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651510 Posts in 26033 Topics by 3714 Members - Latest Member: Tom Tom Play Boy October 23, 2019, 04:55:02 PM
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1  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Aug. 8th 1980 - \ on: September 12, 2019, 12:52:32 PM
I was at this show and I can confirm that LEAVING THIS TOWN was not played.  Neither was SANTA ANA WINDS; the only time I heard that live was in Louisville, KY on August 10.  In addition, YOU ARE SO BEAUTIFUL was not played as Dennis was not at the show.  One song they did play that is not listed on the set list link was LONG TALL TEXAN. As I recall, it was a by the numbers concert, 90 minutes, no more.  The weather was cool and the sky was cloudy, which seemed to fit the tone of the album cover and the mood on stage.  I'd seen them the previous summer, during the LA Light Tour... same deal. No nonsense,  90 minutes.  

As we drove back to Carbondale, IL, I remember thinking that it in no way compared to the first time I'd seen them at the Mississippi River Festival in August of 1977.  That show ran two hours with an intermission, Dennis in excellent form, Brian the most animated I've ever seen him doing vocal riffs on every song, introing every song and getting the crowd riled up (along with Dennis).  A full compliment of album cuts from LOVE YOU, a brand new preview of LADY LYNDA (Dennis introed - "This is one of Alan's songs - which is why I'm not on it!")  That got a laugh, as he then enthusiastically turned the stage over to Alan.  And  back to back FEEL FLOWS and ALL THIS IS THAT.

But August 1980 was a band fulfilling a contract.  Good, tight and professional, but nobody seemed to be having much fun.  
2  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Quentin Tarantino Prepping New Movie Tackling Manson Murders on: August 29, 2019, 10:49:03 AM
I've seen this wonderful film three times so far... to answer an earlier question, I can confirm the version of OUT OF TIME by the Rolling Stones used in the film is the stereo version with strings and had additional vocal overdubs, including a female vocalist buried in the mix.  I believe it was issued as a nine years later single in 1975:
3  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Quentin Tarantino Prepping New Movie Tackling Manson Murders on: August 07, 2019, 07:42:59 AM
Brilliant, funny, sweet film.  Have seen it twice; excited about seeing it again.  The first time I just took it all in.  The second, I was able to take the ride with the characters and notice things I missed.  One was Cliff and Rick's drunken conversation about legendary action movie director William Witney.  Witney's son is a friend of mine and I got a huge kick out of texting him - "You have to see this now - they're talking about your Dad!"

Two emotional musical moments stand out for me among many:

1. California Dreamin' - a montage as the day - and the second act finish - as Tim Olyphant as actor James Stacy gets on his motorcycle and drives away from the studio... foreshadowing a later event in his life

2. Out of Time - another montage in the third act.  Musically and lyrically, a major emotional wallop for me.

LANCER was a hip and edgy western series for its time - so different from contemporary traditional western shows like GUNSMOKE, BIG VALLEY, THE VIRGINIAN, BONANZA, etc.

A perfect masterpiece.  A treasure.
4  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Terry Melcher on: July 25, 2019, 02:35:03 PM
<<I'll repeat again since the point seems to be getting lost.
Only two producers have ever scored a number one hit for the Beach Boys. Brian Wilson and Terry Melcher.
If anyone can dispute the magnitude of that fact, please give it a try. Because I'd like to see how a guy who has three number one singles  has his career reduced to listing his failures versus saying hey, this guy did some great stuff, some timeless stuff...I dont get it.>>

I couldn't agree more.  Well said.
5  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Terry Melcher on: July 24, 2019, 07:26:27 AM
<<I realize I'm just reverting to the most obvious thought that I'm guessing most BB fans have had, but are we absolutely sure those lines aren't predominantly Carl? Believe me, I'm well aware how crazy BB vocal credits can get and how minds can be blown when we discover who is or isn't actually singing on something. I'm not very familiar with Melcher's 80s voice (I've heard his vocal work on the 60s stuff, and I find it pretty bland and workmanlike, and I certainly don't hear anything on the 80s/90s tracks that sound like *that*), and it seems a no-brainer that he would be singing on some of that stuff, especially in cases where he did some amount of pre-production work prior to the "main" BB vocals sessions. But gosh, without going back to listen right at this moment (something I'll do soon), it seems like Carl is in there on those lines. >>

