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Author Topic: Mike, Bruce and Dave @ Jones Beach - July 5th  (Read 36910 times)
Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again
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« Reply #150 on: July 11, 2014, 01:16:51 AM »

Please point me to any book written so far that has Blighted the history of The Beach Boys due to Stamos being on stage with them. It has been 30 years, so if it really is an issue then there should be many out there to quote from if it is that big of an issue.

Does it need to be in a book to be true?  Do I need a fish hack to justify what many common fans think?

I've stated before that I don't dislike John Stamos but myself and I'm certain thousands of others around the globe (who were fans before the cheese set in) loved the band when they actually cared about the music, not cheerleaders and a non-willingness to continue to be creative.

I still love the Beach Boys but I don't view Mike and Bruce as the Beach Boys and I'm not apologetic about it nor will I be.  That's cool if you think Stamos adds something to the M & B showband but it doesn't sit well with all the fans, especially those that pre-date the "Stamos era."

Classic "Mike Lovers" defend the guy for what he does but he yaks about the importance of not devaluing or saturating the brand but other than pimping Stamos fans to buy another rehashed Greatest Hits CD, what value or artistic credibility does he bring to the show?  In the 5 or 6 times I haven't seen the Mike and Bruce Review, Stamos was there each time and I especially wouldn't have wanted to see him for god sakes, you're the Beach Boys!

In each of those shows, Stamos received almost as much advertisement time as did Mike and Bruce.  As a Beach Boys fan that makes you embarrassed that they need to ride Stamos' coat tails to get people interested.

Fans of the band don't need a book to tell them what's right and what's wrong, we make up our own mind.

Also of note in all of this I should remind those of you who's skin I seem to get under (not directed at you drbeachboy) that I am a fan of all the guys as The Beach Boys.  Post Carl, all of them have acted like idiots as far as I'm concerned and are all to blame for the drama.  Not just Mike, not just Al, not just Brian.  The fact that all of them (BRI) couldn't work something out after C50 is simply unreal.






Mike Lover or not, I find Stamos far less irritating or insulting than The Stones wheeling Keith Urban, John Mayer, Gwen Stefani, Lady Gaga, Dave Matthews out to cheese up one of their classic badass songs on their tours..... Stamos might be cheeseball ball but he's rather harmlessly so. He's not out there with The Beach Boys to prop up some fledging career! No, he's a friend and a ham and also a musician. Yeah, it can be irritating, but he's Mike's friend, so that's that. They could be bringing Adam Levine or John Mayer out at every show! ..... Would I rather have The Beach Boys all together busting out Holland and Carl & The Passions in their entirety every night and dressed just like they walked off the Don't Go Near The Water video or the back cover of Pet Sounds: sure? But it's not going to happen. It's gonna be Tommy Bahama, tiny white shorts, or the stupid Hawaiian/obnoxious/bright colored shirts Brian's band wears. The Beach Boys entire career has been an awesome stylistic mess! Too much so for everyone to be happy with all of it ever ...... For the record: Al certainly brings it style-wise when he wants to.
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« Reply #151 on: July 11, 2014, 01:23:27 AM »


Does it need to be in a book to be true?  Do I need a fish hack to justify what many common fans think?

I've stated before that I don't dislike John Stamos but myself and I'm certain thousands of others around the globe (who were fans before the cheese set in) loved the band when they actually cared about the music, not cheerleaders and a non-willingness to continue to be creative.

I still love the Beach Boys but I don't view Mike and Bruce as the Beach Boys and I'm not apologetic about it nor will I be.  That's cool if you think Stamos adds something to the M & B showband but it doesn't sit well with all the fans, especially those that pre-date the "Stamos era."

Classic "Mike Lovers" defend the guy for what he does but he yaks about the importance of not devaluing or saturating the brand but other than pimping Stamos fans to buy another rehashed Greatest Hits CD, what value or artistic credibility does he bring to the show?  In the 5 or 6 times I haven't seen the Mike and Bruce Review, Stamos was there each time and I especially wouldn't have wanted to see him for god sakes, you're the Beach Boys!

In each of those shows, Stamos received almost as much advertisement time as did Mike and Bruce.  As a Beach Boys fan that makes you embarrassed that they need to ride Stamos' coat tails to get people interested.

Fans of the band don't need a book to tell them what's right and what's wrong, we make up our own mind.

Also of note in all of this I should remind those of you who's skin I seem to get under (not directed at you drbeachboy) that I am a fan of all the guys as The Beach Boys.  Post Carl, all of them have acted like idiots as far as I'm concerned and are all to blame for the drama.  Not just Mike, not just Al, not just Brian.  The fact that all of them (BRI) couldn't work something out after C50 is simply unreal.






He wasn`t responsible for any of that though and if he hadn`t appeared at Jones Beach then the only change would probably have been to play a hit instead of Forever.

