Aeijtzsche's Annual Assortment of potentially unsolvable BB mysteries.

[Andrew G. Doe]

7.  Why does there seem to be such a paucity of a photographic record for Beach Boys instrumental tracking sessions?

It does seem strange that there are so few photos out there.  You have to wonder if members of the band (and surviving relatives) have some treasure trove of photographic material not cataloged by BRI.  I also wonder if Diane Rovell has ever been asked if she ever took any photos during tracking sessions.

My personal Pet Sounds mystery...what happened to the tracking session tape of "Don't Talk"?  Portions of it were booted long ago as an early take (With a much more prominent organ and a different tympani fill at the end) and edited portions containing Brian's instructions to the musicians.  I guess it was just one of those tapes "borrowed" but never returned.  It's sad that the full stereo backing track was not available for the remix.

Wonder where the Jasper Dailey prints and negatives are now ? I know where they used to be and what happened... hopefully they're back there now.

[18thofMay]

If you have known me for long, you may know that I have certain pet mysteries to the bottom of which I would very much like to get. 
...
If you can shed any light on these, I would be eternally grateful. 

OK, here's one of my pet mysteries ... when will Josh finish his excellent Sunflower Blog, on which he last posted 3 and 1/2 years ago, after completing song descriptions for only half of the album.

If anyone can shed any light on when Josh will complete writing descriptive info for the songs on the second half of the album, I would be eternally grateful. 

Check it out at http://recordingsunflower.blogspot.com/

Very cool read!

[MaxL]

Re: The intro the WIBN (I doubt this'll be helpful but anyway): in "The Making of Pet Sounds" book (inside the PSS-box) there is a section that mentions Barney Kessel accompanied by a photograph. In this he's holding a 12-stringed instrument (a Gibson, judging by the logo on the head) but the neck is shorter than a regular guitar and the body looks more like a bellzouki (and even more like a bouzouki. I've literally spent minutes pondering over what the instrument may be - and how the intro to WIBN was created. No closer to deciphering, unfortunately.

[c-man]

There's no way that it's Billy Strange.

But it has to be... Carol says so.

I wonder if you would be so derisive to this woman in person as you and others often are on this board? 

Given the horrible things she's said about me and my mother on her forum, whilst banning me so that I cannot reply, not to mention accusing me of theft, damn right I would. She's a liar and a fantasist who takes credit for other people's work. Fact. Don't care how old she is.

Interesting to see this trailer for a new documentary about Carol in which she is credited as bassist on Good Vibrations...a credit which new evidence suggests is probably not accurate. Although she was definitely one of the bassists on the GV "sessions", she more than likely is only on a few seconds of the fade on the released record, or not at all. She's certainly not on the part she plays in this clip. I wonder how much of this doc. just takes her word, or actually researches the work. With the long list of amazing credits that are solidly hers, its a shame she has to muddy that with a habit of claiming credit for some things that are not.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMznvEgOPhU&feature=youtu.be

Said trailer also shows the picture sleeve for The Doors "Light My Fire", a record which she most certainly wasn't on. This is going to be one interesting documentary when it comes out...

I'm sure it just takes her word, or follows the long-established myth.  The only way anyone knows for sure that she was on any GV sessions is by looking at the AFM contracts, which several people (like Russ Wapensky back in the '90s) have done.  The only way to know with a reasonable degree of accuracy if the sessions she played on were used on the final record is to compare those AFM contracts with the session tape excerpts that have been bootlegged, which a few people here have done.  But the only way to know with 100% certainty which sessions were used on the final record, and for that matter to know what INSTRUMENT she played on those three GV sessions that she attended, is to listen to the complete, unedited session tapes...and not too many people have done that! 

[DonnyL]

The intro to WIBN sounds like the Fender Electric XII played way up high.  I have this model guitar and it sonds very unique, not like the typical ric sound, but yes, more mandolin-like on certain settings.  Maybe i can record myself playing it and see if it comes close!

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

The intro to WIBN sounds like the Fender Electric XII played way up high.  I have this model guitar and it sonds very unique, not like the typical ric sound, but yes, more mandolin-like on certain settings.  Maybe i can record myself playing it and see if it comes close!

You should.

I hadn't noticed the talkback cut-in at the end of YSBIM before.  That about ices it for me--but why did Mark insist it was all live when I asked him if that's the case?

