The REAL reason Brian abandoned SMiLE?

[adamghost]

You're leaving out one key factor:  motivation.  It's an intangible, but it's extremely relevant.  There's a world of difference in creativity between having the wind at your back and perceiving that, even though all the tools are at your disposal, you are having to wield an inordinate amount of mental and physical energy to wield them.

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

Exactly!

I guess I'm just saying that in the end it was Brian's decision alone. No one asked him to abandon Smile or ordered him to or plead for it's scrapping.


There could have certainly been more positive support for Brian but it was his decision so the responsibility for Smile being scrapped is his.

[runnersdialzero]

Collapsing under your own ideas and mind =/= making a decision

imo

[Wirestone]

It also seems increasingly clear to me that Smile never really ended ... Smiley comes out, but Brian keeps working on Cool, Cool Water and then comes up with Can't Wait Too Long ... he records this other version of Surf's Up ... At the time, I'll bet it seemed much more fluid than 1.) Project ends here 2.) New project begins.

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

That's a very good way of thinking about it

And yes, Brian did make a decision no matter what the factors.

[Cam Mott]

I think what is being over looked is Brian didn't can SMiLE because of anything but the fact that he didn't dig it for all the reasons he gave. He was enthused about it, he had it all planned, was systematically and orderly improving it, had the band et al jumping through all of his hoops, had fired his dad, had the label in his back pocket, took all the time he wanted, and did as he pleased, and as he got what he wanted he didn't like it. Why is somebody responsible for Brian's Muse?
We also continue to overlook that Brian himself said the Boys didn't want SMiLE scrapped so they obviously weren't exerting pressure or doing anything that Brian took as working against SMiLE, he saw them as advocating for SMiLE. He canned it in spite of even the Boys advocacy for it.
It is fine if Brian didn't dig it back then, he doesn't have to be someone or something's victim, he can own his feelings toward his own creations.

[John Stivaktas]

Did Brian really have the emotional maturity to pull this project off? I mean what about the LAX photo in October 1966. How many friends were in that photo? And within 6 months he was barely talking to any of them. Does that sound like the guy had it together? It makes complete sense to me that he got 'jack' of the whole SMiLE idea and decided to go on a different tangent, one that didn't involve a competitive musical spirit.

[runnersdialzero]

Did Brian really have the emotional maturity to pull this project off? I mean what about the LAX photo in October 1966. How many friends were in that photo? And within 6 months he was barely talking to any of them. Does that sound like the guy had it together? It makes complete sense to me that he got 'jack' of the whole SMiLE idea and decided to go on a different tangent, one that didn't involve a competitive musical spirit.

Which photo would that be?

[Andrew G. Doe]

Did Brian really have the emotional maturity to pull this project off? I mean what about the LAX photo in October 1966. How many friends were in that photo? And within 6 months he was barely talking to any of them. Does that sound like the guy had it together? It makes complete sense to me that he got 'jack' of the whole SMiLE idea and decided to go on a different tangent, one that didn't involve a competitive musical spirit.

Which photo would that be?

The one with Jules Seigel, Danny Hutton, Gene Gaddy & Barbara Rovell et al at LAX, late 1966.

[MBE]

Lots of good thoughts here. My 2 cents is that The Beach Boys probably all had varying degrees of mixed feelings about it including Brian. The only thing that matters today is that they did excellent work on it especially Brian. As far as drugs I doubt Brian was all that drug addled at the time compared to his intake from say 1972-82. As far as mental illness Brian had it before Smile and he had it after Smile. It didn't just pop up because an album didn't come out.

Because Brian did some fabulous work from mid 1967 to mid 1973 I don't think the non release of Smile destroyed him creatively in any sense. Yes during those six years he had times where he wasn't doing much, but he had times where he was quite active. From 1961-73 his creativity doesn't seem interupted to me at all. His hygiene didn't go down until after his dad died and his weight didn't become a real factor (at least not to a dangerous extent) until Holland. Obviously by 1972 he was having chemical and mental issues, but I think he didn't completely change until Murry died. My thoughts are that Brian would have went the way he went no matter what sooner or later. Did being in a group add to his problems at times? Sure but it also gave him a wonderful outlet.