Melcher had a very distinctive voice.  He's lead vocalist on HEY LITTLE COBRA.  For reference, if you want to do a comparison between his and Carl's voice... listen to the symphonic version of KOKOMO on Bruce's 1998 Symphonic Sounds of the Beach Boys.  Terry is singing Carl's part on the chorus ("Ooh, I wanna take you down to Kokomo...").
6  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Honkin' Down the Highway Single/LOVE YOU Marketing on: July 18, 2019, 02:55:40 PM
<<Mike had "Almost Summer". Two of the best songs in Brian's canon versus another "summer" retread from Mike.
Pretty self-explanatory, isn't it?  LOL>>

Not to quibble but while DARLIN' and TIME TO GET ALONE are obviously far superior, a reminder that the writing credit for ALMOST SUMMER reads Brian Wilson, Mike Love & Al Jardine.   Have to give Brian credit for a summer retread, albeit an effective one, in my opinion.  I was 18 when it came out, thought it was fun.  Still do.
7  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Honkin' Down the Highway Single/LOVE YOU Marketing on: July 16, 2019, 02:28:16 PM
"Why weren't the guys in the band doing a Redwood-esque scene cornering *Mike* in 1978 and "forcing" him to hand over the song for the Beach Boys?"

As I recall, from reading the trades and various press accounts in late 1977 or early 1978, the word was that The Beach Boys would be doing the title song for Almost Summer, which is partly why it was written by Brian, Mike and Al.  But WB understandably balked at the idea of MCA getting a new (and commercial) Beach Boys song.  I remember reading a brief Mike Love interview about it at the time, possibly in Billboard or RS. It may even have been a story heard on American Top 40 when it first entered the charts. I don't know if a version was cut at MIU with Brian and Al, but obviously the BGs on the released version are by Celebration.  But my memory tells me it was planned as a Beach Boys track, then changed for legal reasons.
8  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Honkin' Down the Highway Single/LOVE YOU Marketing on: June 17, 2019, 08:18:02 AM
<<With  better promotion and wiser marketing,  both "Honkin' Down the Highway" and LOVE YOU could have had a bit more commercial success. Yes, it was a strange album, but remember, The Beach Boys were fresh off one of the biggest years of their career and continued to command an audience. Someone dropped the ball.>>

*There was no promotion of any significance for Love You or any of the singles, including the 4 song UK EP that included MONA, MARCELLA and two other tracks.  This was even referenced by Mike Love, on stage at the London CBS convention that summer.
*As much as I love LOVE YOU, there is very little on that album that is radio friendly in the context of what was hit record material in the Spring of 1977. It was about 4 years ahead of it's time, pre-dating the early 80s Brit Synth-Pop.  There was no way it could compete in that Eagles/Heart/Doobie Brothers/Fleetwood Mac era.
*Roller Skating Child might have had better chart success; it might have dented the top 40.
*Regarding sales... I remember my High School girlfriend at the time worked in the record/electronics section of our local Decatur, Illinois K-Mart.  At the time, they had a decent selection of music.  I was hoping to get an early release copy from them until I discovered from her that the K-Mart corporate buyers did not pre-order LOVE YOU.  The word she got: The only reason they'd ordered 15 Big Ones the previous Spring was because they thought it was a greatest hits collection.  I suspect a number of other stores believed the same thing.
9  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike working on yet another new album on: May 30, 2019, 09:54:37 AM
Love the new track.  Great, unpretentious fun.  The Ramones would have loved it!
10  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Party/Party Sessions on: April 01, 2019, 12:44:12 PM
First of all, these guys were and continue to be friends.  Bruce and Terry Melcher contributed some great background vocals to Dean's Legendary Masked Surfers redux versions of GONNA HUSTLE YOU and SUMMER MEANS FUN.