I haven`t really read many comments on this board praising Stamos or anything but he is harmless enough and it`s not like M&B are going to start playing Pet Sounds in its entirety if he fails to show up.
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« Reply #152 on: July 11, 2014, 04:22:54 AM »

I know I'm in the grand minority here, but I really don't mind Stamos playing with The Beach Boys. He's been doing it since, what? 1987? And people are still bitching?

The Beach Boys are a serious band, but they're also a fun band. Obviously hardcore Beach Boys fans would rather concentrate on the "serious" aspect, while Mike has continually chosen the "fun (fun fun)" side.

Concerts are supposed to be entertaining, right? Stamos is an entertainer. Casual Beach Boys fans (the great majority of people who attend Beach Boys shows) want to be entertained. And having Stamos dance around the stage is more entertaining than seeing Randall Kirsch standing completely still in his cowboy hat playing bass and singing falsetto. Stamos is the worst musician on stage, obviously, but Mike's an entertainer too, and he wants his audiences to be entertained.

It probably helps that I was a kid when Full House was on, and I loved watching it. But Stamos has legitimate ties to the Beach Boys, he's been playing with them for over 25 years and he makes the band more entertaining for casual fans. Whatever. It's kind of sad how anti Stamos some Beach Boys fans are.

NRBQ is pretty entertaining too. And Terry Adams acts like a total LOON behind the piano (a personal favorite of mine btw), but here's the difference...they're not playing air guitar. They're not aping for the camera. They're playing their ass off. They BELONG there. @#$% Stamos. Put me in that category of BB fan. That's how I feel.

What cameras are Stamos aping for? Local photographers? He's aping for the fans. If Carl Wilson didn't have a problem having him around, I don't mind having him around.

He was annoying at shows when Carl and Al were still in the band too. I've made my own mind up that, from an audience perspective, it's distracting and tacky. I don't know how much Carl enjoyed having him there, versus tolerated it, versus who knows what. But even if it was Carl's personal idea to have him there, it was/is still tacky.


I read that Carl was often very unhappy with Stamos appearing on stage with them. Or looked like that during the shows. I can't say that that is true and I don't remember where I'd read that. Somewhere on this board I guess

I observed that Carl seemed irritated by Stamos's presence when I saw the band play in Melbourne in '92. For instance, towards the end of "Surfer Girl," Stamos reappeared only to be greeted by the squeals of teenage girls, interrupting the flow of the song much to Carl's annoyance.
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« Reply #153 on: July 11, 2014, 04:27:42 AM »

Look, people here can have their own opinions, but as a FACT, Stamos has not been a blight on their career or history. Stamos has not affected how rock historians look at their body of work. There is a big difference whether one believes something and whether it is actually so.
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Oh Brian
Thou Art In Hawthorne,
Harmonied Be Thy name
Your Kingdom Come,
Your Steak Well Done,
On Stage As It Is In Studio,
Give Us This Day, Our Shortenin' Bread
And Forgive Us Our Bootlegs,
As We Also Have Forgiven Our Wife And Managers,
And Lead Us Not Into Kokomo,
But Deliver Us From Mike Love.
Amen.  ---hypehat
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« Reply #154 on: July 11, 2014, 04:31:24 AM »

I would guess that a great many rock historians and critics do look down on the Boys due to the Stamos Effect, just not our in-house journalists (You know, Beach Boys fans who write great, well-researched and rigorously accurate books).
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« Reply #155 on: July 11, 2014, 05:01:53 AM »

I would guess that a great many rock historians and critics do look down on the Boys due to the Stamos Effect, just not our in-house journalists (You know, Beach Boys fans who write great, well-researched and rigorously accurate books).

Nah.

If Stamos hadn`t been around from the mid-80s onwards then they would still have made mostly crap music, still have appeared on cheesy TV shows (Baywatch), still have recorded pointless remakes with other artists (Stars and Stripes, Status Quo), still have added the cheerleaders, still have looked like gimps on stage (Bruce`s shorts, Al`s ponytail, Mike`s dress sense), still have made awful music videos (Crocodile Rock) and still have toured with only one original member for the last 15 years (C50 apart).

Stamos could be looked on as a symptom for some things. But they would be viewed the same by journalists whether or no.
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« Reply #156 on: July 11, 2014, 05:06:16 AM »

I know I'm in the grand minority here, but I really don't mind Stamos playing with The Beach Boys. He's been doing it since, what? 1987? And people are still bitching?

The Beach Boys are a serious band, but they're also a fun band. Obviously hardcore Beach Boys fans would rather concentrate on the "serious" aspect, while Mike has continually chosen the "fun (fun fun)" side.

Concerts are supposed to be entertaining, right? Stamos is an entertainer. Casual Beach Boys fans (the great majority of people who attend Beach Boys shows) want to be entertained. And having Stamos dance around the stage is more entertaining than seeing Randall Kirsch standing completely still in his cowboy hat playing bass and singing falsetto. Stamos is the worst musician on stage, obviously, but Mike's an entertainer too, and he wants his audiences to be entertained.

