SMiLE Boxset - Hidden tracks?

[JohnMill]

Getting off the "Truck Driving Man" topic for a minute.  Does anyone think the "Vosse Posse" segments have a place on this boxset?  I obviously don't expect them to include full length segments of these recordings but short excerpts here and there could add to the overall quality of this release.  Sort of like how they've included some radio promos on other box sets?

Thoughts?

I don't think I have heard of the Vosse Posse segments. What are they?

You probably have heard them as they've all been around for quite a few years now.  They go by the titles on bootleg as "SMiLE Era Party", "Vega-tables Arguments" and all of the stuff encompassed on the "Psychedelic Sounds" bootleg.  They are basically tapes of Brian, Michael Vosse,  Jules Siegel and various others making experimental recordings during the "SMiLE" sessions.

[The Shift]

Revised slightly...  Nothing better to do tonight than listen to the isolated vocal.

I'll concede "Land" is in there, but it's definitely "I'm a gas man" and "I'm out of luck"!

Truck driving man do what you can
High-tail your load off the road
Out of night-life-I'm a gas man
I don't believe I gotta grieve
I'm out of luck
With a buck and a booth
Catchin' on to the truth
In the vast past, the last gasp
Land in the dust, trust what you must
Catch as catch can

How is it that we have the "reconnected telephone" lyrics but not this part that was actually recorded?  Where did the telephone lyrics originate from, Frank Holmes?

Who says it wasn't recorded ?  Granted we don't have a copy of it... but to my sure knowledge, no-one in the collector's world has a copy of "(Wouldn't It Be Nice To) Live Again" - but it exists.

Are you saying....

[rab2591]

Getting off the "Truck Driving Man" topic for a minute.  Does anyone think the "Vosse Posse" segments have a place on this boxset?  I obviously don't expect them to include full length segments of these recordings but short excerpts here and there could add to the overall quality of this release.  Sort of like how they've included some radio promos on other box sets?

Thoughts?

I can only imagine them being included in 15-30 second clips....not unlike the 'Dog Barking Session' from Pet Sounds Sessions. But I doubt the assemblers will want to 'waste' disc space with a lot of the psychedelic skits. Personally, I'd love to see a few minutes of that stuff included in the set - some of it shows a lot of insight into Brian's social scene at the time.

[JohnMill]

Getting off the "Truck Driving Man" topic for a minute.  Does anyone think the "Vosse Posse" segments have a place on this boxset?  I obviously don't expect them to include full length segments of these recordings but short excerpts here and there could add to the overall quality of this release.  Sort of like how they've included some radio promos on other box sets?

Thoughts?

I can only imagine them being included in 15-30 second clips....not unlike the 'Dog Barking Session' from Pet Sounds Sessions. But I doubt the assemblers will want to 'waste' disc space with a lot of the psychedelic skits. Personally, I'd love to see a few minutes of that stuff included in the set - some of it shows a lot of insight into Brian's social scene at the time.

Yeah that is really all I'd want as well and would even accept them as "hidden tracks" (which I why I started the discussion in this thread to begin with).  They are never going to be the "meat and potatoes" of the set but there are a lot of interesting recordings that Brian made during this time which probably would've never found official release on a conventional Beach Boys album but are nonetheless insightful as to the overall atmosphere of the sessions.  The session that has come to be known as "George Fell Into His French Horn" would be another interesting hidden track.  Not the entire session itself but just the bit with the "Talking Horns".

[The Shift]

Getting off the "Truck Driving Man" topic for a minute.  Does anyone think the "Vosse Posse" segments have a place on this boxset?  I obviously don't expect them to include full length segments of these recordings but short excerpts here and there could add to the overall quality of this release.  Sort of like how they've included some radio promos on other box sets?

Thoughts?

I can only imagine them being included in 15-30 second clips....not unlike the 'Dog Barking Session' from Pet Sounds Sessions. But I doubt the assemblers will want to 'waste' disc space with a lot of the psychedelic skits. Personally, I'd love to see a few minutes of that stuff included in the set - some of it shows a lot of insight into Brian's social scene at the time.

