You have a point there. Thank God, there's a lot more Brian on TWGMTR than on Imagination. But  Thomas had a say in track selection and pacing. I don't think Desper, Mankey or Britz were involved in that area.

I don't think anybody here is accusing Brian of stealing production credit or coasting while Thomas does all the hard work. For me, TWGMTR's credits should have read "Produced by Brian Wilson and Joe Thomas" That's all.

The reason why many of us dislike JT's style: the production of Imagination (TWGMTR is okay, compared to that one) and -I'm quoting Darian- his idea to arrange "Caroline No" in "a kind of soft-Sade style".

Vocals is my thing.  Unless I was purposely looking for differences, I wouldn't be able to tell Jeff Beck's playing from any other session guy's playing.  The Beck thing doesn't excite me as much as the inclusion of Al, vocally.

Believe me, if you listen to Beck (never a session guy, unless some hi-profile work with people like Jagger) you'll be able to tell, since his way of playing is unique. (if another guitar player sounds like him, it's because he's copying him). Although he's also an expert on the styles of people like Cliff Gallup or Les Paul. It would be interesting to hear this side of him in some Brian's stuff

If Thomas is credited as "executive producer" it will be an euphemism as it was his credit as "recording" on TWGMTR. If he's actually co-producing, then give him credit. Can't understand why the Brian people insist on the "Produced by (just) Brian Wilson" as a trademark.

Beck's thing is not songwriting, composing or production (he doesn't get much credit for those things on his own albums), but his unique magic with his guitar. I expect him taking Brian's music to some place not other guitar player could take it. A recent example. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGfDslwCYAc

After the premiere of his "raspy" voice on 15BO, Brian said that his old-falsetto voice made him sound like (his words) "a fairy". That Sunflower-era vocals (Where is she, Awake, his bits on Slip on through and Forever) are his "most fairy" vocals. Love 'em, though

3 - What's the story with the backing tracks of "Soul searchin'" and "You're still a mystery"? For years it has been said that the bootlegged versions were the vocals from the Was session flown into the Paley instrumental tracks. The MIC versions are basically the same than the Landylocked  ones (or also, in the case of "SS", The GIOMH version) Who is credited with the production on the MIC liners? Of course this will be cleared with the soon-to-be-online C-Man's session research...

On SS, the production credit is: BW, AP and DW
On YSAM, the credit it: DW, BW and AP

My suspicion is that YSAM actually uses the Was instrumental track, which is why he's credited first.

Could this be a case of Brian re-recording his lead for YSAM during the Was-produced sessions for his new album?

Two observations and a question.

1 -  Without pretending to say that The Beatles invented everything: It's unquestionable that "Where is she" is influenced by "She's leaving home". Another two factors: the beginning of the B part -with melody and chords that echo the "Silenty closing her bedroom door", and the time signature. This is not derogatory to "Where is shy", a really nice song which should have been developed and release in its time: is Brian beign influenced by Paul as "Here There and Everywhere", "Penny Lane", "You mother should known", "Dear Boy", "The Back seat of my car", and many others, including "New" are Paul's songs with Brian's influence over them.

2 - Re: The piano stylings of the "California feelin'" demo. Maybe is an example of Brian's love for Randy Newman's Sail away LP?

3 - What's the story with the backing tracks of "Soul searchin'" and "You're still a mystery"? For years it has been said that the bootlegged versions were the vocals from the Was session flown into the Paley instrumental tracks. The MIC versions are basically the same than the Landylocked  ones (or also, in the case of "SS", The GIOMH version) Who is credited with the production on the MIC liners? Of course this will be cleared with the soon-to-be-online C-Man's session research...

And hey, I haven't got into Brian's hatred of cymbal crashes

Or hi-hats. He used the acoustic guitar to cover the frequency range of them. Of course, TWGMTR (like Imagination) has cymbals all over the place

What about those strings on "Winter Symphony"? That's definitely a Chamberlin, Mellotron, Optigan organ or something...

An ARP String Ensemble, IIRC

I remember that picture from the May Pang. He was the one who put Helen Wheels on the US Band on The Run. He also had a heavy hand promoting solo Lennon, at least Walls and bridges and Rock and Roll

(The one with Bowie on the cover)

Very interesting Q&A with VDP, including questions from Rufus Wainwright and Bill Frisell. Obviously, Smile -along with Zappa, Byrds, etc- was one of the topics, illustrated with the classic BW-WDP-Rickenbacker pic.

The last part of the answer: "The only thing left  is for it (Smile) to be filmic but I have no plans to do anything with Brian."

It's known that Jan Berry wrote very specific parts for his players - but he was something of an exception to the rule, as was Frank Zappa who notated everything for his musicians.