It probably helps that I was a kid when Full House was on, and I loved watching it. But Stamos has legitimate ties to the Beach Boys, he's been playing with them for over 25 years and he makes the band more entertaining for casual fans. Whatever. It's kind of sad how anti Stamos some Beach Boys fans are.

NRBQ is pretty entertaining too. And Terry Adams acts like a total LOON behind the piano (a personal favorite of mine btw), but here's the difference...they're not playing air guitar. They're not aping for the camera. They're playing their ass off. They BELONG there. @#$% Stamos. Put me in that category of BB fan. That's how I feel.

What cameras are Stamos aping for? Local photographers? He's aping for the fans. If Carl Wilson didn't have a problem having him around, I don't mind having him around.

He was annoying at shows when Carl and Al were still in the band too. I've made my own mind up that, from an audience perspective, it's distracting and tacky. I don't know how much Carl enjoyed having him there, versus tolerated it, versus who knows what. But even if it was Carl's personal idea to have him there, it was/is still tacky.


I read that Carl was often very unhappy with Stamos appearing on stage with them. Or looked like that during the shows. I can't say that that is true and I don't remember where I'd read that. Somewhere on this board I guess

I observed that Carl seemed irritated by Stamos's presence when I saw the band play in Melbourne in '92. For instance, towards the end of "Surfer Girl," Stamos reappeared only to be greeted by the squeals of teenage girls, interrupting the flow of the song much to Carl's annoyance.

Those teenage girls....how dare them squeal....like the teenage girls USED TO DO for The Beach Boys in 1964....maybe Carl forgot that....I'm sure after the show Carl told Stamos to appear BEFORE the song begins to get the squeals out of the way.

Speaking of Carl and Stamos, was Carl forced to appear in the Stamos "Forever" video?

On a positive note, you know the way Beach Boy "insiders" read this board? Look at all the ammo we're giving them with this thread and the John Stamos blight factor on the Beach Boys' brand and legacy. They can use THAT in their case to wrestle the license away from Mike! Shocked
« Last Edit: July 11, 2014, 05:19:12 AM by Sheriff John Stone » Logged
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« Reply #157 on: July 11, 2014, 06:43:31 AM »

I’ve seen Stamos cited (and no, I can’t produce firm examples at the moment) in articles about the Beach Boys on occasion in a very snarky, dismissive way. For some fans/journalists/observers, Stamos is an embarrassing dot on the group’s career that is offered up as a snarky or smart-ass reference. I’ve rarely seen Stamos brought up positively in an article or feature relating to the Beach Boys unless the article in question is either an interview with Mike or Stamos, or an article plugging an upcoming show or tour from Mike.

No, he hasn’t ruined the group’s place in history. Serious biographies on the group will not make detailed mentioned of Stamos. But his *debatable* usefulness to the group of, I guess, turning all those kids who watched “Full House” onto his remake of “Forever”, was worn out twenty years ago. To many, including some press/journalists, he is remembered as the guy who played at the same show that the BB’s invited Mr. T to play at. He’s remembered as the guy who was prominent during the same era that the band used tacky cheerleaders for the stage show. He’s remembered as the guy who participated in some of the cheesy moments in their history, when they briefly had one more #1 single 26 years ago and they sang “Kokomo” and let DJ Tanner sing backup vocals on “Barbara Ann.”  

If we have to start justifying Stamos’ current association with the group based on yogurt commercials and “ironically sarcastically nostalgic” appearances on Jimmy Fallon (remember, isn’t this the same guy that got Zack Morris from “Saved by the Bell” to sing “Friends Forever” on his show?), then that doesn’t really help the case.

In case anyone can’t tell, I’m WAY more familiar with “Full House” (and apparently “Saved by the Bell”) than I should be. I can still watch some episodes of “Full House” and actually be entertained. I thought Stamos and Saget and Coulier could actually be funny on that show. I don’t dislike Stamos on his own. But associating himself with the Beach Boys long ago ceased doing the band any favors. Again, Stamos knows this himself based on his comments in my opinion.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2014, 06:44:53 AM by HeyJude » Logged

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« Reply #158 on: July 11, 2014, 06:46:36 AM »

Look, people here can have their own opinions, but as a FACT, Stamos has not been a blight on their career or history. Stamos has not affected how rock historians look at their body of work. There is a big difference whether one believes something and whether it is actually so.

Not a fact.

The holier than thou "historians" don't decide what you or I think about the band - if you read Rolling Stone and decide what albums to buy based on their reviews only then I get it but a majority of people are not that way.

Stamos has not affected how "rock historians" look at their body of work
- if by that you mean their catalog of music then you are partially correct, although "vintage" historians about lost their mind when SIP came out with John's Forever included on it.

Stamos has not been a blight on their career or history - Uh, many people consider Full House the band's "jumping the shark" moment.  There are lots of people who think more about Stamos and the Beach Boys than the Hawthorne era of the Beach Boys.  His association with the band has undeniably altered how people perceive the group and understand this: to some people that's fine and I'm cool with that.  As I said before, I don't dislike John as a person so don't label me a hater, LOL.

