Why Not Use Auto-Tune?

[Jukka]

^
This.

Edit. Ah, the topic changed page. Anyway, SenorPotatoHead nailed it (on the previous page).

[puni puni]

Everyone knows that Brian was notorious for his quest for perfection

"This stuff doesn't have to be perfect. It's gotta be just kinda honest and live."
—Brian Wilson, 1966

Go to bed, Joe. f*** autotune.

[Wirestone]

Brian used pitch correction in his music for at least a decade before Joe Thomas was involved, and he continued using it after Joe left for the first time.

There is a middle ground. TLOS has some pitch correction on it, I'm fairly certain, but Brian still sounds like an older guy. Ditto for BWRG.

The airbrushed textures of TWGMTR are not a necessity. (I enjoyed the effect overall, but I sympathize with those who didn't.)

[beacharg]

 

Autotune is a disgusting disgrace for any well-educated ear. One thing is pitch correction, wich is OK, specially for some guys in their 70s... another thing is a robotic voice. I think it's been well established in this forum that Autotune was totallly unecessary in the latest Beach Boys production, it's pretty obvious that's it was used just as a way to make them sound more "modern" and suitable for today's (sh itt y) manistream markets.

[Jukka]

Yeah. Kind of like they'd swapped their sweet harmonies for ten-minute wah-wah guitar orgies back in '69. Selling out to what is hip at the moment. Disgraceful.

[Pretty Funky]

Why are people so upset that there is auto-tuning on the new Beach Boys album(s)? They have earned the right to use it, but more on that below...

Mods...How about a 7 day ban for such a nutty statement? Obviously drinking while posting!

[Shane]

An old college audio production teacher of mine once said, "The best edit is the one you can't hear." 

I think this is true for auto-tune.  If it is used to fix a bum note here or there, and it is done discreetly, then it's fine.  But using auto-tune as an effect for effect's sake is something entirely different.  20 years from now, it will sound dated and bad, just like a drum machine from 1983 sounds to someone with today's ears.  Heck, I can't even stand the way it sounds today.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Brian used pitch correction in his music for at least a decade before Joe Thomas was involved, and he continued using it after Joe left for the first time.

There is a middle ground. TLOS has some pitch correction on it, I'm fairly certain, but Brian still sounds like an older guy. Ditto for BWRG.

The airbrushed textures of TWGMTR are not a necessity. (I enjoyed the effect overall, but I sympathize with those who didn't.)

All of Brian's solo albums from Imagination onwards had pitch correction used, even GIOMH (listen to the strange thing that happens to Brian's voice on Fairy Tale when he sings 'and the flowers died'), although some used it better than others. Really, Brian's voice is such that heavy use of it makes his vocals sound worse. It's okay for someone who hits the notes straight-on (or misses the note straight on), but Brian hasn't been that type of singer in a long time.  Try running pitch correction on a Daniel Johnston vocal, or for a better example, Robert Plant or Bob Dylan.   Their natural voices waver too much for pitch correction to sound natural.

[Wirestone]

Billy, they used pitch collection on BW88 and OCA as well ... (Fairlight and Melodyne respectively.)

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

True that...was specifically referring to autotune itself but i wasn't clear on that with my wording.

Actually,  i thought the only track using pitch correction on BW88 was one for the boys.

His vocals on IJWMFTT sounded a bit.proccessed too at times.

[Cyncie]

If you're in the studio and the 5th take of a vocal just NAILS it, except for that slightly flat note at the top of your range, using auto tune to "fix" an otherwise great take is fine with me.

Using auto tune to make singers out of people who even sound bad in the shower, is not okay. At least find people with some talent!

Mostly, on the Beach Boys and Brian, I hear auto tune being used to bring a "modern" aesthetic to the music. Slick, smooth production is what's in demand. Too much of that with the teen stars, and you wind up with plastic bands that all sound the same. With the Beach Boys, you get a too perfect sheen, but it still sounds like the 'Boys to me. Until the occasional weird artifact shows up.

Mostly, I'm resigned to auto tune in modern music, for now. The backlash is coming. In the meantime, I'm just looking forward to hearing what Brian's coming up with.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Here's the thing...pitch correction can not make someone who can't sing suddenly be able to sing. Doesn't work like that. Plus, with the way autotune is used in modern pop, you have to sing a certain way in order to get the effect to sound like that. It's not merely clicking an icon and wham there it is. Getting that 'T-Pain' sound is trickier than it seems.

[Micha]

Brian used pitch correction in his music for at least a decade before Joe Thomas was involved, and he continued using it after Joe left for the first time.

There is a middle ground. TLOS has some pitch correction on it, I'm fairly certain, but Brian still sounds like an older guy. Ditto for BWRG.

The airbrushed textures of TWGMTR are not a necessity. (I enjoyed the effect overall, but I sympathize with those who didn't.)

I read they pitch corrected even on BB85, but I read that in "Wouldn't It Be Nice". Could still be correct.

[runnersdialzero]

There's a difference between using pitch correction as needed and really putting effort into an artistic creation and... uh, lazily throwing a filter over something an seemingly not even checking if the filter is really not working well in some spots. Or several spots, or most of the time. It's very, very possible to use pitch correction and have it be virtually (if not completely) undetectable.

