No Pier Pressure (board member reviews)

[Autotune]

Haven't listened to the whole album yet. But three things:

1) it's stupid to purport that negative reviews pursue an agenda or just don't get it. There may be an odd strange new poster or two, but other than that we're all fans and no one wants to or enjoys being disappointed.

2) an issue that occurs with every new BW release: just how much involvement did Brian have? How much input? How "Brian" is the new album? My guess is that, like others said, collaborations are just that, Brian's always been a collaborator and always managed to bring out of his partners special results. On occasion he probably coasted more, sometimes he was probably more active. Sometimes the collaborator colors Brian's music more or less depending on who knows how many factors. Joe Thomas' other music, or Scott's, or Peterik's, or the Wondermints', or Mike Love's, or Usher's, or Asher's, was/is never as interesting  as a whole as their collaborations with Brian were.

3) regarding the production and songwriting I've learned to "blame" only Brian. For me the clip-clops, sleighbells and other plethora of mid-60s beach boy patchwork that was found in much of his recent solo output did not sound very authentic to me. I imagined it was his band coming up with 40 year old quirks. No reason to think this current sound is inauthentic.

[phirnis]

1) it's stupid to purport that negative reviews pursue an agenda or just don't get it. There may be an odd strange new poster or two, but other than that we're all fans and no one wants to or enjoys being disappointed.

Thank you!

3) regarding the production and songwriting I've learned to "blame" only Brian. For me the clip-clops, sleighbells and other plethora of mid-60s beach boy patchwork that was found in much of his recent solo output did not sound very authentic to me. I imagined it was his band coming up with 40 year old quirks. No reason to think this current sound is inauthentic.

Do we actually know who came up with the bass harmonica, clip-clops, etc. production choices? Why do you assume/imagine anyone but Brian picked them?

[guitarfool2002]

It's a thousand times more interesting that the only track that has no identifiable ottotune, 'One Kind of Love', is the only song without a Joe Thomas credit.

[puni puni]

It's less authentic for a guy like Brian who worships Spector to have sleigh bells in his music than it is for him to release tracks with Glee production? After he's repeatedly stated that he dislikes modern music and hasn't listened to the radio since What a Fool Believes?

I'd like to see a journalist ask Brian: "Hey, you say you don't listen to new music, but this album sounds very 'hip'. How did you do that?"

[Debbie Keil-Leavitt]

It's a thousand times more interesting that the only track that has no identifiable ottotune, 'One Kind of Love', is the only song without a Joe Thomas credit.

Thank god you have Geraldo on this, GF!

[Mendota Heights]

I'd like to see a journalist ask Brian: "Hey, you say you don't listen to new music, but this album sounds very 'hip'. How did you do that?"

Why have you not asked that question yourself during one of the BW Q&A's lately?

[Wirestone]

So, it seems I missed the video that went along with the Yahoo article.

In that video, Brian replies specifically to the question of what Joe (and others) brought to the project.

In any interview with BW, the exact question that is asked is important. Here, Brian is picking up on an opportunity to highlight his collaborators, so he's talking about everything that Joe possibly does.

In the WSJ article, it looks like he was replying to a more general question about how he and Joe worked together, and he gave a more general answer. That is, Joe does some chords (implied there is that Brian does some too), Brian does most of the melody work and they both pitch in lyrical ideas.

For that matter, the Yahoo answer he gives about only 4-5 songs in the album not coming from the late 90s is demonstrably incorrect.

One Kind of Love (written for the movie), Our Special Love (written on tour with Joe and Foskett hanging around), Guess You Had to Be There, The Last Song, Sail Away (Peterik talks about doing new co-writing for NPP in his recently released autobiography) and Somewhere Quiet (SMNL with lyrics) are all either newer or older. That's six. And I can't believe the remaining 10 are exclusively Imagination-era.

[Wirestone]

1) it's stupid to purport that negative reviews pursue an agenda or just don't get it. There may be an odd strange new poster or two, but other than that we're all fans and no one wants to or enjoys being disappointed.

Um let me correct that for you. In band fandom, there are always people who enjoy being disappointed. Phil Cohen, anyone?

