Brian to play with Al and David, July in Ohio

[Pretty Funky]

All this talk about meetings, strategy, power games, future of the Beach Boys etc.

Maybe its just me, but since Brians solo career restarted in 99 I have yet to be convinced that his BB life is anything else but a hobby to him. Granted when he signs up for a tour/ album he gives it everything but if it stopped tomorrow he would care not one dot.

He would be more than happy to drop most BB songs from his setlist at his solo shows IMO.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I'd like to know if Mike made more, or less, on the C50 tour.  I paid $175. for a sold out show at the Hollywood Bowl, which is probably a lot more than they charge for the M&B tour.  Although there would be 5 people to share the proceeds with on C50.

Not forgetting a band some three times bigger, a huge stage show and tech team and a considerable entourage. The overhead woudl eb orders of magnitudes bigger than the M&B tour.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Of course, there's a financial aspect in Mike wanting to get back to touring with Bruce in the others, but a possibly more important factor is that he'll be calling the shots as opposed to doing things by committee as per C50. To get last year's touring up and running, everyone had to make concessions and compromises, and Mike's were to use most of Brian's band with just two of his guys (and props to him for agreeing that, it worked like a dream), and to temporarily cede the tiller to BRI & the wivesandmanagers. After some two decades of calling the shots, that had to be hard.

Also, irrespective of how much they each made from the C50, Mike also had to suspend touring and doubtless experienced a net fall in income (as, of course did Brian & Alan as well). So, not so black & white.

Am I reading this right. Brian and *cough* Al made less money during the C50 than they normally would?

Bad phrasing on my part - I mean they made less from Mike's touring.

[Andrew G. Doe]

All this talk about meetings, strategy, power games, future of the Beach Boys etc.

Maybe its just me, but since Brians solo career restarted in 99 I have yet to be convinced that his BB life is anything else but a hobby to him. Granted when he signs up for a tour/ album he gives it everything but if it stopped tomorrow he would care not one dot.

He would be more than happy to drop most BB songs from his setlist at his solo shows IMO.

Beg to differ on that - he most certainly did not "give it everything" on GIOMH, and I've experienced some solo shows that could be charitably described as "perfunctory".

[Andrew G. Doe]

On the other hand if the WilsonJardineMarks show is out grossing the M&B show (quite possible)...

Highly unlikely, IMO. Mike & Bruce have regularly outgrossed Brian since the latter began touring. For one of the 2006 Pet Sounds shows with Alan, I recall there being 600 people in a 3000 seat venue. The Canadian Gershwin tour was a financial disaster of the first order.

[AndrewHickey]

Gee I'd love to know when the current BB touring licence agreement expires ... and then be a fly on the wall at the BRI meeting where the agreement is discussed.

 

I want to be at the BRI meeting with popcorn in hand...

If the M&B show is bringing in the cash my guess is that the meeting would go well.

I would suspect that Brian and al have done okay from the M&B show.
 

On the other hand if the WilsonJardineMarks show is out grossing the M&B show (quite possible) and the former aren't paying royalyties and Mikes's not pulling the bucks he's used to .... then .... hhhmmmmmmmmmm .... who would be the agrieved?? Such a meeting wouldn't be about who is happy, it would be about who is pissed off.

This is getting silly.
There's no "WilsonJardineMarks show" -- there's a single show been announced at which Al and David will be joining Brian's band. Even if the three of them tour more widely (as I hope, as I'd like to see Al perform again, and he's not likely to do a solo UK tour), it would be as "Brian Wilson", playing the same kind of venues, to the same kind of crowd as Brian's solo tours have in the past. Brian's solo tours haven't harmed Mike's tour in the slightest before, so I don't see why this would suddenly be any threat to him now.
There is a huge, huge, Tower Of Babel-sized edifice of speculation here being built on a tiny crumb of fact.

[Pretty Funky]

All this talk about meetings, strategy, power games, future of the Beach Boys etc.

Maybe its just me, but since Brians solo career restarted in 99 I have yet to be convinced that his BB life is anything else but a hobby to him. Granted when he signs up for a tour/ album he gives it everything but if it stopped tomorrow he would care not one dot.

He would be more than happy to drop most BB songs from his setlist at his solo shows IMO.

Beg to differ on that - he most certainly did not "give it everything" on GIOMH, and I've experienced some solo shows that could be charitably described as "perfunctory".

My turn for bad phrasing. I mean in his Brian Wilson world. Good product and average product yes. Good gigs and bad gigs yes, but he fronts.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Well said that man !

[Pretty Funky]

Gee I'd love to know when the current BB touring licence agreement expires ... and then be a fly on the wall at the BRI meeting where the agreement is discussed.

 

I want to be at the BRI meeting with popcorn in hand...

If the M&B show is bringing in the cash my guess is that the meeting would go well.

