SMiLE Sessions box set!

[Andrew G. Doe]

Did you guys just run Philcohen out of town? Jeeze. I rarely know what arguments here are in relation to, usually over something totally stupid and pedantic. Phil may be a pessimist, but he's just expressing his opinion. They've promised to release SMiLE a dozen times over 40 years, I think there's good reason to be skeptical, and I wouldn't call the assertion that the project is quite fragile particularly contentious. Clearly the long drought in news is getting to everyone whether they would admit it or not. So I hope Phil doesn't leave because some of you are freaking out on him.

Number of times that Smile has been officially announced as being released since 1967 - 0

Current state of project (except in Phil's warped psyche) - robust.

[Andrew G. Doe]

He's not just expressing his opinion, which he's entirely free to do, he's pissing people off

This is exactly what people were freaking out on me about, because I was "pissing people off", which anyone should recognize is pretty silly. You say you don't care if he just expresses his opinion, only if he pisses people off, but what are people getting pissed about? The opinion he's expressing.

But you weren't standing there repeating "not gonna happen... why is no-one telling me anything ?... not gonna happen... why is no-one telling me anything ?... not gonna happen... why is no-one telling me anything ?" over and over and over and OVER again. It's not the opinion, it's the method of delivery and the constant repetition. Your posts maybe be many things, but they're never boring.  

[stack-o-tracks]

If the band members already signed off on the release then wouldn't we hear about another Mike Love lawsuit before we hear about the Sessions being cancelled?

Everybody's so pessimistic! And besides, all of you have already heard everything that's going to be on the ultra deluxe 4 disc edition. 

[Dunderhead]

That's nonsense, "being boring" isn't a good reason to act like a such a jerk to somebody. Some people here take disagreements way too personally and I really think you all need to lighten up and stop escalating these arguments to the point where posters no longer feel welcome. We need all the Beach Boys fans we can get and just because you think somebody is "boring" is no reason to bite their head off and chase them away.

[seanmurd]

I tried to change the direction of the thread and put out some Pepper vs. SMiLE thoughts, but they were trampled by the non-existent "debate" between Phil and the rest of the sentient universe. I'm not a "pile on" type myself, but it DOES seem that Phil is willfully ignoring the many (and significant) differences between this time and all the other times we were "promised" SMiLE's release.

[Jason]

It's not just a matter of disagreement, it's a matter of people here taking other's opinions much too personally. I wouldn't say RBB that your posts the last couple of pages have been calm, understanding "agree to disagree" type posts, rather reading them I get the impression that you're about to throw your computer across the room in anger. I totally sympathize with Phil, when all I wanted to do was post a few fun things with some musings a lot of posters were real jerks about it, and still mention and mock me all the time even when those arguments have long since ended. As obnoxious as you guys think Phil is, I really think some of you are being far ruder and more obnoxious than Phil, so take a chill pill.

No, my posts were not calm or understanding. "Calm" and "understanding" both imply agreement. Both statements that I replied to today were so ridiculous that walking on eggshells would not have delivered the message properly. This is discussion and heated discussion at that. If you want to be reminded constantly that everything is ok and that you're always right and a pox on the morons who disagree with you, go to church. No compromise was ever reached on both statements I replied to because both people I replied to never offered their reactions. Therefore, with no evidence to support disagreement with my platform there was nothing to agree to disagree about on my part because no reply from them implies agreement with my platform. Of course I'll stand corrected if a reply is forthcoming and I will respond accordingly.

I'm not telling anyone to leave because I disagree with them. I'd rather have honest disagreement than phony complacency. Obviously much of the board will disagree with that platform, but c'est la vie. If you come on here to constantly tell the fan base what they want to hear, you're going to be doing a lot of talking to yourself.

[Roger Ryan]

I tried to change the direction of the thread and put out some Pepper vs. SMiLE thoughts, but they were trampled by the non-existent "debate" between Phil and the rest of the sentient universe. I'm not a "pile on" type myself, but it DOES seem that Phil is willfully ignoring the many (and significant) differences between this time and all the other times we were "promised" SMiLE's release.

By the way, I liked you PEPPER analogy - it was nicely-written and fun.

[Andrew G. Doe]

That's nonsense, "being boring" isn't a good reason to act like a such a jerk to somebody. Some people here take disagreements way too personally and I really think you all need to lighten up and stop escalating these arguments to the point where posters no longer feel welcome. We need all the Beach Boys fans we can get and just because you think somebody is "boring" is no reason to bite their head off and chase them away.

