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Author Topic: Do you ever think Brian saw this and...  (Read 4032 times)
Mr. Cohen
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« on: August 28, 2014, 06:29:00 AM »

Do you ever think Brian saw the cover of Nilsson Schmilsson (http://lghttp.23652.nexcesscdn.net/80AC18/images/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/h/a/harry_nilsson.jpeg) and thought, now that's cool!

I also think it opens up a broader discussion of how influenced Brian was in the '70s by Nilsson and Randy Newman. I think, as he searched for a new sound for a new decade, he moved past Spector to those guys. I imagine him hearing a song like "Jump Into the Fire" (off Nilsson Schmilsson and released as a single) and grooving out on the repetitive rock riffs and gravely vocals. I also think that "Mt. Vernon and Fairway" was directly inspired by Nilsson's The Point!, and even the interludes on That Lucky Old Sun are, for me, strongly reminiscent of that album.

Of course, we know Brian wrote the fairytale on Holland with Newman's Sail Away on repeat. Hell, one of the songs recorded for his recent album project is even called "Sail Away" (though maybe he's paying homage to Styx!). Oh, and wasn't the working title for Reimagines Gerswhin Wilson Sings Gershwin, a tribute to Nilsson Sings Newman? And what about the Disney Newman songs he covered?

Beyond that, I detect a creeping sarcasm in Brian's '70s output that I believe is very Newmanian, if you will. In fact, I think "Hey Little Tomboy" is a perfect example of a completely tongue-in-cheek Newman take on a subject. Brian plays it completely straight, and just like how "Short People" (done around the same time) caused a big outrage, "Hey Little Tomboy" still perplexes fans. "Johnny Carson" is another good example, with Brian doing a character study that, at times, devolves into rote descriptions of what the character is doing. Didn't Family Guy parody Newman for doing stuff like that?

Plus, you have to wonder if Newman's unusual singing voice encouraged Brian to take such an honest approach with his voice, starting with 15 Big Ones.

Let's hear it, folks.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2014, 09:59:54 AM by Mr. Cohen » Logged
Smilin Ed H
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« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2014, 09:43:23 AM »

There's stuff on Randy's first album that seems to owe something to Smile, probably via VDP
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Mr. Cohen
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« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2014, 10:28:58 AM »

Yeah, I think Randy's first album had a VDP influence, and maybe a little Pet Sounds. Brian, IMO, didn't arrange that similarly to VDP or Randy. They used similar instrumental palettes, but Brian was always very focused on relatively simple pop hooks and immediacy in a way I rarely hear in their early work. And Randy always maintained a rawness to his sound that Brian didn't adopt until a lot later. Or maybe a better way to put it is that Randy was the clear star of his songs - his performances both vocally and on piano tend to dominate. Brian's playing certainly didn't play a prominent role in his '60s work, and he was just one element in the harmonies, and only one of the lead vocalists.
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Joel Goldenberg
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« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2014, 11:32:39 AM »

Do you ever think Brian saw the cover of Nilsson Schmilsson (http://lghttp.23652.nexcesscdn.net/80AC18/images/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/h/a/harry_nilsson.jpeg) and thought, now that's cool!

 Didn't Family Guy parody Newman for doing stuff like that?



I think Family Guy parodied Newman for his Disney soundtrack songs.
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Mr. Cohen
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« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2014, 11:53:16 AM »

Well, yeah, that's a big part of why the writers found him an easy target. But they were also lampooning a weird songwriting trait he's always had, a tendency to fill out lines with generic or repetitive observations. Two examples I can think of off the top of my head (lyrics might be slightly wrong):

"And people stopped and said hello
Or they'd say hi to you"

Or...

