Beach Boys "Fun Fun Fun" at Dodger Stadium

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

You sit in a special chair and a massage therapist works you over. No laying down. And it's because Al said it was OK. I did Alan a huge favor back in the mid-80's here in KC.

Oh no! What drug did you score him some of?

[Dave in KC]

Not hardly.
It had to do with getting several members of his extended family in the show. I believe he said they were from Kansas. Anyway it all worked out and I got a bonus from my employer.

[stack-o-tracks]

A bonus of drugs?

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

One of my best friend's dads (who knew Al in high school) ran into Al at some hamburger stand in Vegas in the mid 70's and Al asked him for a ride to the Beach Boys show that night!!!!!

AGD should know what year this was and what hamburger stand and what Al ordered.

[Ron]

Was it drugs?

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

You mean, was the hamburger stand a front for some drug operation and Al was perhaps either a customer or mule?

[the professor]

If I were to make a final statement on the issue of Jeff, and if I thought anyone with authority in arranging, mixing and producing the band's sound live, or recorded for that matter, I would speak as follows.

I am deeply concerned that Jeff, as displayed in both the Grammys and, much more markedly, at Dodger stadium, is singing and playing as if he were a lead singer or a solo act, with the dear, still mighty BB reduced to merely a faint echo in the background.

Many fans are disconcerted if not deeply crestfallen at this, and we fear that in his desire to contribute to the reunion, Jeff had misunderstood his artistic and historical role.

Please let us hear the BB as they are today and make this historical reunion as authentic and as full of true artistry as possible.

Proof of the legitimacy of my claim and concern is amply provided by listening to the TV feeds of the aforementioned performances.  Who could hear them and not be deeply troubled by Jeff's dominance and his poignantly tragic drowning out of the BB?.

[Ebb and Flow]

I just hope that whoever has been producing these performances realizes before the actual concerts start that people are showing up to hear Brian, Mike, Al, Bruce and David sing and not some sort of bizarre ventriloquist act.  I don't mind Foskett as part of the blend and to sing underneath Brian...but he should not be getting leads and his mic should be turned way down.

[Runaways]

it's so bizarre that Foskett is so dominant on these mixes. sigh.

[I. Spaceman]

Dennis Wilson's death was poignantly tragic.
Since then, the Beach Boys/Brian Wilson trip has been more of a, in John Lennon's words, "half shut your eyes and pretend" deal. With some moments of genuine artistic success scattered among the ensuing years.
Expecting anything more than a whitewash at this point is expecting more than the group could, or would, ever deliver. And if they did hit us with a cold dose of reality, the majority of their audience would walk out. After the early years, whenever the band has made a brave artistic move, they have been rewarded with lesser attention and sales (save Good Vibrations).
Bob Dylan's audience wants reality, and they get it. The Beach Boys' audience, in the main, wants the dream and they'll get it. And as dreams go, I'm sure it will be worth the ticket prices for those who like that sort of thing. You know, such as those who pay large sums to see Paul McCartney play old, moldy Beatles flipsides while his band members sing in fake Liverpudlian accents. Me, I'd rather hear No More Lonely Nights.

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

At least Paul SINGS those damn songs and doesn't seem to lose sleep over whether or not he flubs a note or his aging voice cracks. He's freaking Paul McCartney for Chris's sake and people pay to see and hear him, and he give them what they paid for!

I keep going back to them just losing the falsetto if it means audiences have to put up with a bad copy! (can't call Jeff a carbon copy because he doesn't sound like Brian or a Beach Boy at all)! I could get up there and sound more like a Beach Boy than Jeff!

This might be a bad comparison but Brian Johnson of AC/DC has basically NEVER hit some of those high notes in their canon live. He's pretty much always adjusted the parts since day one and that hasn't stopped AC/DC from selling out every place they play for the last 30+ years. I think Beach Boys fans would deal with a falsetto-less (or falsetto compromised) Surfer Girl or whatever the hell else if they get to see and hear their beloved Beach Boys singing. I really hope someone from their camp is paying attention here...

Then again: perhaps Jeff is simply trying to keep the ship from sinking at appearances like Dodger Stadium. We can't blame him if they rehearse with everyone belting out and then they get up there and Brian and the other guys, for whatever reason, don't bring it. We can't blame him to stepping it up.