Yeah that is really all I'd want as well and would even accept them as "hidden tracks" (which I why I started the discussion in this thread to begin with).  They are never going to be the "meat and potatoes" of the set but there are a lot of interesting recordings that Brian made during this time which probably would've never found official release on a conventional Beach Boys album but are nonetheless insightful as to the overall atmosphere of the sessions.  The session that has come to be known as "George Fell Into His French Horn" would be another interesting hidden track.  Not the entire session itself but just the bit with the "Talking Horns".

I think these are too interesting to be thrown away as hidden tracks. As mentioned, they're a terrific insight into what was happening in Brian's circle while the band was away touring, and his ideas were developing.   The notion of "hidden track" strikes me as inappropriate for this stuff -  I'd like notes, about who the players are, what the date was, what was recorded that sam day or around that date, so that we can gain some insight into the part that skit played in inspiring Brian's creative studio processes.  All the "swim swim fishy fishy" stuff, for instance, puts me in mind of the Water Chant  (sorry, I mean "Wah-doo" Chant) but I don't know how they relate time-wise*.

Brian was a flbberdigibbet at the time and ioeas came and went in a nanosecond.

Hidden tracks tend not to have liner notes, due to the fact that they'd then not really be hidden. Everything important and relevant should be annotated. Notes is what we want.

Else how we gonna graduate from the University of SMiLE?

* I know, I know, I should go to Andrew's site, but I'm working and you guys is distracting me enough already!

[The Shift]

The session that has come to be known as "George Fell Into His French Horn" would be another interesting hidden track.  Not the entire session itself but just the bit with the "Talking Horns".

"Session"? How can you be sure this was a mere session? I suspect this was the missing fourth suite that would have made upSide Four of the double album we all know SMiLE was meant to be. The story of how Barnyard Billy and his pal George Gershwin fell into their instruments.

Dom's essay will reveal all!

[bgas]

Maybe Capitol could release the Vosse Posse sessions as a separate set.
"If you bought The Smile Sessions, you'll want these too!"
I know: send proof of purchase and $5 and we'll send you these sessions as a bonus....

[buddhahat]

Revised slightly...  Nothing better to do tonight than listen to the isolated vocal.

I'll concede "Land" is in there, but it's definitely "I'm a gas man" and "I'm out of luck"!

Truck driving man do what you can
High-tail your load off the road
Out of night-life-I'm a gas man
I don't believe I gotta grieve
I'm out of luck
With a buck and a booth
Catchin' on to the truth
In the vast past, the last gasp
Land in the dust, trust what you must
Catch as catch can

How is it that we have the "reconnected telephone" lyrics but not this part that was actually recorded?  Where did the telephone lyrics originate from, Frank Holmes?

Who says it wasn't recorded ?  Granted we don't have a copy of it... but to my sure knowledge, no-one in the collector's world has a copy of "(Wouldn't It Be Nice To) Live Again" - but it exists.

Are you saying the recording of reconnected telephone line exists, but in that cryptic, indirect AGD way, or am I reading too much into your posts, as usual?

[bgas]

Ya'll lost me again. I'm doing my best to follow this, but what is >>recording of reconnected telephone line <<  ?

[Rocker]

Getting off the "Truck Driving Man" topic for a minute.  Does anyone think the "Vosse Posse" segments have a place on this boxset?  I obviously don't expect them to include full length segments of these recordings but short excerpts here and there could add to the overall quality of this release.  Sort of like how they've included some radio promos on other box sets?

Thoughts?

I don't think I have heard of the Vosse Posse segments. What are they?

You probably have heard them as they've all been around for quite a few years now.  They go by the titles on bootleg as "SMiLE Era Party", "Vega-tables Arguments" and all of the stuff encompassed on the "Psychedelic Sounds" bootleg.  They are basically tapes of Brian, Michael Vosse,  Jules Siegel and various others making experimental recordings during the "SMiLE" sessions.