I'm happy people dig the show that M&B do but I believe some of the issues with everyone's arguments are rooted in when you became a fan and for me, that is especially true.

« Last Edit: July 11, 2014, 06:48:19 AM by Foster's Freeze » Logged

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« Reply #159 on: July 11, 2014, 07:23:20 AM »

I'm more surprised that they cut out Getcha Back (a concert staple that David could sing a nice lead on) but left in Pisces Brothers and Goin' To The Beach. I know the show was a shorter set but why not cut out one of those two songs most people in the audience wouldn't know? With what the setlist for the show was, I think having Al there would have just ended up a wasted opportunity.

As far as Stamos is concerned, I don't have any strong feelings one way or the other. I was born in 1980 so i grew up watching Full House. I remember seeing the episode with Forever and as a kid thought it was a lame performance and video. I also liked Home Improvement and thought the BBs looked cheesy being a little older than my dad and having cheesy clothes, ponytails, etc. I loved Kokomo as a kid but neither of those tv performances made me want to listen to anything else by the band.

From what I've seen on youtube, I think Stamos performing with the Beach Boys is cheesy. Unfortunately, most of the youtube videos I've watched of live performances from the 80's on seem cheesy with or without Stamos. I am glad that he was left out of 50th anniversary tour (as a whole) so that tour could be about what's important, the band and the music. I remember telling three people I work with that I was going to see The BBs during the 50th tour. First thing out of their mouth was laughter and "is uncle jesse" or "is Stamos" going to be there? I remember being shocked out how much great material this band has and that's the first thing someone brings up when mentioning The Beach Boys.

If the Mike and Bruce show came around Charlotte, NC where I live, I'd go see them if it wasn't too expensive. If Stamos randomly were to show up, I wouldn't really care at all.  I don't think it would take away from what the show would be without him. It's not like they were going to play All I Wanna Do or Deirdre but decided to cut it for Stamos doing Forever. If I went to a show, I'd rather hear Forever (in any given form) then Rock & Roll Music, Be True To Your School or a few others that are always on the set list.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2014, 07:25:56 AM by lee » Logged
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« Reply #160 on: July 11, 2014, 07:26:54 AM »

Look, people here can have their own opinions, but as a FACT, Stamos has not been a blight on their career or history. Stamos has not affected how rock historians look at their body of work. There is a big difference whether one believes something and whether it is actually so.

Not a fact.

The holier than thou "historians" don't decide what you or I think about the band - if you read Rolling Stone and decide what albums to buy based on their reviews only then I get it but a majority of people are not that way.

Stamos has not affected how "rock historians" look at their body of work
- if by that you mean their catalog of music then you are partially correct, although "vintage" historians about lost their mind when SIP came out with John's Forever included on it.

Stamos has not been a blight on their career or history - Uh, many people consider Full House the band's "jumping the shark" moment.  There are lots of people who think more about Stamos and the Beach Boys than the Hawthorne era of the Beach Boys.  His association with the band has undeniably altered how people perceive the group and understand this: to some people that's fine and I'm cool with that.  As I said before, I don't dislike John as a person so don't label me a hater, LOL.

I'm happy people dig the show that M&B do but I believe some of the issues with everyone's arguments are rooted in when you became a fan and for me, that is especially true.


So, one song on one album blights a 50 year career, huh?

I know Stamos will be mentioned in articles, but still, his appearances do not factor in their in history of studio or live performance. I get it with you, you don't like him, again I get it. To call his appearances a blight to their history is way, way overblown. Even if it did, it's been going on for close to 30 years. Unless their is a blow out between him & Mike, it isn't going to change. When I go to a show, I go to see the band and to hear the music live. I really do not care who tags along with them. Musically, Stamos has never ruined a full performance. At the shows that he has appeared that I attended over the years, most of the audience liked that he was there. Believe me, if they didn't Mike would have him off the tour quick. At this point touring is their bread & butter and Mike would not jeopardize that if the audience was annoyed by the appearances.
I seriously worry about fans who still at this point want to change who the Beach Boys really are. You can't change history. All you can do is accept it, continue to love the music and move on.
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The Brianista Prayer

Oh Brian
Thou Art In Hawthorne,
Harmonied Be Thy name
Your Kingdom Come,
Your Steak Well Done,
On Stage As It Is In Studio,
Give Us This Day, Our Shortenin' Bread
And Forgive Us Our Bootlegs,
As We Also Have Forgiven Our Wife And Managers,
And Lead Us Not Into Kokomo,
But Deliver Us From Mike Love.
Amen.  ---hypehat
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« Reply #161 on: July 11, 2014, 07:28:49 AM »

I'm more surprised that they cut out Getcha Back (a concert staple that David could sing a nice lead on) but left in Pisces Brothers and Goin' To The Beach. I know the show was a shorter set but why not cut out one of those two songs most people in the audience wouldn't know? With what the setlist for the show was, I think having Al there would have just ended up a wasted opportunity.

