Or maybe that you're capable of considering diverse or conflicting ideas, leading to simultaneous enjoyment and criticism.

Oh, they've been considered. It's like saying "That's Alright, Mama" would've been a better song if the lyrics were written by William S. Burroughs.

Or Bugs Bunny cartoons would be funnier if that damn rabbit wasn't such a wisecracker.

Or Star Trek would've resonated with people more if it had been set in a bus depot.

Sure, you can have that opinion, but it sounds to me like Arthur "Big Boy" Crudup, the classic Warner Brothers cartoons and Star Trek are maybe not for you.

Considering that Brian's original lyric was "I dig the girls" it sounds to me that Mike nailed exactly what Brian wanted. Brian has said so himself and counts it among his favorites. I guess Brian's opinion means nothing?

Really, if you're crapping all over a classic like "California Girls", not only one of the Beach Boys's greatest songs but one of the best pop songs ever written by anyone ever...chances are, you're a fan of the wrong band. 

Isn't all the interview material from the CD on the 2000 expanded edition of the album?

I don't think so as far as I can remember. It has been a zillion years since I listened to that "Words and Music" CD from 1988, but I recall him going into more tracks. I recall for instance a discussion of Jeff Lynne that isn't on the 2000 CD.

I have Words and Music somewhere on a cassette dub. As I recall it is an entirely different recording than the tracks on the reissue.

Dean was a guest on my radio show today (some Beach Boys discussion as well): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1XvhbHXIlE

Nice job, Ghosty.

Thanks Mark. I sent you a message either here or through FB a few months ago about coming on the show to talk about your book. Love to have you on. If you like, pm me here.

Dean was a guest on my radio show today (some Beach Boys discussion as well): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1XvhbHXIlE

Here is a video.  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mqTBPa_jGY

I wonder if he is using it for convenience due to chronic pain in the legs or back.  It makes me deeply sad.

I have elderly friends around Brian's age who also use wheelchair service at the airport. I wouldn't read too much into it. For some people, it's tough to be on your feet and walking great distances when you get to be a certain age.

I'm more saddened that he's being harassed by the idiotic press, barking the most inane and insulting questions at him. "Dennis lived with the Manson girls!"..sure, bring up a serial killer. Classy move. "What song will you be remembered for?"..Yeah, death is always a good way to start a conversation.

Assholes.   

I also think a distinction should be made regarding the "people around Brian". There's a big difference between Melinda and some low level schlub either forging Brian's signature or using a stamp. Ultimately, yes, it does reflect poorly on the people at the top but I find it very difficult to believe that someone who's actually close to Brian is cranking out fake autographs.

It's very simple. Whoever is doing it should be shown the door immediately. "Autogate" should never be allowed to happen again.

The question I can't seem to find an answer to is this: if there's a batch of legit signed books (as Ray stated here and Debbie KL stated on Brian's message board) then why have a batch of fake ones to begin with? This is not a case of Mal Evans forging the Beatles signatures to give to 12 year old girls who write fan letters, this is a case of fans PAYING for actual autographs and getting ripped off. Who's doing this? PC deny it's them and that Brian's team isn't responding to inquiries. Where is the publisher in all this?



I'm so glad I'm not an autograph collector.  At least I know that my Soupy Sales and William Shatner autographs are real since I was there.

Live long and throw pies.

There are other claims in the interview and in the book that are equally as bad, if not more so. The lies about not having access to Maureen and Stan Love are just two of them, but ones that strike me .

Hirsch was indeed wrong about Maureen, however that was up on Brian's page only a few weeks ago and only Phil and Mark can tell us when they actually recorded that interview or if Hirsch had even seen it at the time of recording (I didn't even see it myself until a week after it was up).

The photo of a Brian and Stan is 10 years old. Brian recently revealed in his book that he also met up with Mike around that time (though the fans never knew it at the time ).

