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Author Topic: Damn, I miss it being C50  (Read 18292 times)
stack-o-tracks
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« on: October 15, 2014, 09:53:11 PM »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldD9Vg1izy0

Or if you've got almost 2 hours: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdUeD2ehz64

There's nobody that can say they haven't continued their trend of, in the words of Jack Rieley, "blowing it."


These current Mike & Bruce "Beach Boys" or Brian Wilson with Al Jardine shows simply can't compare. By a long shot.


Discuss, please.
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« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2014, 10:00:54 PM »

They?    Wink
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« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2014, 10:15:41 PM »

They?    Wink

I know you're being facetious, but yes. THEY blew it. If the 5 real Beach Boys wanted to keep playing together, they would have worked something, ANYTHING out. They all just went back to what they were doing before the magnificent time known as C50 like it never happened.... I guess the lyrics to the great "Spring Vacation" mean nothing to them....  Undecided
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« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2014, 10:35:28 PM »

They?    Wink

I know you're being facetious, but yes. THEY blew it. If the 5 real Beach Boys wanted to keep playing together, they would have worked something, ANYTHING out. They all just went back to what they were doing before the magnificent time known as C50 like it never happened.... I guess the lyrics to the great "Spring Vacation" mean nothing to them....  Undecided

I really wonder what Brian and Mike would say if asked today about that Jack Rieley quote. It's *SO* exactly 110% on the mark.
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« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2014, 10:42:34 PM »

Madison Square Garden. Beach Boys. 'Nuff said.  Smiley
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« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2014, 10:48:35 PM »

Madison Square Garden. Beach Boys. 'Nuff said.  Smiley

Can you imagine what 1961 era Mike Love would say if we went back in time and told him that in 51 years, he himself (fronting the future Pendletones) would turn down playing a prestigious bragging-rights venue like Madison Square Garden (it wasn't built till 1968, but still), because of an irresistible urge to forever and ever play "smaller markets" sans cousin Brian? It would be beyond unthinkable.  How power and control has corrupted that man. I'll bet if Jack Rieley was told this exact same future prediction around the time of his departure from the BBs circle, he'd completely believe it and find nothing particularly preposterous about it, given the band politics he'd probably witnessed.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2014, 10:50:41 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
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« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2014, 11:29:57 PM »

Although C50 was nice, I'll always believe the Beach Boys truly ended with Carl's death. As good as the C50 shows were, I still missed Carl's voice.
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« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2014, 11:35:22 PM »

Watching the entire Japanese show tonight really cheered me up, thank you so much for the reminder, stack. Reminded me of being at the soundcheck and in the 10th center at the ecstatic Red Rocks show. I still can't believe how great they sound together with the perfect combination of the two bands. Oh man, the most joyous/celebratory/life comes full circle concert of my life.

And what a disaster the DVD's and CD of the tour turned out to be. I never watch or listen to 'em. If only they released the HD version of this show.

Jack Rieley was right.
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« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2014, 01:51:28 AM »


Can you imagine what 1961 era Mike Love would say if we went back in time and told him that in 51 years, he himself (fronting the future Pendletones) would turn down playing a prestigious bragging-rights venue like Madison Square Garden (it wasn't built till 1968, but still), because of an irresistible urge to forever and ever play "smaller markets" sans cousin Brian? It would be beyond unthinkable.  How power and control has corrupted that man. I'll bet if Jack Rieley was told this exact same future prediction around the time of his departure from the BBs circle, he'd completely believe it and find nothing particularly preposterous about it, given the band politics he'd probably witnessed.

Do you think so?

I would guess that if you had suggested to Mike in the early 60s that he could still be meeting girls and playing county fairs 50 years later that he`d have been thrilled. I think the very fact that The Beach Boys did start out in that manner is one of the reasons why he doesn`t care how prestigious the venue is and he has said he actually prefers playing at the smaller venues.
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« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2014, 02:12:33 AM »

The C50 tour was obviously great but reunion tours very rarely turn into yearly events due to the simple fact that bands generally split up for very good reasons...

Sometimes they might last for a show or two (Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin) and sometimes for a tour or two (The Police, Genesis) but very rarely as a permanent every year thing...
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« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2014, 04:28:02 AM »

Sometimes it isn't why they split up that is the issue - it's why they got back together. I'm sure some bands reunite to get in one last time in the limelight as a reunited band whilst at the same time making a pile of money to shore up their forthcoming retirement. Sometimes they make this decision because of pressure from the fans and from their record label.  Once they've achieved that objective they don't need to continue with it any longer.

