BB's at TAGS NY

[Nicko1234]

Thanks for the kind words, its hard not to question the video tributes when the last Wilson isn't touring with them. Its almost like M&B are really trying to convince the average concert goers that they are the real BBs touring group at this point.

Just think about what you are saying there. You`re saying that by highlighting the fact that two original Beach Boys are dead that they are trying to pass themselves off as the real Beach Boys. Come on.

[JohnMill]

I see nothing wrong with what Mike & Bruce are doing. They are touring as The Beach Boys. I think it is great that Dennis and Carl are not forgotten by the group and most importantly, by the fans. Some of which may not know more than Brian and Mike.

I think it bothers some fans from the perspective that airing the Dennis & Carl Wilson tribute videos makes it seem like Mike Love is still promoting his show as a continuation of the C50 even though 3/5 of the band aren't on stage.  Now to be fair Al Jardine has made several comments in the press referring to the fact that from his perspective the BAD shows are a continuation of the C50 and nobody seemed to have a problem with that.  Although granted BAD to my knowledge hasn't made any overt gestures in the manner that M&B are doing by airing these tribute videos.

It may be a case of the heart being in the right place but in actualizing the intention they end up pushing all the wrong buttons.

[Nicko1234]

I think it bothers some fans from the perspective that airing the Dennis & Carl Wilson tribute videos makes it seem like Mike Love is still promoting his show as a continuation of the C50 even though 3/5 of the band aren't on stage.  Now to be fair Al Jardine has made several comments in the press referring to the fact that from his perspective the BAD shows are a continuation of the C50 and nobody seemed to have a problem with that.  Although granted BAD to my knowledge hasn't made any overt gestures in the manner that M&B are doing by airing these tribute videos.

It may be a case of the heart being in the right place but in actualizing the intention they end up pushing all the wrong buttons.

I genuinely can`t see how that can be the case in the real world though.

The only people who will know about the tribute videos is the people who attended the C50 shows. Now there is no way on earth that they could look at the 7 people on stage when M&B perform and believe that this is attempting to be a continuation of C50. They would have to be blind.

[Cam Mott]

I don't see anything wrong with it.  I don't see why Al and Brian can't do this in their solo shows.

[Nicko1234]

Agree that the Carl-only mode is a shame but good that a Dennis tribute is being worked on. To me, though, that kinda thing belongs as part of the FULL band show, the C50 line up of Al, Brian, Bruce, Dave & Michael with BW's band and M&B's heads of staff.

What I hardly dare do is think ahead, to a time when another of the band's core members has passed.  Are video tributes already being considered? Or will things finally be laid to rest then?

Otherwise the day will eventually come to pass when one surviving member is on the road with his band and spends half his show singing backgrounds to a video projection for Forever, God Only Knows, Disney Girls, Good Vibrations, Cottonfields, Little Bird or Goin' to The Beach… or Kokomo…

I doubt it will be laid to rest. If all of the band members decided to retire tomorrow then they would probably get some hired hands to tour under the name while giving them a healthy percentage. It`s a business.

[drbeachboy]

I see nothing wrong with what Mike & Bruce are doing. They are touring as The Beach Boys. I think it is great that Dennis and Carl are not forgotten by the group and most importantly, by the fans. Some of which may not know more than Brian and Mike.

I think it bothers some fans from the perspective that airing the Dennis & Carl Wilson tribute videos makes it seem like Mike Love is still promoting his show as a continuation of the C50 even though 3/5 of the band aren't on stage.  Now to be fair Al Jardine has made several comments in the press referring to the fact that from his perspective the BAD shows are a continuation of the C50 and nobody seemed to have a problem with that.  Although granted BAD to my knowledge hasn't made any overt gestures in the manner that M&B are doing by airing these tribute videos.

It may be a case of the heart being in the right place but in actualizing the intention they end up pushing all the wrong buttons.