Actually, lots of Zappa's "rock" music was created by him working his bands through rehearsals (an average of 40 hours per week). Of course, he brought a lots of parts written out (and his orchestral works or the more complex instrumentals a la The Black Page were completely written out) , but he was also composing through his musicians' strengths and abilities.

Maybe it was a political move? (around the 20/20 era, at least)

John Entwistle said -around the time of Who Are You- that letting Roger Daltrey sing his songs gave him more songwriting space on the album.

Actually, before starting this topic, I did a search with the wrong keywords... I had forgotten about that topic, I read it when it was posted... Anybody remember the name of the primitive rhythm box used? I know I read it somewhere...

I was relistening the Stephen Desper mix of this haunting song... anybody have any data about the sessions?

Who played vibes and bass?

Thanx

A favourite of Pete Townshend:

"'Blue Red and Grey' (from The Who By Numbers, 1975) was a ukelele ditty with John Entwistle adding brass ... It was about nothing at all; it reminded me of an old "Smiley Smile" Beach Boys number."

Revolution in the Head does this too, and better (to my mind).

I completely agree.  This is the BEST book ever written about the actual music.  Sure, there might be squabbles about recording dates and what not...but Ian MacDonald did an absolutely amazing job dissecting the songs.


[/quote]

Are you familiar with Walter Everett's books?

he takes musical analysis to the highest level.

Another one from Imagination (and hopefully, someone will read this post, not like my reference to "My solution")

The chord pattern from the "Your imagination" (those suspensions around the I chord) verses are lifted from the then-unreleased "Rainbow eyes"

To be fair, Your Imagination has the most cliched chord sequence known to man. I could say it's actually a rewrite of Forever's verse, y'know. Also, don't think Rainbow Eyes has the descending bassline?

You are talking about the whole chord sequence, with the descending bassline, the same used on Forever and Love and Mercy (and Everyone's in love with you, amongs hundreds of them). Actually, I was thinking about how he plays with the first chord of the verses, which is also the key chord.

Another one from Imagination (and hopefully, someone will read this post, not like my reference to "My solution")

The chord pattern from the "Your imagination" (those suspensions around the I chord) verses are lifted from the then-unreleased "Rainbow eyes"

A couple from Imagination

"How could I have left you alone" from Cry comes from one of the Sweet Insanity songs

Happy Days - My solution

The tunes that lead singers of bands usually write are ones where the guitarist/pianist finds the chords that naturally fall behind the vocal melody. If Mike sang the vocal melody of All I Wanna Do acapella, you'd find most of the chords by just following his notes.

True, but Mike knows how to play basic chords on the piano. Desper said it on this board a couple of years ago.

Years ago Desper explained on another board that the keyboard from the intro was not a Mellotron or Chamberlin -like many of us thought- but a processed Rhodes

I don't think it was a matter of who was in the band (i.e. Mike and Bruce), but of really poor promotion. Same thing happened in Sao Paulo and Uruguay-- where they played a nearly empty semi-private show.

Edit: this was 2009.

Yes, on 2009 they played Punta del Este's Conrad. True, a few years ago promotion wasn't great but I remember, at least from my circle of acquaintaces, most people weren't interested since Brain wasn't involved.

Another thing is that, really, Latin America is not a region where the Beach Boys are really popular. By popular, I mean artists whose records are in print, and records were bought at the release time: Beatles, Stones, Zeppelin, Floyd, Creedence... John Fogerty came here last year, did two arenas with great success, but Creedence Clearwater Revisited (CCR original rhythm session plus hired guns) has been playing here with great success since 1998..... Mike and Bruce never could get that kind of response here, even with Brian...

Mike and Bruce played in Buenos Aires in 2005. It was a poorly attended gig: 1/3 (or less) of a 3500 seat theatre. To give you some context: last April, Dylan played at the same place 4 terrific gigs (his management announced that he wanted to do small venue instead of stadium or arenas, even if he had to play more shows). I suppose they got a new promotor this time.  There's a lot of people here who would pay to see  The Beach Boys... if Brian is part of the show. (Frankly, Al's presence wouldn't change anything)

Folks, when you have both Darian and Scott nailing the keyboard work on stage, you probably won't hear Bruce and definitely not Brian (Bruce's keyboard only comes up for Disney Girls). 

Yeah, that's basically Bruce's approach for the Mike&Bruce tours; although then his keys were a little more audible. Anyway, Bruce's stage playing has worked this way since the early 80s, when he played electric piano. There's an old interview with Brad Elliott where he says his keys are not really needed on stage when they had Meros, Brian (and someone else?)

Shame that Brian no longer plays that pounding piano like he did on the early 80s. A different Brian, from a neurological point of view, of course.