From what I have read (and for that matter observed), like a lot of things concerning the Beach Boys, the decision to end the C50 doesn't appear to have been a unanimous one.
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« Reply #11 on: October 16, 2014, 05:20:59 AM »

T'was a glorious time to be alive
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« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2014, 10:00:33 AM »

The C50 events were astonishing... as - sadly - was the torrent of complete nonsense, twaddle & bilge that followed in the wake thereof from all points of the compass and all camps.
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« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2014, 10:23:38 AM »

Madison Square Garden. Beach Boys. 'Nuff said.  Smiley

Can you imagine what 1961 era Mike Love would say if we went back in time and told him that in 51 years, he himself (fronting the future Pendletones) would turn down playing a prestigious bragging-rights venue like Madison Square Garden (it wasn't built till 1968, but still), because of an irresistible urge to forever and ever play "smaller markets" sans cousin Brian? It would be beyond unthinkable.  How power and control has corrupted that man.

By all means, this is NOT a matter of human corruption. Mike Love, or any of the BBs, or any other person, is entitled to not doing what a bunch of people on this forum would like him to.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 10:38:56 AM by Challenger Putney » Logged

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« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2014, 10:48:23 AM »

I guess the lyrics to the great "Spring Vacation" mean nothing to them.... 

Really? I can hear Brian Wilson and the members of Carl Wilson's Estate singing some of those lyrics....about 100 times a year!

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« Reply #15 on: October 16, 2014, 10:55:16 AM »

The C50 events were astonishing... as - sadly - was the torrent of complete nonsense, twaddle & bilge that followed in the wake thereof from all points of the compass and all camps.

...........including this board. I'm burnt out on it. Time to move forward, boys and girls!! 
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« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2014, 11:08:37 AM »

I was just thinking about the C50 tour when I saw Brian and Al in Long Beach the other night.  I definitely miss the C50 tour--it was just a great show to attend.  Satisfying on all levels.  You left the show completely happy.  Wish I could experience that again.


Watching the entire Japanese show tonight really cheered me up, thank you so much for the reminder, stack. Reminded me of being at the soundcheck and in the 10th center at the ecstatic Red Rocks show. I still can't believe how great they sound together with the perfect combination of the two bands. Oh man, the most joyous/celebratory/life comes full circle concert of my life.

And what a disaster the DVD's and CD of the tour turned out to be. I never watch or listen to 'em. If only they released the HD version of this show.

Jack Rieley was right.

PS, I recall you were right in the middle of all the discussions of the upcoming releases of more official DVDs from the tour.  Shame how plans evaporated, isn't it?  I think part of what makes things even more frustrating is that we never got THE perfect live document to represent the tour.  The Phoenix DVD was a huge miss.  Overdubbed vocals, autotuned and edited down to like 90 minutes.  A special edition 2 disc version of either the Royal Albert Hall or Wembley show would have been the perfect product.  But in typical Beach Boys fashion....they screw that up.
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« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2014, 01:00:32 PM »

The C50 tour was obviously great but reunion tours very rarely turn into yearly events due to the simple fact that bands generally split up for very good reasons...

Sometimes they might last for a show or two (Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin) and sometimes for a tour or two (The Police, Genesis) but very rarely as a permanent every year thing...

But when "reunions" break back up, it's usually because some of the principals don't want to continue touring and recording as that band (or at all), and/or the differences in personality, etc. dictate that it can't last (some bands can still eloquently end it even when they're doing so because of differences of personalities, etc.), and then the members go to other things.

The BIG difference with the Beach Boys, and the one that rightly or wrongly paints Mike Love as the villain, is that a couple of the members continued under the same name. I'm pretty sure Sting would have gotten plenty of s**t from fans and the media/critics if he had continued on without the other two guys as "The Police", even moreso if the other two guys *wanted* to keep going as a group. I'm sure Fleetwood and McVie would have been scorned if they had moved to continue on as "Fleetwood Mac" in the later 90's and 2000's without Nicks and Buckingham, while both Nicks and Buckingham were ready and willing. Can anyone imagine Mick Fleetwood going "you know, the smaller markets just can't afford Steve Nicks being in the band, so we're going back to the way it was before the reunion, with Bonnie Bramlett's daughter and Dave Mason."

If Mike Love had moved on from C50 and done solo shows or started another band, *very little*, and probably NO bad press would have resulted. Sure, fans still would have been bummed. But the press wouldn't have caught on to the fact that Mike was continuing to tour under the same name.

Had that crapola press release been well-written, and described how all of the members were going to tour under their own name, there wouldn't have been any "firing" headlines.