I also want to add that the others sooner or later were going to blossom as songwriters in the way Brian and Mike had. They were going to have more input to some level when mono was phased out in any event. They even during Pet Sounds and Smile were still essential to what Brian was doing and these individuals were all too talented not to want to do their own music. That said it seems through Surf's Up Brian had a lot of final say, he was respected by the band, and had some sort of leadership role. To me the turning point was using Surf's Up in 1971. This is all confirmed by Desper and others around at the time to me personally and even Brian without my prompting basically confirmed that Wild Honey to Sunflower in particular was a time where he felt everyone was working together quite well and that he was a full part of that. Even something like 20/20 Desper felt like Brian had final say even approving the Smile tracks being done. After that he changed and the band changed.

I think Brian got sick of hearing about Smile and only when it was made to be this gothic thing did it really hurt him mentally. I think he has been misinformed by those who came into his life later as far as that period goes. Thankfully he has apparently come to a place of peace about not only it being heard but also it seems he may now realize that his band mates did do some great work on it. One last thing I think this is cathartic for all of the surviving members. It got to be as big a noose around their necks as it was for Brian. Mike Love still is being put down because Brian's social group didn't like him and he didn't like them. What people should realize is that Mike was a great asset to the band until he got on the oldies train, and that his work should speak louder than rumors or even his own words. You must understand that even in 1966 Brian was his cousin and somebody he grew up with. He was not going to have this view of Brian as being this prophet of the new dawn or whatever people thought of him from the outside. I think he did and does respect Brian's talent, but to him Brian was and is his cousin and he was going to be frank with him about what he liked or didn't. That really didn't matter because obviously Brian won the argument and he did the work. As his old quotes from 1967 show, he came around enough to show public support. Again trust the art not the artist. Mike may be a great guy, he may be a jerk, he probably can be both. What matters is the work he did. Brian Wilson was one of a kind, without him The Beach Boys wouldn't have got off the ground, but I don't think he would have done as well if he hadn't had some great talents to work with. They were even in 1966 a great GROUP.

[Keri]

As far as mental illness Brian had it before Smile and he had it after Smile. It didn't just pop up because an album didn't come out.

Hey great post, but I'm going to focus on what I don't agree with. 

From reading Carlin's book on Brian and other material I have read, I think actually Brian's mental health did suffer a significant change within the SMiLE period. Early on he was eccentric, fun, adventurous and highly prolific, he was writing and recording amazing pieces. Towards the end of the SMiLE period he had shed a lot of his friends and was having serious paranoid episodes. I think there is a significant shift. if you look at his work, the version of H&V he finally released it was a pale shadow of his early recordings.  I think at the end of the SMiLE period Brian just did not have in his mind the shining vision of a "Teenage Symphony to God" that he had at the start.

[adamghost]

I agree.  A great deal of the band's concern about SMiLE could probably be traced to their perception of Brian's mental state and concern about the people around them.  That said, I think it's a valid point that the real bad stuff didn't kick in until 1973.  But clearly, things were bad before then.  There was the stay in a mental hospital in '68.  Consider how bad things had to have gotten for that to have happened.

[Justin]

x

[MBE]

As far as mental illness Brian had it before Smile and he had it after Smile. It didn't just pop up because an album didn't come out.

Hey great post, but I'm going to focus on what I don't agree with. 

From reading Carlin's book on Brian and other material I have read, I think actually Brian's mental health did suffer a significant change within the SMiLE period. Early on he was eccentric, fun, adventurous and highly prolific, he was writing and recording amazing pieces. Towards the end of the SMiLE period he had shed a lot of his friends and was having serious paranoid episodes. I think there is a significant shift. if you look at his work, the version of H&V he finally released it was a pale shadow of his early recordings.  I think at the end of the SMiLE period Brian just did not have in his mind the shining vision of a "Teenage Symphony to God" that he had at the start.

