Missing 45 master tapes.

[petsite]

This got me thinking about the latest round of Analogue Productions reissues, where it was discovered by listeners that some of the songs on those albums that were picked as singles were sourced from lesser generations because the original masters had been moved over to isolated reels or phono reels that were later discarded. I'm not sure of the exact songs (I seem to remember "Little Deuce Coupe being mentioned) but am I right in thinking that the procedure Capitol/ Brian used at the time was to remix the songs once they had been cut from the LP reel and transferred, thus the variations in overall sound between LP vs. singles pressings? It would cool to get to the bottom of all this.

I just got one of the Analogue Productions LPs in the mail today.  It shows pictures of the back of the tape boxes for the mono mix of Surfer Girl and Surfin' Safari LPs.  Each box has some interesting markings on a few songs-

Surfer Girl (Replaced 5-4-67)
Surfin Safari (Back In 5-4-67)
Surfin' (Back In 5-4-67)


What the heck was going on in May of 1967?  Was Brian trying to cut up his old master tapes while setting the Smile tapes on fire at the same time?


[/quote]


Sounds like when the Capitol Star Line relreases were done. Just putting that out there. Can you put up scans of the tape box covers. I live for that stuff .

[Jason Penick]

This got me thinking about the latest round of Analogue Productions reissues, where it was discovered by listeners that some of the songs on those albums that were picked as singles were sourced from lesser generations because the original masters had been moved over to isolated reels or phono reels that were later discarded. I'm not sure of the exact songs (I seem to remember "Little Deuce Coupe being mentioned) but am I right in thinking that the procedure Capitol/ Brian used at the time was to remix the songs once they had been cut from the LP reel and transferred, thus the variations in overall sound between LP vs. singles pressings? It would cool to get to the bottom of all this.

I just got one of the Analogue Productions LPs in the mail today.  It shows pictures of the back of the tape boxes for the mono mix of Surfer Girl and Surfin' Safari LPs.  Each box has some interesting markings on a few songs-

Surfer Girl (Replaced 5-4-67)
Surfin Safari (Back In 5-4-67)
Surfin' (Back In 5-4-67)


What the heck was going on in May of 1967?  Was Brian trying to cut up his old master tapes while setting the Smile tapes on fire at the same time?

Sounds like when the Capitol Star Line relreases were done. Just putting that out there. Can you put up scans of the tape box covers. I live for that stuff .

Or maybe that was when he got the idea for Stacks-o-Tracks? Your Star Line idea seems more plausible though.

[Shane]

Sure!  Here's a photo of the insert from the Analogue Productions album.  Interesting stuff:

https://flic.kr/p/xyUsPR

[Ram4]

Interesting that at the top of Surfer Girl there is a green sticker that says "Acetate - DO NOT BAKE."  Then at the bottom, there is a red sticker that says "BAKED 12-02-05."

[DonnyL]

Interesting that at the top of Surfer Girl there is a green sticker that says "Acetate - DO NOT BAKE."  Then at the bottom, there is a red sticker that says "BAKED 12-02-05."

That is totally nuts ... acetate tapes should never be baked; hopefully the 'baked' sticker is wrong. Baking an acetate tape will likely make any problems worse ... baking is only for backcoated tape anyway, which was not even introduced until 1969, and generally doesn't affect tape older than 1974.

Maybe someone baked it in 2005, then later on someone else discovered that you shouldn't bake acetate tapes? How Capitol let someone who doesn't know that handle and alter original Beach Boys masters is beyond me.

Baking solves the problem of 'sticky shed syndrome', which is the glue on the binder slowly turning to liquid ... it dries it out and 're-glues' it to the tape.

Acetate tapes often suffer from the opposite problem -- they're dry and brittle. If you bake them, you'll make it worse ... they can easily snap if not played on a machine with a gentle transport.

Acetate tape can also suffer from a less-known problem called 'vinegar syndrome' ... which is basically what it sounds like; a deterioration that produces a (sometimes pretty strong) vinegar odor. Though no one seems to know how to handle this ... or what exactly the implications are. The tape usually plays back okay in my experience.

If the 'Surfer Girl' master is on Scotch 111, it's likely just fine and would not have any problems (other than being brittle or maybe shedding a little). Sadly, I've heard stories of engineers and labels simply baking tapes as a matter of course before transferring for reissue projects.

I'm guessing it might be on Scotch 201, which the successor to 111 (the studio standard since the late '40s) and was introduced in 1962. This particular tape is not stable and sheds in a way that seems like it might be sticky shed, but it's definitely not because the tape is not backcoated, and is not polyester ... it's acetate. So that might explain why someone decided it was a good idea to bake it.  Might have dried up whatever was gunking things up though ... and probably damaged the tape in other ways as well. I don't think anyone knows how to handle problematic 201 though ... I would maybe just try 'cleaning' the tape with something like a dry cotton ball before it passes over the heads to get a clean transfer.

[DonnyL]

Looking at that photo though, the box doesn't even look correct for the period. It looks like a 1980s-'90s Ampex box. The label sheet is obviously original though. So they might have used a replacement box, or maybe the tape is actually a later copy ... which is highly likely to need baking if it's an '80s'-90s Ampex tape (not acetate). The "Surfin' Safari" box looks original.

One interesting thing is how this vintage, priceless collectible has all these modern stickers and bar codes on it ... like, it's a beautiful artefact of the past but still a commercially viable work tape. Imagine if someone found some handwritten Beach Boys lyrics and decided to put a bunch of stickers on it!

