $5 or best offer ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1256 on: July 24, 2016, 12:15:08 PM »

So yeah, between the two, I'd rather Clinton than Trump, but...I'd rather neither.

I agree. Again, though, the best way to get to a point in time where neither is a possibility is if Clinton wins now.

Good point.

I'd say the same holds true if Trump wins, but if that happens, I think the country would fall apart before that happened, and I'd run like hell to Canada anyway.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2016, 12:18:34 PM by ♩♬ Billy C ♯♫♩ » Logged

Need your song mixed/mastered? Contact me at fear2stop@yahoo.com. Serious inquiries only, please!
SMiLE Brian
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 8432



View Profile
« Reply #1257 on: July 24, 2016, 12:20:28 PM »

CSM, you taking rental deposits if Trump wins. Wink
Logged

And production aside, I’d so much rather hear a 14 year old David Marks shred some guitar on Chug-a-lug than hear a 51 year old Mike Love sing about bangin some chick in a swimming pool.-rab2591
Chocolate Shake Man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2871


View Profile
« Reply #1258 on: July 24, 2016, 12:23:37 PM »

I'll say this now to everyone: our place doesn't have that much space.
Logged
Emily
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2022


View Profile
« Reply #1259 on: July 24, 2016, 12:23:49 PM »

I forgot to mention the most terrifying Trump things: Mass deportations and Muslim IDs.
If he carries out his plan for mass deportations, how do you envision it working? Federal agents would have to go around neighborhoods checking people's papers and rounding up the people who don't have them to show (speaking of which, I've lost my passport.) There could easily be 'mistakes' made.
Check out this awesome message from George Takei: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qc4Ps2JZgQ
Don't think citizens won't get wrongly caught up.

Also, both Trump and Gingrich have suggested that American Muslims should be ID'd and/or questioned about their loyalty.

This is truly dystopian stuff.
Logged
Emily
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2022


View Profile
« Reply #1260 on: July 24, 2016, 12:24:50 PM »

Don't worry, CSM. We've got this option!
http://www.theatlantic.com/video/index/491813/the-tiny-irish-island-that-will-welcome-american-refugees/
Logged
SMiLE Brian
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 8432



View Profile
« Reply #1261 on: July 24, 2016, 12:25:30 PM »

Okay CSM man! Grin.   Hopefully sanity prevails in the USA!
Logged

And production aside, I’d so much rather hear a 14 year old David Marks shred some guitar on Chug-a-lug than hear a 51 year old Mike Love sing about bangin some chick in a swimming pool.-rab2591
Emily
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2022


View Profile
« Reply #1262 on: July 24, 2016, 12:26:51 PM »

btw, CSM. I used to see Chomsky tooling around Cambridge in his rickety little car on a regular basis. He's looking mighty good for his age!
Logged
SMiLE Brian
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 8432



View Profile
« Reply #1263 on: July 24, 2016, 12:29:47 PM »

It's about the strength of big ideas! Razz
Logged

And production aside, I’d so much rather hear a 14 year old David Marks shred some guitar on Chug-a-lug than hear a 51 year old Mike Love sing about bangin some chick in a swimming pool.-rab2591
Chocolate Shake Man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2871


View Profile
« Reply #1264 on: July 24, 2016, 12:32:47 PM »

btw, CSM. I used to see Chomsky tooling around Cambridge in his rickety little car on a regular basis. He's looking mighty good for his age!

That story makes me happy.

I had the good fortune to meet Chomsky at a conference about nine years ago. My friend and I turned a corner and there he was, along with a few other notable figures. I shook his hand and said thank you and he was very gracious.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2016, 07:07:15 PM by Chocolate Shake Man » Logged
♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
Pissing off drunks since 1978
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11844


🍦🍦 Pet Demon for Sale - $5 or best offer ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1265 on: July 24, 2016, 12:34:56 PM »

I forgot to mention the most terrifying Trump things: Mass deportations and Muslim IDs.
If he carries out his plan for mass deportations, how do you envision it working? Federal agents would have to go around neighborhoods checking people's papers and rounding up the people who don't have them to show (speaking of which, I've lost my passport.) There could easily be 'mistakes' made.
Check out this awesome message from George Takei: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qc4Ps2JZgQ
Don't think citizens won't get wrongly caught up.

