Love and Mercy - News and Reviews - First clip is out.

[sea of tunes]

I've talked about this a bit in my various observations about L&M but I would like to get other peoples interpretations.

There are two shots of 'Brian Present' (1970s) in bed.  Both shots last no longer than 4-5 seconds each.   What is your take on those two momentary interludes?  What do they mean?  How do you interpret them?

[Fire Wind]

This might have been addressed somewhere already, but where was Audree in the film?  She appears in the end credits.

[rab2591]

This might have been addressed somewhere already, but where was Audree in the film?  She appears in the end credits.

She is standing next to Murry just offstage while the Beach Boys were playing a show during the opening 8mm montage.

[Fire Wind]

Oh, yeah!  Thanks.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I've talked about this a bit in my various observations about L&M but I would like to get other peoples interpretations.

There are two shots of 'Brian Present' (1970s) in bed.  Both shots last no longer than 4-5 seconds each.   What is your take on those two momentary interludes?  What do they mean?  How do you interpret them?

Think Kubrick. Think Bowman.

[rab2591]

I've talked about this a bit in my various observations about L&M but I would like to get other peoples interpretations.

There are two shots of 'Brian Present' (1970s) in bed.  Both shots last no longer than 4-5 seconds each.   What is your take on those two momentary interludes?  What do they mean?  How do you interpret them?

Think Kubrick. Think Bowman.

Exactly.

What is the meaning? According to the book 2001 (spoiler alert), from what I remember, the aliens placed Bowman in that room where his brain is studied or something. The aliens then help him complete the next step of human evolution...Bowman becomes the Starchild.

What does this have to do with L&M? Bowman lives out what seem like his last days in that room - his body becomes frail while he withers away in bed. He becomes old, and the scene quickly shows us this process by showing Bowman looking at himself at different stages of his aging process (much like in Love and Mercy when Brian is looking at different stages of his life):





Finally bowman looks back toward the bed where his dying body rests:







Compare with these (had to use the actual picture of Brian in bed because I don't have the actual scene, but a similar pose is used in the movie):





And I honestly do believe that Brian touching the walls of the studio during the cancelled $5,000 session was a hint at this future evolution (though I am willing to be told I am 100% wrong about this theory ):



I think it all ties together that Brian was in bed, on his deathbed. The bed is symbolic in the movie of every horrible thing that happened to him. He was staring death in the face for much of his life, but through the power of love (when Melinda came along) Brian was able to take that next step in his life (an evolution if you will) - to a better life (much like the dying bedridden Bowman became the Starchild - the next step in human evolution according to 2001).

I recommend anyone who sees and loves Love and Mercy go out and watch 2001 if you haven't. I'm sure there are even more hints to 2001 scattered throughout the film, and again I can't wait to get the blu-ray to fully study the film and connect all the dots.

TL;DR my understanding of this sequence is that Brian is taking a next step in his evolution as a person and musician - and Pohlad expresses this idea more easily by making a direct homage to the final evolution scene in 2001. The power of love allows Brian to transform back to his true self - it allows him to finish Smile, to continue to be a successful musician.

[sea of tunes]

I've talked about this a bit in my various observations about L&M but I would like to get other peoples interpretations.

There are two shots of 'Brian Present' (1970s) in bed.  Both shots last no longer than 4-5 seconds each.   What is your take on those two momentary interludes?  What do they mean?  How do you interpret them?

Think Kubrick. Think Bowman.

To be clear, I'm not talking about the 2001 montage-homage.  I'm talking specifically about the two independent interludes of Brian in bed in the 1970s.

BTW - have you seen the film yet?

[rab2591]

Oh gotcha - even after seeing the movie 4 times I can't place exactly the context in which those two interludes take place.

[sea of tunes]

I've talked about this a bit in my various observations about L&M but I would like to get other peoples interpretations.

There are two shots of 'Brian Present' (1970s) in bed.  Both shots last no longer than 4-5 seconds each.   What is your take on those two momentary interludes?  What do they mean?  How do you interpret them?

Think Kubrick. Think Bowman.

Exactly.

What is the meaning? According to the book 2001 (spoiler alert), from what I remember, the aliens placed Bowman in that room where his brain is studied or something. The aliens then help him complete the next step of human evolution...Bowman becomes the Starchild.

I get what you are saying and indeed I've seen 2001 probably as many times as I've seen LOVE & MERCY, 10 and counting.  I think the two bed interludes I'm referring to are detached from the 2001 homage-montage that happens in the last 20 minutes of the film.