[Custom Machine]

When I first saw "Acetate DO NOT BAKE" stickers on photos of BB tapes, my assumption, and this is purely an assumption on my part, was that when Capitol engineers identified a Mylar/Tenzar/polyester based tape that was of a formulation not known to have stiction issues, they placed a sticker on the tape to indicate that the tape should not be baked. Lacking a sticker that said "Tape formulation not known for stiction problems DO NOT BAKE", they simply used the sticker for acetate tapes, which, although incorrectly identifying the tape as acetate, correctly imparted the information "DO NOT BAKE".

[Bicyclerider]

What is an acetate tape?  Isn't an acetate a groove based record cut on cheap plastic or "lacquer"?

[DonnyL]

When I first saw "Acetate DO NOT BAKE" stickers on photos of BB tapes, my assumption, and this is purely an assumption on my part, was that when Capitol engineers identified a Mylar/Tenzar/polyester based tape that was of a formulation not known to have stiction issues, they placed a sticker on the tape to indicate that the tape should not be baked. Lacking a sticker that said "Tape formulation not known for stiction problems DO NOT BAKE", they simply used the sticker for acetate tapes, which, although incorrectly identifying the tape as acetate, correctly imparted the information "DO NOT BAKE".

The question is why does it have a 'do not bake' sticker, and a 'baked' sticker?

You should really not bake any tape from the 1960s. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that most BB masters from the '60s are on Scotch 201, 202, 203, or 111.

202 and 203 are both poly, and baking will definitely damage the tape. They are not backcoated, so it will not do any good anyway. The problem with these tapes is that the oxide will flake right off the poly because it's dried... you're left with something resembling actual "scotch tape" ... i.e., transparent clear tape without a sound! you can take your fingernail and scrape the oxide off on any reel of 202 or 203 if you want to. Baking the tape will make this problem worse, drying it out even more ... because the tape is already dried out ... this is the opposite of sticky shed, where the tape is wet, and needs to be dried to re-glue the backcoating (remember, 202 and 203 don't even have backcoating).

111 is acetate ... the oxide does not flake off like 202/203, but the tape itself is brittle and can break easily. Baking will only make it more brittle and prone to breaking.

201 is the wild card I suppose, and definitely has problems that might make someone want to bake it. To me, it does seem to be a 'wet' problem ... that is, the tape seems to gunk up heads, etc. Not as bad as real sticky shed ... I would say these tapes are playable on the right transport. The problem is, 201 is acetate ... so if you bake it, you might be 'curing' a problem but creating a potentially worse other problem ... I doubt baking does any good anyway ... but I would absolutely NEVER bake any master on 201, certainly not an iconic BB recording!

Scotch 206 was one of the first backcoated tapes, introduced in 1969. This tape also does not need baking ... but it probably wouldn't damage the tape to do so (I wouldn't).

[DonnyL]

What is an acetate tape?  Isn't an acetate a groove based record cut on cheap plastic or "lacquer"?

Acetate is a material. Prior to the introduction of plastic tape types, the actual tape itself was made from acetate material. This is not to be confused with what's called 'acetates' ... the demo records cut for artists to take home. Those were made from acetate too ... but totally a different scenario.

[DonnyL]

Also, listen to the saxes on the intro, much harder sounding. Throughout the 45 mix the drums are more out front, as are Bruce's vocals on the chorus. Brian falsetto sounds more out front too. Then we get to the fade. Brian smoothed all that out on the LP mix.

The track itself would presumably be the same though ... since it would be on one track of the 8-track. Only the vocals might vary, or the mastering/EQ.

[firm.referent.queue.dizzy]

This got me thinking about the latest round of Analogue Productions reissues, where it was discovered by listeners that some of the songs on those albums that were picked as singles were sourced from lesser generations because the original masters had been moved over to isolated reels or phono reels that were later discarded. I'm not sure of the exact songs (I seem to remember "Little Deuce Coupe being mentioned) but am I right in thinking that the procedure Capitol/ Brian used at the time was to remix the songs once they had been cut from the LP reel and transferred, thus the variations in overall sound between LP vs. singles pressings? It would cool to get to the bottom of all this.

I just got one of the Analogue Productions LPs in the mail today.  It shows pictures of the back of the tape boxes for the mono mix of Surfer Girl and Surfin' Safari LPs.  Each box has some interesting markings on a few songs-

Surfer Girl (Replaced 5-4-67)
Surfin Safari (Back In 5-4-67)
Surfin' (Back In 5-4-67)


What the heck was going on in May of 1967?  Was Brian trying to cut up his old master tapes while setting the Smile tapes on fire at the same time?

IIRC, didn't Chuck Britz remix Surfer Girl in 1967? That could be when the remix was substituted on the master tape.

[Custom Machine]

What is an acetate tape?  Isn't an acetate a groove based record cut on cheap plastic or "lacquer"?

An acetate tape has a base material made of cellulose acetate. It is one of two common types of backing materials used for magnetic recording tape, the other being a type of polyester. The biggest disadvantage of acetate tapes was that they can easily break. Polyester tapes can stretch, but were typically considered more robust because of their increased strength. Magnetic oxide particles, along with a binder to make them stick to the base material, as well as a lubricant, were deposited on either the acetate or polyester base to make a magnetic recording tape.

As far as an acetate record is concerned, in the early days cellulose acetate was used as the material in which the cutter carved a groove, hence the practice of calling such a record an acetate. By the time the Beach Boys were making records cellulose acetate had been replaced by a lacquer material, but the term acetate persisted, although such records are also referred to as lacquers.