Dave's vocals on the early albums

[mabewa]

I know what Dave's singing sounds like nowadays, but I'm a little curious about his vocal role on the early albums.  I can't really pick his voice out in the mix, except for the obvious example of "Summertime Blues."  Can anyone comment on the vocal role he played (range, etc.) and point me towards some songs where you can hear him in the vocal mix?

[GuyO]

Is Dave on Summertime Blues? I think it's Carl and Mike.

In Jon Stebbins excellent 'The Lost Beach Boy' County Fair, Heads You Win, Chug A Lug and 409 are named as songs on which Dave most likely doubles Dennis's parts.

[mabewa]

I've heard it's Carl and Dave, though I suppose that could be wrong.  There does seem to be a different vocal presence there, but I'll have to go back and listen to it again. 

Doubling Dennis' parts makes sense, as Dennis didn't seem to sing harmonies live, so I suppose it was just Dave on those parts when they played live. 

[Jon Stebbins]

Is Dave on Summertime Blues? I think it's Carl and Mike.

In Jon Stebbins excellent 'The Lost Beach Boy' County Fair, Heads You Win, Chug A Lug and 409 are named as songs on which Dave most likely doubles Dennis's parts.

Thanks. BTW Carl and Dave harmonize on the verses of Summertime Blues, Mike obviously is the low solo voice ("like to help you son but you're too young to vote" etc...)

In general Dave didn't sing much in the studio back then... but he sang harmony and had a couple of leads during the live shows, sounds familiar eh?.

[adamghost]

I think way back when we were trying to figure out which songs Dave did sing on, and we figured out that "Surfin' USA," based on the slightly odd vocal blend and seeming doubling of Dennis' part, was a likely candidate.

[Emdeeh]

Dave says it's him singing with Carl on "Summertime Blues," and that's good enough documentation (primary source!) to me.

[37!ws]

(Do I dare point out...again...how on Unsurpassed Masters Vol. 1 that the engineer announces the take of "Summertime Blues" with the harmonized lead vocals as "with Carl and Ni[c]k")

[GuyO]

Yep I stand corrected. On the first overdub takes (takes 5 and 6) Carl sings alone, on the following take we hear two voices. Before the take starts someone in the booth (I think) mentions Dave, followed by someone in the control room saying  <overdub take 6 (sic), with Nick>.

So yeah... Carl and Dave on verses, plus Mike.

[Paulos]

Listen to Unsurpassed Masters Vol. 1, track 4 - it's quite clearly Dave singing alone before Carl's voice is overdubbed later.

[GuyO]

Could be! Dare I ask why you are certain it's Dave who sings alone first?

[startBBtoday]

Granted I don't have the book on me right this second, but I seem to recall during the part in Jon Stebbins' book about which songs Dave sings on, Dave himself seemed a little less than definitive that he sang on Summertime Blues in studio.

Am I incorrect?

[Paulos]

Could be! Dare I ask why you are certain it's Dave who sings alone first?

Because it sounds like Dave to me.....however, when the other harmonized vocal comes in that could very well be Dave and that it is in fact Carl singing first after listening to it again, in conclusion: I don't know! I wasn't trying to call you out or anything, I didn't see your post before making my 'Dave sings first' claim.

[JanBerryFarm]

For some die-hards, decades of attributing it to Carl is hard to repurpose.

It's Dave, a much YOUNGER Dave.

....then, after multiple takes alone..... with Nik.

Dave and Nik.

Why would the engineer say "with Nik" if it was Carl?   He'd say "with Carl" wouldn't he ?

This was already hashed out under a 'Surfin' Safari' Lp thread. I'm sure RangeRover remembers.

[Paulos]

For some die-hards, decades of attributing it to Carl is hard to repurpose.

It's Dave, a much YOUNGER Dave.

....then, after multiple takes alone..... with Nik.

Dave and Nik.

Why would the engineer say "with Nik" if it was Carl?   He's say "with Carl" wouldn't he ?

This was already hashed out under a 'Surfin' Safari' Lp thread. I'm sure RangeRover remembers.

So I just listened to Dave & The Marksmen's 'Kustom Kar Show' on which Dave sings lead for a comparison and I am now convinced it is in fact Dave singing first on Summertime Blues.

[JanBerryFarm]

Well, I'm glad we have that ironed out.

I'm been saying it's Dave for quite a while now, with nary a peep.

 

[Jon Stebbins]

Granted I don't have the book on me right this second, but I seem to recall during the part in Jon Stebbins' book about which songs Dave sings on, Dave himself seemed a little less than definitive that he sang on Summertime Blues in studio.

Am I incorrect?

Yes you are incorrect. In the book Dave says, "I do remember standing around the microphone with Carl singing that song. Brian had wanted each of us to sing at least one song on the album."

[the professor]

Of course that's Dave singing Summertime Blues. 

