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Author Topic: WIBNTLA Reviews  (Read 47266 times)
Disney Boy (1985)
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« Reply #250 on: August 25, 2013, 02:14:12 AM »

Upon first listen I was slightly underwhelmed. ("Too much hype" "Is Evie's version better?") By the fourth hearing, however, I was completely taken by the aching romanticism and the very best vocal of Dennis Wilson's career. It's a wonderful song, but still too new (to me) to evaluate in the context of Dennis's (and The Beach Boys') total body of work.

 It begs the question: where does WIBNTLA fit on SURF'S UP? Again, very hard to say. I can't see it as the closing track. It would work rather well closing side one, but then what the hell do we do with "Student Demonstration Time"? (I don't believe in discarding any original tracks for my alternate versions of SURF'S UP, and I kinda like SDT anyway.)

 It seems odd - insane maybe - that WIBNTLA didn't come out until 2013. Could it have been used for SO TOUGH or HOLLAND? Easily. One of the mid to late 70's albums? A harder sell given the decline of Dennis's voice, but in an alternate world, it may have been rescued from the vaults as part of a 1976 album. The GOOD VIBRATIONS box in 1993? Amazing they would favor "4th of July" over WIBNTLA.

But we're talking about The Beach Boys, and the things they do often make little sense. Very glad we can hear this gem today in 2013 and in all the days to come!
 

Sequence the album [Surf's Up] with WIBNTLA following Til I Die. Then after WIBNTLA a slightly longer than average pause (say 6 seconds) and then Surf's Up. This to my ears works wonderfully. After the beautiful but dark subject matter of Til I Die, WIBNTLA works as a glorious reassertion of hope.
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Disney Boy (1985)
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« Reply #251 on: August 25, 2013, 02:16:17 AM »

The Boys have had their share of dumb decisions but not releasing this song back in the day really takes the cake

That particular decision was taken, and effected by one Wilson, Dennis Carl.  Grin

Any insights as to why did Dennis made this decision?  Even with the hindsight of 40 years of historical and musical perspective, I see no reason why this didn't get an earlier airing.

Politics aside, what would make Dennis shelve this but then support the inclusion of "...,Pete" or "Hold on Dear Brother", "Susie Cin" or even "Make it Good"?

Why would Dennis favour a remake of "Only With You*" for his solo album instead of this smokin' beast?

To me, it indicates Dennis made a rather significant decision to let it go - are there any clues as to what got in his craw?

*Not that there's anything wrong with that. I love the POB Only with You.

I think Dennis never returned to the song because he always wanted to be moving forward creatively and artistically and as such considered it a finished work from the past and didn't want to dig it up for inclusion on POB. River Song differs in this respect as it was a song he'd continually been working and building on for years.
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« Reply #252 on: August 25, 2013, 02:20:11 AM »



Why would Dennis favour a remake of "Only With You*" for his solo album instead of this smokin' beast?

To me, it indicates Dennis made a rather significant decision to let it go - are there any clues as to what got in his craw?

*Not that there's anything wrong with that. I love the POB Only with You.

WIBNTLA was clearly about Barbara. By the time POB was made they were over. That's a good a guess as any as to why he didn't want to revisit it.
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« Reply #253 on: August 25, 2013, 03:32:08 AM »

I'm wondering if that fantastic guitar sound was played by Carl...
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« Reply #254 on: August 25, 2013, 06:15:35 AM »

Fool on the Hill was mentioned. Im hearing a little phrasing from Golden Slumbers too. l'll let you figure out where. Grin
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« Reply #255 on: August 25, 2013, 06:29:11 AM »

Fool on the Hill was mentioned. Im hearing a little phrasing from Golden Slumbers too. l'll let you figure out where. Grin

Haven't heard the MiC version yet, only Adam's live cover – but Golden Slumbers is a certain.  In fact, the two meld together when I'm playing it to myself within my inner-skull hi-fi!
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« Reply #256 on: August 25, 2013, 06:37:13 AM »

Fool on the Hill was mentioned. Im hearing a little phrasing from Golden Slumbers too. l'll let you figure out where. Grin

Haven't heard the MiC version yet, only Adam's live cover – but Golden Slumbers is a certain.  In fact, the two meld together when I'm playing it to myself within my inner-skull hi-fi!

