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Author Topic: I Am Brian Wilson: New Autobiography  (Read 73016 times)
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« Reply #250 on: July 31, 2015, 10:35:39 AM »

And thanks again to SmileBrian and rab2591 for the support. I enjoy your posts too!
I only know what she writes, not how she means it. The fact that we are all interpreting what she said differently shows that she was not clear in what she was trying to get across. I am not a big 'Wall of Brian" fan, so what she says holds no water for me. Sure, Brian could have done a lot of things, but I am sure that even he knew he had something very, very special when the six of them blended together.
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The Brianista Prayer

Oh Brian
Thou Art In Hawthorne,
Harmonied Be Thy name
Your Kingdom Come,
Your Steak Well Done,
On Stage As It Is In Studio,
Give Us This Day, Our Shortenin' Bread
And Forgive Us Our Bootlegs,
As We Also Have Forgiven Our Wife And Managers,
And Lead Us Not Into Kokomo,
But Deliver Us From Mike Love.
Amen.  ---hypehat
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« Reply #251 on: July 31, 2015, 10:51:17 AM »

Referencing the above, the 2012 reunion did not end because Mike had "contractual obligations" for his own touring band that he *had* to attend to.

The opposite is true. He had other dates booked because the reunion ended. He chose to end the reunion and book other dates (that his dates were scheduled before C50 was over doesn't matter; and in fact if anything speaks more strongly to Mike choosing before the reunion even ended that he was done with it).

This of course doesn't even speak to the idea that if somehow someone somewhere had been forcing Mike to book and perform previously-scheduled dates for his own band, he could have done those gigs and then gone back to the reunion lineup. This also doesn't even speak to the myriad of other solutions that were possible (buying the shows off, rescheduling them, re-booking them as C50 shows, etc.)

It's laughable that anyone can argue that the end of the reunion was *caused* by contractual obligations Mike had to attend to with his own band, in light of the fact that three years later Mike has still not gone back to the reunion. It was a choice, and a choice made by Mike. He quit The Beach Boys and went back to his own band. That's fine, but he has to own that decision (which he actually has more than some of his supporters), and fans and spectators have to accept that.

You didn't forget that that Mike has said back then and recently he was ready and expecting to discuss as a band continuing reunion and offers did you?
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CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #252 on: July 31, 2015, 11:03:44 AM »

Referencing the above, the 2012 reunion did not end because Mike had "contractual obligations" for his own touring band that he *had* to attend to.

The opposite is true. He had other dates booked because the reunion ended. He chose to end the reunion and book other dates (that his dates were scheduled before C50 was over doesn't matter; and in fact if anything speaks more strongly to Mike choosing before the reunion even ended that he was done with it).

This of course doesn't even speak to the idea that if somehow someone somewhere had been forcing Mike to book and perform previously-scheduled dates for his own band, he could have done those gigs and then gone back to the reunion lineup. This also doesn't even speak to the myriad of other solutions that were possible (buying the shows off, rescheduling them, re-booking them as C50 shows, etc.)

It's laughable that anyone can argue that the end of the reunion was *caused* by contractual obligations Mike had to attend to with his own band, in light of the fact that three years later Mike has still not gone back to the reunion. It was a choice, and a choice made by Mike. He quit The Beach Boys and went back to his own band. That's fine, but he has to own that decision (which he actually has more than some of his supporters), and fans and spectators have to accept that.

You didn't forget that that Mike has said back then and recently he was ready and expecting to discuss as a band continuing reunion and offers did you?

Even if that were true, Mike obviously would have tried to use the "room" scenario as an ultimatum to bully everyone into getting his way.

