*Merged* Brian Wilson current album thread

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Here's the thing...i am not going to argue whether or not autotune was used on that song. I'd be incredibly shocked if there wasn't any, truth be told. However, the main thing you're hearing is actually  the noise reduction on the damn cell phone. Or maybe I'm full of sh*t, and autotune was used when I did this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFi9CaVLTs0&feature=youtu.be

It's the noise reduction from the phone. That's what you folks are hearing. Unless somebody went psychotic at the mixing board and decided to add pitch correction to the instruments AND the ambient noise in the room as well.

[Niko]

Mike's Beard is just angry that my obviously superior ears detected the telltale pterodactyl shrieks before he did.

Pretty sure that's a brontosaurus, but you can think whatever you want to think buddy.

[Ron]

We've reached a point where people just automatically assume if they imagine it has "Autotune" then it sucks.  


1. You don't know if it has "Autotune"
2. There are things far worse than "Autotune"
3. There are times when "Autotune" is absolutely fine to use
4. You can't tell sh*t by a 10 second clip

Autotune is the boogieman.  It's like those commercials on t.v. where they try to convince you you're poisoning your dog because the kibbles and bits you buy him has chicken in it.  

If this album sucks, it won't be because of "Autotune"

[guitarfool2002]

No shifting parameters, I'm simply expanding on my initial post each time you reply but nice try on trying to twist my words. I'll go back to keeping it very simple. Her vocals have autotune on them - if you can't hear it then I suggest you consult an ENT specialist. As to if they are needless or not - I guess that depends on how one rates Zooey's singing abilty.
And why on earth would I care if you buy Brian's new album or not?

I know why you're doing this, but I'll play along.

Have you used Autotune to either pitch-correct, smooth out trailing notes on a vocal phrase, or deliberately over-use it for the T-Pain or Kanye effect? Have you used Auto-Tune to zero in on a single note within a two-word phrase, then edit it back in seamlessly into a totally different vocal take where that same verse line was delivered with more punch and force to suit the song? Have you ever taken a vocal harmony that trailed off at the end of the breath, Autotuned it just enough to pitch up the trail so you wouldn't need to cut the note earlier than the other three parts around it, and had it be completely unnoticeable?

Maybe you have! Let's compare working notes and such.

Or I'll make a serious offer here. Post a sound file of a single phrase which you've sung, totally dry with no effects at all. The next time I'm working on a mix, which hopefully won't be too far off, I'll determine the key and scale you're singing in, and do a few passes through my Autotune rackmount setup (yeah, I know, I like rackmount stuff better than plugins...). I'll do a few where it's pitch-corrected to the point where you don't notice the Autotune, one where traces of it are noticeable, and one where it's the obvious effect.

As long as you stay relatively in key and close to the right pitches of the notes, this would be standard practice for working with Autotune.

And let me just add...I'm no expert, I have no gold records or Grammy awards or AES accolades hanging on my walls, but I know a little something about Autotune and using it.

And there is no noticeable trace of it on that Zooey vocal. If you don't believe me, take it to any working engineer, tell them it's a compressed cel phone video recording taken inside a studio with a rough mix coming through the monitors, and ask them what they think.

Oh, and there is also that pesky issue of phase cancellation, phase issues in general...sometimes the way the sound is captured and hits at a different angle or off-axis from the source...sorry to be non technically specific...and just try standing in front of your speakers, and cupping your ears, pointing your ears toward the speakers, pulling your earlobes down as you're listening...notice how some frequencies change and drop out, or you get a "whooshing" sound in your ears...all those changes just by altering how the sound is entering your ears physically.  try moving one speaker even a few inches to the side, off-axis from where it was, and notice how the sound is affected.

All that stuff. And then tell me a cel phone video of a lead vocal is enough basis to argue the presence of Autotune. Where were the monitors in that clip, which angle were they facing?

I could go on, but I doubt any of it matters in this case anyway.  

[guitarfool2002]

We've reached a point where people just automatically assume if they imagine it has "Autotune" then it sucks.  


1. You don't know if it has "Autotune"
2. There are things far worse than "Autotune"
3. There are times when "Autotune" is absolutely fine to use
4. You can't tell sh*t by a 10 second clip

Autotune is the boogieman.  It's like those commercials on t.v. where they try to convince you you're poisoning your dog because the kibbles and bits you buy him has chicken in it.  

If this album sucks, it won't be because of "Autotune"

This is good, old-fashioned, common sense. I agree with every point: Well done, Ron.

The problem becomes trying to apply what seems like universal knowledge and common sense in situations where such things are ignored or dismissed.

The only point I'd add is, "If this album sucks, it might be because of bland song titles..." 

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

[Jim V.]

We've reached a point where people just automatically assume if they imagine it has "Autotune" then it sucks.  


1. You don't know if it has "Autotune"
2. There are things far worse than "Autotune"
3. There are times when "Autotune" is absolutely fine to use
4. You can't tell sh*t by a 10 second clip

Autotune is the boogieman.  It's like those commercials on t.v. where they try to convince you you're poisoning your dog because the kibbles and bits you buy him has chicken in it.  

