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674504 Posts in 27219 Topics by 4010 Members - Latest Member: angleofreason May 17, 2022, 12:35:24 AM
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1  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / J.S. Bach's influence on Brian on: July 23, 2014, 05:30:45 AM
This is a topic that's begun to intrigue me. I've recently started listening to a lot of JS Bach and have also been studying his compositions a little at Uni. Me being a obsessed BW fan I am beginning to hear little Wilson-esque elements and stuff that remind me of the Pet Sounds era arrangements. I've read various stories and heard interviews with Brian saying that he loves Bach, so I'm trying figure out where Bach comes intro Brian's compositions.
"Don't Talk" is one that definitely has those Bach 'counter melodies' (The guitars and strings) and the chord movement is also very reminiscent and The distant guitar lines in "You Still Believe In Me" also have that Bach flavour. I've also read that Bruce Johnston once said that the instrumental break on "Here Today" is also influenced by Bach.

Does anyone else know where else Bach's influence came into Brian's writing?
2  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The I Just Wasn't Made For These Times 'Sound' on: May 09, 2014, 06:04:57 AM
Thank you so much! That really does help me with the Guitar part in that section. I played the transcription you wrote and it pretty much sounds dead on to what is on the track.  Smiley I'm still though having trouble hearing the guitar part during the verses because it is so blended in with everything else. Any ideas on what is going on there?
3  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / The I Just Wasn't Made For These Times 'Sound' on: May 05, 2014, 04:22:44 AM
I've been studying Brian's production and arranging techniques on Pet Sounds quite extensively at the moment, and I just can't seem to get my head around this one so I figured I would ask around.

I'm particularly wondering about the general 'sound' of I Just Wasn't Made For These Times. I've been able to figure out the individual parts of almost all of the other PS tracks but it's this one that's got me stumped. There is just something awesome about the arrangement and production that gives it a huge heavy sound.

From the SOT Bootleg I am able decipher the Piano part quite easily because it is quite audible because of the mic leakage through the left channel. However because the main track is so drenched in Gold Star's Echo Chamber reverb it's really difficult to pick out what the Harpsichord, Guitars and other instruments are adding to overall sound. In this I'm mostly focusing on the chordal instruments (keyboards, guitars etc) rather than basses and horns and other stuff.

So basically This is what I've found in the chordal section after I've listened to it a load of times.

The Piano played by Don Randi is definitely a 'Honky Tonk' tuned Tack Piano which plays the main chords and does that insanely cool ragtime thing during the chorus so I'm pretty sure of what's going on in the piano part most of the way through.

The Harpsichord part played by Mike Melvoin I think is the crucial element to the sound and is adding that heaviness to the track. However the harpsichord is so buried in the mix and drenched in echo chamber reverb it's so hard to figure out what it's actually playing. It sounds like it is mostly doubling the piano part in the song and that's what I would assume it probably does because Brian used the 'doubling' technique a lot in PS. B

Glen Campbell's guitar definitely sounds like an Acoustic 12 String which I assume after Brian's direction he switched to from a Banjo after the 1st take (Brian didn't like the sound). It sounds like he's mostly playing chords throughout most of the song which are most audible during "Each time things start to happen again...".

Barney Kessel's guitar is much more buried in the mix and it definitely sounds like an electric 12 String. However It's much more diffucult to tell exactly what this guitar is doing because it's so buried and drenched in reverb but I it's definitely adding something to the sound. There is some really weird dissonant stuff going on I picked up on through the "Each times things..." section and also at the end of the chorus.

Also a little other thing I'll add, there is a sound that I hear which is mostly audible under the "They say I've got brains..." section that i swear sounds something like steel drums mostly sounding on the offbeats. Is it possible that this is also what is adding to the sound during the verse sections?