Well honestly I think his direction changed. Is Smiley as grand as Smile? No not in scale or in quality, yet Brian gushed about how the band was brought together and how much he enjoyed the Smiley sessions to J. Marks in January 1968. This unpublished tape is used in my Beach Boys manuscript and on that day at least Brian was in great shape mentally. Besides Heroes the single may have had a slightly flat mix but it is inventive and ranks as a great piece of work. It could have been better going by the early arrangements,  but what Brian decided on was really good. By 1969-70 many of his productions were as grand as ever. This Whole World and Add Some Music, and Break Away alone are all as clear and exciting as the Smile era.

As far as mental illness it went back to Murry and Murry's father. Brian had it before 1967, as Marilyn once told me he always had bad days. Granted they were few in number when they met in 1962, but there was a tendency to withdraw or lack confidence when he was down. Go back to 1963, he is gaining weight and not wanting to tour. In 1964 he had a few minor incidents on their fall tour and had a full breakdown by the winter. By 1966 Brian had radical mood swings described by Tony Asher that really were serious and not always connected to reality. Smile he had odd behavior on a number of occasions. Honestly though until Carnie was born Marilyn did not notice a big change. That was almost a year later. Al Jardine and Bruce Johnston have both attested that Brian was in good shape during the Wild Honey/Friends period. 20/20 was a struggle to some extent but as I described he bounced back a great deal. His dad selling the songs in 1969 hurt him bad and he stayed in bed a short time, but within weeks he was writing and recording. He even went on tour a few months later. His behavior on the tour included one bad episode, but he performed well at the shows and enjoyed it. By 1972 drugs were a problem as well as lack of motivation but listening to Brian play the Fairly Tale on bootleg in early 1973 shows him to be pretty much who he was ten years earlier. By then yes he had a lot more bad days but the real Brian was still there at times. After Murry died I don't think he was. Not that he hasn't had good moments or good periods, but his whole demeanor changed and his work was never as consistent. As early as 1974 he was still singing and writing well at times, but he gained almost 100 pounds and a track like Battle Hymn just wasn't up to anything he had done before.  Note Steve Shapiro's comments in your often cited Carlin book. Brian as late as the early seventies still had a sense of humor and normalicy on his good days. Debbie Kiel said that when she met Brian in 1969 he didn't have to be watched or worried about. By the mid seventies that had drastically changed.

Smile was a turning point yes, but really it only made more clear problems that had been there all along. Perhaps Brian wasn't one who should have done acid, but I don't think it did anything but bring out things that were in him already. Hard drugs, prescription drugs, and drinking proved a lot more damaging in a permanent way. That the Beach Boys gave Brian more input after Smile was something he mostly welcomed. There were times later on he felt unneeded or unwanted but that rarely the case on albums like Friends, Sunflower, or Wild Honey. The big point I am trying to make is that Brian's decline was happening years before, and continued to happen in the years after. His work isn't totally tied to that. Even after Smile the changes were very gradual. Note the footage of him in the blue shirt in Hawaii in 1967. He is fully in control in the studio segments.

adamghost I agree with you. Brian had a very bad spell in 1968 but it seems like it was short lived. He also had a very bad spell in late 1964. Yet (because of some comments by Carl to Geoffry Himes in 1981) I date 1972 as the start of the drug abuse as opposed to use, and 1973 as when he really changed for good.

[Heysaboda]

These are all great posts, but I look at what Brian says in his notes to The Smile Sessions, talking about the project unraveling:

"Truly, my creative heart was broken."

WOW....  That comment, alone, just breaks my heart too.

So, now in 2011, I trust that Brian's creative heart has indeed mended, for many years now, and that, hopefully he is truly of how much REAL JOY this wonderful, wonderful music brings to thousands of people!!!

[Micha]

This is beyond stupid!

If you're Brian Wilson at the height of your powers and it's 1967 and you have complete control and complete say over the music you're creating, you have these amazing vocalists who will sing exactly what you tell them to no matter if they like it or not (and the only concrete evidence we have IS the Beach Boys singing these parts) and you scrap the whole thing because Mike Love questions a single line of lyric or is generally not exploding with enthusiasm, it's YOUR decision and your mistake. Mike did what he was told and would have continued doing so just like the others. Brian dropped the ball and it's his responsibility. He put himself in the position to make that decision. End of story.

