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637994 Posts in 25499 Topics by 3626 Members - Latest Member: smiley wayback September 25, 2018, 04:04:20 PM
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 11 
 on: Today at 11:20:53 AM 
Started by rickymyfataar - Last post by c-man
"D.W. Suite" -- Lindsey Buckingham

Not to mention "Bang the Drum" from the same album, which I've always loved and thought was about Brian on top of the BB influenced music. Somehow the pauses with faint children's laughter in the background capture the essence of SMiLE for me even though the song and production doesn't sound at all like SMiLE. One of my favorite tracks by Lindsey.

Not to mention much of his work on Tusk!

No doubt! Lindsey was obviously and openly a big fan of Brian's sounds.

Consider his songs for National Lampoon's Vacation. I know, they're not as often discussed musically as his work on Tusk and other efforts solo and with the Mac, but Holiday Road's main hook which everyone knows owes a sonic and musical debt to Brian Wilson when that falsetto melody stretching the word "road" over multiple chords blasts out of the speakers. It's the same effect which Brian loved and then proceeded to use in his own melodies and songs after hearing Ronnie sing "Be My Baby" over the changing chords underneath.

Then consider the B-side, Lindsey's "Dancin Across The USA", also made famous years after the film by Family Guy. This track could have been a Love You track, just listen to the vocals and the basic synth-driven shuffle backing track. It could be a BB's or BW outtake if it weren't a solo Lindsey soundtrack tune. Heck, the first two vocal notes on "we went" sound like the late 70's Mike Love did the vocal! And Lindsey phrases the vocals in the verses using a delivery and tone very similar to Carl Wilson.

Holiday Road and Dancin Across The USA, give them a fresh listen to hear the influences:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcTLeuFni7s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KPi9KarAoM

Ironically, Brian reportedly had a new tune called "Dancin' U.S.A" in the early '80s, around the time of the "Cocaine Sessions" - this was reported in the pages of the "Add Some Music" fanzine circa late '81.

 12 
 on: Today at 10:55:50 AM 
Started by rickymyfataar - Last post by jparis51
"D.W. Suite" -- Lindsey Buckingham

Not to mention "Bang the Drum" from the same album, which I've always loved and thought was about Brian on top of the BB influenced music. Somehow the pauses with faint children's laughter in the background capture the essence of SMiLE for me even though the song and production doesn't sound at all like SMiLE. One of my favorite tracks by Lindsey.

Not to mention much of his work on Tusk!

No doubt! Lindsey was obviously and openly a big fan of Brian's sounds.

Consider his songs for National Lampoon's Vacation. I know, they're not as often discussed musically as his work on Tusk and other efforts solo and with the Mac, but Holiday Road's main hook which everyone knows owes a sonic and musical debt to Brian Wilson when that falsetto melody stretching the word "road" over multiple chords blasts out of the speakers. It's the same effect which Brian loved and then proceeded to use in his own melodies and songs after hearing Ronnie sing "Be My Baby" over the changing chords underneath.

Then consider the B-side, Lindsey's "Dancin Across The USA", also made famous years after the film by Family Guy. This track could have been a Love You track, just listen to the vocals and the basic synth-driven shuffle backing track. It could be a BB's or BW outtake if it weren't a solo Lindsey soundtrack tune. Heck, the first two vocal notes on "we went" sound like the late 70's Mike Love did the vocal! And Lindsey phrases the vocals in the verses using a delivery and tone very similar to Carl Wilson.

Holiday Road and Dancin Across The USA, give them a fresh listen to hear the influences:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcTLeuFni7s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KPi9KarAoM

I've always loved both these songs but I never thought about the vocals on Dancin' that way, agree completely!

And Holiday Road, well I'd wager Brian would have had dogs barking out the beat if he'd had digital sampling in 1966...

 13 
 on: Today at 10:19:46 AM 
Started by Smile4ever - Last post by Rocker
Back In The U.S.S.R. (2018 Mix)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zd1zG9isRqI



The Beatles (White Album) - Anniversary Releases

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dhy26KIOEI



The Beatles (White Album) Anniversary Releases - Giles Martin & Sam Okell

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ve1vaEIXhV0



The Unheard White Album: An Exclusive First Listen

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/beatles-unheard-white-album-exclusive-first-listen-727928/

 14 
 on: Today at 10:09:16 AM 
Started by rickymyfataar - Last post by guitarfool2002
"D.W. Suite" -- Lindsey Buckingham

Not to mention "Bang the Drum" from the same album, which I've always loved and thought was about Brian on top of the BB influenced music. Somehow the pauses with faint children's laughter in the background capture the essence of SMiLE for me even though the song and production doesn't sound at all like SMiLE. One of my favorite tracks by Lindsey.