[PaulTMA]

There is nothing enjoyable about the disappointment of this album.

[HeyJude]

I would really just ignore the short, one-sentence "this album blows" posts and reviews, even if you don't like the album yourself. Anybody can and should post any opinion, but it's a pretty strong tell that someone that posts a one-line negative comment about the album and nothing more may not be interested in a detailed, thoughtful back-and-forth on the topic. That such reviews come from folks with super low post counts may or may not be a coincidence.

As for Brian's Yahoo video interview, those who think that's the definite statement from Brian on the authorship of the album, have you actually seen and read Brian interviews over the years? The Yahoo video interview clips show Brian quite lucid and talkative, but even in that case, I would never assume his VERY GENERAL comment about working with Joe Thomas as applying to every single thing they co-wrote on the album. For that matter, most any artist when asked to give a short response to a very general question, they are not going to go through 14 or 16 tracks and ascribe a percentage to each. No artist, including Brian, is often going to go: "Okay. "This Beautiful Day" had an 80/20 split on the chords, 90/10 split on the melody line, a 65/35 split on the lyrics", and then do that for every song. The closest you ever get to that is like when Lennon did the Playboy interview and went through most of the Beatles songs and generally said whether it was "all Paul", "all John", or both.

Yes, to parse Brian's words, saying they both work on certain aspects, and then saying "Joe writes the chords" does imply only he writes the chords. But knowing how general the question is, knowing how Brian talks, along with using common sense, I don't believe Joe writes ALL of the chords (essentially the entire song without the melody line and lyrics) and Brian has no input on that.

I've never been troubled by the possibility that a given song is largely written by Joe Thomas. Who cares? A good song is a good song. If he's sitting down with Joe and writing, that's good enough for me. If it was a case of Brian signing a record deal, and then the label seeking out all of the album's songs from outside writers-for-hire, then that would be somewhat different. As far as Joe, again, have the critics actually seen and analyzed Brian's best working relationships? A big part of it seems to be the ability to coax stuff out of Brian, to make him feel comfortable to either write from scratch or contribute ideas.

If I like a song or a chord change, and someone tells me "Joe wrote that, not Brian", I don't really care.

And all of this doesn't even get into the often grey areas that present themselves when dealing with two songwriters sitting down together and hammering a song out. I would imagine ideas get tossed back and forth and things get arranged and rearranged. I would imagine it's possible Brian and Joe just do a 50/50 split and don't worry about it after that.

[Shady]

There is nothing enjoyable about the disappointment of this album.

[GhostyTMRS]

No disrespect to anyone who doesn't like the album. People are entitled to their opinions and as fans, all of the opinions expressed here on this board are valid (regardless of the bullying tactics of the "you're part of a conspiracy" crowd)...

..but surely there has to be SOMETHING on this album that you connect with or pleases you? Even GIOMY has its good moments (although this is a 4 star album IMO). I'm curious if the fans who are writing the whole thing off immediately (again, you have every right to do so) hear at least one or two songs they enjoy?

[positivemusic]

Not sure where people are finding the deluxe version, I've only come across the 13 track edition.

I do have the target version on the way, but just couldn't help myself. Sagittarius = impatience. Haha.

I plan on reviewing the album once my full disc arrives, but I just wanted to say, without getting into conjecture, that if this could've been a Beach Boys' album, it's a shame it wasn't. There are numerous spots where I can "hear" Mike and Bruce vocals. Al is incredible!! His voice has practically not aged a bit!

It's also kind of a tragedy of time, because I think Carl's voice would've fit perfectly in place of Zooey's on "On The Island." Though I think she did a great job, regardless.

[Dan G]

isn't it interesting that Brian's best vocals occur when Joe is co-producing. 

It's a thousand times more interesting that the only track that has no identifiable ottotune, 'One Kind of Love', is the only song without a Joe Thomas credit.

You're so right.  What an amazing observation and conspiracy theory!  Maybe while Thomas was away autotuning the other 16 tracks, Brian snuck this one past him.  I'll bet he's gonna be really pissed when he finds out that no OTTOtune was used. 

