There is a new Al date with his Endless Summer Band scheduled for August 26th at The Ridgefield Playhouse in Ridgefield, Connecticut. I'm not sure why Al and his team have not publicly announced it yet. Tickets for this show have been on sale for a few weeks now.

https://tickets.ridgefieldplayhouse.org/eventperformances.asp?evt=23

Speaking of Smile, I ran across the Surf's Up instrumental from BWPS just now on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNETTrZ_aAE), were all of these made available at some point? I was only aware of 'Heroes and Villains being' an available instrumental from the 2004 album. Would love to get my hands on all the tracks.

That is actually my YouTube channel. I also have the Roll Plymouth Rock backing track posted on it too (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jByW0jO4cQ). In addition to the Heroes and Villains instrumental you mentioned, there were also released instrumental versions of On a Holiday and Wind Chimes from BWPS, but I'm not sure where those are from (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8YBmDVfEn0). For the two tracks on my channel, the Surf's Up instrumental was released on the Beautiful Dreamer bonus CD released by David Leaf in 2005 (https://www.discogs.com/release/2909586-Brian-Wilson-Beautiful-Dreamer) and the Roll Plymouth Rock instrumental appeared on a bonus CD that came with the November 2004 edition of ESQ (https://www.discogs.com/release/9549874-Brian-Wilson-On-A-Holiday-Roll-Plymouth-Rock-Instrumental).

There are two different Smile albums at play here.  There is the originally planned 12 track Smile with the associated tracks and songs Brian worked on from August 66- March 67.  This is what Derek Taylor is saying has been sealed in a can and "scrapped."  Someone - presumably Brian - informed him that he was abandoning these tracks (but not necessarily the songs, as we see with Smiley).  As has been pointed out, Dada was Brian starting something new, whether for a B side of a single or a track for an album.

Then there is Smile as the name of "the next Beach Boys album" - whatever Brian decided it would consist of.  That's what the Beach Boys are talking about.  An album was continuing to be worked on.  An album would eventually come out.  And to be fair to them, Brian probably wasn't communicating to Mike, Al, Carl et al what he was going to exclude or include on "the next album" from what he had been recording - as it turns out very little was included, only about half of Heroes and the end of Vegetables.

I Love to Say Da Da is the first of the 2 water chants which form a vital part of Smile.  He may have been working on it to use on the reverse of a single and it changed into Cool Cool Water which he also didn't use on Smiley Smile.  I read somewhere that Brian was unhappy that they had put this on Sunflower.  Vegetables was a change from the original also which had VDP lyrics and was called Vega-tables.   It is quite obvious he was trying to protect as much of the original Smile as possible from use.

I'm enjoying reading this thread, but I want to chime in here on this point even though I rarely post: I Love to Say Da Da was not supposed to be water in the context of Smile, although that is what the track eventually grew into during the period of time being discussed here (i.e., during the time when Smile was transitioning/being reworked into Smiley Smile). According to Stephen Desper, the song was originally about a baby and more likely than not was initially envisioned as part of the 'cycle of life' songs that Wonderful, Child is Father of the Man, and Surf's Up all belonged to. The "wa-wa" 'chant' that you're referring to were baby sounds, and theme of the song being about a baby is referenced in its title and the fact that Brian reportedly sucked on a baby bottle filled with chocolate milk when he was composing it. It was only after Smile that the song's theme changed into being about water. You can read Stephen's comments about how I Love to Say Da Da morphed into Cool, Cool Water here: http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,11964.msg238603.html#msg238603 and here: http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,11964.msg238790.html#msg238790