If this album sucks, it won't be because of "Autotune"

You know Ron, most of the time your posts annoy the sh*t out of me, but right here you couldn't be more right. A lot of the people on here are so obsessed with autotune that it seems to get in the way of whether the songs themselves are good. And while we all have our own tastes, I feel like some people are just too obsessed with this stuff. Like apparently some people don't even like "From There To Back Again" because of "autotune". Personally I don't even hear it. But regardless, how could you not like that song?

[Wirestone]

Mike's Beard is just angry that my obviously superior ears detected the telltale pterodactyl shrieks before he did.

Pretty sure that's a brontosaurus, but you can think whatever you want to think buddy.

I'M SO ANGRY I'M GOING TO TYPE IN ALL CAPS FOR AWHILE. ARGH! HOW CAN YOU NOT TELL IT'S A PTERODACTYL! MY GOD! IT'S LIKE I DON'T KNOW ANYONE ON THIS BOARD ANYMORE!

Hmm ... there I go not contributing anything again. Drat.

[Ray Lawlor]

No shifting parameters, I'm simply expanding on my initial post each time you reply but nice try on trying to twist my words. I'll go back to keeping it very simple. Her vocals have autotune on them - if you can't hear it then I suggest you consult an ENT specialist. As to if they are needless or not - I guess that depends on how one rates Zooey's singing abilty.
And why on earth would I care if you buy Brian's new album or not?

I know why you're doing this, but I'll play along.

Have you used Autotune to either pitch-correct, smooth out trailing notes on a vocal phrase, or deliberately over-use it for the T-Pain or Kanye effect? Have you used Auto-Tune to zero in on a single note within a two-word phrase, then edit it back in seamlessly into a totally different vocal take where that same verse line was delivered with more punch and force to suit the song? Have you ever taken a vocal harmony that trailed off at the end of the breath, Autotuned it just enough to pitch up the trail so you wouldn't need to cut the note earlier than the other three parts around it, and had it be completely unnoticeable?

Maybe you have! Let's compare working notes and such.

Or I'll make a serious offer here. Post a sound file of a single phrase which you've sung, totally dry with no effects at all. The next time I'm working on a mix, which hopefully won't be too far off, I'll determine the key and scale you're singing in, and do a few passes through my Autotune rackmount setup (yeah, I know, I like rackmount stuff better than plugins...). I'll do a few where it's pitch-corrected to the point where you don't notice the Autotune, one where traces of it are noticeable, and one where it's the obvious effect.

As long as you stay relatively in key and close to the right pitches of the notes, this would be standard practice for working with Autotune.

And let me just add...I'm no expert, I have no gold records or Grammy awards or AES accolades hanging on my walls, but I know a little something about Autotune and using it.

And there is no noticeable trace of it on that Zooey vocal. If you don't believe me, take it to any working engineer, tell them it's a compressed cel phone video recording taken inside a studio with a rough mix coming through the monitors, and ask them what they think.

Oh, and there is also that pesky issue of phase cancellation, phase issues in general...sometimes the way the sound is captured and hits at a different angle or off-axis from the source...sorry to be non technically specific...and just try standing in front of your speakers, and cupping your ears, pointing your ears toward the speakers, pulling your earlobes down as you're listening...notice how some frequencies change and drop out, or you get a "whooshing" sound in your ears...all those changes just by altering how the sound is entering your ears physically.  try moving one speaker even a few inches to the side, off-axis from where it was, and notice how the sound is affected.

All that stuff. And then tell me a cel phone video of a lead vocal is enough basis to argue the presence of Autotune. Where were the monitors in that clip, which angle were they facing?

I could go on, but I doubt any of it matters in this case anyway.  

GF.....I have found a place in Maryland that sells that Fordham Lager in bottles I had mentioned earlier.  This will be a nice crisp lager which goes well with a good bacon cheeseburger with jalapeno cheese, or a brick oven pepperoni pizza; or just by itself.  Its kind of a pilsner in a way , but the 5.0 alcohol content gives it a nice kick. I listened tonight to Steely Dan's Aja , over a few bottles of Dos Equiis , a nice Mexican lager .  Kind of got into the production ; a fine record; its great for an audiophile.  I first heard it on a pair of Dahlquist DQ-10's without a sub woofer , so I had thought it lacked bass.  Then I heard it on Quad Electrostatics and that was that; it kicked ass .  Kind of how Beach Boys stuff changes textures over different speakers; Love You sounds so different over different sets of speakers , as does Sunflower; for example , the bass on Cool, Cool, Water literally shook my house on my JBL'S , but on the Dahlquist it's not even close to as overwhelming......or maybe its just the beer or whatever else I was drinking that was enhancing the listening experience !

[halblaineisgood]

.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Van Dyke Parks would be the Philoso-raptor, then..,

[Robbie Mac]

As usual you manage to add absolutely nothing to anything.