I recall reading or hearing an interview with Bruce where he specifically talked about BARBARA ANN.  He described the differences between Brian's falsetto and Dean's falsetto and said the combination of the two was a perfect, happy, and slightly messy accident that made it a hit record.  His stated analogy was having the perfect hair, not a hair out of place... and then your girlfriend messes it up and somehow it looks even better.
11  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Songs That Should’ve Been Hits on: March 22, 2019, 09:18:58 AM
Should have been singles or bigger hits:
MARCELLA - I think had this been the lead single it might have been a hit.  It's a question of taking your best first shot and this had everything you wanted in a classic Beach Boys single - but sounded fresh and modern.
ROLLER SKATING CHILD - should have been the lead single from Love You
COUNTRY PIE - Had The Beach Boys recorded a version of this in 1978 it would have been a big summer hit, based on the reactions of crowds at concerts that year.  But given the dynamics of the band, recording the song was just not going to happen.  Hate it or love it, it had hit song written all over it in the summer of 1978, especially in the midwest.
MATCHPOINT OF OUR LOVE - should have been a single in the fall of 1978... it had that soft disco shuffle later heard in Dr. Hook's WHEN YOU'RE IN LOVE WITH A BEAUTIFUL WOMAN.  Great melody, catchy and hook-filled and Brian's best vocal in years.  Far superior to HERE COMES THE NIGHT. And speaking from experience, it sounded great on the radio.
HERE COMES THE NIGHT - supposedly there is a 3 minute version of this that is incredibly commercial.
ANGEL COME HOME - Bruce had high hopes for this as a single, as I recall from his PET SOUNDS magazine interview in the fall of 1978.  It reminded me of the band Exile ("I Wanna Kiss You All Over").
CONSTANT COMPANION - According to Carli Munoz, Carl Wilson wanted this to be the lead single from what became LA Light Album.  I think Dennis' track and vocal, augmented by The Beach Boys, would have been a 1979 hit in the same way Goodnight Tonight was for Paul McCartney & Wings
ROLLER SKATING CHILD (LIVE) - I heard from some sources at the time that there was some thought given to recording a disco version of this as a single in 1979.  It was in the set list all year.  If true, it was, of course, DOA after the reaction to HCTN.
KEEPIN' THE SUMMER ALIVE - Should have been the lead-off track from the album of the same name.
RUNAWAY (LIVE) - I think CBS dropped the ball on this one.  Paul McCartney was just coming off a hit record with his live version of COMING UP.  I think a release of Runaway as a follow-up to COME GO WITH ME would have been a hit.  Not particularly creative - but a top 30 hit at least.
ROCK & ROLL TO THE RESCUE - Don't get me wrong - I love this song just the way it is... vocals, production, everything.  But I think it would have peaked at a much higher chart position if Mike had been singing lead instead of Brian.
STILL CRUISIN'- I don't know why this didn't do well - it's a car song, had placement in a major studio movie and was one of the best tracks from the Terry Melcher era.
SOUL SEARCHIN' - It's a great pity this project fell apart.  I think this and That's Why God Made the Radio are the last two genuine Brian Wilson hit singles for The Beach Boys

Just my two cents...
12  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Lei'd in Hawaii Fanmade Album Art on: March 18, 2019, 07:54:52 AM
Very nice art... reminds me of Dean Torrence's work.

This one surfaced a few years back... and looks very 1967 Capitol.
13  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys Medley b/w live Runaway 1981 - 45 rpm single on: March 14, 2019, 10:59:20 AM
<<It's a comp featuring Beach Boys Medley, Getcha Back, Rock 'N' Roll to the Rescue, California Dreamin', and a few of the oldies. <<

In an early 1986 interview, Mike said the Sunkist LP would be a collection of "...our favorite live tracks," so I was looking forward to a new live album featuring current highlights like the Surfin' Safari/Surf City/Surfin USA medley, California Girls, Runaway, maybe the opening medley that included I Can Hear Music, Dance Dance Dance, etc.  I was living in Carbondale, Illinois.  On the release day I called the Sunkist office at the DuQuoin Fairgrounds and they said I could drive up and purchase.  Naturally, I was a tad bit disappointed that I'd essentially driven a 40 mile round trip for one song, lol...
14  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: No Endless Summer on: March 12, 2019, 01:57:48 PM
<<One of their greatest hits albums would have become big on the charts again as the mood of the country shifted in the 1970's and the younger generation embraced the music of the group.>>

Having become a fan during that time, I would disagree.  That new generation of teenagers (which I was a part of), had to be reminded who the Beach Boys were.  They weren't on our radar.  In 1974 we knew who the Beatles were but frequently got mixed up between the Bee Gees and the Beach Boys.  A couple of "B" groups.  I remember in 1973 being schooled in Sunday School class that the Bee Gees were cool.  The Beach Boys were not.  There were budget line albums available but nothing really on our radar.  I remember Beach Baby on the radio and thinking that must be The Beach Boys.  The genius of Endless Summer is that it wasn't packaged as a Greatest Hits collection.  It was simply packaged as a new Beach Boys album.  Carefully, yet seemingly randomly programmed, unlike the 1976 Brit collection 20 Golden Greats, which was chronological.  It wasn't marketed to original Beach Boys fans... the ones who bought Holland.  It was marketed to a new batch of teens - a new audience.  In the late 1970s I had a conversation with Dean Torrence about this.  He thought it was brilliant marketing, selling the  Beach Boys as something new.  He said it was precisely why his own 1972 Jan & Dean Anthology Album didn't sell as well.  It was automatically marked as "old."  Dean tried the Endless Summer approach with his own Gotta Take That One Last Ride set.  J&D classics sold simply as fun in the sun music, not greatest hits.  However, he was stuck on the UA label and they only spent about a thousand bucks... nothing near Capitol's massive ad campaign for Endless Summer.  People forget that Endless Summer was a phenomenon.  It was on the top 100 charts for years.  When I went to college as a freshman in 1977 the two albums everybody owned were Endless Summer and Dark Side of the Moon.
15  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys Medley b/w live Runaway 1981 - 45 rpm single on: March 12, 2019, 09:23:14 AM
No.  Runaway was recorded in 1982 after Carl returned and was pushed as a 1982 single release for CBS.  But CBS apparently balked at releasing another cover and Runaway did not appear on vinyl until the 1986 Sunkist promotional LP.
16  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: California Calling on: February 28, 2019, 11:28:00 AM
<<Even has a distinct drum sound. >>