End of story? What about Brian's mental state? What does that make of his "responsibility"?

[Micha]

Thank God Smile did NOT come out when it was supposed to; it so wouldn't be the legend that it is now.

But with what would I have wasted my time then?

Speaking of The Beatles, David Prokopy wrote in his tape set notes back in 1993 that explaining why Smile wasn't finished is like explaining why The Beatles broke up. Ergo, I conclude that the reason Smile didn't come out? It was because of Yoko. *snort!*

So now can finally put this discussion at rest. "End of story".

[Quzi]

Maybe my memory was a little foggy but here are some of them for whatever it's worth.

Nov 7 1966

Dennis Wilson: “In my opinion it makes ‘Pet Sounds’ stink - that’s how good it is.“

Published November 19 1966

Al Jardine: “Brian has done some terrific things - he is unbelievably devoted to our music - and there is more to come in the next album we must finish up when we get home.”

Published  December 17 1966

Al Jardine re. “ a very Hawaiian-influenced track, sung in Hawaiian, no less”: “This is by far the best thing we’ve ever done! Everything - the music, lyrics, singing, background - everything is perfect. “

Published January 7 1967

Mike Love: “Our [early] stage act was sort of early rhythm-and-blues - stuff by the Coasters and Chuck Berry. Not too many musical innovations there. Our progress has been slow. Because of Brian being on the road with us. He and I used to write songs. I’d contribute a lyric or rhyme, but actually, the bulk of the work has always been Brian’s. We worked after or during road tours that lasted weeks. That’s enough to kill a person without trying to come up with hit singles every few months. Somehow we did. Then when Brian stopped touring, wham! We were staggered. And he keeps doing this to us! More and more and greater and greater things.”

May 7 67

Bruce Johnston: “I’ve got some tapes at home of the new tracks to be on the ‘Smile’ LP which would blow your mind. All the ideas are new and Brian is coming up with fantastic ideas all the time.”


May 7 1967

Mike Love re. EMI release of Then I Kissed Her: “The record company didn’t even have the decency to put out one of Brian’s own compositions. The reason for the hold up with a new single has simply been that we wanted to give our public the best and the best isn’t ready yet.”

2nd week of July 67

Mike Love: "[re. Heroes and Villians] A new improvement of Brian’s capacities in this job. Once again he knows exactly what we can and what we can’t. There’s a lot of things happening on the record just like ‘Good Vibrations’…The flip is incredible. The title is ’You’re Welcome’. No other lyrics. I don’t know how Brian did it, but there’s no accompaniment. ‘Heroes and Villains’ is going to be released as the first single on our new label, Brothers Records…We are finishing it [the album] now. We knew the title and songs months ago already. Only Brian played the tapes again a few times and found it necessary to skip some songs. I don’t know how many sleeves they can throw out now, just because the lineup of songs and some songs have changed completely. He also said that we were going to make ‘Vegetables’ [the next single] instead. Brian had a photo session in a supermarket at the vegetables and fruit part."

Late 1967/early 1968

Brian Wilson: "Early 1967, I had planned to make an album entitled SMILE. I was working with a guy named Van Dyke Parks, who was collaborating with me on the tunes, and in the process we came up with a song called 'Surf’s Up,' and I performed that with just a piano on a documentary show made on rock music.
The song 'Surf’s Up' that I sang for that documentary never came out on an album, and it was supposed to come out on the SMILE album, and that and a couple of other songs were junked ... because I didn't feel that they ... I don't know why, I just didn't, for some reason, didn't want to put them on
the album ... and the group nearly broke up, actually split up for good over that, that one ... the decision of mine not to put a lot of the things that
we'd cut for the album SMILEY SMILE on the album, and so for like almost a year, we're just now kind of getting back together ... because I didn't
think that the songs really were right for the public at the time, and I didn't have a feeling, a commercial feeling, about some of these songs that
we've never released, and ... maybe I ... some people like to hang onto certain things and ... just as their own little songs that they've written
almost for themselves. And a lot of times, you know, a person will write and will realize later that they're ... it's not commercial, you know, but
what they've written is nice for them, but a lot of people just don't like it."