As far as Stamos is concerned, I don't have any strong feelings one way or the other. I was born in 1980 so i grew up watching Full House. I remember seeing the episode with Forever and as a kid thought it was a lame performance and video. I also liked Home Improvement and thought the BBs looked cheesy being a little older than my dad and having cheesy clothes, ponytails, etc. I loved Kokomo as a kid but neither of those tv performances made me want to listen to anything else by the band.

From what I've seen on youtube, I think Stamos performing with the Beach Boys is cheesy. Unfortunately, most of the youtube videos I've watched of live performances from the 80's on seem cheesy with or without Stamos. I am glad that he was left out of 50th anniversary tour (as a whole) so that tour could be about what's important, the band and the music. I remember telling three people I work with that I was going to see The BBs during the 50th tour. First thing out of their mouth was laughter and "is uncle jesse" or "is Stamos" going to be there? I remember being shocked out how much great material this band has and that's the first thing someone brings up when mentioning The Beach Boys.

If the Mike and Bruce show came around Charlotte, NC where I live, I'd go see them if it wasn't too expensive. If Stamos randomly were to show up, I wouldn't really care at all.  I don't think it would take away from what the show would be without him. It's not like they were going to play All I Wanna Do or Deirdre but decided to cut it for Stamos doing Forever. If I went to a show, I'd rather hear Forever (in any given form) then Rock & Roll Music, Be True To Your School or a few others that are always on the set list.
Great post! That is exactly how I feel about it, as well.
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The Brianista Prayer

Oh Brian
Thou Art In Hawthorne,
Harmonied Be Thy name
Your Kingdom Come,
Your Steak Well Done,
On Stage As It Is In Studio,
Give Us This Day, Our Shortenin' Bread
And Forgive Us Our Bootlegs,
As We Also Have Forgiven Our Wife And Managers,
And Lead Us Not Into Kokomo,
But Deliver Us From Mike Love.
Amen.  ---hypehat
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« Reply #162 on: July 11, 2014, 07:36:33 AM »

I don't think Stamos is a blight on the entire career of the band. That would negate all of the genius that went before and I don't think he's important enough to do that. However, I do think continuing to feature him in a band that is officially named "The Beach Boys" reinforces a general perception of cheesiness to the band's image that is unnecessary at this stage of the game. In C50 they were presented with class. They were the rock legends they deserved to be. Now they're back to catering to squealing middle-aged Full House fangirls. It's just sad.
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« Reply #163 on: July 11, 2014, 07:58:01 AM »

I don't think Stamos is a blight on the entire career of the band. That would negate all of the genius that went before and I don't think he's important enough to do that. However, I do think continuing to feature him in a band that is officially named "The Beach Boys" reinforces a general perception of cheesiness to the band's image that is unnecessary at this stage of the game. In C50 they were presented with class. They were the rock legends they deserved to be. Now they're back to catering to squealing middle-aged Full House fangirls. It's just sad.

Honestly, had the C50 lineup continued then I could see your point, but seeing as it went back to what to it was previously, I don't believe it affects anything. It's back to the status quo of the past 30 plus years. Again, in the future when looking back, it will be about the music, live performance and studio.
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The Brianista Prayer

Oh Brian
Thou Art In Hawthorne,
Harmonied Be Thy name
Your Kingdom Come,
Your Steak Well Done,
On Stage As It Is In Studio,
Give Us This Day, Our Shortenin' Bread
And Forgive Us Our Bootlegs,
As We Also Have Forgiven Our Wife And Managers,
And Lead Us Not Into Kokomo,
But Deliver Us From Mike Love.
Amen.  ---hypehat
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« Reply #164 on: July 11, 2014, 08:29:19 AM »

Look, people here can have their own opinions, but as a FACT, Stamos has not been a blight on their career or history. Stamos has not affected how rock historians look at their body of work. There is a big difference whether one believes something and whether it is actually so.

Not a fact.

The holier than thou "historians" don't decide what you or I think about the band - if you read Rolling Stone and decide what albums to buy based on their reviews only then I get it but a majority of people are not that way.

Stamos has not affected how "rock historians" look at their body of work
- if by that you mean their catalog of music then you are partially correct, although "vintage" historians about lost their mind when SIP came out with John's Forever included on it.

Stamos has not been a blight on their career or history - Uh, many people consider Full House the band's "jumping the shark" moment.  There are lots of people who think more about Stamos and the Beach Boys than the Hawthorne era of the Beach Boys.  His association with the band has undeniably altered how people perceive the group and understand this: to some people that's fine and I'm cool with that.  As I said before, I don't dislike John as a person so don't label me a hater, LOL.

I'm happy people dig the show that M&B do but I believe some of the issues with everyone's arguments are rooted in when you became a fan and for me, that is especially true.