[Awesoman]

If I were to make a final statement on the issue of Jeff, and if I thought anyone with authority in arranging, mixing and producing the band's sound live, or recorded for that matter, I would speak as follows.

I am deeply concerned that Jeff, as displayed in both the Grammys and, much more markedly, at Dodger stadium, is singing and playing as if he were a lead singer or a solo act, with the dear, still mighty BB reduced to merely a faint echo in the background.

Many fans are disconcerted if not deeply crestfallen at this, and we fear that in his desire to contribute to the reunion, Jeff had misunderstood his artistic and historical role.

Please let us hear the BB as they are today and make this historical reunion as authentic and as full of true artistry as possible.

Proof of the legitimacy of my claim and concern is amply provided by listening to the TV feeds of the aforementioned performances.  Who could hear them and not be deeply troubled by Jeff's dominance and his poignantly tragic drowning out of the BB?.

Jesus, people.  If you honestly are crazy enough to believe that Foskett is trying to maliciously "take over" the Beach Boys, you really should consider going outside and allowing some of that oxygen to return to your brain.  It's really not that hard to understand: Foskett is the only one in this group that can pull off the high parts well.  And the high parts are the lead in the harmonies.  Sure, his vocals seemed to be dominating the live mixes, but would you rather be hearing a half-conscious Brian Wilson muttering some half-hearted vocals instead?  If I were trying to pull off a successful reunion tour and album, I sure as hell wouldn't. 

Foskett and the rest of BW's band are really the backbone of this operation: they're the ones that are doing the heavy lifting with the harmonies.  The current Beach Boys line-up (Brian, Mike, Al, Bruce & Dave) simply can't do it themselves.  Be glad Foskett and crew are there.  They're the ones making these harmonies sound good. 

[ivy]

Many fans are disconcerted if not deeply crestfallen at this, and we fear that in his desire to contribute to the reunion, Jeff had misunderstood his artistic and historical role.

Tell us more about how all of these fans feel. Surely we have a lot to learn.

[Jaspy]

There is much more on-record to smh at for Mike than for Foskett and Melinda. Everything on them is just he said/she said.

What do you mean with on-record, written in books by people who were not there back in the day and just invent and copy stuff that was written in other books?

It's like the thing that Mike once asked Van Dyke Parks what "Over and over..." means which developed to the statement that he didn't support Brian during the SMiLE sessions. The truth is, Mike told what he honestly thought but still sang and supported. Same for Pet Sounds.
Allegedly, some Beach Boys wouldn't show up or leave SMiLE vocal sessions. The truth: The only BB who cancelled SMiLE sessions was Brian. I think he even left VDP alone with a studio full of violin players. Although I'm not even sure if that's true, because it was written in the same book that mentions a fight between Brian & Mike over Redwood + "Time To Get Alone" which isn't true either.
Mr. Positivity - I think one of the things that made the BB work was that there were different personalities. The group needed a positive force, self-confident frontman like Mike as much as a crazy genius like Brian. Wouldn't have worked with five troubled souls like Dennis & Brian.

[endofposts]

If I were to make a final statement on the issue of Jeff, and if I thought anyone with authority in arranging, mixing and producing the band's sound live, or recorded for that matter, I would speak as follows.

I am deeply concerned that Jeff, as displayed in both the Grammys and, much more markedly, at Dodger stadium, is singing and playing as if he were a lead singer or a solo act, with the dear, still mighty BB reduced to merely a faint echo in the background.

Many fans are disconcerted if not deeply crestfallen at this, and we fear that in his desire to contribute to the reunion, Jeff had misunderstood his artistic and historical role.

Please let us hear the BB as they are today and make this historical reunion as authentic and as full of true artistry as possible.

Proof of the legitimacy of my claim and concern is amply provided by listening to the TV feeds of the aforementioned performances.  Who could hear them and not be deeply troubled by Jeff's dominance and his poignantly tragic drowning out of the BB?.

