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Author Topic: Imagining Mike, Al and Bruce on BWPS  (Read 8491 times)
Ron
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« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2011, 07:45:19 PM »

You still don't get it.  

Why does Brian's band not do Wild Honey live?  Because they CANT.  There isn't 1 person in that entire group that can sing that lead.

Al Jardine can.  He's 70, and you can HEAR him singing that if you think about it.  Can you imagine anybody in Brian's band singing it? 

If anybody from Brian's band tries to sing Wild Honey, or anything with any balls in it, it'll sound like a reject American Idol audition.  

That doesn't mean they don't have good voices.  It just means they're bland.  They sing like boring WallPaper.  

If they do "California Girls", they have to get Brian to sing it, because nobody in the band is interesting enough that you'd even listen to them.  Do you honestly, and be honest about this, honestly think that song would have been as big as it was if anybody but Mike sang it?  He has more swagger in his C*CK than anybody in Brian's band has in their entire family.  

------------------------------

So , the argument to my argument is, "Well, Ronnie... these are people with beautiful voices.  They're not rockers, so that's why they can't sing Wild Honey".  

O.K., then when is one of them going to sing "I Can Hear Music" ?  

The reason they don't do "I Can Hear Music" is because nobody in the band can sing like that, and they know it.  Carl sang beautifully, but he had passion and energy in his voice that nobody in Brian's band has.  

Dada's post, as tongue in cheek as it is, is dead on.  The Beach Boys didn't sing great because they were heroin addicts, they sang great because they were excited and full of energy.  Brian's band sounds like the music they play in the food court at my local mall.  
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Wirestone
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« Reply #26 on: December 15, 2011, 08:34:23 PM »

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The reason they don't do "I Can Hear Music" is because nobody in the band can sing like that, and they know it.  Carl sang beautifully, but he had passion and energy in his voice that nobody in Brian's band has.

Nonsense. Darian did a killer "Darlin'" in '09. Easily the best live version I've heard since Carl was with us.
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Tristero
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« Reply #27 on: December 15, 2011, 08:57:09 PM »

Well, I don't think you're going to get much argument on this forum that the Beach Boys in their prime were incredible, but that's a pretty impossible standard for almost any band to measure up to.  Those days are long gone.  The band split apart for countless reasons and Brian apparently felt that it was best to go it alone.  I think that he was pretty lucky to find such a talented, enthusiastic backing band that obviously loves the music and gives it their all.  I don't imagine that we ever would have seen SMiLE performed live in its entirety with the Beach Boys and that was one of the most powerful concert experiences of my life.  No, they don't measure up to peak era Beach Boys in the vocal department, but can't you say the same thing about countless other classic bands that have grown older and experienced major line up changes?  I don't imagine that any of this will change your mind, but I think you're being unnecessarily harsh about it.
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Wirestone
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« Reply #28 on: December 15, 2011, 10:33:35 PM »

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Those days are long gone.  The band split apart for countless reasons and Brian apparently felt that it was best to go it alone.  I think that he was pretty lucky to find such a talented, enthusiastic backing band that obviously loves the music and gives it their all.

Quite right. I cannot imagine another group of musicians that would have allowed Brian to accomplish what he has, while being as caring and low-key as they have. We're aware of their idiosyncrasies now, given that we've spent so much time with them -- Foskett's flowery tone, Mertens' attempts to push a sax solo into every single song, the lack of a solid bass vocalist besides Brian -- but all of these things pale next to their sheer chops.
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TdHabib
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« Reply #29 on: December 15, 2011, 10:56:17 PM »


Al Jardine can.  He's 70, and you can HEAR him singing that if you think about it.  Can you imagine anybody in Brian's band singing it? 
I've talked to Adam Marsland about Alan's current voice. Hell, he's even posted about it. Alan still has very good pipes, but nowhere near the range you're describing. You are completely off-base in this remark. Alan may have some falsetto let, but his days of belting and screaming out rockers or doing Brian's falsetto parts on stage are most likely gone. His baritone range, however, is terrific.