I thought Hirsch was referring to not seeing Mike or Stan after the C50 tour ? Not saying it's true or not true ( I'm not an insider or a fan who claims to be one). Actually, I don't even remember that part of the interview all that well. The things that stuck out to me were Hirsch basically moving into Mike's house, etc.

Why are you trying to make it seem like Hirsch is contradicting himself by repeating the claim in the book that the tour lost money? It's in the book. I know you have the book. Did you expect him to read the entire chapter aloud during the interview so that every single point Mike lists for reasons why he didn't enjoy the tour or the tour lost money are in the interview? You could just buy the audio version of Mikes book to hear that.

Honestly, GF, I respect your knowledge of the band and I respect your right to not believe Mike is being truthful. I get that. Everyone's entitled to their opinion , but again, you have the book yourself. Why not just go through all of the points Mike makes one by one yourself? You've already presented your stuff from Pollstar so evidently you're satisfied with that. Is the point here to try to shame Hirsch or something?

Personally, I think Mike wasn't concerned about the C50 $$, even though it may well have been less than what had been hoped for--rather, I think his worry was that if the C50 tour continued on for too long with greater success and acclaim, it would jeopardize his ability to go out in his M&B incarnation and keep that operation viable.

I think that nails it.

Totally. Why is it so hard for this to simply be admitted to?

Hasn't it been? It's obvious that Mike would rather tour with the setup that he controls rather than joining Brian's band. He more or less says that in his book. I think the only way Mike would give up the ship is if his touring Beach Boys were flopping (and of course, they're not right now) or if Brian, Al and Carl's estate came up with some legal reason to stop him (and they don't appear to be interested..the "Brian Wilson" brand isn't hurting for ticket sales either). Of course, Brian could disband his own group and join Mike's...which would put him in the awkward position of entering a new touring agreement with Mike while paying himself to play his own songs.

And Stig accidentally sues himself.

It certainly wasn't given as a reason in this interview with Jim Hirsch. The statements and reasoning were made clear, the notion that C50 was losing money and Mike was concerned the promoters and venues would lose money, thereby hurting the brand. And unless there is clarification, that reasoning doesn't appear to be supported by the facts and figures. The numbers are all there, as are the reports of the tour's success.

The C50 tour talk was a wee bit of a half hour interview about his career, how they wrote it, etc. They briefly touched on it at best (although given the 3 pages of comments here I suspect some of the things mentioned will be in part 2).

As someone who also has a fake Brian autograph...well, I'm glad I didn't pay for it. PC is doing the right thing by offering refunds and whoever in Brian's team authorized this clear fraud should be fired immediately. This could get ugly otherwise.

Personally, I think Mike wasn't concerned about the C50 $$, even though it may well have been less than what had been hoped for--rather, I think his worry was that if the C50 tour continued on for too long with greater success and acclaim, it would jeopardize his ability to go out in his M&B incarnation and keep that operation viable.

I think that nails it.

Totally. Why is it so hard for this to simply be admitted to?

Hasn't it been? It's obvious that Mike would rather tour with the setup that he controls rather than joining Brian's band. He more or less says that in his book. I think the only way Mike would give up the ship is if his touring Beach Boys were flopping (and of course, they're not right now) or if Brian, Al and Carl's estate came up with some legal reason to stop him (and they don't appear to be interested..the "Brian Wilson" brand isn't hurting for ticket sales either). Of course, Brian could disband his own group and join Mike's...which would put him in the awkward position of entering a new touring agreement with Mike while paying himself to play his own songs.

And Stig accidentally sues himself.

Well, I think the quote was (and I don't have it in front of me) that "budgets were ignored".

That's getting into the book, but I'd ask: Ignored to the point of erasing the roughly 1.3 million gross ticket revenue the tour was taking in each week of that tour in the US? 50 US cities, 53 shows, 11 weeks: 15 million gross. This comes back to the statement made in the interview, how the tour lost money domestically. Going over budget is one thing, but to the tune of erasing those numbers? And going back to my original reaction, where is the proof of this to back up such a statement?