Heart in the right place far outweighs conspiracy theories. If Brian did it at his shows I doubt there would be an uproar. To both Brian & Mike, both guys were family and band members. Notice too, that it is always the same few people in here that spout the hate at every opportunity.

[JohnMill]

I see nothing wrong with what Mike & Bruce are doing. They are touring as The Beach Boys. I think it is great that Dennis and Carl are not forgotten by the group and most importantly, by the fans. Some of which may not know more than Brian and Mike.

I think it bothers some fans from the perspective that airing the Dennis & Carl Wilson tribute videos makes it seem like Mike Love is still promoting his show as a continuation of the C50 even though 3/5 of the band aren't on stage.  Now to be fair Al Jardine has made several comments in the press referring to the fact that from his perspective the BAD shows are a continuation of the C50 and nobody seemed to have a problem with that.  Although granted BAD to my knowledge hasn't made any overt gestures in the manner that M&B are doing by airing these tribute videos.

It may be a case of the heart being in the right place but in actualizing the intention they end up pushing all the wrong buttons.

Heart in the right place far outweighs conspiracy theories. If Brian did it at his shows I doubt there would be an uproar. To both Brian & Mike, both guys were family and band members. Notice too, that it is always the same few people in here that spout the hate at every opportunity.

Exactly.

Which is why the header which should go above this or any other discussion regarding any controversy involving Mike Love should read: "Mike Love Does Not Get The Benefit Of The Doubt From The Majority Of The Diehard Beach Boys Fanbase"

It's just is what it is at this point and personally I don't see it changing anytime soon.  Mike Love had a chance to change how he was perceived by the diehards last year and he blew it.  I don't hold any grudges against the man personally, but I would have to be blind not to acknowledge what exists right before my eyes.

[leggo of my ego]

Man, it's a shame that people can't even share a few pictures of a concert without other people acting like a bunch of idiots and derailing YET ANOTHER FUCKING THREAD.

Bhw, thanks for sharing the pictures. Don't mind the kids on the shortbus who have nothing better to do than hate.

I don't hate. I criticize. There's a difference. Of course, it's easy to marginalize those who recognize what a sham the whole M&B thing really is.

Put me down on the ledger who believe the vid tributes belong with the full band, the 'proper' band. Otherwise it's more needless self aggrandizement by Michael who really, truly, wants to be recognized as the Beeeeeech Boys.

Now THAT is something I hate. Cheapness...phony show business...I hate that.

Yes. You're spot on Doo Dah - some posters sure like to use the word "hate" don't they?

[drbeachboy]

Man, it's a shame that people can't even share a few pictures of a concert without other people acting like a bunch of idiots and derailing YET ANOTHER FUCKING THREAD.

Bhw, thanks for sharing the pictures. Don't mind the kids on the shortbus who have nothing better to do than hate.

I don't hate. I criticize. There's a difference. Of course, it's easy to marginalize those who recognize what a sham the whole M&B thing really is.

Put me down on the ledger who believe the vid tributes belong with the full band, the 'proper' band. Otherwise it's more needless self aggrandizement by Michael who really, truly, wants to be recognized as the Beeeeeech Boys.

Now THAT is something I hate. Cheapness...phony show business...I hate that.

Yes. You're spot on Doo Dah - some posters sure like to use the word "hate" don't they?

Because, some of you do.

[leggo of my ego]

Man, it's a shame that people can't even share a few pictures of a concert without other people acting like a bunch of idiots and derailing YET ANOTHER FUCKING THREAD.

Bhw, thanks for sharing the pictures. Don't mind the kids on the shortbus who have nothing better to do than hate.

I don't hate. I criticize. There's a difference. Of course, it's easy to marginalize those who recognize what a sham the whole M&B thing really is.

Put me down on the ledger who believe the vid tributes belong with the full band, the 'proper' band. Otherwise it's more needless self aggrandizement by Michael who really, truly, wants to be recognized as the Beeeeeech Boys.