It's not a realistic scenario to try and forcibly yank away a writing situation from Brian that Brian had grown accustomed to, which took a long time to get him into a comfort zone, and to do so with ultimatums and threats. It is clearly not an easy thing for Brian to just get into the mode of feeling comfortable, secure, and able to write and create art. At this point in his life, songwriting is more difficult for him for many reasons. A stable writing situation for a person like Brian Wilson is not something to just be tinkered with and f*cked with at whim; if there was gonna be change in that scenario, a 1965-style writing scenario wasn't gonna happen overnight. That should make sense to everyone. I'd venture to guess that 99% of people could understand the logic in that, except apparently for one member of the BBs.

And if you think the "threat" verbage is too strong, well it ain't... because I feel certain that if it had even gotten to the talking and discussion point, Mike would have threatened to walk if he didn't get his way since he was so disappointed with how TWGMTR turned out writing-wise. Waaa waaa waaa. Poor wittle Mike. How about Mike having some understanding for a man with emotional problems, who he claims to love, and not blaming those problems solely on drug use, and waiting for a "room" scenario to possibly evolve naturally over the course of time?

Again, because it would take a morsel of understanding that Mike himself and his own attitude could be part of the problem, which Mike outright refuses to consider.  If there was a way to have less-than-zero self-awareness, Mike has surely found that way. I don't know if Mike ever feels that his attitude has ever been a problem for this band whatsoever, in 50+ years.

2012 was the very first time in the history of the band (as far as I know) where Mike could essentially demand that songs be written his way, or else there would be consequences. He never had such leverage before, but boy did he run with that leverage when he finally attained it. 

Outside of Murry, mental illness, and drugs, Mike's ego issues and lack of understanding rank amongst the biggest problems that this band has ever faced, and most everyone (including I'd venture to guess, most members of the BBs themselves, living or deceased) regretfully knows it.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2015, 01:00:40 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
HeyJude
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« Reply #253 on: July 31, 2015, 12:26:26 PM »

Referencing the above, the 2012 reunion did not end because Mike had "contractual obligations" for his own touring band that he *had* to attend to.

The opposite is true. He had other dates booked because the reunion ended. He chose to end the reunion and book other dates (that his dates were scheduled before C50 was over doesn't matter; and in fact if anything speaks more strongly to Mike choosing before the reunion even ended that he was done with it).

This of course doesn't even speak to the idea that if somehow someone somewhere had been forcing Mike to book and perform previously-scheduled dates for his own band, he could have done those gigs and then gone back to the reunion lineup. This also doesn't even speak to the myriad of other solutions that were possible (buying the shows off, rescheduling them, re-booking them as C50 shows, etc.)

It's laughable that anyone can argue that the end of the reunion was *caused* by contractual obligations Mike had to attend to with his own band, in light of the fact that three years later Mike has still not gone back to the reunion. It was a choice, and a choice made by Mike. He quit The Beach Boys and went back to his own band. That's fine, but he has to own that decision (which he actually has more than some of his supporters), and fans and spectators have to accept that.

You didn't forget that that Mike has said back then and recently he was ready and expecting to discuss as a band continuing reunion and offers did you?

The "discussions" concerning which you spent post after post parsing the definition of the word "discussions", to the point of contending that Mike saying there were "never any discussions" of another album didn't DIRECTLY contradict his 2012 statement that "there's talk about doing another album together"?

Um, yeah, I remember that.  LOL

I was responding to someone else in this thread who made the long-since-disproved (and totally illogical from the outset) assertion that Mike quitting the reunion had *anything* to do with having contractual obligations to do his own shows. He booked those shows because he chose to, and has never once made a single statement suggesting that "oh gosh, oops, I though the reunion was going to end and booked some shows, but as soon as I knock those shows out, we're going to do more reunion stuff."

Mike quit The Beach Boys in 2012. He's owning that (despite not using that terminology) more than a small group of his sympathizers are.
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« Reply #254 on: July 31, 2015, 01:40:36 PM »

Referencing the above, the 2012 reunion did not end because Mike had "contractual obligations" for his own touring band that he *had* to attend to.