It seems to me, as a relatively new poster that every time the positive comments start rolling in, these negative comments follow shortly after.  This is a great sounding album with great songs and from reading Brian's interviews, seems like Brian had a great time making it.  Can't we just leave it at that?

[Andrew G. Doe]

1) it's stupid to purport that negative reviews pursue an agenda or just don't get it.

Possibly my biggest pet hate after Morrissey and "Barbara-*******-Ann": "Nah, you just don't get it, do you ?". The assumption of implied superiority be cause he "gets it" and you don't is... well, worthy of me, now I come to think on it. 

Some times, we truly don't get it, and that may be our loss, but some times, there's nothing to get because the artefact in quest truly is a steaming pile of excrement that only a rabid follower would give house room.

[HeyJude]

Not sure where people are finding the deluxe version, I've only come across the 13 track edition.

I do have the target version on the way, but just couldn't help myself. Sagittarius = impatience. Haha.

I plan on reviewing the album once my full disc arrives, but I just wanted to say, without getting into conjecture, that if this could've been a Beach Boys' album, it's a shame it wasn't. There are numerous spots where I can "hear" Mike and Bruce vocals. Al is incredible!! His voice has practically not aged a bit!

It's also kind of a tragedy of time, because I think Carl's voice would've fit perfectly in place of Zooey's on "On The Island." Though I think she did a great job, regardless.

Agree on Al, and I can't say it enough. It's actually *still* maddening that Al can't put something together as far as another album, or do a clubs tour or something. I'm glad he's on the Brian tour and album, but the tour isn't long and he's only featured sporadically on both the live setlist and the album.

At this stage, even a covers album would be welcome. If he could even do something like stripped-down (or solo) acoustic re-recording of interesting BB tracks, I'd even take that. I'm not sure what kind of original material he still has locked up. I know that "Crumple Car" track finally leaked a while back on YouTube, and that one was kind of a novelty type song, so I dunno.

[luckyoldsmile]

I did a review for the St. Cloud Times, a daily newspaper in Central Minnesota. Well, it's more of a preview and overall "YAY" kind of thing. I haven't had access to the full album yet.

I know a lot of people dislike it, that's fine, but I love what I've heard. I hope you'll check my review out.

The blurb I've been sharing elsewhere:


Brian Wilson is an important part of our cultural fabric. We've heard him in our cars, on our movie soundtracks, on our television shows and commercials. He's a part of us. The Beach Boys legend has a new album coming next week, and I have some thoughts about it.

Check out the article, watch videos (including a handful of the new songs) and check out my Spotify playlist, 54 tracks for 54 years.

http://on.sctimes.com/19PEAhB

[rab2591]

isn't it interesting that Brian's best vocals occur when Joe is co-producing.  

It's a thousand times more interesting that the only track that has no identifiable ottotune, 'One Kind of Love', is the only song without a Joe Thomas credit.

You're so right.  What an amazing observation and conspiracy theory!  Maybe while Thomas was away autotuning the other 16 tracks, Brian snuck this one past him.  I'll bet he's gonna be really pissed when he finds out that no OTTOtune was used.  

It seems to me, as a relatively new poster that every time the positive comments start rolling in, these negative comments follow shortly after.  This is a great sounding album with great songs and from reading Brian's interviews, seems like Brian had a great time making it.  Can't we just leave it at that?

A-freakin-men.

I'm sure a lot of people won't like the album, and that's okay, but it's just funny to see all these new posters dive bomb into these threads with nothing but negativity (even some with a post history of solid BW negativity) - and it's not even interesting negativity - it's just trolling garbage....especially the tool who thinks Brian was better off with Landy than Joe. smh.

[Wirestone]

I know a lot of people dislike it

I don't think that's the case at all. The reception to the preview tracks on the board has been overwhelmingly positive.

Of course, once we had a couple of weeks of near-unanimous praise, we had a flurry of one-sentence posts from folks with a whole dozen posts under their belts declaring it an offense to God and man.

 

[luckyoldsmile]

I know a lot of people dislike it

I don't think that's the case at all. The reception to the preview tracks on the board has been overwhelmingly positive.