Cool youve got one of those too?
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« Reply #257 on: August 25, 2013, 06:43:45 AM »

Fool on the Hill was mentioned. Im hearing a little phrasing from Golden Slumbers too. l'll let you figure out where. Grin

Haven't heard the MiC version yet, only Adam's live cover – but Golden Slumbers is a certain.  In fact, the two meld together when I'm playing it to myself within my inner-skull hi-fi!

Cool youve got one of those too?

Oh yes… can you guess where the volume control is?   Wink
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« Reply #258 on: August 25, 2013, 06:52:47 AM »

Can you guess where the volume control is?   Wink
1st thing that came to mind (if I understood rightly the meaning of "inner skull hi-fi") was ears. I.e. you tug your left ear - it's up & the right one - down, or vice versa.
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« Reply #259 on: August 25, 2013, 08:12:19 AM »

Well when you cant get a tune out of your head thats inner skull HiFi to me. And its usually an outside influnce that drives down the volume although Ive done well at drowning out the wife with something or another playing on my inner skull jukebox driving to work, etc.  LOL
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« Reply #260 on: August 25, 2013, 08:20:51 AM »


There's a reason why, as Jack Rieley said (if he can be trusted as a source in this case) that the rest of the band (not sure if this was all-inclusive or not) was "consumed by jealousy" or words to that effect when presented with his two offerings for SU. This song crystallizes and achieves his gift for emotional connection completely, in spine-tingling fashion.


I'm curious who Jack Rieley was talking about? OK, you don't even have to mention one of them; it's understood. But who were the others who were jealous of Dennis' songs? His brothers Brian and Carl? Al? Bruce?
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« Reply #261 on: August 25, 2013, 08:40:56 AM »

Does anybody know the full breakdown of who played what? Will it be in the liner notes?

No, none.


How much of all the praise is down to the fact that you've been waiting so long to hear it?

In my case, none.

But after repeated listens it really seems to me like the song had been there all the time, like a classic of which you don't remember when you heard it for the first time.

I found another part that I don't like too much, the transition to the second verse. That sounds a bit like "um, what are we gonna do now? Up next is the second verse... umm... here it goes." to me personally.

But in spite of that and the fact I don't like the tag at all, I think this song is good enough that it should have been the single from the album in its day.
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« Reply #262 on: August 25, 2013, 10:49:33 AM »

The Boys have had their share of dumb decisions but not releasing this song back in the day really takes the cake

That particular decision was taken, and effected by one Wilson, Dennis Carl.  Grin

Any insights as to why did Dennis made this decision?  Even with the hindsight of 40 years of historical and musical perspective, I see no reason why this didn't get an earlier airing.

Politics aside, what would make Dennis shelve this but then support the inclusion of "...,Pete" or "Hold on Dear Brother", "Susie Cin" or even "Make it Good"?

Why would Dennis favour a remake of "Only With You*" for his solo album instead of this smokin' beast?

To me, it indicates Dennis made a rather significant decision to let it go - are there any clues as to what got in his craw?

*Not that there's anything wrong with that. I love the POB Only with You.
If you have a basic understanding of the type of people Dennis and Brian are you wouldn't need to labor over this question, and its not just you...many people are asking this upon hearing the song. But think about the history. The Wilsons like to revisit motifs and  lyric snippets and recycle them into newer works, but they tend to be moving forward all the time, they do what they do and move to the next thing. In fact Dennis and Brian are usually done with a song before its done, this is why we get sloppy mixes and messy editing decisions because they throw it together or leave that aspect to others when they lose interest. Its in the doing that they are focused and once whatever that feel or inspiration has been satisfied, that's it, no more thought towards it, they can't get away fast enough. Dennis' whole reason for pulling his tracks off Surfs Up is a simple one, he wanted them heard in a certain context, if that wasn't going to be the case then he he didn't want them on there. He was over it in like two days, never held it against anybody...it was a cold calculated thing. He and Carl disagreed about the sequence of the LP, Carl won out, Dennis said OK but you don't get my tracks. Next. The thing that most grates on me is no one else in the band insisted his tracks stay, according to Reiley, and some others around the activity, they were jealous or envious of Dennis' talent, and were happy to see Dennis' work not on the LP for completely selfish reasons. So yes Dennis made an impulsive choice...gee that's out of character, he was such a careful guy.Roll Eyes ...No one else fought to keep his stuff on there (according to observers). And yes, the fact that he revisited Only With You is the real anomaly, same with All Alone...but in fact later in life I think Dennis's prolific streak had run its course and he was more open to mining the leftovers because he was running out of gas. But in '71 he was on fire and he just kept creating new stuff, and for the next five years it was piling up, the solo LP ahead was the only real release, he could have easily done three but for that to happen the first one needed to be '71/72. Didn't happen, he finished one brilliant LP, but before he nailed down the next one he derailed, and burned out.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2013, 11:02:08 AM by Jon Stebbins » Logged
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« Reply #263 on: August 25, 2013, 11:11:38 AM »


