Was "15 Big Ones" poorly mixed? Would a better mix signficantly improve it?

[bluesno1fann]

Yeah Summer In Paradise is far from the best BBs album but its still better than most albums by most artists.

That is just unbelievably wrong.

For just about any dinosaur band circa 1992, Summer In Paradise is pretty typical of that sort of group in that era...... People hate on most everything most "classic" bands were doing right then.... The Division Bell came out a couple years later: lots of hate for that one ..... Sure, Neil Young put out Harvest Moon in 92, but there's no lack of hate for most of what he'd been doing the entire 10 years prior (excluding Ragged Glory and, to an extent, Freedom) ...

Most Pink Floyd fans (I don't for the most part) seems to love Division Bell. In fact there's a 20th Anniversary box set that came out.

[Please delete my account]

For just about any dinosaur band circa 1992, Summer In Paradise is pretty typical of that sort of group in that era...... People hate on most everything most "classic" bands were doing right then.... The Division Bell came out a couple years later: lots of hate for that one ..... Sure, Neil Young put out Harvest Moon in 92, but there's no lack of hate for most of what he'd been doing the entire 10 years prior (excluding Ragged Glory and, to an extent, Freedom) ...

I was in my Q magazine reading phase in 1992-3 (my first regular music magazine, before I discovered Melody Maker) and they were very positive about a lot of the "dinosaur" releases of the time- e.g. Dylan's "Good As I Been To You", Bowie's "Black Tie White Noise" and the Neil Young album you cite- but they gave "SiP" one star, and you sensed they would have rated it even lower if they could.

[TimeToGetAlone]

I don't think Summer in Paradise offers much worthwhile, with Lahaina Aloha being the only song I make an effort to revisit.  That being said, it's certainly not the last thing I'd choose to seek when it comes to the wide world of music. As much as I hate Summer of Love and, out of anything The Beach Boys have done, wish it didn't exist, I'd still take it over something like Tik Tok by Ke$ha.

[kookadams]

Yeah Summer In Paradise is far from the best BBs album but its still better than most albums by most artists.

That is just unbelievably wrong.

HOW is it wrong? Seriously think about the quality rock music of the last 40 years::: very little exists with the exception of the Ramones, Queers, and a handful of obscure groups with no commercial existence. Commercially viable QUALITY rockNroll faded away in the late 60s/ not saying there hasnt been great music the last 4 decades but very little of it has been on the charts or in the mainstream media/ prove me wrong with examples IF you can, which I doubt. :-)

[bluesno1fann]

Yeah Summer In Paradise is far from the best BBs album but its still better than most albums by most artists.

That is just unbelievably wrong.

HOW is it wrong? Seriously think about the quality rock music of the last 40 years::: very little exists with the exception of the Ramones, Queers, and a handful of obscure groups with no commercial existence. Commercially viable QUALITY rockNroll faded away in the late 60s/ not saying there hasnt been great music the last 4 decades but very little of it has been on the charts or in the mainstream media/ prove me wrong with examples IF you can, which I doubt. :-)

 

[alf wiedersehen]

Yeah Summer In Paradise is far from the best BBs album but its still better than most albums by most artists.

That is just unbelievably wrong.

HOW is it wrong? Seriously think about the quality rock music of the last 40 years::: very little exists with the exception of the Ramones, Queers, and a handful of obscure groups with no commercial existence. Commercially viable QUALITY rockNroll faded away in the late 60s/ not saying there hasnt been great music the last 4 decades but very little of it has been on the charts or in the mainstream media/ prove me wrong with examples IF you can, which I doubt. :-)

First of all, you didn't say Summer in Paradise was a better album than most other popular albums in the past forty years. You said that Summer in Paradise is better than most of the albums by most bands. You're twisting your own words... I could probably list a hundred or so albums better than SIP just from my own collection. I will, if that's what you want.

Secondly, no matter what I name, you clearly have no time for anything other than 70's punk music. I don't see what the point would be.

[petzounds29]

 Bruce   Springsteen

[kookadams]

I never said summer in paradise was a great album/ I jus meant that in comparison to the mainsteam garbage of the last twenty yrs it is.  Good music has TWO types- the kind in the past and the kind based in reverting to that past . Thats what punk was-reverting to the great rock of the late 50s/early 60s.