So is it safe to assume that nobody here has contacted Dan Kessel before?  The last thing I want to do is bother somebody.

[guitarfool2002]

7.  Why does there seem to be such a paucity of a photographic record for Beach Boys instrumental tracking sessions?

It does seem strange that there are so few photos out there.  You have to wonder if members of the band (and surviving relatives) have some treasure trove of photographic material not cataloged by BRI.  I also wonder if Diane Rovell has ever been asked if she ever took any photos during tracking sessions.

Wonder where the Jasper Dailey prints and negatives are now ? I know where they used to be and what happened... hopefully they're back there now.

Yes indeed, I posted the same thoughts on page 1:

7.  Why does there seem to be such a paucity of a photographic record for Beach Boys instrumental tracking sessions?

Apart from wanting to preserve the image of a "band" hard at work in the studio, when reality found session players in that role, I'd say this topic #7 is among the most frustrating and there is no quick answer.

If certain people, family members, estates, collections, collectors, et al would open up their archives and collections, we may have more of a record available. The Smile era alone...Guy Webster, Jasper, various friends and family...we know for a fact so many photos were taken of sessions, gatherings, etc, and all we get is a few of the same groups of photos being cropped and published whenever an "official" product comes out. It's frustrating.

Hal Blaine took hundreds if not thousands of photos during his session work. That archive is perhaps the gold mine.

So to sum it up: We know the Jasper negatives exist, we don't know what or how many photos Hal Blaine may still have but we know he had them in the past...putting it all in context, that is still quite a treasure trove, and I'd seriously like to know who can be contacted to facilitate a release of some kind. What is the reason behind keeping these private? Is it a private collectors' show-off kind of thing? Financial?

[Don_Zabu]

Something like this is the closest I've seen to a photo of the Beach Boys recording a track with Wrecking Crew people.

That picture won't load for me. Could you upload it to Imageshack or something?

Does it work if you follow the link:  http://cache2.asset-cache.net/xc/73989286.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=77BFBA49EF8789215ABF3343C02EA54818B609A54F8341B27E726682337DDAA2279CE20876FC2722

Nope. It just says "Access to the web page was denied".

[guitarfool2002]

All the speculation about the WIBN intro: To those folks thinking it's a nylon-string guitar, a "custom" 12-string, etc...I'll take a few minutes and tab out the intro for mandolin, then post it up. If possible, try to play it on a mandolin, if you don't own one take a trip to your local music store, printed tab in hand, and try it out on one of their mandolins. It may or may not be a revelation when you hear it in person, but it's worth a try. Again, I'm sold on mandolin or MandoGuitar style instrument until further info is revealed.

As far as the idea of custom instruments, I'd advise not thinking too far beyond the obvious answers in this case. Most of these players played the same kind of instruments in the studio. Some had huge collections of exotic instruments, including Hal, Tommy, Mike Deasy, etc. but for the most part in 1966 at least they stuck to the standards: Primarily Fender, Gibson, and Danelectro for most pop sessions. That's from film and photographic evidence.

The modifications might include swapping pickups, putting a more stable bridge on a Danelectro to replace the poor wooden bridge from the factory, changing little elements of the guitar...but nothing too radical in the way of customizing something into a new instrument.

I have looked at that photo of Barney many times, and at this point I think it was  indeed a Gibson version of a 12-string mandolin, like the Vox Mandoguitar. There were some custom 12-string and 10-string mandolins from Gibson through the years, but they're very rare and hard to find.

The idea of them was to get a mandolin sound while playing familiar guitar tuning. It's basically an upper-register 12-string, nothing too exotic. It's the same idea as those 6-string banjos which are played like a guitar, but you get the banjo sound.

Here's the photo we're focusing on with Barney:


And here is a great photo of a Vox Mandoguitar to compare:


And if you play the intro on a standard mandolin, it works just as well. Fascinating stuff, all of this...

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

The only problems I have with it being a true mandolin or mandoguitar is the fact that on some of the lower notes the courses are clearly in octaves, some which seem to go below the range of a mandolin.  There's also the brief moment where whoever is playing it tunes an open e-string course (unison this time) which sounds an octave below the open e on a mandolin.

Basically, I'm waiting for someone to tell me it's a good idea to email Dan Kessel...  I need encouragement.

[2 and a half]

Basically, I'm waiting for someone to tell me it's a good idea to email Dan Kessel...  I need encouragement.