Also, both Trump and Gingrich have suggested that American Muslims should be ID'd and/or questioned about their loyalty.

This is truly dystopian stuff.



The fact that he has so many supporters scares the living sh*t out of me.
Logged

Need your song mixed/mastered? Contact me at fear2stop@yahoo.com. Serious inquiries only, please!
SMiLE Brian
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 8432



View Profile
« Reply #1266 on: July 24, 2016, 12:45:03 PM »

It's like a zombie movie in the south! People have lost their minds and I bet Texas is near the top of Trump insanity.
Logged

And production aside, I’d so much rather hear a 14 year old David Marks shred some guitar on Chug-a-lug than hear a 51 year old Mike Love sing about bangin some chick in a swimming pool.-rab2591
♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
Pissing off drunks since 1978
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11844


🍦🍦 Pet Demon for Sale - $5 or best offer ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1267 on: July 24, 2016, 12:57:56 PM »

It is...one of the many reasons I absolutely hate living here. Been here my whole life and never has and never will feel like home. I don't belong with the MURICA crowd. The day I get to finally move to Colorado (something I've wanted since I was a child) will be the day where I achieve inner nirvana.
Logged

Need your song mixed/mastered? Contact me at fear2stop@yahoo.com. Serious inquiries only, please!
thorgil
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 416


GREAT post, Rab!


View Profile
« Reply #1268 on: July 25, 2016, 11:30:10 AM »

I have an American friend who was born in Colorado and has still her family living there. According to what she says, it seems a really fine place. I hope you fulfill that wish, Billy. Smiley
Logged

DIT, DIT, DIT, HEROES AND VILLAINS...
♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
Pissing off drunks since 1978
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 11844


🍦🍦 Pet Demon for Sale - $5 or best offer ☮☮


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1269 on: July 25, 2016, 11:59:42 AM »

Thankya big big Cool
Logged

Need your song mixed/mastered? Contact me at fear2stop@yahoo.com. Serious inquiries only, please!
bachelorofbullets
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 58


View Profile
« Reply #1270 on: July 26, 2016, 10:43:42 AM »

Quote
I forgot to mention the most terrifying Trump things: Mass deportations and Muslim IDs.
If he carries out his plan for mass deportations, how do you envision it working? Federal agents would have to go around neighborhoods checking people's papers and rounding up the people who don't have them to show (speaking of which, I've lost my passport.) There could easily be 'mistakes' made.

Deporting 20 million illegal immigrants is not possible logistically.  Trump knows this, but that does not stop him from playing it up.  It is possible he could get a "right to work list" bill passed, and then make it a federal mandate, so local governments would have to comply.  I don't see any other way to do it except put the onus on the employers themselves.
Logged
Emily
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2022


View Profile
« Reply #1271 on: July 26, 2016, 11:03:30 AM »

Quote
I forgot to mention the most terrifying Trump things: Mass deportations and Muslim IDs.
If he carries out his plan for mass deportations, how do you envision it working? Federal agents would have to go around neighborhoods checking people's papers and rounding up the people who don't have them to show (speaking of which, I've lost my passport.) There could easily be 'mistakes' made.

Deporting 20 million illegal immigrants is not possible logistically.  Trump knows this, but that does not stop him from playing it up.  It is possible he could get a "right to work list" bill passed, and then make it a federal mandate, so local governments would have to comply.  I don't see any other way to do it except put the onus on the employers themselves.
I agree it's not possible. I don't think that will necessarily deter Trump from trying. And trying in ways that would be very destructive. He's not shown himself to be concerned about the impact his statements or actions have on other people.
Logged
filledeplage
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 3151


View Profile
« Reply #1272 on: July 26, 2016, 01:17:42 PM »

Quote
I forgot to mention the most terrifying Trump things: Mass deportations and Muslim IDs.
If he carries out his plan for mass deportations, how do you envision it working? Federal agents would have to go around neighborhoods checking people's papers and rounding up the people who don't have them to show (speaking of which, I've lost my passport.) There could easily be 'mistakes' made.

