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Author Topic: Technical question about Brian's mature voice  (Read 2538 times)
Ron
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« on: April 21, 2006, 09:46:30 PM »

Alright, kind of a two part question, and a little rambling, so please forgive my ignorance in advance.

First: When I tune my guitar, I can tell if it's in tune because a properly tuned string has certain overtones or almost like a ringing bell like sound (to me, at least) when it's dead on pitch (or close).  Is it possible for human voices to produce this same overtone or 'ring' when they're dead on, as well? 

Second: If it is possible to hear a perfectly tuned vocal 'note' or whatever by the vibes or the overtones, can anybody else hear that in Brian Wilson's mature (i.e., last 10 years) voice?  I THINK I can, but I'm not positive if it's just in my head.

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I've been playing guitar for a long time, but I rarely practice.  It took me years, but eventually I just got so used to playing certain notes or chords, that I could tell if the guitar was in tune just by strumming a chord (I'm sure that's normal and every guitarist can hear that).  After a while, and just recently (past 6 months or so), I've started picking up a certain 'ring' I can hear if something's dead on tune. 

So anyways, with most singers, they sound in tune (and I'm getting pretty good at hearing slightly off notes, etc. on just about any song on the radio, or watching live performances, etc.)... with most singers, they sound in tune, or close enough.  With a FEW singers, though, I hear that ring as if they're dead on tune, not just 'in tune' but DEAD ON the note, maybe they're in perfect pitch? 

Two singers I can give as an example, one is a modern country singer named Sara Evans.  I'm not positive, and it MAY just be the timbre of her voice... but it seems to me that nearly everything she sings is dead on tune and has a certain ring to it like a bell.  Brian Wilson is the other... even when he flubs a note, or doesn't breathe properly or cuts it short... 9 times out of 10, there's a ring to his voice. 

A couple songs that are good examples: Listen to "Live @ the Roxy" and listen to "Back Home".  Brian goes up into Falsetto (I'm nearly positive that's him, maybe doubled by Jeff) in the chorus... and it's breathy and nowhere near as strong as he once was... but ultimately, it 'rings' to me, and sounds dead on pitch even though it's not a perfect sounding tone (sounds slightly strained, etc.). 

Another great example is "What I Really Want For Christmas".  The entire lead vocal just rings to me, like he's slightly sharper than the rest of the band... but not 'sharp'.  It sounds like most singers are singing just a bit below the perfect, absolute note and some (Brian, Sara Evans) sing right on it, sharp compared to other vocalists or instruments but it doesn't sound 'sharp' as in over the note.

"Don't Worry Baby" live @ the Roxy... of course the key is much lower than the original... and I can comfortably sing the song... but when I sing along with it, Brian is slightly sharper than my voice, but not out of tune sharp.  As if I'm singing close to the pitch, but Brian is nailing the pitch better than most of your average singers do, even if he drops notes or cuts things short, etc... he's still usually dead on.  I can't tell if that's just the natural timbre of his voice is to sound a little 'sharper'... or if he truly is singing in perfect pitch in his late 50's (or whatever he was on that recording). 

Am I just full of it, or is my ear getting more trained to recognize this kind of thing?  It's incredibly fascinating to me, I'd like to think it's not just all in my head.   
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Wyndham
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« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2006, 02:27:46 AM »

I think in some ways you are right, but also production plays a big factor in terms of the more recent stuff. I've noticed that recently, in particular on 'WIRWFC' there seems to be a lot of autotuning done with Brian's voice. That is, running it through pro-tools or similar to achieve that perfect pitch. If you've heard the new duet with Carnie it's EXTREMELY prevalent there.

On Back Home on the Roxy album, I actually think that Brian is a little flat when he goes up for the chorus.

I think that more than his pitching being more accurate, it's simply his tone that is clearer/coarser than that of his band members. I've always thought that the BW band produce a very thick sound when harmonizing, in particular Foskett on the falsetto, which Brian's voice cuts through.
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« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2006, 02:32:23 AM »

At the 10/23/04 show in Houston, Brian had a bad cold. There was one part in God Only knows where his voice began cracking, and then he started coughing. In the middle of the line "so what good would living do me" he coughed right at the "what part" (say, the "wha-") then cleared his throat, and returned on "...living do me"...RIGHT ON PERFECT PITCH, all on one breath. THAT takes talent.
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Ron
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« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2006, 05:15:22 AM »

I guess a lot of it could be autotune... but it seems to be a quality of his voice as well, even on things like "Love And Mercy" on the original album he sounds dead on, all the backing vocals, etc. are perfectly in tune.  So I guess we could say that he used to be able to sing dead in pitch without it and now uses it more... but even the little pop princesses that are all over the radio now (and I'm sure have autotune drenched all over their voices) don't sound as clearly in pitch as his stuff does to me.  It may just be his timbre that sounds that way to me, though. 
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Wirestone
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« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2006, 02:43:08 PM »

I think there are a couple of issues here.