I also am getting very frustrated in reading some of the posts about the lack of quality of Brian's band and or Brian, not calling attention to yours specifically. No, Brian does not have the voice he used to. Yes, Mike's band is very good. No, Mike is not the devil. No, David Leaf's version of the Brian and the five-assholes wasn't correct. Yes, Brian's management has some weak spots. But come on, if Brian's band isn't one of the best bands in the business I don't know who is. If Brian didn't sing some terrific lead vocals in the studio (and sometimes on stage) in the past nine years, then I have never heard a good vocal from the man in his entire life. If Darian didn't do a killer "Darlin'," Carl's voice stank. It's getting to that point, folks. Happy holidays!
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« Reply #30 on: December 15, 2011, 11:23:37 PM »

For some reason before I fell asleep last night, I was thinking about how it would have sounded if they were on BWPS. Not how the group would have sounded like in 1966 and 1967. We can easily imagine that. But this different. The Beach Boys in 2004 doing SMiLE. I even imagined what leads they would sing.


Hmmmmm...

Nah.
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Awesoman
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« Reply #31 on: December 15, 2011, 11:29:37 PM »



Al Jardine can.  He's 70, and you can HEAR him singing that if you think about it.  Can you imagine anybody in Brian's band singing it? 


I strongly doubt Al Jardine could handle this song.  Even in his best days, this song was out of his league.  His voice is way too plain and simply lacks the soul that Carl Wilson (and later Blondie Chaplin) delivered on it. 

His son Matt performed this on Al Jardine's live CD.  The performance was ok; although they *did* perform this in a slightly lower key than the original version.  I think that pretty much sums it up about how well ol' Al would handle it. 
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cablegeddon
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« Reply #32 on: December 16, 2011, 01:38:02 AM »

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The reason they don't do "I Can Hear Music" is because nobody in the band can sing like that, and they know it.  Carl sang beautifully, but he had passion and energy in his voice that nobody in Brian's band has.

Nonsense. Darian did a killer "Darlin'" in '09. Easily the best live version I've heard since Carl was with us.

Did Darians band play on live at the Roxy theatre? That performance really stinks.
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« Reply #33 on: December 16, 2011, 02:05:42 AM »

You still don't get it. 

Why does Brian's band not do Wild Honey live?  Because they CANT.  There isn't 1 person in that entire group that can sing that lead.

Al Jardine can.  He's 70, and you can HEAR him singing that if you think about it.  Can you imagine anybody in Brian's band singing it? 

If anybody from Brian's band tries to sing Wild Honey, or anything with any balls in it, it'll sound like a reject American Idol audition. 

That doesn't mean they don't have good voices.  It just means they're bland.  They sing like boring WallPaper. 

If they do "California Girls", they have to get Brian to sing it, because nobody in the band is interesting enough that you'd even listen to them.  Do you honestly, and be honest about this, honestly think that song would have been as big as it was if anybody but Mike sang it?  He has more swagger in his C*CK than anybody in Brian's band has in their entire family. 

------------------------------

So , the argument to my argument is, "Well, Ronnie... these are people with beautiful voices.  They're not rockers, so that's why they can't sing Wild Honey". 

O.K., then when is one of them going to sing "I Can Hear Music" ? 

The reason they don't do "I Can Hear Music" is because nobody in the band can sing like that, and they know it.  Carl sang beautifully, but he had passion and energy in his voice that nobody in Brian's band has. 

Dada's post, as tongue in cheek as it is, is dead on.  The Beach Boys didn't sing great because they were heroin addicts, they sang great because they were excited and full of energy.  Brian's band sounds like the music they play in the food court at my local mall. 

You're hitting the nail on the head here. Brian's band is great – talented, accomplished, supportive, creative… but the sound lacks soul. The addiction thing doesn't make for good singers necessarily but, boy, do addiction-prone personalities seem to be indicative of guts and balls in performance and delivery.

Can anyone here honestly imagine any member of the BW band having problems? Okay, so one member might have had a penchant for M&Ms, but apart from root beer and Hersheys, I think they're all pretty clean*. Which helps make the sound, well, that bit square. As I think I posted a while back, don't expect any onstage jamming or outlandish improv.  "Good clean fun" sums it up.


