Just found a transcription of the interview I mentioned above :
(The full article can be found here :
http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/the-healing-of-brother-brian-the-rolling-stone-interview-with-the-beach-boys-19761104)
How did you first notice something was wrong with Brian?
AUDREE: It was just that he'd stay in his room all the time. I would go over there, and there could be a houseful of people and he just wouldn't come down.
When you talked to him in his bedroom, would he make sense?
AUDREE: Oh, of course, perfectly. He just wanted to be alone. Sometimes he would say, "I'm really so tired," or, "I'll be down in a little while." And I'd think to myself, "You might or you might not, and if not, that's okay with me." I knew he was in trouble. I knew he had a problem.
Did he seem depressed?
AUDREE: Oh yes, I think so. He didn't show his depression to me that much because if I'd go upstairs to say hi or give him a kiss, he would always be sweet to me and say, "Hi, mom. How are you?" or, "I'm tired," or, "I have a cold," or, "My stomach is upset," or just anything. At that time I didn't believe it; I just thought, he wants to be alone. I would never — oh God — no way would I bug him. I figured if he wanted to talk to me he would tell me.
Do you think Brian's creativity began to be a burden to him ?
AUDREE: I do. I think that he just went through a lot of pain. I think it was very painful for him to live up to this tremendous image that had happened just like that [snaps her fingers]. All of a sudden he felt he couldn't do it anymore, he felt like he had reached the pinnacle — and what was left?
And then for a number of years did he just sort of deteriorate?
AUDREE: Well, he went through stages. In fact, Marilyn would say, "Oh, Brian's so much better, we this or we that." I'd be happy to hear it. So it was kind of an up and down thing.
Carl says that he was the closest to his father, but that Brian and Dennis had a difficult time communicating with him.
AUDREE: Yes, they did. But in the later years, Dennis and his father had a great relationship. Well, they had something in common. They both loved to fish, they both loved boxing.
Dennis said when he was young his father used to beat the hell out of him sometimes.
AUDREE: Yeah, he really got the short end of the stick.
How did you feel when you heard about Dennis' involvement with Charles Manson?
AUDREE: Oh my. God, absolutely horrified. Terrified. First of all, when Manson and his family, the girls, moved in with Dennis, Dennis had this beautiful, beautiful place — at Will Rogers State Park, right off Sunset. And he befriended them. They were just hippies and he thought Manson was the nicest person, a very gentle, nice guy. Murry had a fit. He knew there were a bunch of girls living there.
I went there one day. Dennis was at the recording studio in Brian's house, and he said, "Will you take me home?" And I was very hesitant because I thought, "Oh God, Murry's not going to like this." But I took him home, and he said, "Will you just come in and meet them? Come on, they're nice." And I said, "Dennis, promise me you won't tell Dad."
So I went in, and Charlie Manson was walking through this big yard with a long robe on, and Dennis introduced me. And we went into the house, and I think three girls were in the house, just darling young girls, I thought. I zipped through the house, got back in my car and left. And wouldn't you know that Dennis told his dad?
Did you get heck for that ?
AUDREE: Yeah, he didn't like it. He was pissed.
How did Charlie strike you when you saw him?
AUDREE: I just thought he looked older than he supposedly is, like an older man, and I thought he had a kind face. That was the only impression I had. And I did think they were a bunch of leeches; Dennis had been through that before. He could never stand to see anyone who needed anything or anybody who had any kind of a problem... he was right there.
At that time nobody knew who Manson was.
AUDREE: No idea. In fact, when that horrible story came out about Manson's arrest for the Sharon Tate murder, Annie, Carl's wife, called me. And she said, "Ma, do you realize...?" I did not connect at all that that was the same person and the same family who had been with Dennis. When she told me, I just totally froze.
Well, it must have been a shock for Dennis as well.
AUDREE: Horrifying. I think the next day was his birthday, and he was at Carl and Annie's. I went there and we had dinner. And we were all very quiet. And somebody said something, and Carl said, "I don't think we should talk about it." So we just watched television and had a very quiet evening. We were totally terrified. I remember Carl saying, "Mom, let's all go back and stay at your house." And I said, "Carl, everybody knows where I live. What good would that do?" So I stayed at their house a couple of nights. And see, when they left Dennis' house, Manson or somebody stole Dennis' Ferrari, and they stole everything in the house that could be moved. Everything. Stripped. Dennis had kicked them out because they were into heavy drugs and he just wanted them out. And Manson, of course, had music he wanted published, and he wanted money, quite a sum, 10 or 15 thousand dollars. And Dennis turned him down. So Manson threatened Dennis, he said, "If you don't give it to me" — I'm paraphrasing — "something's going to happen to Scotty." Scotty was Dennis' first wife's son, and Dennis just adored him. He was really like his daddy. But that was a terrible period.