Not to mention much of his work on Tusk!

No doubt! Lindsey was obviously and openly a big fan of Brian's sounds.

Consider his songs for National Lampoon's Vacation. I know, they're not as often discussed musically as his work on Tusk and other efforts solo and with the Mac, but Holiday Road's main hook which everyone knows owes a sonic and musical debt to Brian Wilson when that falsetto melody stretching the word "road" over multiple chords blasts out of the speakers. It's the same effect which Brian loved and then proceeded to use in his own melodies and songs after hearing Ronnie sing "Be My Baby" over the changing chords underneath.

Then consider the B-side, Lindsey's "Dancin Across The USA", also made famous years after the film by Family Guy. This track could have been a Love You track, just listen to the vocals and the basic synth-driven shuffle backing track. It could be a BB's or BW outtake if it weren't a solo Lindsey soundtrack tune. Heck, the first two vocal notes on "we went" sound like the late 70's Mike Love did the vocal! And Lindsey phrases the vocals in the verses using a delivery and tone very similar to Carl Wilson.

Holiday Road and Dancin Across The USA, give them a fresh listen to hear the influences:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcTLeuFni7s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KPi9KarAoM

 15 
 on: Today at 09:59:10 AM 
Started by Magic Transistor Radio - Last post by guitarfool2002
I pride myself in being a truth seeker. Something that I realize is that the truth is not always what I want it to be. If you can't tell by my profile name, I love the Jack Rieley era! I think that that along with 65-67, were the artistic heights of the bands career, and 68-70 as well as Love You were not far behind. However, I recall a quote by Carl criticizing Jack Rieley or someone for not listening to all sides. While Carl leaned toward the artistic side, he also respected all voices in the group when he was a leader. He may have faught for Mike and Al's songs to be included on Surfs Up-Holland. Perhaps that had something to do with his fight with Dennis.  

As for the audience shouting for the hits during the newer songs, I will say that I wasn't born until 1977. I have just read things. But my guess is that increased in 1974 after Jack Rieley left and Endless Summer came out. When it went platinum,  it is obvious to me that the majority of fans wanted the hits. Personally,  I believe it was the worst thing to happen to them artistically. They were building something great. Holland showed hints of where they might go next. I feel that Pacific Ocean Blue was the next step.

Also, as a truth seeker,  I try to understand all people's perspective. Personally,  I hate the 80s and 90s Beach Boys for the most part. But let's try and look at this objectively here. In the late 70s, all 3 Wilson brothers were in a bad place. None of them were capable of leading the band at that point. I'm sure Mike worried about the future of the band. I didn't see him fighting for power in 1973 for example. He actually says good things about that era to this very day! He says he liked Blondie, Ricky and Jack Rieley.  He always has good things to say about Carl. He seemed to support Brian's leadership for a time in the mid 70s, but probably realized that Brian was slipping away again. Al voted with Mike because he saw the same thing
 Brian became less interested and sold his vote to Mike. Perhaps I wish he sold it to Carl, but he was also in a bad place at the time. Carl cleaned up and decided to do his own thing. When he returned, he was more interested in being a moderator than a leader. Think about it this way, there were wives and children depending on them. Carl was probably more concerned with the business side than artistic side at this point.

To me, it seems the Beach Boys have been cursed to being a fun in the sun oldies act. I hate this fact, but think about it. Brian was working on Smile and had a nervous breakdown. The following albums were great, but not commercially accessible. In 74 after Holland, Endless Summer came out and went Platinum. They were fighting their own fans at that point! As Carl said in the 1980 tv interview, they fought their old image for years, but realized that's what the fans wanted.

I don't agree with Mike on several things,  but I also don't think he is pure evil, or as egotistical as some might state. He has a sense of humor that some take too seriously I think. I get the sense that his 'scars' was a metaphor. I am sure that he believed that if he didn't take over the Beach Boys in 78-79, they would have collapsed.  And he is probably right! While people blame Mike for the cheesiness of that period,  I must point out that many 60s bands were cheesy in the 80s. As were many 80s bands! Lol! I think Al was embarrassed about the direction they were going and hoped Carl would come back and save it. But I think Carl was more interested in holding things together at that point. He may have
 backed up Mike as the leader, but also faught to keep Al around. Bruce probably just made a business decision to be Mike's biggest supporter in 1998 to keep his job.