I like it, too.  Unpretentious and fun.  And that distinct drum sound is Ringo Starr.
17  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Dean Torrence joining Mike's band? on: February 19, 2019, 12:28:59 PM
 Jan & Dean's comedy bits were an integral part of their act between 1959 and 1966...  THE T.A.M.I. SHOW, Dean's liner notes to Golden Hits Vol. 2, all the liner notes to the Jan & Dean Anthology album, both TV pilots, Schlock Rod... Bucket T... Little Old Lady from Pasadena... Anaheim, Azuza... Horace the Swingin' School Bus Driver... Submarine Races... One Piece Topless Bathing Suit... Hang On Sloopy... Folk City... all of JAN & DEAN MEET BATMAN (both versions), all of FILET OF SOUL... and all of their concert appearances, all of their radio promos and, especially, DEAD MAN'S CURVE, which showed just how dark they were willing to go.  Dean calls it their "FARGO." They were billed as the Laurel & Hardy of rock & roll and their public personas were very much like Stan and Ollie.  Jan was "Ollie" and Dean was Stanley, the "dumb one."  And like Stan Laurel, Dean was actually the brains behind their comedy presentation.  Jan was equally adept at brilliant musical satires so subversive that they actually became hit records.  It's still astounding that he crafted such a deft send-up of drag racing songs like Little Old Lady From Pasadena and it became a number 3 hit with record buyers (including a hell of a lot of gear heads).

I suspect neither one of them would ever claim to have created something as brilliant as PET SOUNDS.  That wasn't the game to these guys.   You want a laugh, check out the way they gleefully savage their own work on FILET OF SOUL - and poke fun not only at Beatlemania but their own willingness to exploit it for fun and profit.

In the Radio Shack ad, the line about Dean is a throwback to his stage persona. 

Look at their work through the prism of their humor and you see what they were all about.  Farm team isn't really the best analogy.  If you think of The Beach Boys as the champion riders at the rodeo, Jan & Dean were the rodeo clowns.  They got plenty of laughs - and they were damned skilled at wrangling angry bulls when the stakes were high.
18  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Dean Torrence joining Mike's band? on: February 15, 2019, 02:40:30 PM
<<Tand then later when they had guys like Cowsill, Farmer, Griffin, etc., those were solid musicians. Many of the same guys who to this day play with Mike, or Al, or the various “Surf City All Star” lineups with varying combos of Al, Dean, and David Marks. But those were not bands that could have pulled off “Pet Sounds” or “Smile” in full.>>

Gary Griffin has been pulling off Pet Sounds in full for the last few years in Brian's band.  And John Cowsill's drumming was a highlight of the 2012 C50 reunion tour.
19  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Dean Torrence joining Mike's band? on: February 15, 2019, 08:30:59 AM

"Now, what *would* be interesting to know is what kind of setlist J&D did when they toured  for the BBs in the 70s/80s/90s. I would imagine they had to drop most BB songs that overlapped with the actual BB setlist, separate from songs they performed together of course.  "

They only toured once with the Beach Boys... in August-September 1978.  For the Lakeland, FL show, they did Surf City, Dead Man's Curve, Little Old Lady and Barbara Ann during the encore.  For any individual shows where they shared billing with the Beach Boys in the 80s or 90s I doubt they changed the set list for any reason.  Tour set lists remained essentially the same for decades; any deviance from the regular order would throw Jan off.
The set list for the 1982 LP ONE SUMMER NIGHT LIVE, which was recorded in the fall of 1981, is pretty typical for the 80s... and a wildly entertaining show, when compared to the 1981 Beach Boys.


