gfxgfx
 
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
logo
 
gfx gfx
gfx
651459 Posts in 26033 Topics by 3714 Members - Latest Member: Tom Tom Play Boy October 22, 2019, 12:59:19 PM
*
gfx*HomeHelpSearchCalendarLoginRegistergfx
gfxgfx
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.       « previous next »
Pages: [1] Go Down Print
Author Topic: Sloop John B - in the context of pet sounds  (Read 3092 times)
CanaanDavis
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 12


View Profile
« on: September 15, 2011, 10:48:21 PM »

Hello,
I would imagine this has been discussed at some point.  Though, I was just wondering what everyone here thinks about Sloop John B and it's inclusion on Pet Sounds.  I know at some point I've read about certain critics saying it's inclusion on PS was a "mistake".  To me PS is a showcase of everything that is good about Brian Wilson, beautiful harmonies/vocals, melodies, instrumentation, song writing and moving instrumentals.  I think SJB is a vital part of that  showcase because it demonstrates Brian's ability to rework an preexisting tune and make it his own unique work.  So, whats the general consensus here?
Logged
ghost
Guest
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2011, 11:21:05 PM »

Sloop John B is essential to "my" Pet Sounds. The people who think it doesn't belong conveniently forget that not every song is Caroline No and Sloop fits the more lighthearted casual vibe of I Know There's An Answer, That's Not Me, Wouldn't It Be Nice...

In fact it contains a similar theme to That's Not Me or I Just Wasn't Made For These Times - "I wanna go home" - i.e., return to a state of simplicity that I am familiar and comfortable with rather than where I am now. The recognition that "I know perfectly well I'm not where I should be..."
Logged
runnersdialzero
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 5143


I WILL NEVER GO TO SCHOOL


View Profile
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2011, 11:55:00 PM »

People legit don't think it belongs? L O L ~
Logged

Tell me it's okay.
Tell me you still love me.
People make mistakes.
People make mistakes.
Ebb and Flow
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 583



View Profile WWW
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2011, 12:03:48 AM »

It's brilliant from both an instrumental and vocal perspective.  It takes a very simple song and pushes it into the stratosphere.

People legit don't think it belongs? L O L ~

I think it's because there's this longstanding bit of info that Capitol forced Brian to include it on the album...something that's never washed with me.  I'm not sure if Brian's ever been asked about that.  Also it's the only cover on an album known for its creative songwriting, so it (unfairly) gets points taken off for that.
Logged
runnersdialzero
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 5143


I WILL NEVER GO TO SCHOOL


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2011, 12:07:46 AM »

Sez right in my Pet Sounds liner notes that it was included on initial tracklists for the albums, proving that Mr.Wilson intended it to be on the record. Rite? RITE!??!//1/gdef
Logged

Tell me it's okay.
Tell me you still love me.
People make mistakes.
People make mistakes.
Ebb and Flow
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 583



View Profile WWW
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2011, 12:22:33 AM »

Sez right in my Pet Sounds liner notes that it was included on initial tracklists for the albums, proving that Mr.Wilson intended it to be on the record. Rite? RITE!??!//1/gdef

Yep, forgot about that mention in Brad Elliot's liner notes.

I recently re-read the Gaines book and he mentions that Sloop John B. was forced by Capitol to be a single release...which makes way more sense and might be how that rumor started.
Logged
Jason
Guest
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2011, 06:24:29 AM »

The general consensus is that Brian intended it to be on the album as it was on his tracklist for the album, so I don't think there should be anything left to the imagination.
Logged
harrisonjon
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 411


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2011, 07:19:15 AM »

It would also fit on later albums: Smile, Friends, Surf's Up, Holland (think Sail on Sailor). It's Brian doing Americana.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2011, 07:20:07 AM by harrisonjon » Logged
ghost
Guest
« Reply #8 on: September 16, 2011, 08:27:36 AM »

It's brilliant from both an instrumental and vocal perspective.  It takes a very simple song and pushes it into the stratosphere.

People legit don't think it belongs? L O L ~

I think it's because there's this longstanding bit of info that Capitol forced Brian to include it on the album...something that's never washed with me.  I'm not sure if Brian's ever been asked about that.  Also it's the only cover on an album known for its creative songwriting, so it (unfairly) gets points taken off for that.

It might get points taken off for not being an original song at its core but Brian MADE IT AN ORIGINAL. Sloop John B is now a Beach Boys song, f*** the rest. Brian's arrangement is unbeatable, it will NEVER BE BEAT. The feel he got on that track is incredible, it rocks so good. WELL I FEEL SO BROKE UP I WANNA GO HOME. Consider that guitar line we hear chiming away the entire time that was a single overdub - brilliant. Sloop has one of the best arrangements on Pet Sounds, it being a non-original song doesn't matter at this point. Brian made it so much more than it ever was or would have been.
Logged
Chris Brown
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2005


View Profile
« Reply #9 on: September 16, 2011, 06:18:44 PM »

It's brilliant from both an instrumental and vocal perspective.  It takes a very simple song and pushes it into the stratosphere.