So, one song on one album blights a 50 year career, huh?

I know Stamos will be mentioned in articles, but still, his appearances do not factor in their in history of studio or live performance. I get it with you, you don't like him, again I get it. To call his appearances a blight to their history is way, way overblown. Even if it did, it's been going on for close to 30 years. Unless their is a blow out between him & Mike, it isn't going to change. When I go to a show, I go to see the band and to hear the music live. I really do not care who tags along with them. Musically, Stamos has never ruined a full performance. At the shows that he has appeared that I attended over the years, most of the audience liked that he was there. Believe me, if they didn't Mike would have him off the tour quick. At this point touring is their bread & butter and Mike would not jeopardize that if the audience was annoyed by the appearances.
I seriously worry about fans who still at this point want to change who the Beach Boys really are. You can't change history. All you can do is accept it, continue to love the music and move on.

Ha, don't worry about me and as of today, who "really are" the Beach Boys?

I don't think Stamos is the worst thing Mike has done to annoy the audiences or the fans but again, that's cool.  When Carl checked out that ended things for me.  As I've said before, people can like whichever version of the Beach Boys is out there.  Al, Brian or the Mike and Bruce show.

As I noted before, we disagree on things and that's o.k., I don't like it but accept it.  I've never stopped loving the music and that's a tribute to the Beach Boys of the 60's, 70's and 80's.
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« Reply #165 on: July 11, 2014, 08:31:39 AM »

Honestly, had the C50 lineup continued then I could see your point, but seeing as it went back to what to it was previously, I don't believe it affects anything. It's back to the status quo of the past 30 plus years. Again, in the future when looking back, it will be about the music, live performance and studio.

I wrote this in another thread, but I'll restate it here and possibly ruffle some feathers. The legacy of The Beach Boys that will live on beyond even our lifetimes as we post here today will be the classic recordings of the 1960's. At least that's how I see it. I don't see a time where the legacy of the live shows in any form will come close to capturing what those 60's recordings continue to do for so many people who aren't even diehard fans. No matter how many shows have been played live and continue to be played live, I'd argue what are the highlights of those shows? What do fans come to the shows to hear, no matter how many "Beach Boys" or which Beach Boys are singing them on stage?

The classics from the 1960's.

When you have a band and a producer who creates such a unique sound and in the process created an entire mythology around California and both the ideals and idealism of both the region and what they were singing about to the point where the band and the mythology are linked forever no matter what the lyrics are actually about, and people gravitate toward those records because they invoke a good feeling or even a certain mindset as they listen, how can that be anything but the defining element of that band's career?

Some bands are "live" bands, name any like the Dead or whoever else. The legacy is in large part due to the live shows. But seriously, as people 40 years from now look back on The Beach Boys, will it be centered around shows they played in the 1970's, 80's, 90's, and beyond, or will it be some 12 year old kid listening to "I Get Around" or "Wouldn't It Be Nice" or even "Surf's Up" and getting that undefinable feeling that draws him or her into something beyond the experience of listening to the music?

I know there is a mindset where keeping the torch lit through endless touring and live shows can get equated with the records themselves, but ultimately I don't know how many future generations will be thinking about a 1977 concert or a 2012 concert when they're talking about the Beach Boys legacy. Is it good to have a chance to see and hear the music live as performed by original members? Absolutely! But that's not this band's legacy when such a powerful magic kind of music was created in the studio when these guys were in their teens and early 20's and creating some of the most evocative music of their era.
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« Reply #166 on: July 11, 2014, 09:00:21 AM »

I know I'm in the grand minority here, but I really don't mind Stamos playing with The Beach Boys. He's been doing it since, what? 1987? And people are still bitching?

The Beach Boys are a serious band, but they're also a fun band. Obviously hardcore Beach Boys fans would rather concentrate on the "serious" aspect, while Mike has continually chosen the "fun (fun fun)" side.

Concerts are supposed to be entertaining, right? Stamos is an entertainer. Casual Beach Boys fans (the great majority of people who attend Beach Boys shows) want to be entertained. And having Stamos dance around the stage is more entertaining than seeing Randall Kirsch standing completely still in his cowboy hat playing bass and singing falsetto. Stamos is the worst musician on stage, obviously, but Mike's an entertainer too, and he wants his audiences to be entertained.

It probably helps that I was a kid when Full House was on, and I loved watching it. But Stamos has legitimate ties to the Beach Boys, he's been playing with them for over 25 years and he makes the band more entertaining for casual fans. Whatever. It's kind of sad how anti Stamos some Beach Boys fans are.

NRBQ is pretty entertaining too. And Terry Adams acts like a total LOON behind the piano (a personal favorite of mine btw), but here's the difference...they're not playing air guitar. They're not aping for the camera. They're playing their ass off. They BELONG there. @#$% Stamos. Put me in that category of BB fan. That's how I feel.