The opposite is true. He had other dates booked because the reunion ended. He chose to end the reunion and book other dates (that his dates were scheduled before C50 was over doesn't matter; and in fact if anything speaks more strongly to Mike choosing before the reunion even ended that he was done with it).

This of course doesn't even speak to the idea that if somehow someone somewhere had been forcing Mike to book and perform previously-scheduled dates for his own band, he could have done those gigs and then gone back to the reunion lineup. This also doesn't even speak to the myriad of other solutions that were possible (buying the shows off, rescheduling them, re-booking them as C50 shows, etc.)

It's laughable that anyone can argue that the end of the reunion was *caused* by contractual obligations Mike had to attend to with his own band, in light of the fact that three years later Mike has still not gone back to the reunion. It was a choice, and a choice made by Mike. He quit The Beach Boys and went back to his own band. That's fine, but he has to own that decision (which he actually has more than some of his supporters), and fans and spectators have to accept that.

You didn't forget that that Mike has said back then and recently he was ready and expecting to discuss as a band continuing reunion and offers did you?

The "discussions" concerning which you spent post after post parsing the definition of the word "discussions", to the point of contending that Mike saying there were "never any discussions" of another album didn't DIRECTLY contradict his 2012 statement that "there's talk about doing another album together"?

Um, yeah, I remember that.  LOL

I was responding to someone else in this thread who made the long-since-disproved (and totally illogical from the outset) assertion that Mike quitting the reunion had *anything* to do with having contractual obligations to do his own shows. He booked those shows because he chose to, and has never once made a single statement suggesting that "oh gosh, oops, I though the reunion was going to end and booked some shows, but as soon as I knock those shows out, we're going to do more reunion stuff."

Mike quit The Beach Boys in 2012. He's owning that (despite not using that terminology) more than a small group of his sympathizers are.

Yeah the one where people couldn't understand the distinction both Brian and Mike made between promoter talk of offers to the band and discussion within the band about those offers.

Mike didn't quit the Beach Boys or the reunion in 2012 anymore than Brian did. As both Mike and Brian made clear, they both expected to discuss AFTER  the tour ended (as in Brian recognizing g there was a "set end date" too) within the band about continuing. I think people are trying to make out that something else was going to happen tourwise in 2012 but the only offers we have been made aware of, I believe, could only be for 2013 or later and Mike and Brian both made it plain (said) that they expected the 2012 C50 tour to end before the band discussed any new offers.  That's the way I understand it anyway.  

OT (for Billy): Maybe the bios will shed more light.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2015, 03:25:16 PM by Cam Mott » Logged

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« Reply #255 on: July 31, 2015, 01:46:55 PM »

I'd say about 95% of the folks on the board reacted in the same way to Mike's "there were never any discussions" assertion from earlier this year. The reaction was to go back and read his 2012 comments and make sure we hadn't had a memory lapse. As it turns out, we hadn't. The statements were directly contradictory, notwithstanding some sort of floating, arbitrary, parsing definitions of "talks" versus "discussions", and so on.

2012 versus 2013, none of that matters. Again, that's parsing, and missing the point. The issue isn't whether they could have or should have *immediately* continued the reunion in October 2012. Nobody cares whether Mike did some October 2012 gigs on his own. Or I should say, they wouldn't have cared if Mike had shown any actual interest in carrying on with the reunion, either later in 2012 or early 2013 or summer 2013 or whatever.

Mike quit the Beach Boys in 2012. No, he didn't resign from any corporate entities. It wasn't an employee separation that required any notice. None of that. But he quit the band in 2012, he went from being in the Beach Boys to licensing the name.
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« Reply #256 on: July 31, 2015, 01:53:04 PM »

Exactly Jude, that is the bottom line of what Mike did.
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« Reply #257 on: July 31, 2015, 02:18:40 PM »

I just observe what happens.