People legit don't think it belongs? L O L ~

I think it's because there's this longstanding bit of info that Capitol forced Brian to include it on the album...something that's never washed with me.  I'm not sure if Brian's ever been asked about that.  Also it's the only cover on an album known for its creative songwriting, so it (unfairly) gets points taken off for that.

It might get points taken off for not being an original song at its core but Brian MADE IT AN ORIGINAL. Sloop John B is now a Beach Boys song, f*ck the rest. Brian's arrangement is unbeatable, it will NEVER BE BEAT. The feel he got on that track is incredible, it rocks so good. WELL I FEEL SO BROKE UP I WANNA GO HOME. Consider that guitar line we hear chiming away the entire time that was a single overdub - brilliant. Sloop has one of the best arrangements on Pet Sounds, it being a non-original song doesn't matter at this point. Brian made it so much more than it ever was or would have been.

Indeed he did - I once listened to the original Kingston Trio version and found it cute, but incredibly lame (and I generally enjoy "lame" folk music).  Brian had such a knack in the 60's for taking good tunes and making them great.
Logged
Justin
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2240



View Profile
« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2011, 12:48:57 AM »

"Sloop" is a bold addition to "Pet Sounds."  At first glance: including the song is a wrong move....but in the end: it's completely right.  Thematically/lyrically, Sloop sticks out like a sore thumb.  In the middle of these deeply introspective pieces, comes a song about a ship.  It' s an unusual inclusion.  But it is because of that abrupt left turn that makes it work so perfectly.  For a moment, Brian takes us away from the "inside"....ourselves, himself, all of us, and throws us straight into the middle of the ocean with the crew of the Sloop John where we're hoisting up its sails and watching cooks throw out grits.  It's a wonderful quick getaway.  Next thing you know, Brian asks "why don't they let me go home?" aaaaaand we're back to where we left off.

The production and arrangement is exquisite and pure "Pet Sounds".  Even if Sloop John B was removed from "Pet Sounds" and put somewhere else...everyone would've eventually said "Hey, this should have been on Pet Sounds!" It's quite obvious that it needed to be on there.  So there it was.  Although the lyrical content steers away from the general theme of the album...its sound and feel is dead-on perfect. 

It's a remarkable track and one that rocks the place whenever it's in the set. 
Logged
oldsurferdude
Guest
« Reply #11 on: September 17, 2011, 08:12:17 AM »

"Sloop" is a bold addition to "Pet Sounds."  At first glance: including the song is a wrong move....but in the end: it's completely right.  Thematically/lyrically, Sloop sticks out like a sore thumb.  In the middle of these deeply introspective pieces, comes a song about a ship.  It' s an unusual inclusion.  But it is because of that abrupt left turn that makes it work so perfectly.  For a moment, Brian takes us away from the "inside"....ourselves, himself, all of us, and throws us straight into the middle of the ocean with the crew of the Sloop John where we're hoisting up its sails and watching cooks throw out grits.  It's a wonderful quick getaway.  Next thing you know, Brian asks "why don't they let me go home?" aaaaaand we're back to where we left off.

The production and arrangement is exquisite and pure "Pet Sounds".  Even if Sloop John B was removed from "Pet Sounds" and put somewhere else...everyone would've eventually said "Hey, this should have been on Pet Sounds!" It's quite obvious that it needed to be on there.  So there it was.  Although the lyrical content steers away from the general theme of the album...its sound and feel is dead-on perfect. 

It's a remarkable track and one that rocks the place whenever it's in the set. 

Your 5th post on the board is golden-well said Justin.
Logged
Justin
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2240



View Profile
« Reply #12 on: September 17, 2011, 12:08:55 PM »

Thanks oldsurferdude...I'm enjoying it here so far.  Lots of good topics and with the great SMiLE release coming up...this is sure to be an exciting place for a while!
Logged
Iron Horse-Apples
Guest
« Reply #13 on: September 17, 2011, 12:14:55 PM »

Sloop John B:- Loss of innocence

Fits in musically and lyrically for me. Never had a problem with it.
Logged
ghost
Guest
« Reply #14 on: September 17, 2011, 03:04:41 PM »

Sloop John B:- Loss of innocence

Fits in musically and lyrically for me. Never had a problem with it.

BUT DEWD IT'S ABOUT A BOAT OR SOMETHING. caroline no is like i ammmm so sensitiiiivvvee, i write songs that maayke grown men cryyy, how couuuuld you include sloop john b hereeee, oh capitol, you break my heart, i just wanna go and cry, it's so sad to hear sloop end side A, oh capitol....
Logged
gfx
Pages: [1] Go Up Print 
gfx
Jump to:  
gfx
Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Page created in 2.89 seconds with 21 queries.
Helios Multi design by Bloc
gfx
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!