That's the issue, isn't it? We don't have the proof because we're not involved with BRI, and info like that wouldn't be publicly available to fans anyway. We only have one principle speaking about how the tour did domestically and that's Mike. We can only wait to hear different from others who were actually part of the business strategy.

Well, I think the quote was (and I don't have it in front of me) that "budgets were ignored".

There has to be more information provided to back up that statement and reasoning that C50 lost money domestically. Having to rent more Fender Twins and slow sales at the T-shirt stand wouldn't account for an 11 week tour that grossed 15 mil running in the red.

There are plenty of reasons/information mentioned in the book, practically a long laundry list of them. Whether or not they're accurate is anyone's guess and they're also kind of vague but they're there in black and white. If someone wanted to go through all of them one by one....well, I'm sure it's doable but it would probably be a lengthy project (talking to promoters/vendors all over the country, crew members, etc.) with very little of anything as a payoff at the end. Maybe someday someone will write a book about the reunion tour itself, or more likely, write a long chapter about it in a new book about the group.

Oh, I got a fast answer, ty for that.
Fake? It's as real as they come. I have exactly the same right to call myself a BB fan as you, even if I don't read ML's book.
You not knowing who I am * has no bearing on this matter. I don't know who 99% of the people here are, and don't care. I care only about what they post here.

* However, if you really want to know, I am the main villain in the excellent "Watership Down" novel by Richard Adams. Here, I masqueraded as "Thorgil" for a while.

lol Then I DO know who you are. Thorgil is a name I recognize. I take it back! Ha!

I also find it a little ironic that Hirsch has an attitude that he doesn't need to read Brian's book, yet Mike supporters, immediately upon publication of Mike's book, started relentlessly asking people if they had read Mike's book and suggested that if they hadn't read Mike's book, they shouldn't be commenting.

I find it quite odd that Hirsch didn't just say "no, I haven't had a chance to read Brian's book yet" and leave it at that, but instead says he doesn't need to read Brian's book. Really? Isn't he giving fans a strong reason then to not read Mike's book. As in, "Sh*t, if Hirsch doesn't need to read Brian's book after studying Brian for two years, then I certainly don't need to read Mike's book if I've been studying Mike for decades!"

I think the supposition/theory that Hirsch is afraid of what reading Brian's book might make him think about his own book about Mike or about Mike's positions/opinions is, while most certainly just a theory, certainly is not craziest theory I've heard. It seems totally plausible to me, and his "I don't need to read Brian's book" attitude is what makes me think it's plausible. It sounds a little defensive to me. And/or like he's annoyed that Brian didn't give him an interview for Mike's book.

I haven't run across any Beach Boys fans worth their salt that haven't read both books, so the whole "Mike supporters" thing I don't get or will ever get. Basically, if you're a Beach Boys fan you owe it to yourself to read them both. It seems silly not to.  
Hirsch points out in the interview that he's not really a big fan to begin with so I wouldn't expect him to read Brian's book. However, I also found it strange for him to say he knew everything about Brian because he sounds like a casual fan at best. Maybe if Brian's book had been published before he was working on Mike's he could have gotten some info from it, but it's a little late for that now. I think it's cool that he agreed to the interview, but it sure didn't sound to me like he's going to be rushing out to buy the SMiLE sessions box and join a fan forum any time soon.    

I'm so sick of the C50 talk. It should be pretty straightforward to anyone.
Either Mike dumps his band and being the boss of his own business and joins up with Brian's band... or Brian dumps his band and the comfort of being the boss to join Mike's band. These guys are in their twilight years and don't have to or want to answer to anybody. It ain't gonna happen. It made sense to do it for the 50th because that was a good PR hook (although let's not kid ourselves, that was NOT two touring acts joining together...it was M & B along with Scott and John joining Brian's band) but Mike clearly doesn't get along with Melinda so that's that....on top of all the other things I just mentioned.