There's a reason why, as Jack Rieley said (if he can be trusted as a source in this case) that the rest of the band (not sure if this was all-inclusive or not) was "consumed by jealousy" or words to that effect when presented with his two offerings for SU. This song crystallizes and achieves his gift for emotional connection completely, in spine-tingling fashion.


I'm curious who Jack Rieley was talking about? OK, you don't even have to mention one of them; it's understood. But who were the others who were jealous of Dennis' songs? His brothers Brian and Carl? Al? Bruce?

If they are "the rest of the band" I'd say, yeah.  Razz

Sounds fishy too me, if they were so jealous why did they contribute to the effort?
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« Reply #264 on: August 25, 2013, 11:12:36 AM »

Back to the happier topic of the song itself, I keep fantasizing that this becomes a huge hit, bigger than Kokomo.
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« Reply #265 on: August 25, 2013, 11:19:52 AM »

The thing that most grates on me is no one else in the band insisted his tracks stay, according to Reiley, and some others around the activity, they were jealous or envious of Dennis' talent, and were happy to see Dennis' work not on the LP for completely selfish reasons. So yes Dennis made an impulsive choice...gee that's out of character, he was such a careful guy.Roll Eyes ...No one else fought to keep his stuff on there (according to observers).

If he wasn't going to fight for himself then why should anybody else? Especially as it does make perfect sense for Surf's Up to close the album.

And Rieley is hardly a man to be trusted.
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« Reply #266 on: August 25, 2013, 11:45:43 AM »

The thing that most grates on me is no one else in the band insisted his tracks stay, according to Reiley, and some others around the activity, they were jealous or envious of Dennis' talent, and were happy to see Dennis' work not on the LP for completely selfish reasons. So yes Dennis made an impulsive choice...gee that's out of character, he was such a careful guy.Roll Eyes ...No one else fought to keep his stuff on there (according to observers).

If he wasn't going to fight for himself then why should anybody else? Especially as it does make perfect sense for Surf's Up to close the album.

And Rieley is hardly a man to be trusted.
Oh come on, all the people in and around the Beach Boys are trustworthy, right? I've never been told otherwise. Should I do more research?

Fight for himself, or within his rights to make an aesthetic choice, call it what you want, it was Dennis' deal. He had no room to subsequently complain about it, and there's no evidence that he did. And ironically Dennis was the one given the job of telling Brian the track "Surf's Up" was going to be on the LP despite Brian's preference that it not be. But then despite Brian's reservations, he reportedly contributed an arrangement suggestion to the new SU vocal bits. And Dennis having pulled his tracks reacted by enthusiastically promoting the album. So this whole saga is more twisted than the average person could ever imagine. But if we can focus on the subject at hand, I'd think those of us with a good knowledge of the working patterns and tendencies of the Wilson boys should not be surprised Dennis didn't submit the WIBNTLA track for the next LP...or the next LP etc... That wasn't gonna happen. But despite what Dennis did, it does seem more than a bit wrong that the band let such a stone classic slip away. If it had been a Brian composition do you think there's any way it would not have been rammed down out throats? That's why Rieley's assessment falls in line with my understanding of the general group vibe. Dennis was not a priority. Is this song more evidence he should have been? Let's let the board decide.
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« Reply #267 on: August 25, 2013, 12:48:43 PM »

Oh come on, all the people in and around the Beach Boys are trustworthy, right? I've never been told otherwise. Should I do more research?

Fight for himself, or within his rights to make an aesthetic choice, call it what you want, it was Dennis' deal. He had no room to subsequently complain about it, and there's no evidence that he did. And ironically Dennis was the one given the job of telling Brian the track "Surf's Up" was going to be on the LP despite Brian's preference that it not be. But then despite Brian's reservations, he reportedly contributed an arrangement suggestion to the new SU vocal bits. And Dennis having pulled his tracks reacted by enthusiastically promoting the album. So this whole saga is more twisted than the average person could ever imagine. But if we can focus on the subject at hand, I'd think those of us with a good knowledge of the working patterns and tendencies of the Wilson boys should not be surprised Dennis didn't submit the WIBNTLA track for the next LP...or the next LP etc... That wasn't gonna happen. But despite what Dennis did, it does seem more than a bit wrong that the band let such a stone classic slip away. If it had been a Brian composition do you think there's any way it would not have been rammed down out throats? That's why Rieley's assessment falls in line with my understanding of the general group vibe. Dennis was not a priority. Is this song more evidence he should have been? Let's let the board decide.

