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Author Topic: Fun, Fun, Fun Backing Track Session.  (Read 4023 times)
branaa09
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« on: March 26, 2015, 12:57:39 AM »

I was playing around with a channel separator in Audacity and I discovered something! The basic track for Fun, Fun,Fun was actually recorded in Mono only during Takes 1-2. Take 3 was actually recorded on two tracks of the Multi-Track tape and the final track of the Three-Track contains the Overdub track of more guitars, more bass, saxes and Hal's drums. So on the first Track you only have Brian on Piano and Carl on Guitar, you can even hear the other instruments in the background. The Second Track has Al on Bass, Ray on Bass, Dennis on Drums,Hal on Tambourine, Jay on Sax and Steve on Sax. I mean what a creative way to record from mono on one track and decide to switch to two tracks instead. Brian still amazes me!

Here are the tracks
http://www.mediafire.com/listen/g5biux3txgxx98a/F,F,F_Track_1.mp3
http://www.mediafire.com/listen/q9go4d4866sd8oa/F,F,F_Track_2.mp3
http://www.mediafire.com/listen/39gxp1y8gpnn3jk/F,F,F_Track_3.mp3
« Last Edit: March 26, 2015, 01:33:47 AM by branaa09 » Logged
SinisterSmile
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« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2015, 01:30:37 AM »

You gotta fix that link, man.
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JK
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« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2015, 03:05:02 AM »

Coming through loud and clear, branaa09. Very cool!
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« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2015, 07:07:10 AM »

Some cool stuff! Thanks for posting the links,  branaa09!
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Matt Bielewicz
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« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2015, 07:54:26 AM »

What are you using to isolate these? It's far from perfect - there are an awful lot of digital artefacts - but I'd like to know more...
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c-man
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« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2016, 05:17:12 PM »

Bringing this thread back over a year later because of some new research into the topic on my part...

For awhile there, I thought branaa09 might be right...but Mark insists the "FFF" basic track final take was indeed mono, and the other two instrumental tracks were overdubs - and he should know! 

I've given the MIC version some close scrutiny through headphones of late, and I now believe that what we hear in the left channel of the stereo mix is the basic track - what branaa09 refers to as "the Second Track": "Al on Bass, Ray on Bass, Dennis on Drums,Hal on Tambourine, Jay on Sax and Steve on Sax." Like branaa09, I hear no guitar on that track - however, I can hear the piano - listen to the downbeat on the first chord - it's there - somewhat faint, indicating it may not have been close mic'd (we know from listening to other BBs tracks from this time period that the piano was sometimes just left un-mic'd, it's sound merely picked up by other mics in the room). This means that, for some reason, it was decided after the first and second takes that Carl should sit out and not play guitar on the basic track - so they would have had to simply count in silence for a bit before commencing. 

Contrast this with the middle channel of the MIC mix - where we hear the piano loud and clear, but NOT on that first downbeat - instead, it enters on the downbeat two bars later. This, then, is an overdub - and besides the piano and Carl's guitar, I also hear the Dano bass in this middle channel, being strummed aggressively like a chunky rhythm guitar. Where branaa09 writes, "So on the first Track you only have Brian on Piano and Carl on Guitar, you can even hear the other instruments in the background", he's speaking of this track - he just didn't notice the Dano bass. The "other instruments in the background" are heard because of a monitor speaker being used to playback the basic track during this overdub, instead of headphones (the same thing happens when you isolate other tracks from '63 or early '64 - for instance, on the "vocals-only" mix of "Surfer Girl" on Endless Harmony Soundtrack - indicating they used a monitor speaker in the tracking room instead of headphones).

What branaa09 refers to as "the Overdub track of more guitars, more bass, saxes and Hal's drums", then, is the other overdub (it probably came first, before the above-mentioned overdub) - on this track, both Carl and Al played rhythm guitar parts, Brian played Fender bass (as per Carl's comment in an interview: "I played that Chuck Berry riff from 'Johnny B. Goode' on the intro and Brian played that rolling bass line"), Ray doubled his original Dano part, Hal played drums to double Dennis' drums, and the saxophones were doubled.