[runnersdialzero]

Yeah Summer In Paradise is far from the best BBs album but its still better than most albums by most artists.

That is just unbelievably wrong.

HOW is it wrong? Seriously think about the quality rock music of the last 40 years::: very little exists with the exception of the Ramones, Queers, and a handful of obscure groups with no commercial existence. Commercially viable QUALITY rockNroll faded away in the late 60s/ not saying there hasnt been great music the last 4 decades but very little of it has been on the charts or in the mainstream media/ prove me wrong with examples IF you can, which I doubt. :-)

Let it be known, an astounding amount of blocks have been snorted in the lifetime of one "kookadams."

[halblaineisgood]

.

[runnersdialzero]

Why can't some people enjoy Had To Phone Ya as is. I don't get on board with this belief that it must be remixed or heard without the vocals to be understood.  On 15 Big Ones , it doesn't draw attention to itself in a groovy way- in a sort of low-key Friends-y vibe way, and I like that. I admire that instinct to bury gorgeous details in the mix to serve the song, an instinct Brian and Phil Spector had.

A+

[Dudd]

Why can't some people enjoy Had To Phone Ya as is. I don't get on board with this belief that it must be remixed or heard without the vocals to be understood.  On 15 Big Ones , it doesn't draw attention to itself in a groovy way- in a sort of low-key Friends-y vibe way, and I like that. I admire that instinct to bury gorgeous details in the mix to serve the song, an instinct Brian and Phil Spector had.

I suppose - as is it's nice and slight. But as the vocals are less than gorgeous it makes it a slightly patchy listen for me; I just get the sense it could have been better.

[halblaineisgood]

.

[Niko]

R&R Music is, also, too slow. Sounds way better sped up a bit and heard on something with a subwoofer. THEN it has some punch.
It's Ok is good, very energetic, great in concert, etc.
I loved Phone Ya the first time I heard it. I don't listen to it much, but it'll always be a nice, short, endearing Brian song.
It's a good opening salvo to an album.

The rest of the tracks might benefit from a remixing....maybe. It's hard to tell. The only song that does need a redoing is Just Once In My Life. It's a nice song, but the mix makes it really hard to listen to - the instruments lack clarity, and not in a good, Spector-y kind of way.

What a weird album. I don't think I'll ever make up my mind on it. It's quite an oddball album. Not the greatest!

[phirnis]

Why can't some people enjoy Had To Phone Ya as is. I don't get on board with this belief that it must be remixed or heard without the vocals to be understood.  On 15 Big Ones , it doesn't draw attention to itself in a groovy way- in a sort of low-key Friends-y vibe way, and I like that. I admire that instinct to bury gorgeous details in the mix to serve the song, an instinct Brian and Phil Spector had.

Couldn't agree more! This is exactly what makes many of Brian's productions stand out. They're intricate but never are they pompous.

One more thought on 15BO in general... As I said before I love the album as is, definitely one of my most-played records by the BB. Still I can relate to why some may find it weird. I'm about the same age now as Brian and Dennis were when this was recorded and still, when I hear their voices on this record I find that kind of hard to believe. Their voices were really shot by this point, to such an extent that it's kind of bizarre. I don't like to judge anyone's lifestyles, it's just something that I've grown aware of while I got older.

That said, I still absolutely love the rawness in their vocal performances on 15BO and Love You. It's unique for a major pop/rock group to even consider releasing stuff like that and I totally appreciate it. Would be 100% impossible today, by the way. Just try and imagine Love You given the Joe Thomas treatment.

[Niko]

Just try and imagine Love You given the Joe Thomas treatment.

I've actually always felt Love You needed some nylon string guitars plucking around in the mix.

[phirnis]

Just try and imagine Love You given the Joe Thomas treatment.

I've actually always felt Love You needed some nylon string guitars plucking around in the mix.

Would probably fit best on Love Is a Woman. Also, imagine that slowed-down, sexier version of Ding Dang.