No, you don't: like anyone with an idée fixe (viz. pretty much everyone in the world at some time or other and certainly everyone here), you see what you want to see in any given situation and build on that. Not that it really matters, because the opinion of anyone who truly thinks - or even puts forth the proposition - that Pet Sounds would have sounded better without the vocals of Carl, Dennis, Mike, Alan & Bruce, but rather with a wall-of-1966-Brians,  is several AUs beyond worthless. Just my opinion, of course, but I feel it has merit.

Gosndarn it, I woke up cranky this morning. More tea, more toast...

You are putting words into my mouth. I never said Pet Sounds would have sounded better without the other Beach Boys - I said that Brian could have done it (and it would have sounded good).  I also made the point that Mike and Dennis had deeper voices than Brian and obviously that means that Brian couldn't sound just like either of them.  The Beach Boys, plural, were responsible for superb vocals, I'm not arguing with that. But that was then. Without Carl and Dennis and with the surviving Beach Boys in their 70s the situation is different. No doubt it helps Brian to have a younger band on stage with him and no doubt the same is true for Mike and Bruce.  


Am I ?

Pet Sounds would have had amazing vocals if Brian had done them all on his own.

... the implication being the existing vocals... aren't: "well, yeah, it's OK I guess, but if Brian...". That's your basic MO these days: anything The Beach Boys can or have done, Brian can do or could have done better. Know something ? There are many times I would heartily agree with you... but invariably ? No. It's the differences that make up the wonder of BB harmony. A wall-of-Brian's can be an astonishing, moving thing ("Midnight's Another Day", "Lovin' Feelin'", to name but two) But as GIOMH proved dramatically, it can also pall if used indiscriminately (granted, such a dire album isn't the best possible example, but you see my point).

BTW, you noted that Mike & Dennis have deeper voices than Brian: fact is, Brian has a respectable bass vocal when he turns his mind to it (best example: 1973 version of "Shortenin' Bread"). Currently, he's the best (only ?) bass in his own band. For some arcane reason that both amuses and pleases me.  Smiley

I hold by what I wrote. Pet Sounds WOULD have had amazing vocals had Brian done them on his own. I did not state they would have been better. The interplay of different voices is interesting even when some of those voices are better than some others. The close relationship of most of the band probably helped too.

I find it more than slightly irritating that you read into my words something that wasn't there and even when I point that out, try to make out that was what I implied. NO, it was what you inferred - incorrectly as it happens. I think sometimes Brian does it better. I think Carl did God Only Knows better than Brian, for example. I prefer Brian on Add Some Music, for another example. Al made a great job of Cottonfields. Mike's BVs were very good on many songs.

And, yes, Brian can sing bass vocals when he chooses. Brian had a pretty good range.  Just that it isn't something Brian did very often.

Ang, I feel very similar about Pet Sounds as well-always have. Let's face it, Brian not only taught everyone their parts, he could also sing them very well I'm sure. Save your time and effort trying to convince the one who thinks he walks on water that unless he agrees with it, it can't be considered viable. And all the tea in China(plus 10 more slices of toast) ain't gonna change him one iota. Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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« Reply #258 on: July 31, 2015, 02:20:44 PM »

Hey at least Brian didn't name the book "I am the Beach Boys and they are my messengers." lol
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« Reply #259 on: July 31, 2015, 02:26:02 PM »

Thanks The Legendary OSD! The guy who suffers the f***wits etc is welcome to believe whatever he likes, including, if he wishes, to believe he can walk on water. A demonstration would be great - just let me get a camera.....

Had to smile about Josh's suggestion. Quite a good title actually - all those who are less au fait with the band would then be made aware of the Beach Boys connection. But more litigation would presumably follow....
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« Reply #260 on: July 31, 2015, 03:40:54 PM »

I'd say about 95% of the folks on the board reacted in the same way to Mike's "there were never any discussions" assertion from earlier this year. The reaction was to go back and read his 2012 comments and make sure we hadn't had a memory lapse. As it turns out, we hadn't. The statements were directly contradictory, notwithstanding some sort of floating, arbitrary, parsing definitions of "talks" versus "discussions", and so on.