Now THAT is something I hate. Cheapness...phony show business...I hate that.

Yes. You're spot on Doo Dah - some posters sure like to use the word "hate" don't they?

Because, some of you do.

Can you prove that?

I see Lots of posts from the staunch defenders of Michael that call his critics "haters" - Why not just label criticism as criticism?

[Nicko1234]

Can you prove that?

I see Lots of posts from the staunch defenders of Michael that call his critics "haters" - Why not just label criticism as criticism?

Is it normal? That`s the question I would ask.

[drbeachboy]

Man, it's a shame that people can't even share a few pictures of a concert without other people acting like a bunch of idiots and derailing YET ANOTHER FUCKING THREAD.

Bhw, thanks for sharing the pictures. Don't mind the kids on the shortbus who have nothing better to do than hate.

I don't hate. I criticize. There's a difference. Of course, it's easy to marginalize those who recognize what a sham the whole M&B thing really is.

Put me down on the ledger who believe the vid tributes belong with the full band, the 'proper' band. Otherwise it's more needless self aggrandizement by Michael who really, truly, wants to be recognized as the Beeeeeech Boys.

Now THAT is something I hate. Cheapness...phony show business...I hate that.

Yes. You're spot on Doo Dah - some posters sure like to use the word "hate" don't they?

Because, some of you do.

Can you prove that?

I see Lots of posts from the staunch defenders of Michael that call his critics "haters" - Why not just label criticism as criticism?

Yes, I can. Peruse just about any thread where Mike Love or Bruce Johnston is mentioned. There you will find the answer to your question. Also, you call it whatever you like. It is the intent that counts. You and I both know that there are some folks in here that no matter what is discussed about Mike, they ALWAYS respond negatively.

[Michael Edwards Love]

I think it bothers some fans from the perspective that airing the Dennis & Carl Wilson tribute videos makes it seem like Mike Love is still promoting his show as a continuation of the C50 even though 3/5 of the band aren't on stage.  Now to be fair Al Jardine has made several comments in the press referring to the fact that from his perspective the BAD shows are a continuation of the C50 and nobody seemed to have a problem with that.  Although granted BAD to my knowledge hasn't made any overt gestures in the manner that M&B are doing by airing these tribute videos.

It may be a case of the heart being in the right place but in actualizing the intention they end up pushing all the wrong buttons.

I genuinely can`t see how that can be the case in the real world though.

The only people who will know about the tribute videos is the people who attended the C50 shows. Now there is no way on earth that they could look at the 7 people on stage when M&B perform and believe that this is attempting to be a continuation of C50. They would have to be blind.

In the world outside of SSMB, many of those attending a Beach Boys show don't really know who the members are but are there for the songs.  The video tributes were a cool way at C50 of "introducing" Carl and Dennis to many who attended.  At the Bethlehem show, the people beside me asked who was on the video screens and wondered how exactly they were related to Brian.

So, is it really so hard to believe that Mike just wants the audience to be engaged in the larger narrative of the Beach Boys and point out that they are, in fact, real people who performed these iconic songs?  And, maybe more importantly, is it that hard to believe that Mike loves his cousins and the "tear in the fabric" of the Beach Boys is felt by him much more than we could ever appreciate?

I intend to take my 11-year old daughter to her first BB (M&B, whatever) show at the end of September.  If she gets to see the Carl video and maybe even the Dennis one, all the better.  It's the only way she can experience that history.

[Doo Dah]

In the world outside of SSMB, many of those attending a Beach Boys show don't really know who the members are but are there for the songs.  The video tributes were a cool way at C50 of "introducing" Carl and Dennis to many who attended.  At the Bethlehem show, the people beside me asked who was on the video screens and wondered how exactly they were related to Brian.