Joe Thomas' production on That's Why God Made The Radio and especially the live album is extremely lazy and detestable and, worst of all, really hurts the Beach Boys legacy, especially in what may go down as the last albums we get from them. I'm not a fan of his.

[Rick5150]

Why shouldn't the Beach Boys use auto-tune if it gives them the results they are satisfied with, within the time-frame that they have available, given their various schedules? At this point in their lives they may not be capable of producing results that are acceptable to them without using auto-tune.

If it gives us more music from them I am all for it, even though I do not necessarily like the effect. If it is that or nothing, I will gladly take it. Especially if Brian has music he wants to get out.

Also, I will take the auto-tuned Beach Boys over a group of professional musicians who can perfectly recreate their harmonies, because even auto-tuned, I can tell it is the Beach Boys and not the Wondermints, or the touring Beach Boys band. As talented as these bands are (and they are really talented) there is something missing from the vocal blend that needs Brian, Mike, Al and Bruce.

[phirnis]

Also, I will take the auto-tuned Beach Boys over a group of professional musicians who can perfectly recreate their harmonies, because even auto-tuned, I can tell it is the Beach Boys and not the Wondermints, or the touring Beach Boys band. As talented as these bands are (and they are really talented) there is something missing from the vocal blend that needs Brian, Mike, Al and Bruce.

There's a part in Shelter where I seriously can't tell whether it's Jeff Foskett or Mike Love who's singing and that's because of the auto-tune effect.

It's obvious the BB used lots of audio processing on their voices on Still Cruisin' but even on that album (which isn't a big fan favorite as far as I can tell) it sounds a lot more tastefully done than on TWGMTR.

Also, I'm pretty sure at least Al Jardine's voice would sound perfectly fine without the auto-tune effect but it's even used on his singing in From Here to Back Again. Doesn't make an awful lot of sense to me.

[filledeplage]

"This stuff doesn't have to be perfect. It's gotta be just kinda honest and live."
—Brian Wilson, 1966

Give me the seventy-somethings, singing straight from their toes, any old day...

Any flaws were hard-earned, endearing, and now part of their charm...

[Lee Marshall]

"it is probably impossible for the boys to get together for an entire album and do take after take and expect the vocals to be anything other than a little embarrassing "...

From the original post...I don't agree with this.  Embarrassing?   

No.

[phirnis]

Imagine Love You with auto-tune.

[filledeplage]

"it is probably impossible for the boys to get together for an entire album and do take after take and expect the vocals to be anything other than a little embarrassing "...

From the original post...I don't agree with this.  Embarrassing?  

No.

Singing in an "age appropriate" key might be more advantageous to conserve the voice, instead of subjecting it to injury.

When we were in our Music Education for Teaching courses, we learned that different ages and genders have different vocal ranges, where they can sing "do-to-do" comfortably, and several notes above and below the scale.  

Key transposition might be a better alternative to auto tune, where greater authenticy is preserved.  I've read somewhere there is a desire to sing in the (twenty-something) original key.  Keys might need to be adjusted up or down, to accommodate the human voices as it is male/female, young, adult or "mature."

There no shame in transposing a key, but altering/robotizing a voice is another story.  JMHO

[Freddie French-Pounce]

Imagine Love You with auto-tune.

That would be a hell of a trip...

[SMiLE Brian]

Freddie, make more autotune experiments.

[Rick5150]

"it is probably impossible for the boys to get together for an entire album and do take after take and expect the vocals to be anything other than a little embarrassing "...

From the original post...I don't agree with this.  Embarrassing?   

No.

Actually, the original post stated "a little embarrassing." If you remove the auto-tune, the vocals will obviously not be to their high standards or they would not be using auto-tune to begin with. Do you think any of the Beach Boys would want us to hear them sing on a studio album when their vocals are off-key?

[Lee Marshall]

I think we get a pretty good idea of what they can do when we hear them perform live.  Doubtful that many expect perfection in that situation.

What WAS embarrassing is [back in the day] when they played the huge arenas and stadiums and really couldn't hear one another properly.  Next to impossible to nail it in that situation...and they didn't.  When they played the smaller venues...like they did when they went out to promote the 4 disc box ste in the early 90s...the harmonies were tight and ON the mark.  Nowadays with the little ear-pieces they use...they CAN hear and that makes all the difference...usually.

'They' say the last thing to 'go' is the voice...  So I think that they can still do pretty well with all of this and that tweaks are probably all they need much of the time.

----------------------------------

By the way...just so we're clear here...*I'M* not saying it was embarrassing 'back in the day'.  The guys commented about it on stage during the box set tour.

[CenturyDeprived]

The use of Autotune should be invisible, or damn near so. Especially in the case of BB product.

Autotune (when it's used to draw attention to itself as an intentional weird-sounding effect, as is the case on many hip hop/pop albums these days) makes my ears bleed and stomach turn. I don't really think that Joe Thomas was quite going for that style. Maybe he was going for something that sounded a bit "modern", but I can't quite figure out what the intentions were, honestly.

But if there was ever any intent for the use of Autotune to not be blatantly apparent on TWGMTR, it didn't work. It took me a long while to be able to enjoy the album and just “tune out” the annoying autotune, to the best of my ability. I mean, it's still there, but because I love many of the songs on the album, I just try to listen “through” and despite it. I have grown to really love about 60% of that album (even with the Autotune annoyingly audible), but the implementation of Autotune really should have been done better, IMO.