Given how late in the Smile Session's chronology Brian worked on it, and given how Van Dyke never even wrote lyrics for it, what with the song itself being an outgrowth of a scrapped section of Heroes and Villains (All Day), I am not convinced that Da Da would have appeared on any hypothetical released version of Smile back in early 1967. I definitely wouldn't say that the song was a 'vital part of Smile', and, given its origins, it is also highly improbable that Brian ever had it in mind as part of any elements suite given how the song was originally about a baby. On the thread I just linked to, someone suggested that the transition from the song about a baby to being about water likely happened during this transition period into Smiley Smile after Smile (as it had originally been conceived) had officially been scrapped. I think that view has merit to it — Brian working on the song during this period may have just been him experimenting and fleshing out the song, and that experimentation led to Cool, Cool Water instead. There are a lot of misconceptions out there about Da Da being water and what its overall place/role in Smile was, which I think in large part stems from the fact that the above posts from Stephen were the first time I think that information about the history of the track had been revealed. So I think Bicyclerider's comment about DaDa ultimately being the start of something new for Brian is on point, even though that 'newness' was him experimenting and building upon an older song.

For those who saw the Beach Boys Talk stream last night, Jon Stebbins was the guest and he commented on Greg, Matt, Evan, and I's thoughts on a potential 60th reunion and whether or not Al was joking. During Evan and I's segment with Greg and Matt earlier on in the stream, Evan and I both agreed that we thought Al was just joking and messing with the fans, but when Jon came on he pretty much said without revealing any details that Al was not joking and there are big things being planned/discussed. After the stream ended, I also heard from a different inside source who confirmed a few things Jon was hinting at, some of which I've heard rumblings about. But needless to say, I no longer think Al was joking.

I am still not getting my hopes up. Nothing is a sure thing until it happens, just like the Feel Flows box set delay showed. But still, I am much more excited about the possibility of a potential reunion now compared to how I felt 8 hours ago.

Edit: Edited for clarity.

Excellent show at the Wall Street Theater last night. I agree with tpesky above. I had a blast and I even randomly met Evan Holly there last night – Evan is the kid who has appeared on Beach Boys Talk twice so far: once to review the Summer Days album, and he also appeared on the most recent 20/20 episode. He and his mother flew in just to attend the show and I randomly spotted him and we started talking for a bit. At one point as we were talking, Al’s wife Mary Ann walked past us and complimented our shirts – the three of us happened to be wearing custom made “Keep It Clean With Al Jardine” shirts. Evan’s and his mom’s shirts matched, but mine was of a completely different design. Al actually even saw my shirt mid-show and made a non-verbal gesture of recognition and acknowledgment of it to me (I was in the first row sitting right in front of him) and after the final bow he said to me “Keep on keeping it clean, man” to which I replied “Oh I definitely will!”  It was pretty cool!

Sonically everything was excellent, and I must say that all of the Wilson-Phillips songs were among the most impressive sounding of the night. Carnie and Wendy were in top form. I recorded a few videos for anyone interested, since I know this tour is limited in geographical scope and not everyone can go to one. Definitely go and see these shows live if you can:

Darlin: https://youtu.be/48-AlrZ_Wbg
Don’t Worry Baby: https://youtu.be/UntnHl7K838
God Only Knows: https://youtu.be/H6vlwRfExrQ
Wake The World: https://youtu.be/TiSFvF-8tZE

[so much better]

I am extremely happy to see this board back online. I don’t post here that often, but I do actively read the forums. I credit this board as being the source of so much of the knowledge I’ve wound up acquiring about my favorite band.

I joined here over a decade ago and read it even prior to that. Let me just say that I think the ‘split’ that occurred circa 2016 has been a very good thing. In 2014 this place was getting so toxic that I actually voluntarily left the forum for years and stopped reading it entirely. Bear in mind this was BEFORE guitarfool ever got promoted to moderator. I only actually started reading and occasionally posting here again in 2017, and by then the events that led to The Pet Sounds Forum’s creation had already occurred. At first I had no idea what had happened and was confused why half of smileysmile was seemingly gone and were now over there, but I managed to piece together what had happened through reading certain key threads that had been active during the time period I had been away. This board has been so much better since the split took place; it’s like night and day. I sincerely hope it never goes away and never reverts back to how it was prior to the split.