The original screenplay, as I understand, had three Brian's.  Brian 'Past' (1960s), Brian 'Present' (1970s) and Brian 'Future' (1980s).  Brian 'Present' was whittled down to two 4-5 second interludes at the beginning of the film, following the initial prologue of Brian at the piano -> and then the "Black Hole" ear sequence.  There we first see Brian 'Present'.  I think that part of the story (and this is just a theory) is Brian 'Present' remembering all the sounds and images of Brian 'Past'.  The second time we see Brian 'Present' is at roughly the 100 minute mark of the film after Marylin calls to Brian 'come see (Carnie), she's got your smile'.   Quickly after the 2nd appearance of Brian 'Present' we cut to 'the Last Will and Testament of Brian Douglas Wilson', Gloria giving Melinda what she found in the printer.

My take on this is that as the film opens Brian 'Present' is remembering Brian 'Past' and the music.  And the 2nd time is a visual reference of what Brian 'Past' becomes after several more years of psychosis.  Then we jump back to the 'Future' with the will and then Landy being served.

Regarding the 2001 homage-montage (I'm coining that phrase) definitely thing you are right on the money in your assessment.  Brian 'Future' laying in bed now unshackled from Dr. Landy, hearing voices in his head, again remember the past –  all the way back to childhood.  And then feeling himself first person in bed at various stages.  

Heavy stuff, all of it.  A lesser film wouldn't have even dared go anywhere near this.  

[rab2591]

My take on this is that as the film opens Brian 'Present' is remembering Brian 'Past' and the music.  And the 2nd time is a visual reference of what Brian 'Past' becomes after several more years of psychosis.  Then we jump back to the 'Future' with the will and then Landy being served.

I never looked too deeply into those two interludes - always thought they were only put there to shock the viewer: this was Brian at his absolute worst when he had no one....and Pohlad just placed them there twice to keep the viewer informed of that time period. But reading your interpretation, and given the symbolic nature of the rest of the film, I definitely agree with your assessment.

On a side note, I find it crazy that I've had David Bowman as my avatar on Smiley Smile pretty much ever since I signed up here, and he's being used as a nearly direct homage in this new film.

[sea of tunes]

On a side note, I find it crazy that I've had David Bowman as my avatar on Smiley Smile pretty much ever since I signed up here, and he's being used as a nearly direct homage in this new film.

That is pretty sweet, I have to say.  This is off topic but I still remember the first time I saw 2001.  Early 1990s on American Movie Classics, before they branded themselves AMC I think.  It was I think like the first letterboxes presentation of the film on cable.  Wish I had been alive in and of age in the 1968 to have seen it in the theater.

I can't think of a more ambitious movie than 2001 ever maybe... except CITIZEN KANE.

[jjbackus]

To clarify the Guardian review situation:

There was a 3 star (out of 5) early review from the Toronto film festival. 
http://www.theguardian.com/film/2014/sep/08/love-and-mercy-review-brian-wilson-biopic

This was the young guy in the video review (http://www.theguardian.com/film/video/2015/jul/10/love-and-mercy-video-review).

The old guy in the video review is the Guardian's senior film critic (and one of the most respected in the UK). He gave it a 4 star review.
http://www.theguardian.com/film/2015/jul/09/love-mercy-review-the-two-lives-of-brian-wilson

And to add to the confusion, there is also a four star ("film of the week") review in the Guardian's sister paper The Observer:
http://www.theguardian.com/film/2015/jul/12/love-and-mercy-brian-wilson-beach-boys-paul-dano-john-cusack-review

[Andrew G. Doe]

Just back from seeing the movie, and initial reactions are:

Some towering and award-worthy performances...

Impeccable attention to period detail...

Surprisingly few "that's wrong/never happened" moments...

Symbolism and cross-referencing to beat the band...

Delighted to see someone finally getting their due recognition...

That score demands to be released...

A timely reminder of just how truly wonderful this music is...

I need to see it at least twice more.

[cant wait]

nice review.  What is an example of symbolism and cross referencing?

- seen it myself, but am not a deep thinker...

[Misterlou]

nice review.  What is an example of symbolism and cross referencing?

- seen it myself, but am not a deep thinker...

Glad you liked it Andrew!

As far as symbolism "can't wait," that topic has been discussed quite extensively on this board, in more than one thread if I'm not mistaken, including this one.

One biggie is the placement of the Beach Boys in the pool scene toward the end of the film. Brian treading water and in the deep end, which is symbolic on more than one level; Dennis up to his neck in water, and the closest to Brian, which again works in more ways than one, most especially that he would go anywhere for Brian; Carl waist deep, perhaps not quite as loyal to Brian (although that may be up for debate, maybe not); Mike out of the water altogether, and elevated on a ledge, if I remember correctly; and Al, out of the water as well, as if to say, I'm not having anything to do with this (were his arms crossed too?). And Van Dyke Parks, off to the side a bit, as was Mike, but as far from Mike as possible, sitting on the pool edge, his feet dangling in.