Oh, I think we all know Dennis wasn't the priority. Absolutely. Al himself has said that.

And of course you shouldn't do more research. I fully respect your knowledge of the subject.

But Dennis had space for between 2 and 4 songs on each album from Friends through to Holland. So if other band members were jealous (and with Mike of course that's entirely believable) then he still wasn't exactly being sidelined.

He was entirely within his rights to take his bat and ball and go home with this album. They were his songs after all. But I don't think it is realistic to think the other guys would have fought for these tunes. They fought for Brian's because they wanted to sell more albums. But including songs with a Dennis Wilson writing credit was no guarantee of that at the time as evidenced by the flop albums they had just suffered.
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« Reply #268 on: August 25, 2013, 04:26:13 PM »

The thing that most grates on me is no one else in the band insisted his tracks stay, according to Reiley, and some others around the activity, they were jealous or envious of Dennis' talent, and were happy to see Dennis' work not on the LP for completely selfish reasons. So yes Dennis made an impulsive choice...gee that's out of character, he was such a careful guy.Roll Eyes ...No one else fought to keep his stuff on there (according to observers).

If he wasn't going to fight for himself then why should anybody else? Especially as it does make perfect sense for Surf's Up to close the album.

And Rieley is hardly a man to be trusted.
Oh come on, all the people in and around the Beach Boys are trustworthy, right? I've never been told otherwise. Should I do more research?

Fight for himself, or within his rights to make an aesthetic choice, call it what you want, it was Dennis' deal. He had no room to subsequently complain about it, and there's no evidence that he did. And ironically Dennis was the one given the job of telling Brian the track "Surf's Up" was going to be on the LP despite Brian's preference that it not be. But then despite Brian's reservations, he reportedly contributed an arrangement suggestion to the new SU vocal bits. And Dennis having pulled his tracks reacted by enthusiastically promoting the album. So this whole saga is more twisted than the average person could ever imagine. But if we can focus on the subject at hand, I'd think those of us with a good knowledge of the working patterns and tendencies of the Wilson boys should not be surprised Dennis didn't submit the WIBNTLA track for the next LP...or the next LP etc... That wasn't gonna happen. But despite what Dennis did, it does seem more than a bit wrong that the band let such a stone classic slip away. If it had been a Brian composition do you think there's any way it would not have been rammed down out throats? That's why Rieley's assessment falls in line with my understanding of the general group vibe. Dennis was not a priority. Is this song more evidence he should have been? Let's let the board decide.
Jon, do you think we will ever get more Dennis material from the archives? There is "Carry Me Home" and "I'm Going Your Way" (which, from the bootlegs, would greatly benefit from a new mix) for starters.
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« Reply #269 on: August 25, 2013, 04:31:12 PM »

Great points, Jon, they make sense both empirically and intuitively. And let's not forget what the atmosphere was like in the time frame surrounding the "Surf's Up sessions": even by BB standards, this was a time fraught with concern. In America, the BBs were struggling mightily to shed the albatross of their image in the counterculture that had come to dominate the pop music scene in America. While they were getting some endorsements from "hip" folks in the first half of '71 (playing with the Dead, Dylan's "they're f*ckin' good, man..."), the fact remained that Sunflower had tanked in the US along with each and every single pulled from it.

There was about as much on the line as there possibly could be at this time, so the tensions had to be high. Despite Reiley (and possibly because of him in some instances), factionalization increased. Bruce's open dislike for Reiley could not be contained as they moved beyond the success of the SU release into a subsequent LP (CATP) where he was completely unrepresented and pretty much rebelled against the direction that CATP had taken (no fan of "Mess of Help" can be found living in his Montecito manshun!!). Dennis sliced up his hand, couldn't drum for at least a couple of years, and Brian entered his most problematic period--so, for better or worse, Carl and Reiley retooled the band. Most everyone seems to be satisfied with that live band at this remove in time, and it's clear that the effort to position the group more toward the prevailing zeitgeist helped shore them up: they may not have had any hits, but they'd gotten past the stigma that threatened to stop them dead in their tracks in '69-'70.