Allright. Thanks ! Yes, I know them of course

[buddhahat]

Ya'll lost me again. I'm doing my best to follow this, but what is >>recording of reconnected telephone line <<  ?

some extra lyrics for cabinessence. I don't have them to hand. I remeber them being discussed in an old thread And I don't think anyone could work out where in the song they would have fit. I think one thought was that they may have been an equivalent to the truck driving man lyrics i.e. running underneath the who ran section. I may be wrong about all this.

[?]

Taken from http://smilealbum.tripod.com/songs.html:

“These lyrics are out of ‘Cabin Essence’:

    ‘Reconnected telephone direct
    dialing;
    Different color cords to your
    Extension,
    Don’t forget to mention
    This is a recording.’

And below that, it has:

    ‘Even though the echoes through
    my mind
    Have filtered through the pines,
    I came and found my peace,
    And this is not a recording.’

Then there was:

    “Doobie doo,
    Doobie doo,
    Or not doobie!’”


-Frank Holmes (Endless Summer Quarterly, March 1997 -Beard & Dempsey, editors)

AGD had a good point though.  I should have said "released" rather than "recorded" in my earlier post.  I'd love to hear this segment if it exists.

[bgas]

Thanxx. I pulled out my copy and read it again.  

[JohnMill]

Getting off the "Truck Driving Man" topic for a minute.  Does anyone think the "Vosse Posse" segments have a place on this boxset?  I obviously don't expect them to include full length segments of these recordings but short excerpts here and there could add to the overall quality of this release.  Sort of like how they've included some radio promos on other box sets?

Thoughts?

I can only imagine them being included in 15-30 second clips....not unlike the 'Dog Barking Session' from Pet Sounds Sessions. But I doubt the assemblers will want to 'waste' disc space with a lot of the psychedelic skits. Personally, I'd love to see a few minutes of that stuff included in the set - some of it shows a lot of insight into Brian's social scene at the time.

Yeah that is really all I'd want as well and would even accept them as "hidden tracks" (which I why I started the discussion in this thread to begin with).  They are never going to be the "meat and potatoes" of the set but there are a lot of interesting recordings that Brian made during this time which probably would've never found official release on a conventional Beach Boys album but are nonetheless insightful as to the overall atmosphere of the sessions.  The session that has come to be known as "George Fell Into His French Horn" would be another interesting hidden track.  Not the entire session itself but just the bit with the "Talking Horns".

I think these are too interesting to be thrown away as hidden tracks. As mentioned, they're a terrific insight into what was happening in Brian's circle while the band was away touring, and his ideas were developing.   The notion of "hidden track" strikes me as inappropriate for this stuff -  I'd like notes, about who the players are, what the date was, what was recorded that sam day or around that date, so that we can gain some insight into the part that skit played in inspiring Brian's creative studio processes.  All the "swim swim fishy fishy" stuff, for instance, puts me in mind of the Water Chant  (sorry, I mean "Wah-doo" Chant) but I don't know how they relate time-wise*.

Brian was a flbberdigibbet at the time and ioeas came and went in a nanosecond.

Hidden tracks tend not to have liner notes, due to the fact that they'd then not really be hidden. Everything important and relevant should be annotated. Notes is what we want.

Else how we gonna graduate from the University of SMiLE?

* I know, I know, I should go to Andrew's site, but I'm working and you guys is distracting me enough already!

In essence I agree with everything you wrote but it's important to remember that this set will have to be marketed to the general public who probably will have little to no interest in the non-musical segments on this boxset.  That is why I feel that if they are included at all that a few of them will be slotted into the sessions portion of the boxset (again see the "Caroline No!" promos on "PSS") or hidden as bonus tracks at the end of the disc.  I think the "Talking Horns" would actually make a fine bonus track, it's irreverent and weird enough to stick at the end of the disc where the everyday listener would either have a laugh at it or think WTF is that which is just the kind of affect hidden tracks are supposed to have.

[hypehat]

IIRC, and this is a bit of stretch of the old noodle, but the 'session' of Vegetable skits, Water skits, Brian falling in the mic and so on (not the cabbie, or Lifeboat tape) are from the day of the first Surf's Up session. Is that right? I think I read it on Project Smile, but have no idea of its veracity.