So yeah If anyone has any information to add to this or if anyone has any different opinions I'd love to hear. Even if anyone knows what specific inversions the chords are playing aswell I'd really love to know. Smiley

4  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / Smiley Smilers Who Make Music / Wouldn't It Be Nice - Instrumental Track Re-Creation on: April 15, 2014, 12:52:51 AM
Hi all! As a few of you might be aware I have a Youtube channel on which I've attempted to re-create Pet Sounds a few times (I know it sounds a little obsessive doesn't it Cheesy ). I released a version last year which I wasn't completely satisfied with but it taught me a heap about the production and arranging side of things.

Anyway, I just wanted to share a little project I've been doing over the past 2-3 months. I've been working to make a note for note replication of the instrumental track from "Wouldn't It Be Nice". I tried to get as close as I could to the positioning and mixing of the original track as possible.

Here it is:

Here's a little info on how I recorded it

Track 1 Mix: Rhythm Track
Drums, Tambourine, Timpani, Bells, String Bass, Electric Bass, Picked Electric Bass/Guitar

Track 2 Mix: Keyboards and Guitars
12 String Electric Guitars x2, Grand Piano, Upright Tack Piano, Accordions (Doubled), Hollow body electric (mic'd up acoustically),

Track 3 Mix: Horns
Trumpet, 2 Tenor Saxes, Baritone Sax

-The reverb I'm using is actually a sample I made of the Gold Star Studios echo chamber which is a crucial element to the overall sound. There is also room reverb in there to add to the 'live' sound.
-I played the Basses, Guitars, tambourine the Trumpet part however Most of the Instruments I used are actually Virtual Instruments I played in with my Midi keyboard (I can't really afford to own all of them).
-To get the distinctive 'Harp' like guitar sound in the introduction I detuned my electric 12 string a tone down to get a more slacker sound to the strings and played the line high up on the neck. The 2nd 12 string part is playing a melody borrowed from 'It's raining it's pouring the old man is snoring'
-From the bridge through to the end I played a guitar in place of the 3rd bass part an octave higher
-For the 3rd guitar part (chord strumming one which can be heard clearly in the 2nd bridge) I acoustically mic'd up my hollow body jazz guitar instead of plugging it in to get the high end strumming sound
-The 2 pianos play roughly the same part until the 1st bridge where they play some really cool polyrhythms which connect up with the guitars.

Anyway I really hope you like it! Smiley
5  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Gold Star Studios Echo Chamber convolution reverb sample on: March 13, 2014, 03:25:20 AM
Sorry if I haven't replied since I first posted a while back. I have revised over the Gold Star Sample and I realized the first one I made was a little harsh and got really messy when there was a lot of instruments combined together, so I made a new one plus I attempted to sample the studio room aswell from a click sample from a session. In the pack I've also included the United Western samples I also talked about which include a heap of live room samples and 3 different Echo Chambers (these are real ones). I hope you enjoy Cheesy

Here's a link to all of them
6  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: \ on: January 05, 2014, 04:39:51 AM
Thanks for everyone's info!! Sorry I haven't managed to come back here in a while, For the last few weeks or so I've intensely studied (like a madman) the Instrumental sessions for God Only Knows and I'm also making an attempt to replicate the track. I also listened to the soloed Lyle Ritz Bass track from the 5.1 mix and it actually really helped me in hearing the other instruments much clearer.

For the keyboards situation on the track I have concluded that there is only a Piano and Harpsichord on the track. For that in that small instrumental break after the 2nd verse the harpsichord temporarily plays in a very high register which is why I initially thought it was an organ.

If you like you can listen to my attempt at re-creating the sound of the instrumental break. Let me know what you think
7  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Gold Star Studios Echo Chamber convolution reverb sample on: December 11, 2013, 10:35:40 PM

Hi Joel, thanks for the sample! I was wondering about what program do you use with the sample to record your music. I have seen your examples on YouTube and they Rock!
Thanks for checking my Youtube! Smiley
I record all of my stuff with a program called Magix Samplitude and I use an in built reverb plugin with the reverb sample. I also add a room reverb effect to further replicate the 'live' sound.