"Look at that mountain
Look at that tree
Look at that bum"
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♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇
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« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2014, 11:55:54 AM »

That, and he had the voice of a cartoon bear.

edit

referring to Newman, obviously
« Last Edit: August 28, 2014, 12:06:52 PM by Solid Snake » Logged

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Chocolate Shake Man
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« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2014, 12:04:02 PM »

I'm surprised that Brian doesn't name check Nilsson more, which suggests that Nilsson hasn't had as much of an impact on Brian as I would imagine he should have had. In other words, you'd think that Nilsson would have been right up Brian's alley but he almost appears to be more of a periphery interest. The song of Nilsson's that Brian calls out the most seems to be This Could Be the Night - but I think that speaks more to his allegiance to Spector than anything.

It always seemed to me, though, that Newman-Parks-Nilsson were a kind of particular triumvirate - they appeared to be friends and they collaborated together. Brian would have made a comfortable 4th addition, but never quite seemed to join in. But Brian speaks so highly of Van Dyke and Newman that you wonder why Nilsson doesn't come up as much.
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« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2014, 12:08:05 PM »

Considering they partied together a bit right when Brian started to REALLY go down (the first time), maybe it brings back bad memories from Brian?


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Chocolate Shake Man
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« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2014, 12:16:11 PM »

Considering they partied together a bit right when Brian started to REALLY go down (the first time), maybe it brings back bad memories from Brian?




Could be.

Also, Parks and Newman were a bit more Americana than Nilsson. They understood their place in a national tradition of music and evoked the spirit of Americana often in their own works. Nilsson doesn't do that as much and maybe Brian appreciated the Americana element.
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Mr. Cohen
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« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2014, 05:13:19 PM »

Because of my first post, I relistened to Nilsson Schmillson (I love how he's begging for a typo), and I noticed that the album has a day to night theme.  It starts with songs like "Gotta Get Up" and "Early in the Mornin'" and ends with songs about sleep and dreaming. There's a lot of focus on the sun and moon. Reminds me of the original concept of That Lucky Old Sun, some of which carried into the final product.

Oh, and there's a song in Spanish on Schmillson, while TLOS has "Mexican Girl".
« Last Edit: August 28, 2014, 05:27:56 PM by Mr. Cohen » Logged
alf wiedersehen
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« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2014, 05:31:06 PM »

I relistened to Nilsson Schmillson (I love how he's begging for a typo)

That is a typo.
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Mr. Cohen
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« Reply #11 on: August 28, 2014, 05:32:07 PM »

Dang.
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« Reply #12 on: August 28, 2014, 05:36:39 PM »

Considering they partied together a bit right when Brian started to REALLY go down (the first time), maybe it brings back bad memories from Brian?




Could be.

Also, Parks and Newman were a bit more Americana than Nilsson. They understood their place in a national tradition of music and evoked the spirit of Americana often in their own works. Nilsson doesn't do that as much and maybe Brian appreciated the Americana element.

And, that may explain why I'm a fan of Nilsson and don't care for Parks or Newman.
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Smilin Ed H
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« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2014, 02:49:37 AM »

Harry's a lot better when he's not trying to be a Beatle.
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phirnis
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« Reply #14 on: August 29, 2014, 05:16:46 AM »

He only seems to namecheck a small portion of his influences regularly. Also, his 70s bathrobe phase was a long time ago and Ding Dang/Shortenin' Bread/Mt Vernon is not what interviewers tend to ask about a lot.
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harveyw
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« Reply #15 on: August 29, 2014, 12:35:46 PM »

On a more prosaic note, the typeface on the cover of Schmilsson (cooper) is the same as the Pet Sounds typeface. 
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« Reply #16 on: August 29, 2014, 12:42:22 PM »

On a more prosaic note, the typeface on the cover of Schmilsson (cooper) is the same as the Pet Sounds typeface. 

I never noticed that!  LOL
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Sound of Free
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« Reply #17 on: August 31, 2014, 10:56:40 PM »

I'm a big fan of Nilsson. If you haven't seen the documentary "Who Is Harry Nilsson and Why is Everybody Talking About Him?" you should check it out.

Brian appears briefly a couple of times and praises Harry's songwriting. As might be expected, there's a lot of Van Dyke, but no Ringo Starr. Ringo finds it hard to talk on camera about his late friends.



Anyone know who the blonde is?
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