Talk about a wall of sound!
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c-man
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« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2016, 04:44:19 AM »

To elaborate a bit on the Dano bass parts - there are two distinct parts being played by Ray Pohlman here, and one of them is doubled: he picks high single-notes in the left (basic track) and right (1st overdub) channels, and strums the root and fifth interval, as if it were a rhythm guitar, in the center (second overdub) channel - in the latter case, it's one of only three instruments on that track (the others being Brian's second piano and Carl's guitar, which plays the lead intro before resorting to a rhythm pattern along with Ray's part).

The guitars in the right channel are playing two separate rhythm patterns - one higher up on the neck, the other lower - and by process of elimination, these two guitars would have to be played by Carl and Al (both of whom also play guitar on "The Warmth Of The Sun" basic track, recorded at the same session). This track is more prominent on the mono basic track mix heard on the Hawthorne, California comp. Also on the right side, we hear a double of the lead guitar intro and the guitar solo, but they are on one of the vocal tracks, not this instrumental overdub.

Speaking of the vocals, I've come to a somewhat weird, but unavoidable conclusion - the vocals on the right are actually double-tracked, while the vocals on the left are single-tracked (thus, there are three layers of vocals, but two are combined). First off, I'll draw your attention to the fact that the vocals in the two channels (left and right) are singing slightly different parts: both sides sing, "And she'll have fun, fun, fun 'til her Daddy takes the T-bird away", but those on the left are followed by an answer of ("Fun, fun 'til her Daddy takes the T-bird away)", while those on the right are followed by an answering part of "Fun, fun 'til your Daddy takes the T-bird away". Also, the left vocal channel includes a couple of drum rolls in the fade - but NOT Brian's high part at the end of each chorus or his wailing falsetto during the ending fade - while the right vocal channel includes Brian's high part in the choruses & wailing in the fade, plus the doubled guitar intro & guitar solo.

So...we have:

RIGHT VOCALS - lead & background, including Brian's high part in the chorus & wailing falsetto in the fade, plus Carl doubles his guitar intro & plays the solo (this must be the first vocal track, recorded simultaneously with a dubdown of the original 3-track into one track of a 2nd generation tape - the multiple attempts of this dubdown & simultaneous vocal/guitar overdub, up to Take 14a, can be heard on Tracks 5-8 of Sea Of Tunes' Unsurpassed Masters Vol. 5, because Chuck just kept the 2nd-gen tape rolling for each attempt, rather than stop and rewind to begin again each time - thus preventing continual tape wear wherever possible). I believe what happened next was a doubling of this vocal part on the third track of that 2nd-generation 3-track, and that this vocal double can be heard on Track 10 of the U.M. boot (on this track, we can hear the guitar intro double at first, but then it's faded out, and we can only hear the guitar solo faintly in the background - which indicates two things: [1] it's on the same generation tape as this vocal double, but NOT as the organ overdub, since the organ is not to be heard, and [2] it's heard either as bleed-through from the monitor speaker in the room, or as print-through resulting from the playback head not quite aligning with the tape tracks. The fact that we can only hear the final take of this track, and not the previous takes as on the first vocal/guitar overdub, seems to prove that this is the second of two vocals on this 2nd-gen tape, and that it was done after, not during, the dubdown of the 1st to 2nd generations. Note how on both of these vocal tracks, the group sings the answering part of "Fun, fun 'til your Daddy takes the T-bird away".

I believe the next step was a dubdown to a 3rd-generation tape, during which the group added the organ/rhythm guitar/snare drum "instrumental insert" behind the guitar solo, as heard on Tracks 2-4 of the U.M. disc - again, we can hear all the takes, up to Take 6b, because Chuck just kept the 3rd-gen tape rolling for each attempt. During this dubdown from Gen 2 to Gen 3, the two vocal tracks were combined into one track of the new tape - so what then amounted to Generation 3 were the "middle" channel with the Gen 2 dubdown of the original three instrumental tracks (basic & two overdubs) combined with the organ/rhythm guitar/snare drum "insert", and the "right" channel, consisting of the doubled vocals.

Finally, the "left" channel of the 3rd generation tape was used for the third vocal track, consisting of the group singing the answer of "Fun, fun 'til her Daddy takes the T-bird away, minus Brian's high part in the choruses and super-high falsetto wail in the fade (both as heard in the right channel), and plus the drum roll doubles at the very end. For some reason, this part is not highlighted at all on the U.M. boot.