Of course, once we had a couple of weeks of near-unanimous praise, we had a flurry of one-sentence posts from folks with a whole dozen posts under their belts declaring it an offense to God and man.

 

Ha! Fair enough.

I love what I've heard, and I can't wait for my preorders to arrive. Got one of the package deals from brianwilson.com, ordered the deluxe version with ITBOMM from Target, got the iTunes stuff, etc. And I'll probably buy several copies as gifts, too.

I'm giddy.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I did a review for the St. Cloud Times, a daily newspaper in Central Minnesota. Well, it's more of a preview and overall "YAY" kind of thing. I haven't had access to the full album yet.

I know a lot of people dislike it, that's fine, but I love what I've heard. I hope you'll check my review out.

The blurb I've been sharing elsewhere:


Brian Wilson is an important part of our cultural fabric. We've heard him in our cars, on our movie soundtracks, on our television shows and commercials. He's a part of us. The Beach Boys legend has a new album coming next week, and I have some thoughts about it.

Check out the article, watch videos (including a handful of the new songs) and check out my Spotify playlist, 54 tracks for 54 years.

http://on.sctimes.com/19PEAhB

Read it. Nice, well written. However, my problem is with your admission that you've not heard the full album, yet you're writing as if you have. Suppose the cuts you've not heard are 100%, 24 carat, A1 stinkers* ? What then ?

[* as it happens, they're not... but please, indulge me.]

[JohnMill]

isn't it interesting that Brian's best vocals occur when Joe is co-producing.  

It's a thousand times more interesting that the only track that has no identifiable ottotune, 'One Kind of Love', is the only song without a Joe Thomas credit.

You're so right.  What an amazing observation and conspiracy theory!  Maybe while Thomas was away autotuning the other 16 tracks, Brian snuck this one past him.  I'll bet he's gonna be really pissed when he finds out that no OTTOtune was used.  

It seems to me, as a relatively new poster that every time the positive comments start rolling in, these negative comments follow shortly after.  This is a great sounding album with great songs and from reading Brian's interviews, seems like Brian had a great time making it.  Can't we just leave it at that?

A-freakin-men.

I'm sure a lot of people won't like the album, and that's okay, but it's just funny to see all these new posters dive bomb into these threads with nothing but negativity (even some with a post history of solid BW negativity) - and it's not even interesting negativity - it's just trolling garbage....especially the tool who thinks Brian was better off with Landy than Joe. smh.

I have to agree with you there unfortunately.  From what I've read on the NPP related threads most of the negative comments are people with agendas.  Agendas against Brian, agendas against his management team, agendas against Joe Thomas, agendas against the fact that Brian Wilson's current music doesn't sound like a rehash of his nineteen sixties glories.  Agendas, agendas, agendas.  Very little said about the music except: "I don't like it and by the way I also have something against __________ (take your pick from one or more of the topics I listed above)".

[luckyoldsmile]

That's a fair point, AGD. I guess I don't think I wrote it as if I have heard the full thing, especially with the disclaimers. I tried to write it more like a "hey, so far I've loved these songs, and I've checked out the previews, and BW is pretty darn important, so buy the album."

Between the radio plays, the previews, the songs that have already been made available this way or that way, I've heard a good portion of the album.

But certainly, I do use language that conveys a "listen to the songs, just listen to them" and there is perhaps a tone of "I've heard it, go get it," so I dig what you're laying down.

If anyone reads it that way, and clearly it's a possibility, and if the other tracks DID stink, then I guess I'd have a reason to write a follow-up column and do a "oops, my bad."

I don't think I'll have to worry about that, too much. I've heard enough to endorse it, and I think I put my bias out there right in front anyway.

Thanks for reading. And thanks for the compliment. Really means a lot!

[ontor pertawst]

If you're gonna post bile... at least make it interesting, readable, and informative. Criticism that boils down to "I don't like it" is just so dull to read, it adds nothing to the conversation... Throwing in some humor helps too.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Like this ?

Hate this album. Hey, man walked into a bar and screamed.

It was a metal bar.