I only mention this because the end of the Beach Boys "reunion" was NOT typical, even compared to other fogey bands doing short-term reunions. The Beach Boys only look more like idiots because the actual reunion itself went much better than some other bands' reunions have, in terms of critical acclaim.

Howie Edelson is right; they were the laughing stock of the industry when C50 fell apart. They probably aren't anymore, because everybody stopped caring. They're back to being known on the touring rounds as a Motown-style revue, making good money touring small to medium venues with bands like the remnants of "Chicago" and "Creedence Clearwater Revisited."
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« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2014, 03:38:30 PM »

Watching the entire Japanese show tonight really cheered me up, thank you so much for the reminder, stack. Reminded me of being at the soundcheck and in the 10th center at the ecstatic Red Rocks show. I still can't believe how great they sound together with the perfect combination of the two bands. Oh man, the most joyous/celebratory/life comes full circle concert of my life.

And what a disaster the DVD's and CD of the tour turned out to be. I never watch or listen to 'em. If only they released the HD version of this show.

Jack Rieley was right.

+1.

No band has mastered pulling defeat from the jaws of victory like the Beach Boys have.
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« Reply #19 on: October 16, 2014, 03:57:14 PM »


Can you imagine what 1961 era Mike Love would say if we went back in time and told him that in 51 years, he himself (fronting the future Pendletones) would turn down playing a prestigious bragging-rights venue like Madison Square Garden (it wasn't built till 1968, but still), because of an irresistible urge to forever and ever play "smaller markets" sans cousin Brian? It would be beyond unthinkable.  How power and control has corrupted that man. I'll bet if Jack Rieley was told this exact same future prediction around the time of his departure from the BBs circle, he'd completely believe it and find nothing particularly preposterous about it, given the band politics he'd probably witnessed.

Do you think so?

I would guess that if you had suggested to Mike in the early 60s that he could still be meeting girls and playing county fairs 50 years later that he`d have been thrilled. I think the very fact that The Beach Boys did start out in that manner is one of the reasons why he doesn`t care how prestigious the venue is and he has said he actually prefers playing at the smaller venues.

Oh I do think that a young 1961-era Mike Love would be thrilled to hear that he could still be meeting girls and playing county fairs 50 years later - I don't deny that. It's just that IMO, the concept that he would choose that scenario over the prestige of the BBs playing Madison Square Garden (pretty much one of the very, very ultimate venues for any band) and playing with his cousin Brian... that those things would be turned down in and of itself would probably seem to be an unthinkable concept to young Love if a future visitor told him so. And yes, I'm sure he could never forsee the amount of water under the bridge that would flow that could cause such a crazy circumstance to happen either.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 04:03:04 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
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« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2014, 04:00:07 PM »

I wonder how much the failure to get other "C50" product out there has to do with the relations (or lack thereof) that led to the tour not continuing. In other words, have the other potential DVD/Blu-ray projects fallen apart because no companies are interested, or because the companies are sketchy (which appears to be the case with the operation that used "PledgeMusic" to put together their project), or because certain parties within the group don't want more "50th Anniversary Tour" product out there to highlight the fact that that lineup is not what is out there now.

Besides the failed project done through PledgeMusic (to be fair, it's not "PledgeMusic" that failed, it's the company that used them to solicit donations), there was word that EMI/Universal might pick up the remnants of that project and put something out, but nothing came of that. Also, does anyone remember that there were full-on posters/promotional materials made for an in-theater 3D presentation of their Hollywood Bowl show from 2012? They apparently shot the thing in 3D, and at some point were going to put something out with that.

http://rockfuelmedia.com/event/the-beach-boys-3d-live-at-the-hollywood-bowl/



They also supposedly got the Red Rocks show captured for a potential video release.

Not to mention the other obvious projects like at least putting out the Royal Albert Hall show in audio form (video from any tour dates is much more difficult because they have to pay for sync rights to the publishing companies; this is one of the reasons the "Live in Concert" release only had 21 songs).

I can't imagine Mike would be particularly extra enthusiastic about putting more C50 releases out there right now. Brian probably cares little about it too. It makes sense that maybe more time would have to pass. But we can't have another "Knebworth 1980" where it takes 22 years to put it out. I don't want to wait until 2034 for a "Royal Albert Hall 2012" release.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2014, 04:02:47 PM by HeyJude » Logged

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« Reply #21 on: October 16, 2014, 04:06:23 PM »

The C50 tour was obviously great but reunion tours very rarely turn into yearly events due to the simple fact that bands generally split up for very good reasons...