Anyone disagree? Smiley
 
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Mr Bones
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« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2016, 04:57:44 AM »

Reading that makes my head explode c-man, but after listening through it sounds pretty bang on to me. I have one question because I haven't heard the whole session tape, just the highlights from the 'Keep an eye on summer' Comp, but is there any way that Dennis switched with Hal during the basic tracking from drums to tambourine? Early on it is clearly Dennis drumming but on the final master to me it sounds a lot like Hal on both sides. Of course, I'm just basing that on my ears and I could be very wrong. At the very least the drumming approach seems to change a bit throughout the tracking. Early on it seems a bit more traditional with Dennis playing the ride cymbal but on the final recording It sounds like it's just the bass and snare drums with the occasional crash cymbal. Anyway, I've always been in awe of this recording. The hard work they went through definitely payed off.
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yrplace
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« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2016, 09:00:59 AM »

Saw this thread as I was passing thru. Have you listened to the Fun Fun Fun session and vocal tracks on the Keep An Eye on Summer release ? Should answer some questions...
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branaa09
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« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2016, 06:31:02 PM »

Wow I'm surprised this was resurrected ha ha. Thanks for further looking at the subject Craig, I think it's awesome! Sorry Mark, the channel separator I used made me hear Carl's guitar missing from the basic track, which I heard on the other track thinking; it was still part of the basic track just on another track of the tape. Didn't realize that Brian added more Piano, with Carl playing his Lead part and Ray playing Dano Bass as an Overdub. This is why I love this stuff!!
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c-man
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« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2016, 08:14:04 PM »

Well, it appears there IS a guitar in the left channel (basic track), after all...but I believe it's just playing rhythm, no lead. So, Carl didn't sit out the basic track, but played a rhythm part, saving the intro lead for the overdub. At least that's how I hear it now...
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halblaineisgood
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« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2016, 10:34:04 AM »

Bringing this thread back over a year later because of some new research into the topic on my part...

For awhile there, I thought branaa09 might be right...but Mark insists the "FFF" basic track final take was indeed mono, and the other two instrumental tracks were overdubs - and he should know! 

I've given the MIC version some close scrutiny through headphones of late, and I now believe that what we hear in the left channel of the stereo mix is the basic track - what branaa09 refers to as "the Second Track": "Al on Bass, Ray on Bass, Dennis on Drums,Hal on Tambourine, Jay on Sax and Steve on Sax." Like branaa09, I hear no guitar on that track - however, I can hear the piano - listen to the downbeat on the first chord - it's there - somewhat faint, indicating it may not have been close mic'd (we know from listening to other BBs tracks from this time period that the piano was sometimes just left un-mic'd, it's sound merely picked up by other mics in the room). This means that, for some reason, it was decided after the first and second takes that Carl should sit out and not play guitar on the basic track - so they would have had to simply count in silence for a bit before commencing. 

Contrast this with the middle channel of the MIC mix - where we hear the piano loud and clear, but NOT on that first downbeat - instead, it enters on the downbeat two bars later. This, then, is an overdub - and besides the piano and Carl's guitar, I also hear the Dano bass in this middle channel, being strummed aggressively like a chunky rhythm guitar. Where branaa09 writes, "So on the first Track you only have Brian on Piano and Carl on Guitar, you can even hear the other instruments in the background", he's speaking of this track - he just didn't notice the Dano bass. The "other instruments in the background" are heard because of a monitor speaker being used to playback the basic track during this overdub, instead of headphones (the same thing happens when you isolate other tracks from '63 or early '64 - for instance, on the "vocals-only" mix of "Surfer Girl" on Endless Harmony Soundtrack - indicating they used a monitor speaker in the tracking room instead of headphones).

What branaa09 refers to as "the Overdub track of more guitars, more bass, saxes and Hal's drums", then, is the other overdub (it probably came first, before the above-mentioned overdub) - on this track, both Carl and Al played rhythm guitar parts, Brian played Fender bass (as per Carl's comment in an interview: "I played that Chuck Berry riff from 'Johnny B. Goode' on the intro and Brian played that rolling bass line"), Ray doubled his original Dano part, Hal played drums to double Dennis' drums, and the saxophones were doubled.

Talk about a wall of sound!

This was the most interesting post evar.



« Last Edit: July 27, 2016, 10:36:12 AM by blalhainegooals » Logged
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