OMG everybody is so ready to put unwarranted labels on people. So I'm "not worth my salt" because I haven't read Mike's book, not do I plan to after reading the excerpts? Sheesh, forget about darn C50, I'm so sick of THAT.
Added to left signature.

Spare me the fake outrage. I have no idea who you are and have no opinion about you one way or the other...but if you're asking me if I think someone like GF who's read both Mike and Brian's books is more knowledgable than someone who hasn't then the answer is obviously yes.   

I'm so sick of the C50 talk. It should be pretty straightforward to anyone.

This is why the comment that C50 domestically had lost money was such a jolt as I listened. I think as I did with the other points that a clarification is necessary. It doesn't appear straightforward enough if a tour which was labeled a success is now being described as having lost money.

And thanks to "Rocker" and his post with pure logic on the subject, I was able to go beyond the numbers and stats I posted from Pollstar's data on the tours from 2012 to the present and look at the basic, brass tacks of the whole thing as he did.

Rocker's point should be made again: The C50 tour was reported as it not only met expectations but exceeded them. It over-performed according to the industry, and that also led to requests for more bookings. That's all in the reports from that time.

So how could a tour which was meeting and exceeding expectations now four years in retrospect be reported as losing money as all of this was unfolding and the box office receipts and sales figures were coming in? The full quote is in my post above on page 1, but it's crystal clear that the point is being made that C50 lost money domestically.

My questions as follow ups would be where is the proof of this, and is there proof of this...or did everyone reporting on it in the press and in the industry get it wrong in 2012-13? And did the success of the tour which saw a large number of sellouts and very little empty seats at the various venues across the US suggest the tour was engineered to lose money if it's now reported as having lost money, or something...It doesn't add up.

It doesn't add up because you're only going by the ticket grosses Pollstar supplies. Mike's gripes are about the C50's tour expenses and overhead that included claims of mismanagement right down to tour merchandise. It's not uncommon for tours to have great ticket sales but wind up losing money (just ask Pink Floyd). Not saying it's true, but it sure does happen.

That budgetary info (bus rentals, promoter fee's, etc) is the kind of info Pollstar or the average fan wouldn't have. Your best bet for getting any real information about this would be for Brian and Melinda (and presumably Joe Thomas) to openly dispute Mike's claims or enter litigation (the book's only been out for little over a month) and make the results public or maybe someone goes through every example in Mike's book alleging extravagant spending and manages to get ahold of the documents (a BRI wikileaks?).

If I had to guess we may hear some refuting Mike's claims years down the line. It doesn't seem to be a priority for any of the principles right now.

I also find it a little ironic that Hirsch has an attitude that he doesn't need to read Brian's book, yet Mike supporters, immediately upon publication of Mike's book, started relentlessly asking people if they had read Mike's book and suggested that if they hadn't read Mike's book, they shouldn't be commenting.

I find it quite odd that Hirsch didn't just say "no, I haven't had a chance to read Brian's book yet" and leave it at that, but instead says he doesn't need to read Brian's book. Really? Isn't he giving fans a strong reason then to not read Mike's book. As in, "Sh*t, if Hirsch doesn't need to read Brian's book after studying Brian for two years, then I certainly don't need to read Mike's book if I've been studying Mike for decades!"

I think the supposition/theory that Hirsch is afraid of what reading Brian's book might make him think about his own book about Mike or about Mike's positions/opinions is, while most certainly just a theory, certainly is not craziest theory I've heard. It seems totally plausible to me, and his "I don't need to read Brian's book" attitude is what makes me think it's plausible. It sounds a little defensive to me. And/or like he's annoyed that Brian didn't give him an interview for Mike's book.

I haven't run across any Beach Boys fans worth their salt that haven't read both books, so the whole "Mike supporters" thing I don't get or will ever get. Basically, if you're a Beach Boys fan you owe it to yourself to read them both. It seems silly not to. 
Hirsch points out in the interview that he's not really a big fan to begin with so I wouldn't expect him to read Brian's book. However, I also found it strange for him to say he knew everything about Brian because he sounds like a casual fan at best. Maybe if Brian's book had been published before he was working on Mike's he could have gotten some info from it, but it's a little late for that now. I think it's cool that he agreed to the interview, but it sure didn't sound to me like he's going to be rushing out to buy the SMiLE sessions box and join a fan forum any time soon.   