I attended the concert at the Capitol Theatre last night. Great show, and it had probably the most impressive live performance of Good Vibrations that I've personally gotten to experience in-person. Brian's singing was on-point and it had incredible energy throughout. Two friends of mine actually attended both the Huntington show and last night's show in Port Chester, and after the concert they talked to me about how Good Vibrations didn't have that same level of energy at the Huntington concert. Normally most live performances of Good Vibrations that I’ve seen suffer from not having cellos playing triplets during the choruses, like how they do on the studio recording, but last night even without any cellos it sounded awesome. The entire audience was on their feet the whole time during it.

I was also very impressed with Feel Flows – compared to past performances of Blondie singing Feel Flows live, this time around he switched up a few things in terms of how he sang it, and those changes made his performance sound much more soulful and spellbinding than in the past, although past performances have also sounded soulful. But it's difficult to describe, and unfortunately even though I managed to get a video of the performance (https://youtu.be/KUN2LsZ8Nqc), the recording doesn't really fully capture just how amazing it sounded live. It's just different when you hear this stuff live and in-person, and this is one of the reasons why performances captured on cell phones are not authentic recreations of the actual concert experience by any means – you can't truly capture the energy and some of the sonic nuances of how this stuff actually sounds when there in-person.

Brian also performed lead – and sounded great doing so – on It's OK. My friends who attended the Huntington concert said that Brian also sounded really good doing It's OK on Tuesday night as well. He seemed into it – there was no hesitation or anything like that in his performance last night, so when Brian fell silent and didn't sing it at all at that one show around a month ago, maybe he didn't know/remember the words and fell silent because of that? Not sure, but he definitely appeared to enjoy singing the song last night.

The VIP experience was kind of a sh*t show if I'm being honest. I bought VIP tickets for me and a friend of mine back in July when the tour was announced, and it was never 100% clear what the VIP package was or was not supposed to contain. Originally a soundcheck performance was advertised, but then about a month after I purchased the package the mention of getting to see the soundcheck performance was removed. There was never any meet and greet advertised, which is fine because I figured there would be no meet and greets anymore due to Covid. But the soundcheck stuff being removed doesn't make much sense to me – it's no less safe than playing the concert itself, so I'm not sure why they are not offering it. And the thing is, I was charged for a soundcheck. That was one of the aspects that was much later confirmed by Future Beat (the company that I guess handles the VIP packages) to have been built into the price I paid for the package. Communication about the VIP package was awful – I didn't receive any notice of whether the VIP package would include a soundcheck, or how to receive the VIP items/merchandise until midday Tuesday. My friend and I even called the Capitol Theatre's box office separately the day prior to that (Monday), and they were just as in the dark as we were about whether or not there would be a soundcheck performance or what one needs to do to receive/redeem their VIP items/merchandise. They basically found out at the same time that my friend and I did, and it turns out that not only would there be no soundcheck performance, but also the items/merchandise would be mailed to us directly after the concert, but only after Ticketmaster emails us a voucher code that we need to input into Ticketmaster's website, and that voucher code would only be sent to us the day after the concert. It's as if they didn't have this stuff ready in time for the tour, and/or are counting on us to maybe neglect or forget about doing the whole voucher code stuff afterwards or something. I don't know, but it was handled very poorly by them overall, although at least they have since promised to issue a partial refund for the part of the VIP package that we paid for which was supposed to cover the soundcheck performance portion of it.

Not sure, but for anyone interested in accessing the old site, it is possible to do so via the Wayback Machine Internet Archive: https://web.archive.org/web/20190108090319/http://surfermoon.com/
There is an email address listed at the bottom of the main page presumably for people to use to get in contact with the manager(s) of the site, but I haven't tried seeing if it still works.