Creating great art was not Dean's intent at that stage.  He knew that was impossible given Jan's condition.  By 1981, audiences were largely made up of new fans - people who had seen the TV movie.  That audience identified it all as California music... Beach Boys... Jan & Dean... whoever.  They didn't differentiate.  The whole point of the exercise was to get bookings.  Lots of bookings.  And provide a good, solid, surf and drag oldies show for 60 or 90 minutes, whatever the promoter wanted to buy.  And to keep the price down; you could book Jan & Dean for less than the Beach Boys cost you.  In 1978, when Dean was contemplating going back on the road with Jan and Papa Doo Run Run, he told me the idea was to mix it up... do the Jan & Dean hits that everyone knew and expected... and to do a certain amount of Beach Boys covers, because it would give the audience the California music they expected, and would give Jan a chance to lay back and sing bg vocals between his leads on J&D songs that he struggled with every day.  It was a winning formula and it worked for them for 25 years.
20  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Dean Torrence joining Mike's band? on: February 14, 2019, 09:52:47 AM
The assertion that the phase II Jan & Dean Shows of the late 70s to early 2000s were an "unauthorized Beach Boys show" is ridiculous.  Both Jan & Dean and the Beach Boys covered each others songs in the 60s and have continued that exchange over the last 5 decades.  In terms of the Jan & Dean post accident set lists, Jan sang most of the leads.  And the more he struggled, certain songs were dropped. Jennie Lee was an early casualty.  Ditto Ride the Wild Surf, which by the late 80s became an instrumental band intro.   Doing Beach Boys covers was a no brainer, to fill the time.  The audiences ate it up and the band loved performing them.

As for being a "farm team," Dean himself referred to the duo as that very thing... but they were playing huge venues in the 80s and 90s... Three River Stadium... the Daytona Beach Band Shell shows, some of them on the same bill with the Beach Boys.  It's all documented in Bob Greene's wonderful book WHEN WE GET TO SURF CITY.  They also managed to be the first western rock group to play Red China, which is an amazing and bizarre tale of its own.

Quality of the show?  I saw Jan & Dean in the summer of 1981, in DuQuoin, Illinois.  I saw The Beach Boys a couple of months later, in Terre Haute, Indiana.  Anyone who saw any of those shows that year knows who put on the better concert, lol...
21  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1981 Queen Mary “Pre-Show” on: February 07, 2019, 12:25:48 PM
I'd love to hear Best Summers of Our Lives again, for nostalgia's sake.   Lots of enthusiastic interviews from the five principals, etc..  It was a fun old school ride through their first fifteen years.  I remember in the last part, after going into detail about 15 Big Ones they talked about what songs they still had in the can and what might be present in the next album.
22  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1981 Queen Mary “Pre-Show” on: February 07, 2019, 09:13:37 AM
I recorded the radio broadcast when it aired on TV.  I have a vague memory of the pre-Show radio special.  I think Dick Clark and Wolfman Jack were the hosts and they played a mix of the as yet unheard track Brian's Back.  My memory may be failing but I think the bulk of the program was an edited version of 1976 syndicated Radio special - The Best Summers of our Lives.
23  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brothers, Cousins, and Friends - possibility on: January 09, 2019, 08:53:44 AM
As I recall, from this period, some other interesting things were in the mix.

BROTHERS, COUSINS & FRIENDS, from what I recall, was Bruce's proposed title for KTSA.  I remember hearing rumors in 1982-83 a proposal was on the table to use that title for a new album to be produced by guest producers, all big names.  One of them was Lindsey Buckingham, who was interested only if he got to produce the entire album.  Eventually the concept evolved into the Steve Levine album.

A live version of "Runaway" was prepared as a follow-up single to "Come Go With Me," but was vetoed by CBS.  It later surfaced on the 1986 promotional Sunkist album.  This is, of course, old news, but I do remember Al announcing it as their new single at all the 1982 shows I attended.

According to one early 80s interview - I remember Bruce saying he was trying to persuade Carl to have the band record a cover version of "Rock & Roll Lullaby."

In early 80s interview, Al spoke about a cover version of the Del-Vikings' "Whispering Bells" which I assume evolved into "Island Girl."
24  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: I can hear music/ Made In California on: November 23, 2018, 10:34:32 AM
Capitol Center, Landover, MD, week of June 24, 1975...
25  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: I just wanna know......... on: September 07, 2018, 10:27:48 AM
Tarantino's crew is rebuilding Spahn ranch on the old Corriganville Movie Ranch site in Simi Valley, which is actually about 4 miles from the actual Spahn site:
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