Jesus, people.  If you honestly are crazy enough to believe that Foskett is trying to maliciously "take over" the Beach Boys, you really should consider going outside and allowing some of that oxygen to return to your brain.  It's really not that hard to understand: Foskett is the only one in this group that can pull off the high parts well.  And the high parts are the lead in the harmonies.  Sure, his vocals seemed to be dominating the live mixes, but would you rather be hearing a half-conscious Brian Wilson muttering some half-hearted vocals instead?  If I were trying to pull off a successful reunion tour and album, I sure as hell wouldn't. 

Foskett and the rest of BW's band are really the backbone of this operation: they're the ones that are doing the heavy lifting with the harmonies.  The current Beach Boys line-up (Brian, Mike, Al, Bruce & Dave) simply can't do it themselves.  Be glad Foskett and crew are there.  They're the ones making these harmonies sound good. 

Ugh.  I don't agree.  Brian's band really is not that good in the vocal department, Jeff Foskett in particular.  He sounded really bad at that Dodger Stadium performance, to the point they really should not have done "Surfer Girl" if they were forced to give him the lead.  They could have done "California Girls" instead, where he'd just do a backing part instead of a lead. I also think that's an insulting thing to say about Brian.  He can't really do falsetto too much anymore, but don't say he's half-conscious when he clearly is doing the best he can and does most of the leads at his solo shows, even now.  Also note that Brian sounded fine on the Grammy performance of "Good Vibrations" when you hear the YouTube audience recordings, where he was not mixed down by the house sound man.  It was the TV broadcast sound man who turned Jeff way, way up.  Brian sings better than Jeff at this point, on songs where falsetto is not dominant.  The band also sounded pretty good on the National Anthem, where Jeff was not turned way up and his voice was more blended in.  He's okay as a back-up singer, but shouldn't take leads.  They really need to find another lead falsetto singer for the tour if none of the old guys are up to it, because Jeff sure isn't.

[stack-o-tracks]

Maybe they were all standing at the wrong microphones and Jeff ended up at the one with the volume turned up the loudest?

Or it's just a conspiracy and this whole tour is just a Jeff Foskett solo tour utilizing teh Beach Bros as the backing band.

[Exapno Mapcase]

"Bob Dylan's audience wants reality, and they get it."

I've been to great Dylan shows in the last few years where he's really up for it and actually sings; I've been to others where the band caries him and he displays no interest whatsoever, almost Brian-like.  The bulk of the audience don't seem to care,  It's Bob Dylan and he's singing THOSE songs that are part of our cultural heritage.  As for his recent recorded stuff... I can take or leave the faux-Crosby crooning; mostly I can leave the endless chugging bar room boogie stuff. Leave that to J. J. Cale (and I'll leave that too). As for all the fuus about him lifting other people's lyrics, other people's prose for his 'autobiography' and other people's artwork... Hey, he's post-modern.  Always has been. But reality? No.  It's Dylan's current reinvention  of himself.

[runnersdialzero]

Nevermind. All's I'm gonna say is that yes, Jeff's voice is completely overbearing and yes, he does sing every part as if he's the lead vocalist. Fans and non-fans alike are saying the same, and because of him shadowing Brian etc. they're saying Brian, Mike, David, Al, and Bruce can't perform anymore, and that's not true at all.

I really wish they would just change the keys of some of this stuff and have the original members loud and up front - no one expects them to sound as they did 40-50 years ago. To those saying this will change the feel of the original compositions, I say having someone whose voice is so overbearing, who is consistently mixed so high, and whose voice clashes so much with the other people singing does more of a disservice to the songs than merely changing the key. Jeff would be fine if he would just take it down a few levels and be mixed appropriately, but he chooses not to on the former and very likely played a hand in the decision for the latter. I hate to speak ill of someone I don't know, which is why I deleted my original post, but the guy is compromising something I love and I'm far from the only one who feels that way.

Brian, Mike, David, Al, and Bruce all still sound great, it's a slap in the face to everyone involved AND the fans to have things continue the way they are. The situation is just really sad and frustrating.

[Iron Horse-Apples]

I'm happy for people to like Jeff, and defend him. It's all part of the rich tapestry of BB fandom. However, the thought police on this board have now turned on those of us who, for whatever reason, don't care much for Jeff Foskett.

I took on board what a lot of people, particularly Ivy, had to say. It must be hard to defend, protect and coerce Brian Wilson into doing his job, and I witnessed that frustration. And I don't for one minute believe he is consciously trying to take over the band. This is a sound mixing issue, and I doubt the performers have much say in these decisions.