2012 versus 2013, none of that matters. Again, that's parsing, and missing the point. The issue isn't whether they could have or should have *immediately* continued the reunion in October 2012. Nobody cares whether Mike did some October 2012 gigs on his own. Or I should say, they wouldn't have cared if Mike had shown any actual interest in carrying on with the reunion, either later in 2012 or early 2013 or summer 2013 or whatever.

Mike quit the Beach Boys in 2012. No, he didn't resign from any corporate entities. It wasn't an employee separation that required any notice. None of that. But he quit the band in 2012, he went from being in the Beach Boys to licensing the name.

And how did 95% of the board react to Brian also saying they never discussed the offers within the band?

Nobody quit the band or the tour, they didn't even discuss any plans for after the tour within the group just as Mike and Brian both said.  In fact it seems they never even got any actual actionable, on-paper offers for continuing the tour or a new album.  It sounds to me if anyone is at fault, they all are at fault. It could be none of them were at fault and it just wasn't going to happen at that time. I'm sure false accusations and not having a courtesy press release proofing and sniping back and forth in the press didn't help get them into discussions. Al seems to have tried to get everybody discussing but postings on his webpage probably didn't help either.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2015, 04:06:53 PM by Cam Mott » Logged

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« Reply #261 on: July 31, 2015, 03:47:30 PM »

Barely anybody buys that story. Even Mike Love is more honest about his decision than you.
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« Reply #262 on: July 31, 2015, 04:15:54 PM »

Barely anybody buys that story. Even Mike Love is more honest about his decision than you.

Exactly. When nobody buys the story, then the story shifts to "it's everybody's fault." Brian's LA Times letter and Al's comments after the tour suggest they were ready and willing. Mike's LA Times letter and subsequent interviews have *never* refuted this. To chalk it all up to some sort of logistical issue where they just didn't get to that discussion table misses the entire point.

As for "postings" on Al's website, that's the incorrect allegation that was made by Mike a few years ago (Al doesn't "post" on his website, nor does anyone else), which, if I'm recalling correctly, I believe someone in Mike's camp corrected soon after the reference was made. Mike apparently at that time didn't understand the difference between Al's official page and Facebook (even though Mike is a regular, somewhat prolific Facebook poster now). The reference was apparently actually to Facebook comments, and people at the time pointed out that there has been anti-Mike stuff (whether justified or not) on everybody's Facebook pages, including anti-Mike stuff on Mike's own Facebook page. Mike was trying to blame Al for stuff random people were saying on the internet, as if Al was condoning or encouraging it. Total crap. Now Cam is using stuff that Mike's own people admitted was an erroneous allegation.
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« Reply #263 on: July 31, 2015, 04:57:06 PM »

Here is what always amazed me about the end of C50...regardless of whether Mike wanted to go on or not...where the hell is the band's management?Huh  Why would someone in charge not step in and say, "Ok, Brian, Al and Dave want to continue on and have signed on do to (fill in the number) more shows which we have contracts waiting to be signed for.  Mike, Bruce, we are just waiting on your signatures."  At least this then puts the entire thing on Mike (and Bruce) to choose to continue or not and there isn't any of this back and forth, "Brian got fired- no he didn't" crap.  It ended poorly with the band members obviously not communicating because of no management being in charge.  Everyone has their own manager, wife, etc. that they seem to answer to or try to placate and that is why we (the fans) end with a mess like we got. 
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« Reply #264 on: July 31, 2015, 05:17:36 PM »

Here is what always amazed me about the end of C50...regardless of whether Mike wanted to go on or not...where the hell is the band's management?Huh  Why would someone in charge not step in and say, "Ok, Brian, Al and Dave want to continue on and have signed on do to (fill in the number) more shows which we have contracts waiting to be signed for.  Mike, Bruce, we are just waiting on your signatures."  At least this then puts the entire thing on Mike (and Bruce) to choose to continue or not and there isn't any of this back and forth, "Brian got fired- no he didn't" crap.  It ended poorly with the band members obviously not communicating because of no management being in charge.  Everyone has their own manager, wife, etc. that they seem to answer to or try to placate and that is why we (the fans) end with a mess like we got.  