I don't have much time right now, but another instance is when the three brothers are on the deck, and Dennis is sitting on the railing overlooking what's below, including the water, and it looks like quite a drop-off, and is symbolic in how he is positioned, and what he says, and how he died... as in the montage following, he is gone from that shot, symbolizing his death.

There's a lot more though.... a great film that demands multiple viewings, and like only a few films, works like our favorite music (not just because our favorite music is in it), in that it doesn't grow old.

[Niko]

Delighted to see someone finally getting their due recognition...

Agreed, after all this time its great to see Melinda in the spotlight.

[rab2591]

Delighted to see someone finally getting their due recognition...

Agreed, after all this time its great to see Melinda in the spotlight.

I know that her role has been discussed quite a bit in recent years (especially in Carlin's book), but it's wonderful that the mainstream public will now see and understand the importance of her role thanks to Love and Mercy. Glad others realize this as well!

[sea of tunes]

I don't have much time right now, but another instance is when the three brothers are on the deck, and Dennis is sitting on the railing overlooking what's below, including the water, and it looks like quite a drop-off, and is symbolic in how he is positioned, and what he says, and how he died... as in the montage following, he is gone from that shot, symbolizing his death.

There's a lot more though.... a great film that demands multiple viewings, and like only a few films, works like our favorite music (not just because our favorite music is in it), in that it doesn't grow old.

So much going on in this film.  Not just for BW devotees, for film lovers alike.  The scene you reference there, Dennis sitting on the railing — my thoughts exactly.  In the closing flashback montage late in the film, as you mention, the same shot is shown but Dennis is no longer sitting on the rail.  The very next frame shows shadows of water from the pool. 

Deep stuff.

[rab2591]

On a side note, I find it crazy that I've had David Bowman as my avatar on Smiley Smile pretty much ever since I signed up here, and he's being used as a nearly direct homage in this new film.

That is pretty sweet, I have to say.  This is off topic but I still remember the first time I saw 2001.  Early 1990s on American Movie Classics, before they branded themselves AMC I think.  It was I think like the first letterboxes presentation of the film on cable.  Wish I had been alive in and of age in the 1968 to have seen it in the theater.

I can't think of a more ambitious movie than 2001 ever maybe... except CITIZEN KANE.

First time I saw 2001 I was 10 years old and fell asleep halfway into it - thought it was tremendously boring. Then rewatched it as an adult and my mind was blown away by it. 2001 is indeed one of the most ambitious films ever made, so glad Pohlad put elements of it in L&M.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Delighted to see someone finally getting their due recognition...

Agreed, after all this time its great to see Melinda in the spotlight.

I wasn't referring to Melinda. Her role in Brian's life since the mid-eighties has long been recognised and rightly appreciated.

[Chocolate Shake Man]

On a side note, I find it crazy that I've had David Bowman as my avatar on Smiley Smile pretty much ever since I signed up here, and he's being used as a nearly direct homage in this new film.

That is pretty sweet, I have to say.  This is off topic but I still remember the first time I saw 2001.  Early 1990s on American Movie Classics, before they branded themselves AMC I think.  It was I think like the first letterboxes presentation of the film on cable.  Wish I had been alive in and of age in the 1968 to have seen it in the theater.

I can't think of a more ambitious movie than 2001 ever maybe... except CITIZEN KANE.

If you like ambitious, you should also consider Kurosawa's Ran and Robert Altman's Nashville. Talk about ambitious movies!

[SMiLE Brian]

Don't forget about Stamo's "American family". That scene of the BBs being forced to stare at a doll kills me every time.

[SMiLE Brian]

Delighted to see someone finally getting their due recognition...

Agreed, after all this time its great to see Melinda in the spotlight.

yeah Melinda is a wonderful lady who comes off great in the movie, Mike Love not so much.

[sea of tunes]

If you like ambitious, you should also consider Kurosawa's Ran and Robert Altman's Nashville. Talk about ambitious movies!

I appreciate Kurosawa's work, my favorite is probably IKIRU.  Out more grandiose films, I would have have to settle in with SEVEN SAMURAI.  I'm nearly 40 and still never seen NASHVILLE.  I do love Altman though, very much.  I have a personal love for THE PLAYER.

The first movie I ever saw when I was like 4 years old, my aunt took me to see POPEYE (the Altman movie).  I guess if you are going to be introduced to the cinema with a classic cartoon character, it might as well have Altman in the director's chair and Harry Nilsson & Van Dyke Parks doing the soundtrack.  It wasn't until many, many years later that I made the associations of course.  Still happy thought that I can say that was my first experience in a theater.

[rab2591]

Delighted to see someone finally getting their due recognition...

Agreed, after all this time its great to see Melinda in the spotlight.

I wasn't referring to Melinda. Her role in Brian's life since the mid-eighties has long been recognised and rightly appreciated.

Who were you referring to?