* Scotty looks like he might have lived a bit tho', to be fair!

Oooh, all those official eyes, watching… reading… monitoring… I wonder if we'll suddenly discover Taylor's been on a 12-month fling with Jack Daniels and Mary Jane, and comes back singin' like Janis Joplin, with a pusher in tow**!

** maybe for pushing a pram!  Grin
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Cam Mott
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« Reply #34 on: December 16, 2011, 05:28:13 AM »

I think that all of the bands playing for/with the various Beach Boys are great, outstanding, they would not be playing for/with legends if they were not. I do agree, and I bet they would too, that no one is ever going to capture the family-friend-history-life-shared blend-depth that those ol' farts can. Even if they have superior skill they will never achieve that extraordinary "it".
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Jim McShane
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« Reply #35 on: December 16, 2011, 08:27:06 AM »

Quote
The reason they don't do "I Can Hear Music" is because nobody in the band can sing like that, and they know it.  Carl sang beautifully, but he had passion and energy in his voice that nobody in Brian's band has.

Nonsense. Darian did a killer "Darlin'" in '09. Easily the best live version I've heard since Carl was with us.

Yes, he absolutely nailed it! And I'm quite sure Darian could do I Can Hear Music really well too. Listen to his leads on the Wondermints CDs, and then listen to Darlin'.  His voice is perfect for it, he's got the range and the power.

"Nobody in the band can sing like that?" Reiterating Wirestone- nonsense.
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Wirestone
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« Reply #36 on: December 16, 2011, 10:56:59 AM »

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boy, do addiction-prone personalities seem to be indicative of guts and balls in performance and delivery.

Quote
Can anyone here honestly imagine any member of the BW band having problems? Okay, so one member might have had a penchant for M&Ms, but apart from root beer and Hersheys, I think they're all pretty clean*. Which helps make the sound, well, that bit square.

Preposterous. Also destructive. Thinking like that has helped to destroy the lives of a lot of young musicians.

Quote
I think that all of the bands playing for/with the various Beach Boys are great, outstanding, they would not be playing for/with legends if they were not. I do agree, and I bet they would too, that no one is ever going to capture the family-friend-history-life-shared blend-depth that those ol' farts can. Even if they have superior skill they will never achieve that extraordinary "it".

Quite so, Cam. Mike's band had some rough patches in the late 90s and early 00s, but otherwise it takes some serious skill to perform this music professionally.

Quote
Did Darians band play on live at the Roxy theatre? That performance really stinks.

1.) No it doesn't. 2.) To call BW's band Darian's band is just dumb. And 3.) Darian isn't singing lead on that version.

Quote
But come on, if Brian's band isn't one of the best bands in the business I don't know who is. If Brian didn't sing some terrific lead vocals in the studio (and sometimes on stage) in the past nine years, then I have never heard a good vocal from the man in his entire life. If Darian didn't do a killer "Darlin'," Carl's voice stank. It's getting to that point, folks.

And that all sums it up perfectly.

Okay, time to go back to orgasming over "reunion" news.
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Ron
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« Reply #37 on: December 16, 2011, 11:34:46 PM »

I think that all of the bands playing for/with the various Beach Boys are great, outstanding, they would not be playing for/with legends if they were not. I do agree, and I bet they would too, that no one is ever going to capture the family-friend-history-life-shared blend-depth that those ol' farts can. Even if they have superior skill they will never achieve that extraordinary "it".

You said you agree, and the band would agree, that they can't capture what the Beach Boys can, but this whole thread is full of people saying that you're wrong (and I'm wrong). 

Look folks: If perfection is what anybody was looking for, then "Bread" would be the greatest band of all time.  They're not... yet find 1 flaw on any of their songs.  It's perfectly recorded, perfectly written, perfectly produced, and PERFECTLY BORING!

The Beach Boys had "it" like Cam said; nobody in Brian's band has "It" like Al Jardine has 'It", or Mike does, or Brian does.  These guys are cut from a different cloth.  I'm sure Darian can sing just beautifully, but he's proven with his career that nobody wants to pay to hear him.  The Beach Boys have proven with their career that people the world over are happy to pay to hear them.  That's the 'it' factor. 