Deporting 20 million illegal immigrants is not possible logistically.  Trump knows this, but that does not stop him from playing it up.  It is possible he could get a "right to work list" bill passed, and then make it a federal mandate, so local governments would have to comply.  I don't see any other way to do it except put the onus on the employers themselves.
I agree it's not possible. I don't think that will necessarily deter Trump from trying. And trying in ways that would be very destructive. He's not shown himself to be concerned about the impact his statements or actions have on other people.
Probably it is impossible to deport that many with hearings, etc.  But what is the solution?

Today ISIS slit the throat of an 86 year old priest to kneel, to be "sacrificed" while offering Mass in Normandy.  This is not OK.

There was an attack by a suicide bomber in Mogadishu, today.  On top of a truck attack on Bastille Day last week.

There is an immigration code and procedural manual in the US, that is as fat as a phonebook to help people either come to the States as non-immigrants (to work) or to gain status as an immigrant and a pathway to be citizens.  As many categories as the alphabet and ordered that way.  "A" visas for diplomats, etc. 

There are rules to become a citizen that my grandparents followed and were "admitted, inspected (for health reasons)" and followed a path starting at Ellis Island to citizenship.  Seven siblings came through Ellis Island, and became productive citizens who assimilated into the US, learning English, four becoming veterans.

What would you suggest to be both compassionate and meet the needs of the American Citizens, to live in safety without fear of being attacked in our own land, as has happened all over Europe, Africa and in the States?

 
Logged
the captain
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 7255


View Profile
« Reply #1273 on: July 26, 2016, 04:02:50 PM »

The American citizens have no more to fear from immigrants than they do from themselves. It's just fiction that immigrants--illegal or otherwise--are more prone to violent crime, terrorism, etc. It's not true. You can trot out single examples, multiple examples, but it's not true that these things happen more than fully domestic crimes.

There is no massive highway from Saudi Arabia, Syria, Iraq, etc., to Mexico, where jihadists dressed as Mexicans sneak across our border, take up jobs as farm laborers or janitors, biding their time quietly while planning their massive infiltration of our country through dramatic terrorist means. Terrorists grow where they grow, there is no massive need to export or import. The ones here were usually born here and commit their atrocities here. Orlando, Dallas, Baton Rouge, to name recent examples.

The answer isn't obvious, but it is obvious that it isn't deporting tens of millions of people and building a wall. A fucking wall? It's absurd on its face and anyone who isn't an absolute idiot is well aware of this. It's fiction, and it's fiction that unnecessarily demonizes plenty of illegally here, but otherwise law-abiding, people whose sinister offense is trying to care for their families.

The ISIS-inspired attacks can--and will--continue regardless of our, France's, or anyone else's immigration policies. Our immigration issues, particularly through our southern border, and ISIS are not directly related issues. Building a wall can't and shouldn't help Americans "live in safety without fear of being attacked in our own land." We are attacked in our own land all the time by our own citizens. And fear isn't something a wall can solve, as it is an internal phenomenon stoked by people with financial and political interests in doing so.
Logged

Demon-Fighting Genius; Patronizing Twaddler; Argumentative, Sanctimonious Prick; Sensationalist Dullard; and Douche who (occasionally to rarely) puts songs here.

No interest in your assorted grudges and nonsense.
SMiLE Brian
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 8432



View Profile
« Reply #1274 on: July 26, 2016, 04:22:44 PM »

Exactly, it's fear and loathing in the Trump nation.
Logged

And production aside, I’d so much rather hear a 14 year old David Marks shred some guitar on Chug-a-lug than hear a 51 year old Mike Love sing about bangin some chick in a swimming pool.-rab2591
Pages: 1 ... 46 47 48 49 50 [51] 52 53 54 55 56 ... 81   Go Up
Print
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines
Page created in 0.376 seconds with 22 queries.