I expect he'd be flattered by the interest in his dad's work

[guitarfool2002]

Here is the full-size photo of Barney from the PS booklet, showing more of the instrument. The more common photo got cropped somehow...here's the full deal. Notice the 12 tuning pegs:

[Sam_BFC]

The only problems I have with it being a true mandolin or mandoguitar is the fact that on some of the lower notes the courses are clearly in octaves, some which seem to go below the range of a mandolin.  There's also the brief moment where whoever is playing it tunes an open e-string course (unison this time) which sounds an octave below the open e on a mandolin.

Basically, I'm waiting for someone to tell me it's a good idea to email Dan Kessel...  I need encouragement.

Absolutely go for it.

It's funny, yesterday morning on my way to work, before I'd read this topic, I was contemplating this very subject of how they got that sound/tone on record for WIBN and how it has never really been repeated!

Great discussion so far...would be great to see any audio examples from people trying to recreate the sound.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

Here is the full-size photo of Barney from the PS booklet, showing more of the instrument. The more common photo got cropped somehow...here's the full deal. Notice the 12 tuning pegs:

What a cool lookin' thing.  Regardless of its use or non-use on WIBN, it would be neat to hear the story behind it and know what session that photo is actually from.

[guitarfool2002]

One point to consider: Seeing it full-length, you'll notice what appears to be a boom microphone stand with the microphone placed a few inches under Barney's pickguard, near the F-holes where you'd most likely mic up an acoustic mandolin. If that instrument were electric, chances are with 4 tracks in the mid 60's you would either record it acoustic or electric and not both.

In this case, if it has a mic on it, I doubt it is an electric instrument in that photo. Again, just a guess.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

That has bothered me too, but Barney could have had a pickup thrown on there, and this session whoever it was just wanted the acoustic sound.  But, was there even any such thing as a mandolin with a pickup in those days?  I mean, I'm sure they existed, but who would have wanted that sound?

[guitarfool2002]

That has bothered me too, but Barney could have had a pickup thrown on there, and this session whoever it was just wanted the acoustic sound.  But, was there even any such thing as a mandolin with a pickup in those days?  I mean, I'm sure they existed, but who would have wanted that sound?

They existed going back to the 30's, here is an example of a factory-made 30's Gibson electric mandolin:



Anything from the Gibson factory would have had a pickup and knobs on the body. An aftermarket pickup in the 60's, like a DeArmond or something, would have a wire or external control plate hanging on the lower body, looking something like this:

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

Very good.

So we're left with three choices, I think.

Standard Electric, Barney's Custom Mandola-thingy, or something else.

Pros for Standard:  Something he would have had for sure, octave courses for sure.  Cons for standard:  Nobody playing standard can quite duplicate the sound.  Out-of-tune sound to the whole thing suggests short-scale instrument.

More later...

[Andrew G. Doe]

One - the instrument in the BK pic has 12 strings, the color shot has 8.

Two - the neck looks longer in the Kessel pic, plus there's some kind of label above the top nut.

I'd say BK's axe is a custom, maybe self-built, job.

[guitarfool2002]

One - the instrument in the BK pic has 12 strings, the color shot has 8.

Two - the neck looks longer in the Kessel pic, plus there's some kind of label above the top nut.

I'd say BK's axe is a custom, maybe self-built, job.

I'm almost certain the instrument Barney is holding came from Gibson, whether it was a custom order or an actual Gibson production-line model will hopefully be addressed shortly. It has all the trademarks of a Gibson mandolin style, and no one if maybe a few master luthiers would be able to craft such a neck as that Gibson outside a shop, and if they did they probably wouldn't label it Gibson unless it was from Gibson's factory. Research is underway!

I posted the two other photos just for comparison after the question was raised about electric mandolins, and the photo was to show the differences. Nothing related to Barney's, just to clarify all that about electric versus acoustic mandolins. Barney's 12-string instrument looks acoustic, again I'm about 99.8% certain on that point.