Very cool. Going to try this out in TL Space tonight! Thanks! They have United Western ones out there to download as well!

I actually use the united western ones for most of my recordings and mixes because they are so amazingly close to that Beach Boys reverb sound.

If you'd like to hear the sample in action Here's a test I did with my own recording of the Be My Baby Instrumental track (mostly focusing on the sound of the drums):
8  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Gold Star Studios Echo Chamber convolution reverb sample on: December 10, 2013, 05:22:47 PM
I'm not sure if this is the appropriate section in the forum, but I'll post it here. This is for the Audiobuffs or anyone interested in recording and production techniques and such.

Recently I've been listening to alot of the different amazing echo chamber reverbs from a lot of Beach Boys and Phil Spector recordings and trying a lot of different ways to re-create it. So I recently took a short sample from the Gold Star Studios session of I Just Wasn't Made For These Times of Brian's talkback mic reverberating through the echo chamber. At first I didn't expect it to work very well but very surprisingly I was able to create a sample which actually replicated the sound of the chamber quite well.

Here is a link to the sample if anyone would like to try it out. Let me know what you think:

9  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: \ on: December 02, 2013, 02:05:50 AM
I'm quite sure Carl Wilson is responsible for the staccato Guitar that begins in the 2nd verse. It sounds like he's most likely using a 12 string plugged directly in to the desk and also I think he's most likely playing four note voicings on the bottom four strings. I've listened a little closer and I think it most definitely is some type of organ and I'm maybe going a bit further to say that it is doubling the harpsichord. It's really difficult to tell though with the tape echo and the chamber reverb.
10  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / "God Only Knows" Backing track session Question on: December 01, 2013, 06:22:35 PM
I'm not sure if this has been brought up before or not, But I'm wondering if anybody has any info on what specific keyboard instruments were used on the recording of the backing track.

The piano played by Don Randi is quite audible on the track and by listening to the Unsurpassed Masters Pet Sounds Sessions I'm 100% sure there is a Harpsichord in there aswell because there is audio of the harpsichord playing the intro chords. But I can hear something else with a different more high pitched sound that begins in the 2nd verse and is specifically audible in the instrumental break at 1:04 that sounds really cool that I don't think is a harpsichord. Is it maybe an organ of some sort? Because on the session notes Larry Knetchel is listed as playing the organ. But a lot of the Pet Sounds notes aren't really very accurate. Is it maybe a combo organ like a Farfisa or something?

I've tested out many different sounds but I'm not really getting anything as close to the original track. I really love how Brian used the wall of sound technique to combine various instruments together to create a really unique sound.
11  Smiley Smile Stuff / Welcome to the Smiley Smile board / Hello from Joel! And a little bit of a story... on: July 17, 2013, 02:58:27 AM
Hi all! My name is Joel Koster. A lot of you might actually know me already because I did a cover of the entire Pet Sounds album, and SMiLE and a load of other Beach Boys and Brian Wilson stuff on YouTube.

I thought I might aswell join this forum to talk to everyone and maybe share around some of my projects and stuff  Smiley

Here's a little story about me (If you can be bothered reading LOL: )

I've had a love for music ever since my brain could understand what sounds were and I first picked up a guitar when I was about 10. I grew up mostly listening to bands like The Beatles and Queen and I often went through different phases, like most kids do. There was that magic moment though about 3 or so years ago when I decided to listen to Pet Sounds for the very first time (at the time I just wanted to figure out why a Beach Boys album was next to Sgt Peppers on every greatest album list). It completely changed my outlook on music and started my obsession with Brian Wilson. I began teaching myself piano and mostly because of Brian's influence on me I started writing heaps of my own songs aswell.

I'm now 18 years old and I'm currently studying music at uni and looking to begin a career in the industry.
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