What cameras are Stamos aping for? Local photographers? He's aping for the fans. If Carl Wilson didn't have a problem having him around, I don't mind having him around.

He was annoying at shows when Carl and Al were still in the band too. I've made my own mind up that, from an audience perspective, it's distracting and tacky. I don't know how much Carl enjoyed having him there, versus tolerated it, versus who knows what. But even if it was Carl's personal idea to have him there, it was/is still tacky.


I read that Carl was often very unhappy with Stamos appearing on stage with them. Or looked like that during the shows. I can't say that that is true and I don't remember where I'd read that. Somewhere on this board I guess

I observed that Carl seemed irritated by Stamos's presence when I saw the band play in Melbourne in '92. For instance, towards the end of "Surfer Girl," Stamos reappeared only to be greeted by the squeals of teenage girls, interrupting the flow of the song much to Carl's annoyance.

Those teenage girls....how dare them squeal....like the teenage girls USED TO DO for The Beach Boys in 1964....maybe Carl forgot that....I'm sure after the show Carl told Stamos to appear BEFORE the song begins to get the squeals out of the way.

Speaking of Carl and Stamos, was Carl forced to appear in the Stamos "Forever" video?

On a positive note, you know the way Beach Boy "insiders" read this board? Look at all the ammo we're giving them with this thread and the John Stamos blight factor on the Beach Boys' brand and legacy. They can use THAT in their case to wrestle the license away from Mike! Shocked
That was a great one!  Beer

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« Reply #167 on: July 11, 2014, 09:06:49 AM »


Why should Stamos "hide" backstage? Because there are posters in cyberspace who think they can "wag the dog?" He has toured with them for about thirty years. He is hardly a newbie.

Most concertgoers don't make it their business to know or care what the not-so-silent minority feels.  There is a larger contingent of fans who actually have a ticket and attend, than those in cyberspace.  Most of us are inherently Brian Wilson fans.  The music can't be bifurcated in such a way that splits Brian from this band.  

And, I was actually at the show and have seen the Oikos snapshot onscreen more than once in the last several months.  And people find it hilarious.  If the commercial clips were not successful they would be pulled.  

If I listened to every pseudo-intellectual during college and grad school disparage my favorite band, who were not considered "cool" at the time, I would not be seeing them now.  And there are plenty of fans with advanced degrees who love the Touring Band, and clearly they aren't stupid people, either. But they don't get into his lower-than-a-bad-soap-opera disparagement that seems to be prevailing as of late.

And, so what if Al didn't perform.  Maybe, just maybe, he decided to be with his son, while he gets his feet wet with Brian's band, with the guy with whom he worked forming the band and who is a fellow BRI member.  

And yet, I never read this as a possibility to explain why he wasn't available to be at this show.  

It was a blast, particularly because it wasn't just The Beach Boys.  It was Felix Cavaliere, and The Lovin' Spoonful. A triple billing and a nice slice of the absolute best of that era in rock.


One of my points has been that Stamos shouldn't perhaps demur when asked to play because of what others say or think. Rather, one can make the argument that it might behoove someone to come to that conclusion on their own, out of humility. The fact that, after he already makes the decision to horn in on the shows, he does so knowing some sort of contingent of fans (who have quickly been marginalized as "internet" nerds, etc.) are annoyed is only potentially a bit extra troubling.

He participates because he's a hambone. He does it for selfish reasons. He's honest about it at least. If fans of his appearances would do the same, well, it wouldn't really change anything, but maybe it would make these discussions a little bit less circular.

It's clear you're inclined to measure not only Stamos, but Stamos' relationship to the Beach Boys, based on yogurt commercials and YouTube hits. That's cool. Some who feel the Beach Boys are owed a bit more class than the current stage presentation afford them feel otherwise, that's all.
What do you mean by "demur?"

Thanks.
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« Reply #168 on: July 11, 2014, 09:10:15 AM »


Why should Stamos "hide" backstage? Because there are posters in cyberspace who think they can "wag the dog?" He has toured with them for about thirty years. He is hardly a newbie.

Most concertgoers don't make it their business to know or care what the not-so-silent minority feels.  There is a larger contingent of fans who actually have a ticket and attend, than those in cyberspace.  Most of us are inherently Brian Wilson fans.  The music can't be bifurcated in such a way that splits Brian from this band.  

And, I was actually at the show and have seen the Oikos snapshot onscreen more than once in the last several months.  And people find it hilarious.  If the commercial clips were not successful they would be pulled.  

If I listened to every pseudo-intellectual during college and grad school disparage my favorite band, who were not considered "cool" at the time, I would not be seeing them now.  And there are plenty of fans with advanced degrees who love the Touring Band, and clearly they aren't stupid people, either. But they don't get into his lower-than-a-bad-soap-opera disparagement that seems to be prevailing as of late.

And, so what if Al didn't perform.  Maybe, just maybe, he decided to be with his son, while he gets his feet wet with Brian's band, with the guy with whom he worked forming the band and who is a fellow BRI member.  