I too wish it could have happened, but I have to assume that any celebrity that far gone into their own la-la land of isolated reality, who would behave in such a short-sighted manner, would probably not listen to the reasoned words of any manager. And I think that's the root part of the problem, which was best said years earlier by the Nostradamus-like statement of the wise Jack Rieley.
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« Reply #265 on: July 31, 2015, 05:43:05 PM »

M&B were barely on pet sounds in way that BW doesn't need them for a tour of the album. Plus add all the baggage of them being dicks to BW and its a no brainier. BW's 2015  band with Al  Jardine is all that is needed to recreate the lush studio sounds.

 w00t! w00t!  You're damn right, SB!!  Thumbs Up
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« Reply #266 on: July 31, 2015, 05:55:26 PM »

While we're off once again on this topic -- can someone explain why adding another dozen or so dates to the tour would have mattered? Do folks think that in 2015 the C50 lineup would still be touring? Would Brian be doing 165 dates per year?Or would Mike want to do only 30, say?

Why would anyone care in 2015 whether the 2012 tour could have been extended a few weeks, unless the thinking is that Mike, Bruce, Brian, Al, and Dave would all be up for a permanent touring lineup? Was that ever a possibility?
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« Reply #267 on: July 31, 2015, 06:18:16 PM »

While we're off once again on this topic -- can someone explain why adding another dozen or so dates to the tour would have mattered? Do folks think that in 2015 the C50 lineup would still be touring? Would Brian be doing 165 dates per year?Or would Mike want to do only 30, say?

Why would anyone care in 2015 whether the 2012 tour could have been extended a few weeks, unless the thinking is that Mike, Bruce, Brian, Al, and Dave would all be up for a permanent touring lineup? Was that ever a possibility?

As has been discussed/hypothesized many times on here before, there would have to have been compromises reached. Either the reunited band would be more selective about dates they played, and do the "quality over quantity" thing (not a bad way to do things)... or there could probably have been something negotiated where Brian would take some time off from some dates. Those are not impossible scenarios.
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« Reply #268 on: July 31, 2015, 06:23:02 PM »

Referencing the above, the 2012 reunion did not end because Mike had "contractual obligations" for his own touring band that he *had* to attend to.

The opposite is true. He had other dates booked because the reunion ended. He chose to end the reunion and book other dates (that his dates were scheduled before C50 was over doesn't matter; and in fact if anything speaks more strongly to Mike choosing before the reunion even ended that he was done with it).

This of course doesn't even speak to the idea that if somehow someone somewhere had been forcing Mike to book and perform previously-scheduled dates for his own band, he could have done those gigs and then gone back to the reunion lineup. This also doesn't even speak to the myriad of other solutions that were possible (buying the shows off, rescheduling them, re-booking them as C50 shows, etc.)

It's laughable that anyone can argue that the end of the reunion was *caused* by contractual obligations Mike had to attend to with his own band, in light of the fact that three years later Mike has still not gone back to the reunion. It was a choice, and a choice made by Mike. He quit The Beach Boys and went back to his own band. That's fine, but he has to own that decision (which he actually has more than some of his supporters), and fans and spectators have to accept that.

You didn't forget that that Mike has said back then and recently he was ready and expecting to discuss as a band continuing reunion and offers did you?

Even if that were true, Mike obviously would have tried to use the "room" scenario as an ultimatum to bully everyone into getting his way.