I'm really sorry to necro this thread, but where were these quotes published? LLVS?

[Cam Mott]

Mostly New Music Express and Disc & Music Echo. A few are republished in LLVS. The last one was broadcast on KHJ's History of Rock and Roll.

[Bill Tobelman]

David Anderle said the point at which he knew they were going to have trouble with SMiLE was Brian's reaction to the "Fire" music, and things did seems to gradually go downhill from there.

Brian's idea that the Fire music could somehow mystically cause an increase of fires in the area is an outward manifestation of some underlying factors.

In my view---SMiLE was about communicating the spiritual/LSD experience to the consumer of the album/art. "Fire" communicated a negative aspect of the spiritual/LSD experience and Brian's sensitivity to this, along with the double bind that he couldn't disclose what he was really working on (for to do so would rob it of its power in the same way something is lost when a joke has to be explained), left Brian in a bind that he needed a way out of. I think the fire paranoia served that purpose and it also led Brian to question his direction and the appropriateness of the project as a whole.

[Quzi]

Mostly New Music Express and Disc & Music Echo. A few are republished in LLVS. The last one was broadcast on KHJ's History of Rock and Roll.

I hope it isn't too much to ask, but could I please have a breakdown of which appeared where? These would add great perspective to the band's attitude towards Smile on the Wikipedia article (something that's sorely lacking), but I unfortunately wouldn't be able to add them without reliably citing their origins. Thanks in advance 

[Cam Mott]

Mostly New Music Express and Disc & Music Echo. A few are republished in LLVS. The last one was broadcast on KHJ's History of Rock and Roll.

I hope it isn't too much to ask, but could I please have a breakdown of which appeared where? These would add great perspective to the band's attitude towards Smile on the Wikipedia article (something that's sorely lacking), but I unfortunately wouldn't be able to add them without reliably citing their origins. Thanks in advance 

Here's the best I can do at the moment:

DW:  Hit Parader Magazine, issue unknown; interview Nov/7/66; LLVS 27
AJ: Disc & Music Echo; Published Nov/19/66; interview mid-Nov/66
AJ: New Music Express; Published Dec/17/66
ML: New Music Express; Published Jan/7/67
BJ: New Music Express; Published May/27/67; interview May/7/67; LLVS 198
ML: New Music Express; Published May/27/67; interview May/7/67; LLVS 198
ML: TeenBeat; issue unknown; interview late July 67; LLVS 140
BW: KHJ History of Rock and Rock; interview late 67/early 68

[Bill Tobelman]

Following up on my prior post it's notable that Jules Siegel was under the impression that Brian had destroyed the Fire master. As Siegel reported "Brian destroyed the master."

Obviously the truth is that Brian had not destroyed the master and this reinforces my prior claim that the whole Fire thing was possibly a fabrication to get out of a situation Brian wanted to get out of.

[Mujan, 8@$+@Rc| of a Blue Wizard]

Some very interesting points here that I hadn't considered:

1-The idea that Carl also hated SMiLE. This changes everything when Brian cites the group's disapproval as a key factor. This also reaffirms the idea that there was more going on then just Mike asking what Cabin Essence was about. When your previous collaborator/front man and little bro/studio associate both seem unsupportive and/or hostile to your project, that's pretty significant on top of all the other issues going on. Brian thought Fire literally caused fires. Maybe in his paranoid state he honestly believed this music was tearing his band apart and so it had to be killed.

2-This idea that the reason vocals weren't recorded for many tracks was because of similar complaints from Love and Brian's own indecisiveness to all aspects of the project. Can anyone confirm this?

[Emdeeh]

Some very interesting points here that I hadn't considered:

1-The idea that Carl also hated Smile.

I doubt that theory -- seriously, seriously doubt it.