Sometimes they might last for a show or two (Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin) and sometimes for a tour or two (The Police, Genesis) but very rarely as a permanent every year thing...

But when "reunions" break back up, it's usually because some of the principals don't want to continue touring and recording as that band (or at all), and/or the differences in personality, etc. dictate that it can't last (some bands can still eloquently end it even when they're doing so because of differences of personalities, etc.), and then the members go to other things.

The BIG difference with the Beach Boys, and the one that rightly or wrongly paints Mike Love as the villain, is that a couple of the members continued under the same name. I'm pretty sure Sting would have gotten plenty of s**t from fans and the media/critics if he had continued on without the other two guys as "The Police", even moreso if the other two guys *wanted* to keep going as a group. I'm sure Fleetwood and McVie would have been scorned if they had moved to continue on as "Fleetwood Mac" in the later 90's and 2000's without Nicks and Buckingham, while both Nicks and Buckingham were ready and willing. Can anyone imagine Mick Fleetwood going "you know, the smaller markets just can't afford Steve Nicks being in the band, so we're going back to the way it was before the reunion, with Bonnie Bramlett's daughter and Dave Mason."

If Mike Love had moved on from C50 and done solo shows or started another band, *very little*, and probably NO bad press would have resulted. Sure, fans still would have been bummed. But the press wouldn't have caught on to the fact that Mike was continuing to tour under the same name.

Had that crapola press release been well-written, and described how all of the members were going to tour under their own name, there wouldn't have been any "firing" headlines.

I only mention this because the end of the Beach Boys "reunion" was NOT typical, even compared to other fogey bands doing short-term reunions. The Beach Boys only look more like idiots because the actual reunion itself went much better than some other bands' reunions have, in terms of critical acclaim.

Howie Edelson is right; they were the laughing stock of the industry when C50 fell apart. They probably aren't anymore, because everybody stopped caring. They're back to being known on the touring rounds as a Motown-style revue, making good money touring small to medium venues with bands like the remnants of "Chicago" and "Creedence Clearwater Revisited."

Sure but this is all a separate (albeit related) topic. The OP was talking about missing the C50 and the truth is that it was never still going to be continuing in 2014.

People have talked about many hypotheticals...

What if they had retired the name in 1998? (They didn`t)

What if Mike was a different person? (He`s not)

What if they had a supreme manager who could equally represent and please all members for years? (They never have and never will)

Of course other groups do not have the same set of circumstances as The Beach Boys and split up in different ways. But the reality is that when the reunion ended Mike was always going to go back to touring using the group name. As they couldn`t even agree to do a few more shows at the end of 2012, there was never any chance that they were going to carry on for another 2 years up to this point...
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« Reply #22 on: October 16, 2014, 04:13:18 PM »

I wonder how much the failure to get other "C50" product out there has to do with the relations (or lack thereof) that led to the tour not continuing. In other words, have the other potential DVD/Blu-ray projects fallen apart because no companies are interested, or because the companies are sketchy (which appears to be the case with the operation that used "PledgeMusic" to put together their project), or because certain parties within the group don't want more "50th Anniversary Tour" product out there to highlight the fact that that lineup is not what is out there now.

Besides the failed project done through PledgeMusic (to be fair, it's not "PledgeMusic" that failed, it's the company that used them to solicit donations), there was word that EMI/Universal might pick up the remnants of that project and put something out, but nothing came of that. Also, does anyone remember that there were full-on posters/promotional materials made for an in-theater 3D presentation of their Hollywood Bowl show from 2012? They apparently shot the thing in 3D, and at some point were going to put something out with that.

http://rockfuelmedia.com/event/the-beach-boys-3d-live-at-the-hollywood-bowl/



They also supposedly got the Red Rocks show captured for a potential video release.

Not to mention the other obvious projects like at least putting out the Royal Albert Hall show in audio form (video from any tour dates is much more difficult because they have to pay for sync rights to the publishing companies; this is one of the reasons the "Live in Concert" release only had 21 songs).

I can't imagine Mike would be particularly extra enthusiastic about putting more C50 releases out there right now. Brian probably cares little about it too. It makes sense that maybe more time would have to pass. But we can't have another "Knebworth 1980" where it takes 22 years to put it out. I don't want to wait until 2034 for a "Royal Albert Hall 2012" release.

I hadn`t seen a possible Royal Albert Hall release mentioned before...