I would suspect that Brian and al have done okay from the M&B show.
 

On the other hand if the WilsonJardineMarks show is out grossing the M&B show (quite possible) and the former aren't paying royalyties and Mikes's not pulling the bucks he's used to .... then .... hhhmmmmmmmmmm .... who would be the agrieved?? Such a meeting wouldn't be about who is happy, it would be about who is pissed off.

This is getting silly.
There's no "WilsonJardineMarks show" -- there's a single show been announced at which Al and David will be joining Brian's band. Even if the three of them tour more widely (as I hope, as I'd like to see Al perform again, and he's not likely to do a solo UK tour), it would be as "Brian Wilson", playing the same kind of venues, to the same kind of crowd as Brian's solo tours have in the past. Brian's solo tours haven't harmed Mike's tour in the slightest before, so I don't see why this would suddenly be any threat to him now.
There is a huge, huge, Tower Of Babel-sized edifice of speculation here being built on a tiny crumb of fact.

Its what we do!

[AndrewHickey]

If the members want to keep touring together as the full BBs, what's wrong with that? M&B's time has passed as BBs group, its time for the reunited group to show what they got.

But 'the members' *don't* want to keep touring together. *SOME* of the members do, but if they all wanted to continue working together, they would be.

And the 'reunited group' *did* 'show what they got' -- last year.

No matter how much some fans might want it (and frankly, if Al *does* join Brian's band full time -- which I doubt, but going with it for a second -- that would be immensely preferable to me than a continued reunion tour, as we'd then have two excellent bands, not one, touring, competing with each other, so we'd have both bands upping their game and get to see twice as many shows), if they don't *all* want to be on the same stage, they don't owe it to anyone to do so.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Exactly - Alan & Brian & David all said they wanted to carry on touring, but what did the two voting members of BRI actually do about it ? Nothing, beyond making statements to the media.

[Kurosawa]

As long as Brian continues to record and tour I really don't care what the others do. He's the only one doing new recordings of any significance unless the whole band does more.  

[Wirestone]

Exactly - Alan & Brian & David all said they wanted to carry on touring, but what did the two voting members of BRI actually do about it ? Nothing, beyond making statements to the media.

Would we actually know what's going on behind the scenes in this case, though?

[Moon Dawg]

On the other hand if the WilsonJardineMarks show is out grossing the M&B show (quite possible)...

Highly unlikely, IMO. Mike & Bruce have regularly outgrossed Brian since the latter began touring. For one of the 2006 Pet Sounds shows with Alan, I recall there being 600 people in a 3000 seat venue. The Canadian Gershwin tour was a financial disaster of the first order.

 Only because Mike & Bruce tour as "The Beach Boys." If Mike toured under his own name, he would be easily beaten by Brian touring under his. I guess it is fruitless to argue with a LOOKING BACK WITH LOVE apologist though. 

[AndrewHickey]

On the other hand if the WilsonJardineMarks show is out grossing the M&B show (quite possible)...

Highly unlikely, IMO. Mike & Bruce have regularly outgrossed Brian since the latter began touring. For one of the 2006 Pet Sounds shows with Alan, I recall there being 600 people in a 3000 seat venue. The Canadian Gershwin tour was a financial disaster of the first order.

 Only because Mike & Bruce tour as "The Beach Boys." If Mike toured under his own name, he would be easily beaten by Brian touring under his. I guess it is fruitless to argue with a LOOKING BACK WITH LOVE apologist though. 

I don't think anyone has argued otherwise -- certainly AGD hasn't. But his post was in response to someone claiming that Brian, Al and David without the name would make more money than Mike and Bruce with it -- which is a very different proposition to the claim that you're making.

[KittyKat]

I don't understand why Brian Wilson has toured  so much the past decade plus. Has he always lost money on it? Considering the huge band he has, and his demand for a luxury bus from city to city, and the fact a fair number of gigs have had either mediocre or terrible attendance, what has that cost him? I don't get the motivation. Maybe pride, maybe Melinda Wilson's pride? I have to think the reunion tour made more money for Brian than his own tours have. Heck, his BRI share from Mike's tours have to had made more money for him than some of his solo tours. 

[Jim V.]

I don't understand why Brian Wilson has toured  so much the past decade plus. Has he always lost money on it? Considering the huge band he has, and his demand for a luxury bus from city to city, and the fact a fair number of gigs have had either mediocre or terrible attendance, what has that cost him? I don't get the motivation. Maybe pride, maybe Melinda Wilson's pride? I have to think the reunion tour made more money for Brian than his own tours have. Heck, his BRI share from Mike's tours have to had made more money for him than some of his solo tours. 

I don't claim to have any inside knowledge, but my guess is it's good for Brian to get out there and tour, instead of sitting at home with the chance to sit around and think and get depressed.