But many of us don't like the fact that we're not hearing the Beach Boys. Jeff has a place in the mix, but when all you can hear is Jeff, and people are saying "no, don't worry guys, i can just make out Al's voice", seriously, is that enough?

And if they really can't sing anymore, maybe they shouldn't be doing this reunion. Maybe it is just about topping up their retirement funds. However, Brian and Mike's reconcillition seems genuine, and for that I am very happy.

[hypehat]

I have faith that it will not be the case on the reunion shows, but yes, it's far from ideal. I think claiming that Jeff is taking over the group is absolutely fucking absurd, though.

It's funny, I never really had an opinion on the guy until everybody here kicked off. 

[Iron Horse-Apples]

Well, I think we're all united in wanting this reunion to go well. For some of us this means taking a critical viewpoint, others at times adopt a "empowers new clothes" stance, then we all swap round!

[SBonilla]

Well, I think we're all united in wanting this reunion to go well. For some of us this means taking a critical viewpoint, others at times adopt a "empowers new clothes" stance, then we all swap round!

Endowed emporers may feel empowered.

[Autotune]

I don't get the "lower the key of the songs and/or do without the falsetto" comments. Or maybe those that submit that idea don't get the BB's music.

The whole BB catalogue is harmony-dominated and driven. There's harmony stacks everywhere. There's a certain relation between the lead and its backgrounds. You don't change keys easily in that context. You kill the bass line, to begin with. Or, If you drop the falsetto leads down an octave, it'll sound like sh*t,  the former high lead clashing against the mid-range harmony parts.

In other words: don't you people realize how heavily your favorite music is built upon tight arrangements?  And that changing a crucial part of them would mess up the whole? They would have to rearrange their entire setlist to produce a sh*t-sounding result.

This ain't a Bob Dylan freakin' folk song. This is the Beach Boys, dammit.

[SBonilla]

I don't get the "lower the key of the songs and/or do without the falsetto" comments. Or maybe those that submit that idea don't get the BB's music.
...There's harmony stacks everywhere.

What's not to get about changing keys from F down to Eb, or some other transposition? If no one in the group can execute the falsetto parts, bring in ringers, which they do. You can have harmony stacks in any range. No one has suggested that they sing low end triads.

[AndrewHickey]

I don't get the "lower the key of the songs and/or do without the falsetto" comments. Or maybe those that submit that idea don't get the BB's music.
...There's harmony stacks everywhere.

What's not to get about changing keys from F down to Eb, or some other transposition? If no one in the group can execute the falsetto parts, bring in ringers, which they do. You can have harmony stacks in any range. No one has suggested that they sing low end triads.

Well, of course the people arguing for key changes are also arguing that they *shouldn't* have extra singers. But that aside, if you change the key down a tone, you're not only bringing the high end down, you're bringing the low end down too. Mike's voice is quite weak these days, and he may not be able to hit extremely low notes.

At some point, those arguing for the band to sing without assistance are going to have to face reality. The Beach Boys *were* one of the greatest -- if not *the* greatest -- vocal groups of all time. But that was before Brian lost his top end completely (and he can't keep pitch wonderfully even in the range he's still got), Carl died, and Bruce's voice roughened and became much quieter.

I'm absolutely certain that when we see an actual show, we'll have a better mix than we've seen so far. But I also know what that mix will be -- there'll be a prominent five-part harmony stack of Totten, Foskett, Cowsill, Al and Mike, and a lower-in-the-mix wash of everyone else. Obviously we'll be able to hear Brian, David and Bruce on their leads, but otherwise we won't be able to pick them out of the mix. They'll *be* there, but no more prominent than Scott Bennet or Probyn. At least, that's what they'll do if they have any sense at all, as that's the way they'll actually get a good sound out.

I'm going to go to the shows because I want to see Mike, Al, Brian, Bruce and David take their lead vocals, and hear them backed by extremely good musicians, and hear Mike and Al in the harmony stack. Anyone going because they expect to hear the BBs sing like they could in the 1960s will be horribly disappointed. They've used additonal singers, especially for the falsetto, for more than thirty years -- they're not going to stop now...