A friend of mine and I recorded a discussion/breakdown/video review of the Feel Flows set... and we wound up talking about the set for nearly 4 and a half hours :https://youtu.be/W1QoT1zcMZI

I am really pumped that Brian, Al, and Blondie are playing the Capitol Theatre in Port Chester. I can't believe they're playing so close by to me. Definitely gonna go to it, I just wonder if they are gonna be offering any Meet and Greet packages. I missed out on my chance to attend a meet and greet with Brian, Al, and Blondie in January of 2020, thinking that there would be more opportunities later, and I've been kicking myself for that decision throughout this pandemic ever since. I do wonder if perhaps the pandemic is gonna make Meet and Greets a thing of the past.

Really great video. It was funny to hear my name come up - for what it's worth, if the case wasn't already solid enough, one of Frank Holmes' 1966 illustrations is subtitled "diamond necklace play the pawn" (present tense), and he was working first-hand from the source.

Need to point something out RE Jack Rieley - in the 1996 email you allude to, Jack emphatically said that none of the other members of the band (including Brian) were responsible for the extra couplet. He didn't make a claim that it took 7 people to write. That isn't something he ever said. The heavy implication of the message is that Jack himself wrote the words, but he couldn't outright say it for obvious reasons. That, I think, is completely believable, measured up on the Jack Rieley believability scale - more so than them having come from Brian.

There's no writer's credit officially given, so I am somewhat reticent about this question. How about this.... it was not Brian, Carl, Jardine, Love, Johnston, Van Dyke Parks, Dennis or Steve Desper.

Perhaps you will excuse this admittedly chicken-sh*t way around your question. The couplet's authorship should of course have been credited. It was not.

I'll also challenge "adieu or die" - it's a nice idea, and I'm sure a somewhat intentional pun, but Brian sings "a do or die" each time. Those are the words he's consciously singing in every attempt without any real wiggle room.

Some handwritten lyrics by Van Dyke were included in the 2004 tour programme. He makes the retroactive "the diamond necklace played" mistake, mixes up some of the order, and there's no final verse printed, but I think it's probably the most reliable reflection of his original intentions regarding most of the rest of the spelling. Punctuation and line structure reproduced:

A diamond necklace played the pawn
Hand in hand some drummed along to a handsome mannered baton
A blind class aristocracy
Back through the opera glass you see the pit and the pendulum drawn
Columnated ruins domino!
Canvas the town and brush the backdrop
Are you sleeping?

Hung velvet overtaken me
Dim chandelier awaken me to a song dissolve in the dawn
The music hall a costly bow
The music all is lost for now to a muted trumpeter swan
Columnated ruins domino!

Dove nested towers
The hour was strike the street quicksilver moon
Carriage across the fog two-step to lamp light cellar tune
The laughs come hard in Auld Lang Syne

The glass was raised – the fired roast
The fullness of the wine – the dim last toasting
While at port a do or die

A choke of grief heart hardened I
Beyond belief
A broken man too tough to cry

Thank you for pointing this out and for all the feedback! I wrote and pinned a comment in the comments section just now to mention my mistake and correct it (and in it, I mention you as being the one who accurately pointed out my mistake). At that point when I was recording the video I was going partially off of memory (ditto when I created the accompanying visual). Jack's roundabout non-answer in that email is stated in a way that I've always found confusing, but you are right. I still think that there's a chance that Brian could have written those lyrics though, but rereading Jack's email now, yeah, he definitely could have written them and I wouldn't be surprised if he did.

And very interesting about those handwritten lyrics! I don't own a tour program myself, but now that you mention them I do recall reading claims that they included handwritten lyrics by Van Dyke. Those certainly would have been good to incorporate into the video and talk about, especially RE: the spelling aspect, but unfortunately it's too late to do that now.

Hello fellow smileysmilers! Back in February of this year, there was a thread that was posted on here that asked a few questions concerning the lyrics to Surf's Up, and that thread gave me the idea to create a singular comprehensive resource which chronicles the history, meanings, and evolution of the song's lyrics over time. There have been many threads on this board (and other places on the internet too) over the years that have discussed various aspects of Surf's Up's lyrics, but to my knowledge no one had ever attempted to compile a singular resource that chronicles all of the key information about the lyrics, their meanings, their history, etc. in it. So I recently created a new video which attempts to do exactly that:

https://youtu.be/PkBZP96NoAw

I hope people enjoy this and find it interesting. Even I learned a few new things about the lyrics which I hadn't known before!