I'm so sick of the C50 talk. It should be pretty straightforward to anyone.
Either Mike dumps his band and being the boss of his own business and joins up with Brian's band... or Brian dumps his band and the comfort of being the boss to join Mike's band. These guys are in their twilight years and don't have to or want to answer to anybody. It ain't gonna happen. It made sense to do it for the 50th because that was a good PR hook (although let's not kid ourselves, that was NOT two touring acts joining together...it was M & B along with Scott and John joining Brian's band) but Mike clearly doesn't get along with Melinda so that's that....on top of all the other things I just mentioned.

Thank you for the link.  That guy kept asking Brian about the voices, but Brian shut him down pretty quick.

I don't think Brian was feeling this guy at all, and to be honest, neither was I.

A pet peeve of mine. Why not ask Brian about something he enjoys for a change? Does every interview have to be "tell me about those dark years..". Sheesh. No wonder he clams up.

Speaking of a "hand on a leg"...RE: Gene Landy putting his hand on Brian's leg to find out if Brian was attracted to a woman? I wish I had never read that. Damn scumbag.

A few things that have stuck out for me so far:

-Very surprised to hear Brian say that he was unsure of the direction that "Imagination" was going and felt that at times it was more Joe Thomas' album than his. He generally praises Joe but that was interesting. 

-Unlike others here, I never thought "The Last Song" was about the C50 tour ending. I always felt if that were true it kind of cheapened the song. I figured I was correct. Brian says the song is about wondering if every album he makes is going to be the last one given his age. Powerful stuff and helps me to reexamine and re-appreciate that song in a new way. 

-The whole story about Murray forcing Brian to sh** on a plate is turned on its head. In Brian's version he purposely did it and handed the plate to his father saying "Here's your dinner" just to get back at him for numerous offenses. 

He also mentioned Thomas remixing and adding stuff to "Everything I Need" as well

Yeah, that was for the version that wound up on The Wilsons album, right? I was surprised at that because it seemed to me that he loves working with Joe. I'm an "Imagination" apologist. It my #2 favorite solo album from Brian. 

A few things that have stuck out for me so far:

-Very surprised to hear Brian say that he was unsure of the direction that "Imagination" was going and felt that at times it was more Joe Thomas' album than his. He generally praises Joe but that was interesting. 

-Unlike others here, I never thought "The Last Song" was about the C50 tour ending. I always felt if that were true it kind of cheapened the song. I figured I was correct. Brian says the song is about wondering if every album he makes is going to be the last one given his age. Powerful stuff and helps me to reexamine and re-appreciate that song in a new way. 

-The whole story about Murray forcing Brian to sh** on a plate is turned on its head. In Brian's version he purposely did it and handed the plate to his father saying "Here's your dinner" just to get back at him for numerous offenses. 

VDP posted to twitter that he's pissed that Brian said he didn't want to work with him again.

 ‏@thevandykeparks  8h8 hours ago
Wilson sez he won't work with lyricists Asher or Parks again, as he's "moving on". No good deeds will go unpunished.

Van Dyke Parks ‏@thevandykeparks  55m55 minutes ago

Van Dyke Parks
I agree with that Tony Asher and I are better than that. So is Wilson. We all appreciate your kind attention!Kindness is key.

Then a couple of quotes about loyalty.

He seems to overreact sometimes, doesn't he? I guess he's still angry about Love & Mercy.

I follow VDP on Twitter. This is typical Parks. He reads or sees something in the media and he goes on a Twitter rant. I really disliked him for a while, but now I've learned to just let the crazy rants roll off my back. Some people should just REALLY not be allowed to go on Twitter.