He had mentioned in an interview that the hoped that would be in the set now, but I guess the other vocals, which he is killing wonderfully, must have been the plan instead.  I always seem to burden Jon with this, and I know I am a one-note-pony, but all I care about (in addition to anticipation of a new album and hope for health and joy for all the BB) is that Dave is happy (so many of my posts reflect this, so I won't repeat my detailed comments here).  I hope he is aware of the love we have for him and that such feats as his leading the BB orchestra in Pet Sounds (Great Caesar's ghost!!) have provided artistic and personal satisfaction.  I would imagine that all the BB and the fans and the record company now understand his importance; I cannot imagine the shows without him.  I trust that this will translate into a greater role in the next album. Please, no more Skunk. . . .

I know that history is not ready to explain this, but I do hope we hear that Dave is really singing on the new album, and I look forward to his detailed account of his guitar parts on TWGMTR, each song of which I continue to study to determine his style, sound and thus contribution (I am not so good at that, I fear, with so many guitarists listed).

best to all,

[Rocker]

Why would the engineer say "with Nik" if it was Carl?   He'd say "with Carl" wouldn't he ?

It's a joke. "six" and "Nick" kinda rhymes. That's it. Not unlike Brian saying "right on Leon" during the BWPS sessions (it's somewhere on the DVD iirc) while no Leon was there.

[runnersdialzero]

Also, who would Nik () or Nick even be?

[JanBerryFarm]

A joke? That's a stretch. Why would the engineer announce the next take "with six" ? That makes no sense. ...

and why then, with all the prior takes just Dave alone,  the engineer announces "....with Nik " there is suddenly additional voice singing with Dave ?

Who is Nik?  

Don't you suppose the only nik at those sessions was Nik Venet?

He plays guitar with them, so why not singing too?

[startBBtoday]

Granted I don't have the book on me right this second, but I seem to recall during the part in Jon Stebbins' book about which songs Dave sings on, Dave himself seemed a little less than definitive that he sang on Summertime Blues in studio.

Am I incorrect?

Yes you are incorrect. In the book Dave says, "I do remember standing around the microphone with Carl singing that song. Brian had wanted each of us to sing at least one song on the album."

Thanks for the reply Jon. Appreciate it.

Really hoping for a CD quality version of Dave singing Getcha Back from this tour on the rumored live CD or DVD.

[mabewa]

Thanks for all the replies and the great debate, guys.  I'm kind of a geek about who did what, and this kind of thread is exactly why I joined the board.  Sounds like it was indeed Dave on Summertime Blues, plus he doubled Dennis's parts on a few other songs.  He didn't sing much in the studio, but did harmonies live, and also got the odd lead (again, kind of like now!).  I'm assuming that he mostly did Dennis's parts live, since Dennis himself doesn't seem to have sung harmonies live much. 

[JanBerryFarm]

Right... and it also busts all those Beach Boy LIARS who, for decades, insisted that Brian wouldn't let Dave sing at all, live or on record.

The same liars who also said that the Beach Boys didn't really play their own instruments and had studio cats doing it all.

Of course they weren't the only liars.

Brian Wilson explaining how he destroyed the smIle masters. Yeah right.

OR the big lie about where the instrument money came from in Hawthorne when Dennis's parents vacationed in Mexico.

[mabewa]

Are they really lies though, or just half-truths?  I mean, it does seem clear that Dave didn't sing as much on record as the other guys, and that was probably at least partially at Brian's behest.  The Beach Boys did play their own instruments on the early albums, but the studios guys did more and more as time went on--I've never heard the claim that they didn't play at all on their records, just that they didn't do it as much as many other bands.  And Brian saying that he destroyed the masters of Smile--Brian has said some pretty weird stuff over the years--my impression is that he hasn't been lying as much as being affected by mental illness.  Perhaps he actually thought he had destroyed the Smile master tapes at one time. 

[JanBerryFarm]

Are they really lies though, or just half-truths?  I mean, it does seem clear that Dave didn't sing as much on record as the other guys, and that was probably at least partially at Brian's behest.  The Beach Boys did play their own instruments on the early albums, but the studios guys did more and more as time went on--I've never heard the claim that they didn't play at all on their records, just that they didn't do it as much as many other bands.  And Brian saying that he destroyed the masters of Smile--Brian has said some pretty weird stuff over the years--my impression is that he hasn't been lying as much as being affected by mental illness.  Perhaps he actually thought he had destroyed the Smile master tapes at one time.  

Sounds reasonable...

IF you want to redefine a lie as just 'pretty weird stuff'.

One "pretty weird" thing that comes to my mind is the lie that Brian was mentally ill.

Brian is a super intelligent trickster....very good at putting up walls and barriers when he deems them needed. Now he's old, he no longer needs to pretend to be 'crazy'... he just 'gets tired'. The perfect dodge, because it's true.

Tired of acting crazy.