... and this is what happens when you try to be nice about someone, extend a small olive branch.

Fact - by their actions, some posters make themselves unwelcome. Phil, oldsurferdude, Bobby California/Walfisch, Carol Kaye, summerinparadise.flac.. the list is long and growing.

We need an 'ignore' function on the board - sure we used to have one.

[Andrew G. Doe]

If you want to be reminded constantly that everything is ok and that you're always right and a pox on the morons who disagree with you, go to church.

Or the Bloo.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I tried to change the direction of the thread and put out some Pepper vs. SMiLE thoughts, but they were trampled by the non-existent "debate" between Phil and the rest of the sentient universe. I'm not a "pile on" type myself, but it DOES seem that Phil is willfully ignoring the many (and significant) differences between this time and all the other times we were "promised" SMiLE's release.

I for one enjoyed your post, even with my aversion to the Beatles

[Jason]

If you want to be reminded constantly that everything is ok and that you're always right and a pox on the morons who disagree with you, go to church.

Or the Bloo.

What's the difference? Both are full of sh*t! 

[earcandy]

Imagine the wild "Pepper" comps we'd all be dreaming up 30 years later -- and they'd all be wildly off the mark, of course. And to make matters MORE complicated, imagine that Paul resurrects the project in 2003 and releases "Paul McCartney Presents Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band"! Oh my God!! "A Day In The Life" is in the middle now! "Mr. Kite" is a pirate!! All we've known for 35 years has been wrong!!! (Cue gargling, strangling sounds as "Pepper Nerds" choke on their cherished theories.)

Oh, the thought of Paul doing that boggles the mind!   He inserts "Ebony and Ivory" as the centerpiece of the "third movement"!

But I think "George Harrison Presents Sgt. Krishna" would have been a mindblower...A Krishna trilogy, as there are clues that every Pepper song was influenced by Krishna Consciousness.

[vintagemusic]

As the release gets closer and I check in for any updates, I realize,
more of the Hoffmanites are logging in and passing some wind.
Over there is an old boys club that will gang up and rip apart those
who disagree, are unsuspecting, or don't brown nose Hoffman.

I hope that doesn't happen here. Having said that, Clearly Phil Cohen
is wrong about the SMiLE project not being forthcoming. Maybe it's just
fear, it would be ok to say, gee I am afraid I have been disappointed in the
past, but to hatch all these conspiracy theories about how the whole upcoming
SMiLE release is not solid, is not dealing with reality.

I disagree with the whole SMiLE was never finished you cant compare it to Pepper
or Pet Sounds. Pepper would have still been Pepper if one or two songs were changed
or the running order was changed. You can take Good Vibrations, Cabin Essence, Vegetables

Surf's Up, Wonderful, Hero's and Villians, Wind Chimes, Mrs O'Leary's Cow, you can quibble about
the last few songs and the running order, and certainly it makes a difference. But that's enough right
there to rival Pepper or any album. I look forward to the "As close as they can get" disc one.

True it wasn't totally finished, mostly it wasn't totally assembled. Assembly is certainly important, but
there is enough there to read between the lines and see it for the great work it is.

If they had been deliberate and chosen this song or that song, and assembled what they felt were
the best pieces, they were at worst a couple songs or lead vocals away, from what would have been
a great and succesful album.

 an albums running order is certainly important, especially on vinyl with side one and side two, but it's
not the be all and end all of things.

[Dunderhead]

It's not just a matter of disagreement, it's a matter of people here taking other's opinions much too personally. I wouldn't say RBB that your posts the last couple of pages have been calm, understanding "agree to disagree" type posts, rather reading them I get the impression that you're about to throw your computer across the room in anger. I totally sympathize with Phil, when all I wanted to do was post a few fun things with some musings a lot of posters were real jerks about it, and still mention and mock me all the time even when those arguments have long since ended. As obnoxious as you guys think Phil is, I really think some of you are being far ruder and more obnoxious than Phil, so take a chill pill.

No, my posts were not calm or understanding. "Calm" and "understanding" both imply agreement. Both statements that I replied to today were so ridiculous that walking on eggshells would not have delivered the message properly. This is discussion and heated discussion at that. If you want to be reminded constantly that everything is ok and that you're always right and a pox on the morons who disagree with you, go to church. No compromise was ever reached on both statements I replied to because both people I replied to never offered their reactions. Therefore, with no evidence to support disagreement with my platform there was nothing to agree to disagree about on my part because no reply from them implies agreement with my platform. Of course I'll stand corrected if a reply is forthcoming and I will respond accordingly.