Again, that's not a slight to Darian or any of the rest of them, they're great musicians and great singers, but this entire topic is about how cool it would be to hear the Beach Boys on the Smile 2004 album.  There's no argument that it would be cool to hear those guys sing some of those tracks. 
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« Reply #38 on: December 17, 2011, 01:47:19 AM »

I think that all of the bands playing for/with the various Beach Boys are great, outstanding, they would not be playing for/with legends if they were not. I do agree, and I bet they would too, that no one is ever going to capture the family-friend-history-life-shared blend-depth that those ol' farts can. Even if they have superior skill they will never achieve that extraordinary "it".

You said you agree, and the band would agree, that they can't capture what the Beach Boys can, but this whole thread is full of people saying that you're wrong (and I'm wrong). 

Look folks: If perfection is what anybody was looking for, then "Bread" would be the greatest band of all time.  They're not... yet find 1 flaw on any of their songs.  It's perfectly recorded, perfectly written, perfectly produced, and PERFECTLY BORING!

The Beach Boys had "it" like Cam said; nobody in Brian's band has "It" like Al Jardine has 'It", or Mike does, or Brian does.  These guys are cut from a different cloth.  I'm sure Darian can sing just beautifully, but he's proven with his career that nobody wants to pay to hear him.  The Beach Boys have proven with their career that people the world over are happy to pay to hear them.  That's the 'it' factor. 

Again, that's not a slight to Darian or any of the rest of them, they're great musicians and great singers, but this entire topic is about how cool it would be to hear the Beach Boys on the Smile 2004 album.  There's no argument that it would be cool to hear those guys sing some of those tracks. 

"Censure is the price a man pays for eminence" - Someone
"Familiarity breeds contempt" - Voltaire, probably, or John Locke...

Remember when Brian's band was an improbable miracle? Now, the backlash of the backlash has begun. I blame David Leaf's Office of Strategic Information.

I think this post marked a rhetorical and logical nosedive. To wit: people all the world over paid to hear Bread. Does that mean they have that je ne sais quois? I think you are mixing your rhetorical devices.

Darian's career has proven that people will pay to hear him. In fact, I believe Darian has been playing music for a living for about twenty years. That necessarily means that people have been paying to hear the sounds he makes. Also, his solo stuff is pretty good.

If I understand you correctly...

Imperfecton + Members who are addicts + High record and tour sales = "They've got that something!!"

You don't happen to work as an executive in the music industry, do you?
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« Reply #39 on: December 17, 2011, 04:09:09 AM »

Darian isn't singing lead on that version.


You're pulling my leg.
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Ron
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« Reply #40 on: December 17, 2011, 07:05:09 AM »

I love Bread.  I do.  I also love Brian's band.  Both are bland, boring.  Pretty... but bland and boring. 

Darian singing Darlin' with his perfect "You're so fine; sweety!" voice does not have 'it'.  'it' has nothing to do with drug use.  'it' has more to do with testicles. 


JUST SAYIN'.


BTW, so far, in this thread, I'm one of the only people to hate 'it'. 
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Tristero
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« Reply #41 on: December 17, 2011, 07:34:04 AM »


You said you agree, and the band would agree, that they can't capture what the Beach Boys can, but this whole thread is full of people saying that you're wrong (and I'm wrong). 
 

Not true.  As far as I can see, no one has argued that Brian's band comes close to the level of excellence that the Beach Boys achieved in their heyday in the vocal department.  I would tend to agree that, as skilled as they are, they lack that indefinable "it", the spark of true greatness.  Not many performers reach this level.  (Whether or not Mike, Al and Bruce still have "it" in large supplies at this stage of the game may be open to question.  I'm not familiar with their more recent performances.)  I simply think that you're being unnecessarily harsh and disrespectful in your open slams on this band.  You've made your point and you're starting to sound like a broken record.