[harveyw]

I think it's probably beyond question that the instrument we hear at the opening to Pet Sounds is the instrument we see in Kessel's photo. Definitely 12-string, definitely mandolin, probably mic-ed up rather than amplified or DI'ed.
The only other 12-string Gibson Mandolin I can find on the web is pictured about 1/3 of the way down this page:
http://www.mandolincafe.com/news/publish/printer_1266.shtml
A very different beast: each string has two sympathetic strings, which appears to be standard tuning for 12-string mandolins (which are very uncommon instruments anyway). I'd guess that Kessel's is strung more like a 12-string guitar, with an octave on the lower strings and unison on the upper; at least, that's the way it sounds on the WIBN intro. My guess is that -like the one pictured in the link- the model Barney is playing is a custom job, in the absence of being able to find any further information about such an instrument on the web, though I appreciate that's hardly conclusive.
Aeijtzsche: your point about some notes going below the normal range of a mandolin is a good one, but don't forget, we're talking a 12-string mandolin here. Standard mandolins have only 8-strings. I don't know how the tuning differs on a 12-string, but chances are it can reach lower notes than a trad model. Maybe?
Incidentally, the Vox model was in production for less than 2 years. Admittedly one of those years was 1966 (the other was 1967), but Barney would have had to be quick off the mark to get one in time for the WIBN session. And why would he want one, when he had that gorgeous Gibson model?  

[harveyw]

Also, this fellow seems to know what he's talking about...
http://uniqueguitar.blogspot.com/2010/08/to-study-barney-kessels-personal-guitar.html
 Listen to the opening lines of the Beach Boys song, "Woudn't It Be Nice."  The first four bars sound sort of like a calyopy (sic), but it is actually Kessel and another player both on 12 string guitars.  The instrument Kessel played on that track was unusual. It had a mandolin body and a short 12 string neck.

[guitarfool2002]

Two things I'm sure of:

1. There is an electric 12-string being played low, but the part in question is definitely not an electric 12-string. I played the part on my Fender 12-string, and to match that high register you're playing high up around the 14th fret, and the high octave double on the G-string in unavoidable, and it's not a pitch heard on the recording. I'm eliminating that possibility for now, it doesn't work on an actual electric 12-string.

2. The part being played on the recording is amplified. An acoustic, mic'ed mandolin or any other acoustic instrument would not project as the instrument projects on the recording.

The possibilities:

1. A Vox Mandoguitar is tuned like a standard 12-string EADGBE, and the strings are grouped in pairs tuned in the same octave, just like a standard mandolin. *That* is key to the discussion, because that is the sound we're hearing on the recording. The instrument Barney is holding appears to have that same setup, however I still think that is an acoustic instrument. A Mandoguitar was basically designed so a guitarist could play normal guitar fingerings with a mandolin sound.

2. An electric mandolin, with 8-strings, would also produce the same sound with easy fingerings.

I have tablatures for the possibilities, and I've tested them out.

[guitarfool2002]

I'd like to ask that another possibility be considered: Going back to the beginnings of this research process, let's clear the slate. How do we know the roles of Jerry Cole and Barney were not reversed, and Cole took the high part while Barney played the more static low 12-string part which we know 100% is an electric 12-string guitar?

I say this because on one of Jerry Cole's albums, a Vox guitar is pictured. Barney was a Gibson man, he had his own Gibson model signature guitar, and for electric we know he played a Telecaster. Cole, on the other hand, was releasing a lot of instrumental albums in the 60's and the possibility may be greater that he, not Barney, may have had a Mandoguitar or Fender or something similar to play the part.

How did we arrive at the conclusion of who -played-what in the first place? Was it based on that photo of Barney?

[Ebb and Flow]

Also, this fellow seems to know what he's talking about...
http://uniqueguitar.blogspot.com/2010/08/to-study-barney-kessels-personal-guitar.html
 Listen to the opening lines of the Beach Boys song, "Woudn't It Be Nice."  The first four bars sound sort of like a calyopy (sic), but it is actually Kessel and another player both on 12 string guitars.  The instrument Kessel played on that track was unusual. It had a mandolin body and a short 12 string neck.

He seems to have based that info on my "Behind The Sounds" video, which was based on the book for The PS Sessions set...which may end up being incorrect.  I did attempt to be ambiguous in my notes at the time but people will run with it.  If guitarfool can verify what exact make and model Kessel has in that photo I can add a note clarifying what exactly he's holding in that photograph.

How did we arrive at the conclusion of who -played-what in the first place? Was it based on that photo of Barney?

I'm not sure it's possible to fully verify this, even by close examination of the session tape since both guitars were DI'd.  I think people have just assumed that if a track featured an esoteric guitar part it must have been Kessel playing it.