I'm not telling anyone to leave because I disagree with them. I'd rather have honest disagreement than phony complacency. Obviously much of the board will disagree with that platform, but c'est la vie. If you come on here to constantly tell the fan base what they want to hear, you're going to be doing a lot of talking to yourself.

Calm and understanding imply agreement? I think calm and understanding imply being courteous and polite and not treating people who disagree with you like they're the scum of the earth. It shouldn't being anyone any pleasure that they made a member here feel unwelcome, it's a sign that maybe they're taking things too far. Personally I've felt much less welcome here in the last few months and have avoided posting much due to the rudeness and insults.

If you're so 100% positive that Phil is wrong, then what does it matter? If there's no chance that further complications might arise, than why be a jerk about it? It will come out regardless of what Phil says so why let it bother you so much? It seems people are just taking their frustrations regarding this project's protracted release schedule out on Phil, which isn't cool. Making people scared to post here is not something to be proud of so I'd really suggest reigning in the hyperbole and showing a modicum of respect towards other posters.

[Peter Reum]

Keep the faith ...The Smile Sessions will arrive soon...

[rogerlancelot]

I tried to change the direction of the thread and put out some Pepper vs. SMiLE thoughts, but they were trampled by the non-existent "debate" between Phil and the rest of the sentient universe. I'm not a "pile on" type myself, but it DOES seem that Phil is willfully ignoring the many (and significant) differences between this time and all the other times we were "promised" SMiLE's release.

I loved your post very much. And to add to it I would have to say that Pet Sounds and Sgt. Pepper are two of the very few albums that I love to listen all of the way through without skipping a track. That hardly (if ever) happens with newer artists' albums IMO.

[Andrew G. Doe]

It seems people are just taking their frustrations regarding this project's protracted release schedule out on Phil, which isn't cool.

Maybe I'm missing something here (I'm being disingenuous, of course - I know I'm not), but the only person I've noticed to be in any way frustrated over the impending release of The Smile Sessions is Phil Cohen: our frustration is with his constant repetition of "why hasn't it been released yet ?... why aren't they telling us anything ?... why don't I know all about it ?". He's like a five-year-old on a long car journey, and if I were the driver, I'd leave him at the side of the road, preferably somewhere where there are large and exceedingly dangerous wild animals. That'd shut the bugger up.  

[buddhahat]

I tried to change the direction of the thread and put out some Pepper vs. SMiLE thoughts, but they were trampled by the non-existent "debate" between Phil and the rest of the sentient universe. I'm not a "pile on" type myself, but it DOES seem that Phil is willfully ignoring the many (and significant) differences between this time and all the other times we were "promised" SMiLE's release.

Hey I enjoyed your post about sgt Pepper!

I think Phil Cohen loves the smile music but is a victim of his own negative predictions. I have to say, there's only so much I can read "this is not going to happen", without feeling like I'm bashing my head against a wall, although if he has other contributions to make I actively encourage him to return to the forum. If he would post once in a while about what he likes in the music, rather than focusing on all his worst fears, he might get a warmer response.

Also has no one noticed Turtle 13's post about UNcut's promise of a review in next month's issue? News, surely?!

[Mike's Beard]

We all had a healthy degree of skepticism when the project was first mentioned, but since then we've had confirmation from, let's see, Brian, Mike, VDP, Mark & Alan, the record company, plus features and tie-ins with major music magazines. Yet still Phil repeatedly claims it's not gonna happen with near certainty that's becoming increasingly maddening to the point that he's become a major bringdown. What will it take Phil? Brian Wilson to sign a confirmation in blood?

[Shady]

Just posted this message on the Steve Hoffmann SMiLE tread:

Browsing through the new issue of Uncut magazine in Tower Records Dublin today, at the end of the new music review section, beside recommendations, has a box which notes three upcoming reviews in next months edition: Beach Boys.........SMiLE sessions.

AGD's educated guess of September release looking more likely........

I was in the exact same tower records today and caught that little nugget..