It's not a realistic scenario to try and forcibly yank away a writing situation from Brian that Brian had grown accustomed to, which took a long time to get him into a comfort zone, and to do so with ultimatums and threats. It is clearly not an easy thing for Brian to just get into the mode of feeling comfortable, secure, and able to write and create art. At this point in his life, songwriting is more difficult for him for many reasons. A stable writing situation for a person like Brian Wilson is not something to just be tinkered with and f*cked with at whim; if there was gonna be change in that scenario, a 1965-style writing scenario wasn't gonna happen overnight. That should make sense to everyone. I'd venture to guess that 99% of people could understand the logic in that, except apparently for one member of the BBs.

And if you think the "threat" verbage is too strong, well it ain't... because I feel certain that if it had even gotten to the talking and discussion point, Mike would have threatened to walk if he didn't get his way since he was so disappointed with how TWGMTR turned out writing-wise. Waaa waaa waaa. Poor wittle Mike. How about Mike having some understanding for a man with emotional problems, who he claims to love, and not blaming those problems solely on drug use, and waiting for a "room" scenario to possibly evolve naturally over the course of time?

Again, because it would take a morsel of understanding that Mike himself and his own attitude could be part of the problem, which Mike outright refuses to consider.  If there was a way to have less-than-zero self-awareness, Mike has surely found that way. I don't know if Mike ever feels that his attitude has ever been a problem for this band whatsoever, in 50+ years.

2012 was the very first time in the history of the band (as far as I know) where Mike could essentially demand that songs be written his way, or else there would be consequences. He never had such leverage before, but boy did he run with that leverage when he finally attained it.  

Outside of Murry, mental illness, and drugs, Mike's ego issues and lack of understanding rank amongst the biggest problems that this band has ever faced, and most everyone (including I'd venture to guess, most members of the BBs themselves, living or deceased) regretfully knows it.

There it is in all it's glory. This post belongs in the" Smiley Smile Hall of Fame"! CD, you've outdone yourself for clarity and a complete and thorough understanding of why I and many others feel toward myKe luHv. And, yes, this is exactly why I spell his name the way I do because he is an unmitigated, ego infested, self absorbed jerk who will never admit to anyone how stinking fortunate he was to be "set up for life" by his ultra talented cousin. He just doesn't get it and most likely never will. This is what turns me and soooooooooo many others against this treacherous clown who ambushes Brian and his problems at every opportunity afforded to him. It's sickening behavior that comes from a truly warped mind. The most hated, laughed at cartoon of our day, bar none.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2015, 06:28:53 PM by The LEGENDARY OSD » Logged

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« Reply #269 on: July 31, 2015, 06:54:46 PM »

While we're off once again on this topic -- can someone explain why adding another dozen or so dates to the tour would have mattered? Do folks think that in 2015 the C50 lineup would still be touring? Would Brian be doing 165 dates per year?Or would Mike want to do only 30, say?

Why would anyone care in 2015 whether the 2012 tour could have been extended a few weeks, unless the thinking is that Mike, Bruce, Brian, Al, and Dave would all be up for a permanent touring lineup? Was that ever a possibility?

As has been discussed/hypothesized many times on here before, there would have to have been compromises reached. Either the reunited band would be more selective about dates they played, and do the "quality over quantity" thing (not a bad way to do things)... or there could probably have been something negotiated where Brian would take some time off from some dates. Those are not impossible scenarios.
So, do we know that Al and Dave would want to do 150+ dates per year? Would some dates have only Mike and Bruce, some have Al without Brian, some Brian without Al? Would they still charge the same for tickets nonetheless?

And whose backup band would they use, Brian's or Mike's, or would they mix and match?

Or would the grand compromise be that Mike and Bruce would join Brian's band, and play only the limited number of dates that Brian is prepared to play? "Quality over  quantity", as you say. But we know that that is not what Mike or Bruce want to do. Who or what is going to force them to do something the don't want to? And why should they?