Look in the mirror, dude.

[Wirestone]

Van Dyke Parks would be the Philoso-raptor, then..,

Eventually, this thread will encompass all known human experience.

[Niko]

Eventually, this thread will encompass all known human experience.

I'm embarrassed too.

[Mike's Beard]

As usual you manage to add absolutely nothing to anything.

Look in the mirror, dude.

What are you his boyfriend? Everytime me and him have an issue there you are whooshing to his rescue.

[Mike's Beard]

Mike's Beard is just angry that my obviously superior ears detected the telltale pterodactyl shrieks before he did.

Pretty sure that's a brontosaurus, but you can think whatever you want to think buddy.

I'M SO ANGRY I'M GOING TO TYPE IN ALL CAPS FOR AWHILE. ARGH! HOW CAN YOU NOT TELL IT'S A PTERODACTYL! MY GOD! IT'S LIKE I DON'T KNOW ANYONE ON THIS BOARD ANYMORE!

Hmm ... there I go not contributing anything again. Drat.

Too funny. Remember the last time you picked a fight with me? The pathetic, pleading PMs you sent me pleading to stop? I do.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Alright...this has gone on too far. Please take it to PMs...I actually wish this wasn't going on at all, because quite frankly I like and respect both you guys. MB, Wirestone, agree to disagree, but this is out of hand at this point. If this continues, I will have to take action, and I really cannot stress enough how little that appeals to me in this situation.

Please.

[Mike's Beard]

I know why you're doing this, but I'll play along.

Why am I doing what? Mentioning I hear autotune after God only knows how many others have said the same thing? Here's an olive branch for you;I actually think -  vocal effects aside - the song sounds very nice. All 9 seconds of it.

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

Guys, this being 2014, we should be safe and ASSUME everything has autotune on it! T-Pain fans aren't bitching about autotune on his records because he's freaking T-Pain! But we're here talking about the main force behind THE GREATEST VOCAL GROUP IN MUSIC HISTORY!!!! This being the case: autotune will rankle some nerves!!!!

The album will come out and it will likely be a matter of seeing past the autotune and appreciating the mere fact that one of the only few living geniuses in music history is creating new stuff.... Autotune is a fact of life these days.  And so is Joe Thomas, it seems.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Very true, but Joe doesn't seem as hands-on as before.

[Niko]

The auto-tune on TWGMTR was applied in post production. I really don't think there's anything there, especially considering the clip was a work in progress. Also I don't hear it.

[Mike's Beard]

Guys, this being 2014, we should be safe and ASSUME everything has autotune on it! T-Pain fans aren't bitching about autotune on his records because he's freaking T-Pain! But we're here talking about the main force behind THE GREATEST VOCAL GROUP IN MUSIC HISTORY!!!! This being the case: autotune will rankle some nerves!!!!

The album will come out and it will likely be a matter of seeing past the autotune and appreciating the mere fact that one of the only few living geniuses in music history is creating new stuff.... Autotune is a fact of life these days.  And so is Joe Thomas, it seems.

Great that he is still making music but worrying that he's working so closely with the man who made the Live Album sound like garbage and blighted the otherwise decent tracks on TWGMTR with his autotune over egging. Here's hoping Joe doesn't make it a hat trick.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Is Don Was involved with the album in any other way other than playing bass?

[The Shift]

We still had our milk delivered to the doorstep, old-style, in glass bottles. Even so, you can taste the auto-tune and not only when drinking it neat but also in coffee, tea and when poured I've cereal especially honey nut cornflakes, the really frikking nutty ones that come in a handcart wheeled in from Hell.
 

You'll know when to turn the page when Tinkerbell rings her little bell, like this…

[Loaf]

Here's an idea, let's try to appease all the posters on this thread, be they optimists or pessimists, with this premise...

Let's all assume from this point onwards, a priori, without having heard anything from the album itself, that this new BW album will be the single worst listening experience imaginable of all time. The gaps of silence between tracks will be autotuned and it will be obvious to everyone. Even the autotune will have autotune on it. Each track will be a recycled, watered-down, guest-appearanced mess of Joe Thomasery that features no recognisable traces of BW. It will be a hardcore Frank Ocean rap album with autotuned sitcom stars and dinosaurs and brian will do interviews in which he not only denies knowledge of the guest stars but doesn't even realise he has an album coming out.


Now, with that starting point, we have set the bar so low that anything, any single thing, even a split second of melody, that appeals to us will be a bonus and we can discuss it fruitfully on this board when the music does come out as intended.

Agreed?

[ToneBender631]

Seems to me the vast majority of comments that I`ve read about the 10 second clip have been positive. The negative opinions are just as valid imo.

Criticism of melody, lyrics or arrangement is totally valid, albeit with limited source material available to judge from. Claiming that "Auto-Tune" has clearly been used when there's nothing to suggest it has been, and presenting this claim as a statement of truth (when it isn't), rather than a statement of opinion (when it would still be a stretch given the total lack of evidence), is not valid.