I’m am so happy right now I could cry. Been too long.

https://youtube.com/shorts/ffkgvrRHXCw?

In an interview on the Michael Shelly radio show on WFMU, Al Jardine just mentioned/confirmed that July 23rd is indeed the release date for the Feel Flows box set. The show is just airing now, but I believe it can be listened to later on the WFMU archives site: https://www.wfmu.org/recentarchives.php

Vocal-wise, All I Wanna Do, Big Sur, Meant For You - all incredible. Lyrics-wise, Good Vibrations, The Warmth of the Sun, Kiss Me Baby, Only With You. Lots of good stuff.

[both included and installed]

Here's a photo I took of my Light Up set's back insert, specifically the portion shown in the photo Tricycle Rider linked to:



What they don't tell you – and what they also made more confusing/less clear by the "Install batteries as indicated" sentence – is that they both included and installed the batteries already. Meaning that you are pretty much good to go to activate the light switch once you unseal your set, but if you don't unseal it, well.... the batteries will eventually start to leak, just like one of them started to do in my case. I was fortunate to catch that process at a very early stage.

For some reason I assumed that flyer thing was on the outside of the box and under clear shrink wrap so it could be read from the outside; is it not?

Most of the back insert is, yes, but the small flap in the above photo actually came tucked inside the lids of the box sets, where the front lid meets the back lid. So the info on the flap isn't visible to anyone who kept their set sealed. The only reason I know this is A) The regular non-Light Up versions were packaged this way as well, which I know because I own a still-sealed regular set myself, and B) I actually made an unboxing video when I first received and opened my Light Up set, and upon viewing it again just now, I can confirm that the flap in question was/is tucked into the box, just like how they were for the non-Light Ups.

Here's a photo of my sealed regular set so you can see what I mean:



Unlike the Light Up sets though, the flap on the regular sets are blank:



(I own, like, 4 SMiLE Sessions sets: 1 Light Up Edition and 3 regular versions, one of which is sealed, for anyone who is wondering where I am getting all of these pictures from )

Hi UEF, and congratulations on your new SMiLE Light-Up Edition Box Set!   (That was very cool of MyOnlySunshine!)

I'm wondering if you can do me a favor. In this photograph: http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5336/7185967940_9c9caae260_n.jpg there appears to be some writing that I think says "Battery Installation Instructions" and some other writing below it too small for me to read. Could you take a photo of that writing from your box set so I could read it? I'm trying to find out if the batteries came pre-installed in those light-up box sets. I have one I never opened, and have recently become worried about battery acid leaking out inside the box. (gosh, I sure hope not!)

Thank you in advance,

Hi Tricycle Rider, I know you are addressing UEF but I actually have the answer to your question as well — yes, batteries unfortunately come preinstalled inside the Light Up sets. The sets take/include three AA batteries, and the brand of battery that they used isn’t a big-name brand that I recognize (i.e. Duracell, Energizer, Panasonic, etc.). They are alkaline batteries. This is my biggest peeve with the Light Up sets – they shouldn't have installed batteries prior to sealing the sets.

I remember when I first received my Light Up Edition, one of the batteries actually came loose during shipping and was rolling around inside of the set. Thankfully I had planned on opening my box set anyway once it arrived, so I was able to put that loose battery back into the battery compartment. Much later when I was preparing to transport my Light Up box to one of Al’s storyteller solo shows to have him add his autograph to it, I opened up the battery compartment again and I noticed that the middle battery had started to leak and that the corresponding coil in the middle of the compartment had begun to corrode as a result. I removed all three batteries from the battery compartment and cleaned it by applying cleaning vinegar (6% acidity – since alkaline is a base, it needs to be neutralized with an acid) to the corroded coil with a q-tip and then let it sit for a few minutes to do its work. After drying the coil using a combination of water (applied by q-tip), dry q-tips, a cotton cloth, and rubbing alcohol, the corrosion was neutralized/removed and thankfully I got the coil looking good as new. I confirmed that the lights were still working afterwards by putting fresh batteries in, and after that I removed those batteries and have kept the battery compartment empty ever since.