What stands out is how both Endless Summer and Kokomo, the two items which brought the band their most commercial success in the 70's and the 80's respectively, were more or less flukes that connected at that specific time to wider audiences due as much to what was surrounding their releases in pop culture and good old fashioned timing. ES was Capitol deciding to mine the back catalog for "Greatest Hits vol. 3" and releasing it when the country was hungry for nostalgia, and Kokomo was placed on a soundtrack of a blockbuster Tom Cruise fluff film. Neither could have been planned out any more than the Beatles hitting American audiences not much more than a month after the JFK assassination and subsequent national shock and mourning period which left a void in the teen generation which the Beatles happened to be there to fill.

Again, consider what Dennis said in '76 about the band's touring and live shows being as much of a catalyst for their revival as the Endless Summer fluke.

What also stands out is the band's history in the 70's and beyond. I know some will refute anything that Jack Rieley said, but consider if his account of Mike declaring "I am the Beach Boys!" during an angry exchange was exactly what happened. There is the dynamic of a band member who wanted desperately to be thought of as the leader of this band entering the mix. What you'll see is several people brought in to manage or work behind the scenes in management or financial roles eventually being accused of some manner of wrongdoing or malfeasance, and being unceremoniously dumped or simply choosing to leave. When this included Mike's own brother, you see how bizarre it all must have been.

Then fast forward to when Al Jardine got fired from the band - led by Mike - it's even more surreal yet it falls into line with what appeared to be a decades-old power grab. I think Carl simply checked out after a certain point. Dennis definitely did. Brian did years earlier. The notions of a normal working band just came and went in cycles, as did the notion of keeping a manager of any kind without eventually accusing them of wrongdoing.

Look for the common threads in all of the history and they will become visible.

 16 
 on: Today at 09:39:59 AM 
Started by rickymyfataar - Last post by jparis51
"D.W. Suite" -- Lindsey Buckingham

Not to mention "Bang the Drum" from the same album, which I've always loved and thought was about Brian on top of the BB influenced music. Somehow the pauses with faint children's laughter in the background capture the essence of SMiLE for me even though the song and production doesn't sound at all like SMiLE. One of my favorite tracks by Lindsey.

Not to mention much of his work on Tusk!

 17 
 on: Today at 09:34:03 AM 
Started by CenturyDeprived - Last post by guitarfool2002
I think, from what I understood from Brian, he wanted a place to get away and record what he wanted to do without being overruled.


If *anyone* deserved this (total creative control/freedom from agenda-driven bandmates/politics), it's Brian. 

That he had to go through all sorts of hoops to attain that freedom bugs me and should bug everyone too. It's beyond ridiculous the crap he had to go through and egos he had to put up with. Urgh.

</rant>

(thanks again Debbie for your amazing stories and recollections).

I have to say the story about Bruce and Terry at the time was that they gave Brian $50K to record, but the money was "found out" and removed from the account. I've heard other stories since. I have no idea which is true, particularly since I can't remember who told me this. Oh, well. I do remember Terry coming over to Brian's, and he couldn't stop smiling when he saw Brian. I think he really was in awe and adored Brian at that time, by his expression. That's why I feel a bit guilty when I talk about the production on SIP, but I can't help what it sounds like to me.

This has turned into a terrific discussion, thanks to all involved and thanks Debbie and Stephen especially for the firsthand memories!

We were discussing Jack Rieley in another recent thread, and it was good to get more information and perspective on the table, especially for newer fans reading this stuff who may have only heard *one* version of events, and perhaps had opinions shaped on people like Jack based on one perspective. We need to look at and weigh all sides. Whether it's Jack, or Terry Melcher, or the way Brian had to go elsewhere to record his ideas (seriously...add me to the chorus of those wondering WTF was going on within the band to cause this).

More on that to come. But discussing Terry brought up more of the story with him in particular. Debbie, I agree 100% that Terry in particular was very influenced by and in awe of what Brian could do even as early as when they first connected. You hear Terry during the Party! sessions, where he was already cutting hit records on his own as performer and producer, including one which has gone on to be one of the most important records of the modern era, Mr. Tambourine Man...as well as cutting sides for the Raiders, who people might not realize were one of the hottest bands in the US during the mid 60's and basically had their own network TV show.