Maybe in a few years they'll all be semi-retired, off the road, and willing to reunite for 3 or 4 live, special occasion dates per year. But until then, C50 may have ended prematurely, but it will always have ended.
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« Reply #270 on: July 31, 2015, 07:21:27 PM »

While we're off once again on this topic -- can someone explain why adding another dozen or so dates to the tour would have mattered? Do folks think that in 2015 the C50 lineup would still be touring? Would Brian be doing 165 dates per year?Or would Mike want to do only 30, say?

Why would anyone care in 2015 whether the 2012 tour could have been extended a few weeks, unless the thinking is that Mike, Bruce, Brian, Al, and Dave would all be up for a permanent touring lineup? Was that ever a possibility?

As has been discussed/hypothesized many times on here before, there would have to have been compromises reached. Either the reunited band would be more selective about dates they played, and do the "quality over quantity" thing (not a bad way to do things)... or there could probably have been something negotiated where Brian would take some time off from some dates. Those are not impossible scenarios.
So, do we know that Al and Dave would want to do 150+ dates per year? Would some dates have only Mike and Bruce, some have Al without Brian, some Brian without Al? Would they still charge the same for tickets nonetheless?

And whose backup band would they use, Brian's or Mike's, or would they mix and match?

Or would the grand compromise be that Mike and Bruce would join Brian's band, and play only the limited number of dates that Brian is prepared to play? "Quality over  quantity", as you say. But we know that that is not what Mike or Bruce want to do. Who or what is going to force them to do something the don't want to? And why should they?

Maybe in a few years they'll all be semi-retired, off the road, and willing to reunite for 3 or 4 live, special occasion dates per year. But until then, C50 may have ended prematurely, but it will always have ended.

I'm sure Mike and Bruce could handle being "forced" to do something they don't wanna do, kinda like recording SMiLE vocals... Something that might have been out of their comfort zone, but they went ahead and did it anyway. And guess what... Years later, everyone realizes that it's good that they did stuff outside their conservative, fear-based comfort zone, because otherwise we'd not have Mike's admittedly great vocals on that album.

Just like years later, history will look back upon Mike's actions regarding C50 in not a good manner, to say the least. People can minimize the effect that the C50 implosion had all they want, but bottom line was that he sadly cemented his reputation in a highly negative fashion in exchange for milking a few more years of things being exactly his way in his comfort zone. He must really think it's worth it, but he's just about the only one.

Not everybody gets to do everything they want to do all of the time in a band. It was high time in 2012 and beyond that BW (and Al too) got to have his way with the name The Beach Boys (after 1.5 decades of Mike having things his way), and by having things Brian's way, I mean having Mike go along with things without being grudging about it, not Brian hypothetically resorting to forcing the name away in some awful courtroom being the only option for Brian to have things his way in BB-land.  Mike needed to be selfless for once.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2015, 08:20:49 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
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« Reply #271 on: July 31, 2015, 11:18:19 PM »

Last time, and it's not a request...this thread is supposed to be about Brian's autobiography, not chapter 420 of the endless Brian v Mike debate.

Strongly considering closing this and starting a new thread.
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« Reply #272 on: August 01, 2015, 01:43:36 AM »

Considering the bio's on hold, the topics cold for now. Would love to know whats really going on.
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« Reply #273 on: August 01, 2015, 02:18:20 AM »

Text deleted by author.

I hope this is addressed in Brian's new autobio, and Mike's, and Al's, and Bruce's, and so on and so forth...but I'm not holding my breath.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2015, 06:46:42 AM by Cam Mott » Logged

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« Reply #274 on: August 01, 2015, 06:17:48 AM »

Quickly, I thought they are all to blame for a while and I said postings on Al's site, not that Al posted them.

I hope this is addressed in Brian's new autobio, and Mike's, and Al's, and Bruce's, and so on and so forth...but I'm not holding my breath.

like trying to get the last word because you think you're special?
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