But in early '71, none of that had happened, and while Dennis had been writing a lot of impressive stuff for the past several years, none of it had proven to be a catalyst to bring the BBs out of the wilderness. (To be fair, nothing had managed to do that as yet.) There was clearly a great deal of flailing around going on, and the ground must have been shifting quite a bit (and rather rapidly at that).

And let's not forget that the "jealousy" directed at Dennis was coming from another source as well--from the fact that he'd been cast in Two-Lane Blacktop, which was released right in the middle of this time frame.
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« Reply #270 on: August 25, 2013, 04:47:00 PM »

I think where the Beach Boys really lost their way, beginning, in my opinion, when Sunflower flopped, and continuing for the rest of their career, is that their string of failures get to them to the extent that they forgot an absolute cardinal rule - make the best album you can, and let the public follow. The whole semi-cynical idea of trying to create the illusion of Brian involvement to build publicity, plus all the petty internal power struggles, got in the way of putting out the best album they could. And once you stop working at your best, stop focusing first and foremost on the music, you're cutting off your nose to spite your face, because people can tell when you're not at your best; they smell blood. In my opinion, it's often easier for a lesser band to do well working at their very best than for a great band that's letting crap get in the way of the music, even if the great band's mediocre music is better than the lesser bands best work. People can just feel it. The fact that Carl or Brian or Al or Mike or Bruce didn't stand up and say: this song has to come out because it's frickin fantastic, because we want the best album we can make, is so sad. So sad, but not remotely surprising. 
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« Reply #271 on: August 25, 2013, 04:58:51 PM »

Dennis' whole reason for pulling his tracks off Surfs Up is a simple one, he wanted them heard in a certain context, if that wasn't going to be the case then he he didn't want them on there. He was over it in like two days, never held it against anybody...it was a cold calculated thing. He and Carl disagreed about the sequence of the LP, Carl won out, Dennis said OK but you don't get my tracks. Next. The thing that most grates on me is no one else in the band insisted his tracks stay, according to Reiley, and some others around the activity, they were jealous or envious of Dennis' talent, and were happy to see Dennis' work not on the LP for completely selfish reasons.

I just asked this in the "would Surf's Up have been the greatest" thread, but I want to ask again here since if anyone would know, it would be Jon I imagine: do we know exactly what songs Dennis expected to be on the album before he pulled them? And particularly, what is the evidence, or lack there of, of Lady being included? (It always seemed like a strange fit to me, personally.) I'm assuming Sound of Free wasn't under consideration, despite making it into many board member's alt. Surf's Up playlists - is this accurate?

Three more questions: Do we know anything about Dennis's preferred sequence, other than Wouldn't It Be Nice to Live Again going last? Did Dennis feel that the song Surf's Up shouldn't be included, either because he felt it was wrong to disrespect Brian's wishes, despite Brian's eventual decision to work on the tag? Or because he felt that band should be looking forward, and not backwards? Or did he just want his song last, and Surf's Up elsewhere on the album? And finally, do we have any evidence about whether or not Feet or Student Demonstration Time were replacements for the Dennis songs, or did the group just originally expect a longer album?

Any answers to any of these would be very appreciated if they exist! It can be so hard to sort out fact from well supported rumor from spurious rumor from opinions sometimes.
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« Reply #272 on: August 25, 2013, 05:08:51 PM »


There's a reason why, as Jack Rieley said (if he can be trusted as a source in this case) that the rest of the band (not sure if this was all-inclusive or not) was "consumed by jealousy" or words to that effect when presented with his two offerings for SU. This song crystallizes and achieves his gift for emotional connection completely, in spine-tingling fashion.


I'm curious who Jack Rieley was talking about? OK, you don't even have to mention one of them; it's understood. But who were the others who were jealous of Dennis' songs? His brothers Brian and Carl? Al? Bruce?

It's sad to think of Dennis' stellar talent and its potential to shape the band's identity being thwarted by any kind of petty circumstances or envy, as well as his own mercurial, uncompromising nature. Jealousy aside, interesting that he and Carl would have even had a power struggle about album structure between them in the aftermath of the vacuum that was left after Brian's withdrawal from the primary leadership role after Smile, didn't realize that their relationship had that kind of dynamic to it. It has always seemed like Carl was the clear 2nd-stringer on the depth chart to Brian, anointed as his successor (at least in the late '60s) and Dennis went along with that.