There is Brian's tone -- the way his voice actually sounds -- and his pitch -- how close he comes to a certain note value. His tone has certainly taken on a unique character from the 80s onward. It has remained fairly consistent over that time -- roughening or smoothing depending on the year, amount of smoking, and number of overdubs.

Yes, Brian sounds quite different on, say, the Xmas record and BW 88 or the OCA material. But that has more to do with the way he produces the voice. He did a lot of shouting in the 80s and early 90s. He's reigned that in. The general tone, however, has been reasonably consistent.

Now, as for pitch, it's much harder to figure out what's going on. Brian's pitch has been much more uncertain in live appearances than one might expect, but he's also able to do amazing things. My suggestion is that as he's gotten older and deafer it's become more difficult to sustain exact pitch in a live environment. His inherent musicality, though, prevents him from going off the cliff (Ringo's party notwithstanding). In the studio, with the possibility of endless retakes and computer pitch correction (which existed at the time of BW88 too, let's not forget), he can sound as in or out of tune as he desires.
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matt-zeus
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« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2006, 02:55:35 PM »

In the early 60s Brians singing was very much that of a perfectionist, it is clear in tune perfectly and the other BBs are driven to that level of perfection by Brian (and he was probably driven by his Dad). By the late 60s his voice becomes more 'feel' orientated, more with his Mickey Mouse squawk than his golden early 60s voice.
What is astounding is how much all that technique went out of the window in the late 70s (I know he wasn't well) but this guy had a perfect voice and he just shouts and growls (a bit like Elton john today) through the Beach Boys love you - that said I love this period for Brians voice he sounds more like a 'New York' type of singer if that makes any sense to anyone - probably due to his Frank Sinatra obsession. Due to his personal circumstances he sounds and sings like he doesn't give a sh*t (which he probably didn't.
I'm not really sure where I'm going with this....but this guy was trained from an early age to sing perfectly so its no wonder that recently he still does come up with the goods, he has the technique, he still has that unique timbre, and though his voice sometimes sounds unpleasant, when he wants to he can probably outsing anybody.
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Ron
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« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2006, 03:42:21 PM »

... but what I'm getting at is this.  If we Autotuned Mike Love's voice, would it ever sound as 'in pitch' as Brian's?  When I hear Brian's it's one of the few voices I've heard that rings like it's DEAD IN PITCH.  I've never heard Mike Love even on the old stuff have that ring to his voice, although he always sounded pretty much in pitch.  Am I just hearing a timbre quality of Brian's voice making that ring, or is he more in tune than say Mike would be so I hear a ring like you hear a ring from a tuning fork or from a perfectly tuned guitar string?  It's so hard to explain.

If a guitar is just slightly, slighty off, it still sounds good and in key.  However, if it's dead in key it rings a little bit.  You hear overtones.

I hear that same ring in Brian's voice.  Is that because Autotune made it that way, or is that because Brian's more dead on perfect pitch than most singers (who are also autotuned, but don't ring)?
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matt-zeus
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« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2006, 03:57:29 PM »

Mike Love would sing better if he didn't hold his nose whilst he did it
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« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2006, 05:43:41 PM »

I asked a question, and now I think I found something that sort of answers it.  Apparently, bass and baritone voices don't "ring" in the way that higher voices do.  So, that might explain Mike Love not "ringing," besides the fact that he's nasal and never was a super singer to begin with.  A formal explanation of "vocal ring":

http://ccrma.stanford.edu/CCRMA/Courses/150/singing.html

I'm not sure if Brian "rings" or not, I don't have an ear that says it does, either now or in the past.  But I think he has had some voice lessons the past few years, and maybe his teacher teaches him these things.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2006, 06:01:26 PM by forget marie » Logged
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