But to put out another live album from the same tour featuring mostly the same songs only 1 year later would seem relatively uncommon.
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« Reply #23 on: October 16, 2014, 04:20:52 PM »

I wonder how much the failure to get other "C50" product out there has to do with the relations (or lack thereof) that led to the tour not continuing. In other words, have the other potential DVD/Blu-ray projects fallen apart because no companies are interested, or because the companies are sketchy (which appears to be the case with the operation that used "PledgeMusic" to put together their project), or because certain parties within the group don't want more "50th Anniversary Tour" product out there to highlight the fact that that lineup is not what is out there now.

Besides the failed project done through PledgeMusic (to be fair, it's not "PledgeMusic" that failed, it's the company that used them to solicit donations), there was word that EMI/Universal might pick up the remnants of that project and put something out, but nothing came of that. Also, does anyone remember that there were full-on posters/promotional materials made for an in-theater 3D presentation of their Hollywood Bowl show from 2012? They apparently shot the thing in 3D, and at some point were going to put something out with that.

http://rockfuelmedia.com/event/the-beach-boys-3d-live-at-the-hollywood-bowl/



They also supposedly got the Red Rocks show captured for a potential video release.

Not to mention the other obvious projects like at least putting out the Royal Albert Hall show in audio form (video from any tour dates is much more difficult because they have to pay for sync rights to the publishing companies; this is one of the reasons the "Live in Concert" release only had 21 songs).

I can't imagine Mike would be particularly extra enthusiastic about putting more C50 releases out there right now. Brian probably cares little about it too. It makes sense that maybe more time would have to pass. But we can't have another "Knebworth 1980" where it takes 22 years to put it out. I don't want to wait until 2034 for a "Royal Albert Hall 2012" release.

I have thought the same exact thing. What incentive was there (past a certain point) to promote BB reunion-related product?  I think that's why Isn't it Time got very little traction, I have a hunch that the promotion machine was cut off at the knees and called off early.

I'm not sure that anyone knows the exact timeline in C50 of when the sh*t hit the fan internally, when there started to be some real hurt feelings and lack of communication... certainly when M&B didn't attend that famous dinner, though I think it was brewing right around the time of the Grammy Museum performance. I think that timeline would probably coincide with certain other things getting called off (besides more reunion shows). Prior to myself or anyone publicly knowing about the impending C50 implosion, I briefly talked to Joe Thomas about the Isn't it Time single version at the Grammy museum, and I do wonder how much it must've seemed to everyone behind the scenes that the new single (which they spent time re-doing as a single version) was dead in the water because the reunion was about to be also.

In any event, I think that the only reunion-related releases since it imploded have purely been contractual. I'd wonder if more care would've been put into the autotune disasters on the live CD if there wasn't so much bad blood around then. When the band gives less of a damn than they would have in other circumstances, I'll bet the approval process was easier to let sloppy stuff slip through and get released.  

I don't think the band (certainly Mike) needs more releases to remind people of C50. I've said it before and I'll say it again: I wonder if he wishes it had never happened at this point, if he could do it all over again, because he gets asked about it (and finds himself in a defensive position about it) in most interviews since 2012.  At a certain point, that might tip the scale and be more negative than whatever he "got" out of the reunion (which obviously wasn't what he wanted, at least songwriting-wise).
« Last Edit: October 17, 2014, 01:30:06 AM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
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« Reply #24 on: October 16, 2014, 04:24:43 PM »

But we can't have another "Knebworth 1980" where it takes 22 years to put it out. I don't want to wait until 2034 for a "Royal Albert Hall 2012" release.

I am fully expecting something like that to happen at this point.  The wave of hype from 2012 has completely evaporated by now.  It's a shame that the band doesn't have Led Zeppelin sized popularity where they released their reunion concert on DVD/BR 5 years later to huge sales.  Had the BB not released the Phoenix show and actually waited to get the right package together, I think it would have done fairly well even 5 years later or whatever.

My impression was that the "other" DVD/BR project was supposed to be a documentary focusing more on the behind the scenes story of the tour with a healthy dose of live performances edited together from Red Rocks and the Hollywood Bowl.  Perhaps PS could give some insight since he was close with the director of the project(s).  It's clear now that all parties involved have lost interest (and maybe the funds) to keep the project going.  No doubt it died soon after the tour ended.

As it is with most BB related material, they seemed to have bit off more than they could chew when they filmed all those shows.  They thought they'd do something with it but were probably full expecting the footage to go straight to their archives where it'd sit for several years.  The Red Rocks show certainly would have been a great release but one of the London shows would certainly have been the ultimate package.  Shame they appeared to have filmed the Royal Albert Hall show with nothing more than a few GoPro cameras around the stage.
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