Ironic that, in hindsight, Dennis' emotive music fit the model that was more in the vanguard of sensitive early '70s singer-songwriter-type material. They were self-consciously seeking hipness at that juncture (DGNTW and SDT) and they undoubtedly saw in Dennis' music the real deal, effortlessly achieved and without being contrived. Odd that these jealousies would have come to the fore right at this time, when he had made major contributions to the preceding album and would to the next one (perhaps they were critically short of material for CATP). Perhaps SU, with it's renowned Smile-era centerpiece, had a more high-profile launch, as their live career was taking off, and there was more vying for power as their '70s identity (pre-Endless Summer) was taking shape. As we know, the jealousy continued and even reached a peak with POB and the potential for a solo career taking off.

With the inclusion of Dennis' tunes SU would have had such an incredible balance between some of all three brothers' best, deepest work, along with arguably Bruce's best band effort in Disney Girls, and it's a really unfortunate lost opportunity. When you think of all the moody and magnificent tracks that would have comprised it, with perhaps the omission of SDT and Feet, SU would have been a dense forest of introspection, too much of it for some tastes, but undeniably powerful.

Wish I'd seen the few previous posts that were made while I was writing this, they cover some of the same ground. Oh well.....
« Last Edit: August 26, 2013, 10:12:23 PM by mutedtrumpeterswan » Logged

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Jon Stebbins
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« Reply #273 on: August 25, 2013, 06:35:05 PM »

Dennis' whole reason for pulling his tracks off Surfs Up is a simple one, he wanted them heard in a certain context, if that wasn't going to be the case then he he didn't want them on there. He was over it in like two days, never held it against anybody...it was a cold calculated thing. He and Carl disagreed about the sequence of the LP, Carl won out, Dennis said OK but you don't get my tracks. Next. The thing that most grates on me is no one else in the band insisted his tracks stay, according to Reiley, and some others around the activity, they were jealous or envious of Dennis' talent, and were happy to see Dennis' work not on the LP for completely selfish reasons.

I just asked this in the "would Surf's Up have been the greatest" thread, but I want to ask again here since if anyone would know, it would be Jon I imagine: do we know exactly what songs Dennis expected to be on the album before he pulled them? And particularly, what is the evidence, or lack there of, of Lady being included? (It always seemed like a strange fit to me, personally.) I'm assuming Sound of Free wasn't under consideration, despite making it into many board member's alt. Surf's Up playlists - is this accurate?

Three more questions: Do we know anything about Dennis's preferred sequence, other than Wouldn't It Be Nice to Live Again going last? Did Dennis feel that the song Surf's Up shouldn't be included, either because he felt it was wrong to disrespect Brian's wishes, despite Brian's eventual decision to work on the tag? Or because he felt that band should be looking forward, and not backwards? Or did he just want his song last, and Surf's Up elsewhere on the album? And finally, do we have any evidence about whether or not Feet or Student Demonstration Time were replacements for the Dennis songs, or did the group just originally expect a longer album?

Any answers to any of these would be very appreciated if they exist! It can be so hard to sort out fact from well supported rumor from spurious rumor from opinions sometimes.
Nothing is exactly clear cut in the BB's history of picking tracks for their post '67 LP's, but I think its been stated here many times, and is fairly well accepted among people with what info is available that Dennis' tracks specifically recorded and submitted for Surf's Up were WIBNTLA and 4th of July. They had not been mixed and mastered, and they each had a little bit of polishing to be done, as with his Holland tracks Dennis probably would have left the clean-up to Carl, or would have done it in collaboration with Carl. These decisions on sequencing probably occurred while this work was being planned. I highly doubt Lady was considered, as it had already seen release as a European Dennis solo side.

Regarding DW's suggested sequence, from what I've been told he wanted WIBNTLA to follow Till I Die and to close the LP. I've also heard he suggested that Surf's Up be the album opener. I think its a good bet Feet or SDT would have been the ones to be left out if Carl and Dennis had reached a consensus. But again this is all very speculative, the route the BB's took to finalizing track inclusion, sequence and getting over the label approval hurdle is always one of those "depends on who you're talking to" kind of things, because a lot of people put in their two-cents, and the pattern of things being in constant flux was definitely the case once Brian wasn't taking responsibility for such choices anymore.
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« Reply #274 on: August 25, 2013, 06:39:13 PM »

Thanks for taking the time to give such thoughtful responses Jon.

I am just surprised that there isn't a WIP track sheet in someone's archives.
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