[the professor]

How many BB shows are scheduled for 2013, in comparison to pre-reunion tour levels of performance?  My sense is that no one is "touring" (is there a full BB schedule or just a few shows here and there?). For BW, AJ, and DM it's just one night? I sense that wheels are turning behind the scenes re: the new album, which they will have to promote together, and some major, select venues for the whole band. Forget warfare and strategy; I rather think that all the boys want to rock in any way they can while that all gets sorted out. Perhaps this is why (even in Mike's letter) that nothing has been ruled out.  The one Brian show, somewhere in Ohio (no offence Buckeyes), actually encourages me about a full reunion and new album.

[AndrewHickey]

How many BB shows are scheduled for 2013, in comparison to pre-reunion tour levels of performance?  My sense is that no one is "touring" (is there a full BB schedule or just a few shows here and there?). For BW, AJ, and DM it's just one night? I sense that wheels are turning behind the scenes re: the new album, which they will have to promote together, and some major, select venues for the whole band. Forget warfare and strategy; I rather think that all the boys want to rock in any way they can while that all gets sorted out. Perhaps this is why (even in Mike's letter) that nothing has been ruled out.  The one Brian show, somewhere in Ohio (no offence Buckeyes), actually encourages me about a full reunion and new album.

Mike & Bruce have a dozen dates already announced, between February and May. Between that and AGD's posts, I'd be prepared to bet a substantial amount of money that there won't be a single show featuring all five Beach Boys this year.

[KittyKat]

How many BB shows are scheduled for 2013, in comparison to pre-reunion tour levels of performance?  My sense is that no one is "touring" (is there a full BB schedule or just a few shows here and there?). For BW, AJ, and DM it's just one night? I sense that wheels are turning behind the scenes re: the new album, which they will have to promote together, and some major, select venues for the whole band. Forget warfare and strategy; I rather think that all the boys want to rock in any way they can while that all gets sorted out. Perhaps this is why (even in Mike's letter) that nothing has been ruled out.  The one Brian show, somewhere in Ohio (no offence Buckeyes), actually encourages me about a full reunion and new album.

Mike & Bruce have a dozen dates already announced, between February and May. Between that and AGD's posts, I'd be prepared to bet a substantial amount of money that there won't be a single show featuring all five Beach Boys this year.

I'd have to agree with that. Mike & Bruce play a lot of dates on the summer outdoor venue circuit.  Most of those types of venues don't finish booking and announcing gigs until as late as May. I'm going to guess they line up many more dates that will take them from June until October, when the weather gets too cold.  I don't see any way that there would be rehearsal and playing time for any reunion type of line-up.  If it happens, it will be another year (and would fit with Mike's belief that they needed to give the reunion a rest to build up demand, if they do decide to try it again).

[Mikie]

On the other hand if the WilsonJardineMarks show is out grossing the M&B show (quite possible)...

Highly unlikely, IMO. Mike & Bruce have regularly outgrossed Brian since the latter began touring. For one of the 2006 Pet Sounds shows with Alan, I recall there being 600 people in a 3000 seat venue. The Canadian Gershwin tour was a financial disaster of the first order.

Wouldn't be surprised if the Lucky Old Sun tour didn't make any money either. I think there was about 500-600 people at the venue I saw that show too.

[Pretty Funky]

My guess is Brian makes enough in royalties to make our eyes water. Didn't Bruce say about 10 years ago he still made $200k a year for 'I Write The Songs'? Multiply that by the number of BW hits and we are talking some nice coin.

As I said earlier, I think it is a hobby to Brian nowdays so the money (or loss) could be covered.


Oh and another thing. The money Mike has to pay each year for the touring rights probably more than covers Brians tours. Now how is that for irony?

[jimmy1949]

Would that venue have been in Oakland Mike?

[Mikie]

Si, Senor.  Paramount Theatre. September of '08. Total capacity around 3,000 seats.  About 1/2 full in my estimation.  Were you there too, Jimmy?

[Andrew G. Doe]

On the other hand if the WilsonJardineMarks show is out grossing the M&B show (quite possible)...

Highly unlikely, IMO. Mike & Bruce have regularly outgrossed Brian since the latter began touring. For one of the 2006 Pet Sounds shows with Alan, I recall there being 600 people in a 3000 seat venue. The Canadian Gershwin tour was a financial disaster of the first order.

 Only because Mike & Bruce tour as "The Beach Boys." If Mike toured under his own name, he would be easily beaten by Brian touring under his. I guess it is fruitless to argue with a LOOKING BACK WITH LOVE apologist though. 

Not at all, because it's a documented fact: Mike & Bruce, post Carl's passing, tried touring as "America's Band" and drew very poorly (four shows were cancelled). That's why BRI were asked to issue a license for touring as "The Beach Boys". You really didn't know that ?