[Mikie]

I wanted to bring up the remix of Rock An Roll Music on MAde In California (again?). It's not very flattering to the performances, imo.  It's too defined for its own good. That track sounds better with some murk.

We had murk already. I waited for many years for the unreleased version with the original 'extra' track and they did a great job with it. I love it. It shoulda been released in 1976 on the album or single.

[shangaijoeBB]

I think if you use the single mix of Rock N' Roll Music and It's Ok, and ditch Everyone's In Love With You/A Casual Look/Blueberry Hill and replace them with Sea Cruise/Ruby Baby/Mony Mony and FINALLY use the Dumb Angel bootleg alternate mixes for all the rest, you've got a pretty decent album. Not great, but so much better!

Like Bean Bag mentioned, 15 BO/Love You/Adult-Child should really be considered like some kind of trilogy. Id' even compare it to Neil Young's 70s ditch trilogy.

[Awesoman]

Yeah Summer In Paradise is far from the best BBs album but its still better than most albums by most artists.

Don't kid yourself; this is one of the worst recordings by anyone.  The concept was quite simple: since "Kokomo" was such a big hit, Mike decided to make an album of "Kokomo's".  Utterly dreadful and misguided.  Their attempts at improving the album by rerecording a few of the songs is even worse!

[Pablo.]

Relistening now. Another one from this album is Dennis drumming on most tracks

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

For just about any dinosaur band circa 1992, Summer In Paradise is pretty typical of that sort of group in that era...... People hate on most everything most "classic" bands were doing right then.... The Division Bell came out a couple years later: lots of hate for that one ..... Sure, Neil Young put out Harvest Moon in 92, but there's no lack of hate for most of what he'd been doing the entire 10 years prior (excluding Ragged Glory and, to an extent, Freedom) ...

I was in my Q magazine reading phase in 1992-3 (my first regular music magazine, before I discovered Melody Maker) and they were very positive about a lot of the "dinosaur" releases of the time- e.g. Dylan's "Good As I Been To You", Bowie's "Black Tie White Noise" and the Neil Young album you cite- but they gave "SiP" one star, and you sensed they would have rated it even lower if they could.

Those such rags toe the party line pretty hard ...... The Beach Boys have always been fair game bashing-wise.

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

Why can't some people enjoy Had To Phone Ya as is. I don't get on board with this belief that it must be remixed or heard without the vocals to be understood.  On 15 Big Ones , it doesn't draw attention to itself in a groovy way- in a sort of low-key Friends-y vibe way, and I like that. I admire that instinct to bury gorgeous details in the mix to serve the song, an instinct Brian and Phil Spector had.

There's a lot to love in the details on that album.

Dennis and Ricky's tandem drums on It's OK .... Dennis dropping the beat each 4, Ricky keeping it straight.

The Wilson Brother's tortured harmony coda on A Casual Look ....... Al on the verses, Mike on the chorus are great too..... LOVE what Dennis does on the drums coming out of the bridge. Fantastic!

Brian's voice cracking on Just Once In My Life.

Dennis' drums on Back Home.

Dennis' drum into and vocal on In The Still Of The Night.

Carl's lead on Palisades Park.

"Hi Brian" on the outro to Had To Phone Ya.

"Time for me to meditate"

Dragon's awesome drum pickup out of the break-down on Susie Cincinnati.

I could go on and on......

[bringahorseinhere?]

like McCartney defending his/their double 'white album' when people said this and that, it's too long, too many crappy songs etc etc....

he says something to the effect 'leave it alone, its great, it is what it is, it's the Beatles bloody white album'.....

same goes for 15 big ones!

its great, its flawed, its brilliant and weak.....its the 'bloody' Beach Boys!

RickB

[Sheriff John Stone]

like McCartney defending his/their double 'white album' when people said this and that, it's too long, too many crappy songs etc etc....

he says something to the effect 'leave it alone, its great, it is what it is, it's the Beatles bloody white album'.....

same goes for 15 big ones!

its great, its flawed, its brilliant and weak.....its the 'bloody' Beach Boys!

RickB

Do you realize that you just compared 15 Big Ones to.....The Beatles' White Album!