SMiLE is coming and it seems it's coming very soon 

How did the biggest smile news in months get completely bypassed lol

[hypehat]

Ok, that's kinda amazing. That means the thing is potentialy going to be in the hands of journalists in a week or so, which means..... LEAKS 

[Jason]

It's not just a matter of disagreement, it's a matter of people here taking other's opinions much too personally. I wouldn't say RBB that your posts the last couple of pages have been calm, understanding "agree to disagree" type posts, rather reading them I get the impression that you're about to throw your computer across the room in anger. I totally sympathize with Phil, when all I wanted to do was post a few fun things with some musings a lot of posters were real jerks about it, and still mention and mock me all the time even when those arguments have long since ended. As obnoxious as you guys think Phil is, I really think some of you are being far ruder and more obnoxious than Phil, so take a chill pill.

No, my posts were not calm or understanding. "Calm" and "understanding" both imply agreement. Both statements that I replied to today were so ridiculous that walking on eggshells would not have delivered the message properly. This is discussion and heated discussion at that. If you want to be reminded constantly that everything is ok and that you're always right and a pox on the morons who disagree with you, go to church. No compromise was ever reached on both statements I replied to because both people I replied to never offered their reactions. Therefore, with no evidence to support disagreement with my platform there was nothing to agree to disagree about on my part because no reply from them implies agreement with my platform. Of course I'll stand corrected if a reply is forthcoming and I will respond accordingly.

I'm not telling anyone to leave because I disagree with them. I'd rather have honest disagreement than phony complacency. Obviously much of the board will disagree with that platform, but c'est la vie. If you come on here to constantly tell the fan base what they want to hear, you're going to be doing a lot of talking to yourself.

Calm and understanding imply agreement? I think calm and understanding imply being courteous and polite and not treating people who disagree with you like they're the scum of the earth. It shouldn't being anyone any pleasure that they made a member here feel unwelcome, it's a sign that maybe they're taking things too far. Personally I've felt much less welcome here in the last few months and have avoided posting much due to the rudeness and insults.

If you're so 100% positive that Phil is wrong, then what does it matter? If there's no chance that further complications might arise, than why be a jerk about it? It will come out regardless of what Phil says so why let it bother you so much? It seems people are just taking their frustrations regarding this project's protracted release schedule out on Phil, which isn't cool. Making people scared to post here is not something to be proud of so I'd really suggest reigning in the hyperbole and showing a modicum of respect towards other posters.

As far as being treated like the scum of the earth for disagreeing with someone, I've had that charge thrown at me several times by people far less interesting and far less challenging than Phil. I'm not happy that Phil feels unwelcome. I was not out to make anyone feel unwelcome. Others here (they know who they are so I won't name names) have done far more to try and make Phil and others here feel unwelcome, and I think that is very wrong.

When I told Phil he was making this thread into a dog's dinner and to knock it off (which I now realize was a poor choice of wording) was a much more long-winded way of saying "yes, I GET it". Done differently I would have just left that part of my post out, but it's history now, so there's no changing that. If that made him feel unwelcome then yes, I am willing to call a spade a spade and admit wrongdoing. Will it make Phil come back? Maybe. Maybe not. I was much more willing to let Phil's theories go under my radar because, frankly, I found many of them to be rather uninteresting; they were ideas I had heard regurgitated so many times before.

Problem with being a Beach Boys fan is that we are all so set in our ways of thinking with regards to our favorite band that we seem to have trouble considering the contrary viewpoint and that is something of which everyone here, including myself, is guilty.

As far as people being afraid of posting here, that's a bit of an overreaction to our conversations of late. If you're nervous about someone's responses to your remarks, maybe it's best to just not talk. But the worst that'll happen here is that a few people will get their panties in a knot and issue demands to the mods to hand out some immediate banhammers. However, "this guy is a moron", "will someone just ban this f*ckwit please?", "enough with the mod politics and ban this f*cker, please", "he keeps telling me Brian Wilson is a genius", and "over and over the crow cries uncover the cornfield" are not valid reasons to ban people. Grow thicker skins, for Christ's sake. That goes for all here. This is a webforum. No one here knows each other beyond mere acquaintance with a few exceptions. Maybe it's best that way. It's not like this forum is your complete and total life. There are bigger issues in the world. Do the math.

[JMZ]

Also has no one noticed Turtle 13's post about UNcut's promise of a review in next month's issue? News, surely?!

So this means a press release is ready ?

[rogerlancelot]

I just googled "smile sessions leak" and came up with 3 sites offering it all upped within the last 3 days. Anybody here brave enough to chance it? I'm going to wait until I get home to my own computer.....

[Jason]

I do not envy the amount of sh*t people will find on their computers trying to get that.