Sad, but true. We can argue the motivation behind the vids, but the upshot is that many at the M&B shows need to be educated. I've mentioned a real story from when Mike and Bruce played the Puyallup Fair outside of Tacoma, Washington (circa '05 or so). Mike dedicated that evening's performance of God Only Knows to the memory of Carl Wilson. An older gentleman to my right said to me - "who's that? is that their dad?"

[head explodes]

And who's at fault for that? The overall marketing of the band over the past 30 yrs. Note: I am not just blaming Mike here, but the overall marketing of the brand. There's nothing that can be done to change it, only engage it. That bird has flown.

[leggo of my ego]

Man, it's a shame that people can't even share a few pictures of a concert without other people acting like a bunch of idiots and derailing YET ANOTHER FUCKING THREAD.

Bhw, thanks for sharing the pictures. Don't mind the kids on the shortbus who have nothing better to do than hate.

I don't hate. I criticize. There's a difference. Of course, it's easy to marginalize those who recognize what a sham the whole M&B thing really is.

Put me down on the ledger who believe the vid tributes belong with the full band, the 'proper' band. Otherwise it's more needless self aggrandizement by Michael who really, truly, wants to be recognized as the Beeeeeech Boys.

Now THAT is something I hate. Cheapness...phony show business...I hate that.

Yes. You're spot on Doo Dah - some posters sure like to use the word "hate" don't they?

Because, some of you do.

Can you prove that?

I see Lots of posts from the staunch defenders of Michael that call his critics "haters" - Why not just label criticism as criticism?

Yes, I can. Peruse just about any thread where Mike Love or Bruce Johnston is mentioned. There you will find the answer to your question. Also, you call it whatever you like. It is the intent that counts. You and I both know that there are some folks in here that no matter what is discussed about Mike, they ALWAYS respond negatively.

If anger is a seed, hate is the tree it grows from.

I'd say Michael's behavior and track record has elicited a very wide range of feelings/ responses in the BB fan base. Like another poster mentioned some people don't even know who Carl & Dennis are but they enjoy the music! Most of the people at this forum are much better informed and that knowledge can be a blessing and curse I suppose. In any event I do not see the feelings and responses towards Love / M&B
changing --  even if Michael were to behave in a diametrically different fashion he will still have detractors and many will not trust him anyway.

Undoubtedly, in that wide range there is ridicule, disgust, criticism and sure, even a tree of hatred may grow - but how can you truly classify who is feeling what...? 

[Pretty Funky]

FWIW. I also think the video tributes should have finished with the C50. Even if the group reunite again sometime, I hope they pay tribute by playing some Carl and Dennis tracks only.

[drbeachboy]

Man, it's a shame that people can't even share a few pictures of a concert without other people acting like a bunch of idiots and derailing YET ANOTHER FUCKING THREAD.

Bhw, thanks for sharing the pictures. Don't mind the kids on the shortbus who have nothing better to do than hate.

I don't hate. I criticize. There's a difference. Of course, it's easy to marginalize those who recognize what a sham the whole M&B thing really is.

Put me down on the ledger who believe the vid tributes belong with the full band, the 'proper' band. Otherwise it's more needless self aggrandizement by Michael who really, truly, wants to be recognized as the Beeeeeech Boys.

Now THAT is something I hate. Cheapness...phony show business...I hate that.

Yes. You're spot on Doo Dah - some posters sure like to use the word "hate" don't they?

Because, some of you do.

Can you prove that?

I see Lots of posts from the staunch defenders of Michael that call his critics "haters" - Why not just label criticism as criticism?

Yes, I can. Peruse just about any thread where Mike Love or Bruce Johnston is mentioned. There you will find the answer to your question. Also, you call it whatever you like. It is the intent that counts. You and I both know that there are some folks in here that no matter what is discussed about Mike, they ALWAYS respond negatively.

If anger is a seed, hate is the tree it grows from.