Yet here was Terry happy to hit a tambourine at Brian's Party sessions, and who would appear in the studio to hang out and watch as Brian was making Pet Sounds and beyond. Yes, Terry was a big fan, no doubt, but you hit on the aspect that doesn't get said as much: Terry admired Brian and what he could do. No doubt.

What is lost too is how Terry would devote his career to his mom Doris Day and her various musical and TV/film projects instead of continuing to cut rock and roll records. Who knows how much more he would have done in the rock world had he not made the decision to work for his mom and build her career. And, doing so at a time when Doris Day was no stranger to the scandal sheets and Hollywood gossip, some of which was blatantly racist and unfair...again, topic of other discussions.

What Terry did with SIP, I feel, is do what he was hired to do. *Terry* was the one who got the band back on the charts in the 80's with Kokomo. It was Terry who produced California Dreamin and got Roger McGuinn in on the session to add some cool 12-string guitar to the track - It gave the Boys an AC hit when they couldn't buy one. It was also Terry who called Papa John Phillips and asked if he had any songs available for the Beach Boys to record, with what was yet another drought of songwriting within the band. Papa John sent Terry demos of Kokomo and Somewhere Near Japan, and obviously we know what happened to Kokomo. Major credit to Terry, despite some attempts to undercredit him in favor of other band members' involvement in that track.

SIP - Mike's baby through and through. That's not bashing, that's what it was. Let's recapture the winning Kokomo formula, and cut an entire album with this "new" sound. It was an ill-conceived attempt. Terry produced, yes - But read the credits in full. I have to think Terry was doing exactly what he was hired and told to do. The saying goes "you can't make chicken salad out of chicken sh*t".


The story of the "remote" studio and 4-track and Terry and Bruce's involvement in other ventures really makes you wonder about how things played out up to the present, and which loyalties carried over into the band's inner politics. Much more can be added to this aspect of the discussion, but I rambled enough already.

I just thought it was great to hear some more about Terry and Brian especially in this time period, and get more details and info on the table for fans to see how everything was not as cut and dry and clean-cut as other versions of events have tried to suggest.

 18 
 on: Today at 09:08:35 AM 
Started by CenturyDeprived - Last post by Debbie KL
^Agreed CD

Debbie, as usual thank you so much for sharing your recollections!

You're so welcome. That's pretty much all I have to share here since I'm not a musician, nor a producer, so I'm happy to do it.

To add to my vague memory (after about 40 years) of the lyrics to "Passing By," the chorus (maybe it was a bridge, the song was so short?) was something close to

"soft/long(?) nights, quiet nights,
nights of living dreams,
so close you were to being all I ever needed"

I sort of etched the song into my memory because I knew once I handed the tape over, I'd probably never hear it again.

Maybe someone who actually has a copy of the tape can correct me?

 19 
 on: Today at 08:36:59 AM 
Started by CenturyDeprived - Last post by Debbie KL
I think, from what I understood from Brian, he wanted a place to get away and record what he wanted to do without being overruled.


If *anyone* deserved this (total creative control/freedom from agenda-driven bandmates/politics), it's Brian. 

That he had to go through all sorts of hoops to attain that freedom bugs me and should bug everyone too. It's beyond ridiculous the crap he had to go through and egos he had to put up with. Urgh.

</rant>

(thanks again Debbie for your amazing stories and recollections).

I have to say the story about Bruce and Terry at the time was that they gave Brian $50K to record, but the money was "found out" and removed from the account. I've heard other stories since. I have no idea which is true, particularly since I can't remember who told me this. Oh, well. I do remember Terry coming over to Brian's, and he couldn't stop smiling when he saw Brian. I think he really was in awe and adored Brian at that time, by his expression. That's why I feel a bit guilty when I talk about the production on SIP, but I can't help what it sounds like to me.

 20 
 on: Today at 08:13:23 AM 
Started by Unreconstructed Wilsonite - Last post by KDS
I shan't say cliched "Well played" if it's OK with you. Tongue

Is there film which you draw parallels with the other, different film?

I think one can draw parallels with Ghostbusters and Men in Black.   Both movies are action comedies that use elements of horror / sci fi.   Both feature a team of protagonists going battle against otherworldly beings who threaten human life as we know.   Both movies had hit songs that shared the movie title and spawned cartoon series adaptations and sequels.   

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