And yet, I never read this as a possibility to explain why he wasn't available to be at this show.  

It was a blast, particularly because it wasn't just The Beach Boys.  It was Felix Cavaliere, and The Lovin' Spoonful. A triple billing and a nice slice of the absolute best of that era in rock.


One of my points has been that Stamos shouldn't perhaps demur when asked to play because of what others say or think. Rather, one can make the argument that it might behoove someone to come to that conclusion on their own, out of humility. The fact that, after he already makes the decision to horn in on the shows, he does so knowing some sort of contingent of fans (who have quickly been marginalized as "internet" nerds, etc.) are annoyed is only potentially a bit extra troubling.

He participates because he's a hambone. He does it for selfish reasons. He's honest about it at least. If fans of his appearances would do the same, well, it wouldn't really change anything, but maybe it would make these discussions a little bit less circular.

It's clear you're inclined to measure not only Stamos, but Stamos' relationship to the Beach Boys, based on yogurt commercials and YouTube hits. That's cool. Some who feel the Beach Boys are owed a bit more class than the current stage presentation afford them feel otherwise, that's all.
What do you mean by "demur?"

Thanks.

As in "to show reluctance." For instance, "Thanks Mike for asking me to appear on stage, but you guys are the show, not me, I'll just watch and enjoy the show and we can hang out after the show."

The example I used previously was David Marks. In his book with Stebbins, he mentions turning down opportunities in the 80's and 90's in some cases to jump on stage with them and instead would watch from the wings or in the audience.
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« Reply #169 on: July 11, 2014, 09:29:44 AM »

A glaring point to make: The girls screaming at these modern BB's shows with John Stamos are not screaming for the Beach Boys. Simple as that. Where are the screaming girls at shows when Stamos isn't on stage? Where are the screaming girls at any BB's related show of the past three or four decades? They're screaming for Stamos. Otherwise the crowd is mostly there to hear the songs, and beyond that the classics.

An example: Stamos was on Broadway performing "Bye Bye Birdie" some time ago. Someone I know was walking around the theater district on a random afternoon when they heard some kind of chaos erupt nearby. There were girls running over, screaming, just a whole chaotic scene on the street. When they got closer, here it was Stamos walking on that street. He got mobbed by screaming girls who wanted photos, autographs, or just to see him up close. That's been his rep since he was on a soap opera in the 80's, that's his draw. So wherever he is, he gets those kinds of reactions.

As much as he's been friends with the band, as much as he enjoys playing the music with them, don't you think the appeal of having screaming girls at a BB's concert feeds into something Mike might want to hear and see on occasion as well? The difference is, the girls don't scream that way when Stamos isn't on the stage.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2014, 09:55:18 AM by guitarfool2002 » Logged

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« Reply #170 on: July 11, 2014, 09:32:53 AM »

guitarfool2002, I love this: "Where are the creaming girls at any BB's related show of the past three or four decades?" I know it's a typo, but would love to see this, myself. Wink
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As We Also Have Forgiven Our Wife And Managers,
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« Reply #171 on: July 11, 2014, 09:46:24 AM »

I would guess that a great many rock historians and critics do look down on the Boys due to the Stamos Effect, just not our in-house journalists (You know, Beach Boys fans who write great, well-researched and rigorously accurate books).

Nah.

If Stamos hadn`t been around from the mid-80s onwards then they would still have made mostly crap music, still have appeared on cheesy TV shows (Baywatch), still have recorded pointless remakes with other artists (Stars and Stripes, Status Quo), still have added the cheerleaders, still have looked like gimps on stage (Bruce`s shorts, Al`s ponytail, Mike`s dress sense), still have made awful music videos (Crocodile Rock) and still have toured with only one original member for the last 15 years (C50 apart).

Stamos could be looked on as a symptom for some things. But they would be viewed the same by journalists whether or no.

Exactly. Stamos is the lingering after effect of when they "jumped the shark" as somebody else so astutely said (I was going to say "lingering stench" but it seemed a bit harsh. Then I said it, anyway).


guitarfool2002, I love this: "Where are the creaming girls at any BB's related show of the past three or four decades?" I know it's a typo, but would love to see this, myself. Wink

Ewww
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« Reply #172 on: July 11, 2014, 09:57:02 AM »

guitarfool2002, I love this: "Where are the creaming girls at any BB's related show of the past three or four decades?" I know it's a typo, but would love to see this, myself. Wink

Haha!!! I just caught that...I had to correct it.  Grin
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« Reply #173 on: July 11, 2014, 11:04:29 AM »

I've seen 47 BB shows in different variations. Each show with stamos on stage was better because the crowd is WAY more lively
 
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« Reply #174 on: July 11, 2014, 01:24:05 PM »

I've seen 47 BB shows in different variations. Each show with stamos on stage was better because the crowd is WAY more lively
 

I've never seen a show with him, and the crowds were always lively and sometimes transported. But then, this was mostly in the UK.
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