Yes, I would love to hear the remaining Beach Boys perform the completed SMiLE tracks, but whether or not they would be into that idea is another question.  Would Mike be enthusiastic about such a project and give it his all or would he rather be doing something else?  Sometimes with "it", there is also ego and attitude.  The enthusiasm and interest on the part of Brian's band (Darian, in particular) helped to make SMiLE happen and I don't think the involvement of the surviving Beach Boys would have been beneficial in 2003.  Maybe the relative selflessness of the band was actually more conducive to finally getting it done.  Still, I'm hopeful that we may get to hear the Beach Boys take on some of these songs in 2012.
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Wirestone
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« Reply #42 on: December 17, 2011, 03:10:55 PM »

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Maybe the relative selflessness of the band was actually more conducive to finally getting it done.

I think this is precisely right.
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« Reply #43 on: December 17, 2011, 06:23:33 PM »

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Maybe the relative selflessness of the band was actually more conducive to finally getting it done.

I think this is precisely right.
Yes, he hit the nail on the head. This band has a distinct lack of ego - they chose to back Brian because they love his music. Isn't that refreshing?
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« Reply #44 on: December 17, 2011, 08:59:21 PM »

Well, I thought I had something to say about this topic until I got to page 2.  Now I'm not so sure...

I think it was a good idea for Brian to finish SMiLE with Van Dyke and take it on the road and record it with his band.  I don't think it would have been as healing for him, or as much of a vindication of his original vision, if he'd done it any other way.

As for the other BB's voices on it in 2004--that would have been great, but it just wasn't meant to be.
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« Reply #45 on: December 18, 2011, 03:48:51 AM »

This thread seems to have gone sideways or I'm not understanding some of the posts.

Brian's new band in its various incarnations is great. They are Brian-centric and selfless to a great degree.  I know it's not a popular concept around here but I think the real BBs were also an equally Brian-centric selfless band. This no slight to the new band but I believe most/any assemblage of qualified musicians would be equally selfless. I mean who wouldn't be? On the other hand, do we think this band would stick if Brian went as wonky as he did when the Boys stuck by him?

Darian is extraordinary and did a great job and the man for the job but I bet there are equally great men who would have been equally the man for the job. It wouldn't have had Darian's "it" but it would have some other dedicated, selfless, extraordianry someone's "it". We are lucky that the man was there for the job.
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Tristero
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« Reply #46 on: December 18, 2011, 06:50:37 AM »

This thread seems to have gone sideways or I'm not understanding some of the posts.

Brian's new band in its various incarnations is great. They are Brian-centric and selfless to a great degree.  I know it's not a popular concept around here but I think the real BBs were also an equally Brian-centric selfless band. This no slight to the new band but I believe most/any assemblage of qualified musicians would be equally selfless. I mean who wouldn't be? On the other hand, do we think this band would stick if Brian went as wonky as he did when the Boys stuck by him?

Darian is extraordinary and did a great job and the man for the job but I bet there are equally great men who would have been equally the man for the job. It wouldn't have had Darian's "it" but it would have some other dedicated, selfless, extraordianry someone's "it". We are lucky that the man was there for the job.
The original Beach Boys were certainly Brian-centric, but I'm not as sure about the selfless part.  When you're there at the beginning and you rise to great fame quickly, touring around the world in front of screaming fans, that can't help but go to your head a little.  I think Mike in particular had specific ideas about who the Beach Boys were (or should have been) and he wasn't necessarily enthusiastic about Brian's new direction circa Pet Sounds/SMiLE.  Of course, he followed Brian's lead and did his job, but he still raised questions and voiced his concerns (as was his right as a founding member).  It's not quite the same thing as being a part of Brian's backing band today.  I guess he could have found other musicians who were equally well suited it, but where BWPS is concerned, I think Darian was the right man for the job of 'musical secretary'.
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« Reply #47 on: December 18, 2011, 10:54:42 AM »

Fair enough, the bands don't have as much at stake or the rights the Boys did/do. However, even with their stake and right to be less selfless they were actually more selfless because they put Brian's wants ahead of their own rights in spite of. Not a popular view as you point out.

I agree Darian was the man for the job but not the only man for the job. I'm repeating myself. Anyways, I'm glad it was Darian.
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