I'd say Michael's behavior and track record has elicited a very wide range of feelings/ responses in the BB fan base. Like another poster mentioned some people don't even know who Carl & Dennis are but they enjoy the music! Most of the people at this forum are much better informed and that knowledge can be a blessing and curse I suppose. In any event I do not see the feelings and responses towards Love / M&B
changing --  even if Michael were to behave in a diametrically different fashion he will still have detractors and many will not trust him anyway.

Undoubtedly, in that wide range there is ridicule, disgust, criticism and sure, even a tree of hatred may grow - but how can you truly classify who is feeling what...?  

If you cannot feel it after reading this stuff day after day, then I don't know what to say to convince you, so I won't. With Mike, things have been truly strained with Brian and Al since the early 90s. Even Carl's relationship was strained with his own brother. The band has been fractured since Carl died. I cannot believe that there are folks in here who thought one tour was going to fix 20 plus years of issues. While I always believed there would be a reunion, I also am not surprised that it didn't last. I also believe that Brian and his management had more to do with Mike's decisions than just Mike refusing to go on as a fully functional band again. He had that as a option and he took it. Considering that I am not privy to what actually went down, I make no judgment either way and just let things play out. Speculating in here leads to constant fighting, because we go around in circles, and in the end, means absolutely nothing, but frustration. Meanwhile, both tours go on as they had done before, no worse for wear.

[Cabinessenceking]

I can't believe they showed the Carl video for God Only Knows.  It makes me cringe actually.  In the reunion tour, it made sense, you have Carl and Dennis joining the rest of the group in spirit to make it a complete reunion.  Here they have Carl singing with Mike, Bruce, and a whole bunch of guys that Carl never played with when he was alive.

It's also a bit of a fuck you to Dennis, as if Carl is the only one worth commemorating.

If you're going to do one video tribute, you have to do the other.

just another example of Myke showing off his legendary sense of taste and sensibility.

[RubberSoul13]

I was talking to an older couple in Baltimore behind me about C50, and they were happy and excited to see so many younger fans etc. but they didn't know who David Marks was...but they knew everyone else!...just had to be the devil's advocate 

[Nicko1234]

I think it bothers some fans from the perspective that airing the Dennis & Carl Wilson tribute videos makes it seem like Mike Love is still promoting his show as a continuation of the C50 even though 3/5 of the band aren't on stage.  Now to be fair Al Jardine has made several comments in the press referring to the fact that from his perspective the BAD shows are a continuation of the C50 and nobody seemed to have a problem with that.  Although granted BAD to my knowledge hasn't made any overt gestures in the manner that M&B are doing by airing these tribute videos.

It may be a case of the heart being in the right place but in actualizing the intention they end up pushing all the wrong buttons.

I genuinely can`t see how that can be the case in the real world though.

The only people who will know about the tribute videos is the people who attended the C50 shows. Now there is no way on earth that they could look at the 7 people on stage when M&B perform and believe that this is attempting to be a continuation of C50. They would have to be blind.

In the world outside of SSMB, many of those attending a Beach Boys show don't really know who the members are but are there for the songs.  The video tributes were a cool way at C50 of "introducing" Carl and Dennis to many who attended.  At the Bethlehem show, the people beside me asked who was on the video screens and wondered how exactly they were related to Brian.

So, is it really so hard to believe that Mike just wants the audience to be engaged in the larger narrative of the Beach Boys and point out that they are, in fact, real people who performed these iconic songs?  And, maybe more importantly, is it that hard to believe that Mike loves his cousins and the "tear in the fabric" of the Beach Boys is felt by him much more than we could ever appreciate?

I intend to take my 11-year old daughter to her first BB (M&B, whatever) show at the end of September.  If she gets to see the Carl video and maybe even the Dennis one, all the better.  It's the only way she can experience that history.

Indeed.

[Heywood]

I'm glad to see them do it - I remember seeing them 10 years ago thinking there should be some way of incorporating a bit of history and telling their story. Something like this should have been done all along - even if it was just a video montage for a couple of minutes. Not just a quick name check during one song.