You said that Dennis and his father later became much closer.
AUDREE: They were buddies. You know, it's the most amazing thing... the year that he died, Dennis called his father on Mother's Day and Murry told him, "I'm just going to live about a month." Which Dennis didn't tell me, thank God. I didn't need to know it. But he could tell Dennis that.
He'd had one heart attack.
AUDREE: He'd had a heart attack and he was just getting along famously. And six weeks later, it was in June, he just... well, it's weird the way that happened. I was waiting for him to wake up, thinking, "I wish he'd wake up. I wonder if he's really okay." I was standing in the kitchen, watching the clock, thinking I'll be so glad when he wakes up. And all of a sudden he woke up, and we had a great talk. He was in a good mood. He seemed to feel fine. And we talked for quite a while, about so many things. He said to me, "I'm so glad I've never had to take nitroglycerin." And I was glad, too, because I knew that would' be frightening. That's for the pain. He said he wanted to take a walk — he'd been able to walk around the house but not outside yet. And I said, "Great, if you feel like it." So I was going to drive him down to Whittier Boulevard to walk. I went into the kitchen to make cereal for him, and all of a sudden I heard him yelling for me. I started dashing down this long hallway. He was in the bathroom sitting on the toilet. And he said, "Nitroglycerin," so I grabbed it and said, "Put it under your tongue." But he just sat there, very pale. And he said, "Cold water." So I got a cloth with real cold water on it and kept going like this on his forehead, and then I held it on the back of his neck. And he still just sat there. I said, "Are you okay?" And he said, "I don't know."
I got up next to him to hold him — he was much bigger than I am — and he just toppled over. So I turned him over — I don't know how I did it, but I did it. And I realized he was really in bad trouble. In fact, I thought he was gone. By that time his face looked very flushed and his eyes... I knew he didn't see me because I went like this [pats her cheek] and said, "Baby, baby." All I said to him was, "Baby, baby, I love you." I ran into the bedroom and called the fire department. I never went back in that bathroom.
I locked the house, got in my car and went to the hospital... and sat there for quite a while. A doctor came out once and said, "We're doing everything we can." And I said, "I'm sure you are." And I knew that that was it.
Brian did not go to the funeral.
AUDREE: Nope. I understand that perfectly. You know, Carl was very angry that Brian didn't go to the funeral. And I said, "Carl, I understand perfectly." It didn't bother me. Brian couldn't face it. No way.
Do you think he'll go to yours?
AUDREE: I'd be surprised. You know, I don't know if he's ever been to one. To me, so what? I don't believe in funerals, frankly — the most barbaric, outmoded bunch of... [censors herself and laughs]. Anyway...
In general you seem to have been much looser than your husband.
AUDREE: Oh yeah, a great deal more. He took life so seriously, really. It was hard for him to have fun. Once he said to me, "Sometimes you can be so mad or in some kind of mood, and somebody comes over and you can laugh and have a good time. Maybe I'm jealous of you." I used to think it would be so nice if he could just loosen up. But he was what he was, you know?
About ten years ago everyone started getting into drugs and marijuana, and I'm sure your boys did too. How did that affect you ?
AUDREE: Well, I had a horrible problem with my husband about that. He was so, sooo against it, so mortified — I can't even think of a strong enough word. They all went and told him that they were smoking pot and, oh, he just thought that was the end of the world, the most horrible thing they could do. And of course he was angry with me. In fact, he was so angry he wouldn't allow them to come to our house for quite a while. And he told me I couldn't go see them.
But now, of course, dope is much better understood. Have you ever tried it?
AUDREE: Frankly, I did try it. In fact, I just zonked out. I was at Carl and Annie's house and I walked into the living room and I couldn't get up. I didn't like it at all. Then one other time, though, I tried it and I've never had more fun in my life. Laughed and laughed and laughed, just had a ball. This is since Murry's gone.
How old are you?
AUDREE: Thirty-seven. You know I'm lying. Should I tell the truth?
Let's see... you said you got married when you were 20... and you had Brian after four years, and he just turned 34... so you're about 58.
AUDREE: Exactly. Rats.
So what are you doing with your time?
AUDREE: Not as much as I should.
You mean not as much as you'd like?
AUDREE: Well, as I'd like and should for my own good, because I'm lonely a lot and that's ridiculous.
Do you still play music?
AUDREE: I don't like to play by myself. And I should because I just adore it. In fact, the other night some of my relatives were here and they were watching Gone with the Wind, and all of a sudden I just got bored and I went into the living room and I played the piano for a while. And I played the organ. And I was comfortable because I knew there was somebody here. But by myself I'm not comfortable. I just don't have anything in particular going for me.
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