Now that the Light Up sets are almost 10 years old, I imagine most people who left their sets sealed or who opened theirs but never bothered to remove the batteries that came with them are now experiencing some degree of battery leakage. It absolutely sucks that they did this – for once I wish batteries weren't included!

I'm cautiously optimistic about this news. You always have to wait and see how things truly play out of course, but there are some pretty encouraging quotes in those articles.

One more- in the verses at the beginning of the song, is the BG vocal singing " my love my love" or "my god my god"??

It's actually "Bygone, bygone." But according to Stephen Desper via a post he made on this board some years back, it's actually "Michael, Michael" said in conjunction with/at the same time as "Bygone, bygone". I believe he said that Carl had mentioned that this was supposed to be a reference to the archangel Michael.

Can the lightup box be bought anywhere in 2020?

So, 4 months after making THAT comment! Smileysmile user 'MyOnlySunshine' got in touch to say that he'd found one for sale, though unfortunately at the time the seller wouldn't ship internationally (I'm in the UK, and most of these boxes seem to be in the US)

Well, it's a long story but as I was trying to bid on the auction using my American forwarder address, something went wrong at the last minute and I missed out. I mentioned this to MyOnlySunshine and, amazingly, he had the winning bid and kindly offered it to me instead of keeping it! I thought I'd lost it completely and this was an amazing surprise!

What resulted was much research on both our parts to find the best way of getting it over (including our shock at UPS quoting nearly $400 to ship it over during the era of Covid)

myonlysunshine received the product, repackaged it to better suit an international trip, and got it insured and shipped over to the UK and didn't really ask for anything extra in return - THANK YOU! It arrived yesterday, number 169 (of? 200? 250?)





You're a good man

Happy to help, UEF! And thank you for all the info you provided regarding shipping options and your help with coordinating all this. This was my first time shipping an item like this abroad.

I posted this on Discogs a few years ago, but I’m going to post it here too in case any other Light Up Edition owners read this thread: In Perry Cox's 2017 “Price & Reference Guide for The Beach Boys American Records" book, he stated that only 50 Light Up Editions were made and that they were unnumbered, but this isn't true – the Light Up sets are numbered and more than 50 of them were made. Their numbers are listed on the inside of their lids, near the bottom-righthand corner. So you cannot determine which number box you have unless you open it.

According to Perry, the 50 count that he included in his book actually came from Brian's camp early on during the bookmaking process. Perry is now aware of this inaccuracy and he plans on correcting it in future printings of his book. But, it still isn’t clear exactly how many Light Up Editions were produced in total. My own Light Up box is number 71, which proves that more than 50 were made. A few years ago I saw a picture of someone else’s Light Up box – number 102. This means that more than 100 were made. I have also seen (and read about) a few Light Up boxes that have numbers higher than 150 (but lower than 200). 

I suspect that either 200 or 250 Light Up sets were made in total, although the latter number is just an educated guess based upon some unverifiable info I came across. Does anyone here who has opened up their Light Up box have a number higher than 200? Or have a source that can confirm for certain exactly how many were made?

The one that always gets me is "The fired-roast" versus "The fired rose". I'm guessing Carl wrote the lyric out as the latter, but I'm positive that the original lyric is the former, and Van Dyke seems to agree since he always uses "roast" and not "rose" whenever I've seen him type that line. One can hear the "T" in "roast" in the 1967 Brian solo version. It's more difficult to make out in the 1966 piano demo though.

Just want to chime in and confirm how great this episode was and how good they have all been – I have been tuning in and participating in the chat every week since the second episode (I'm FeelFlows409 in the Twitch chat). To anyone who hasn't checked out the streams yet but is considering potentially doing so, I highly recommend it. Kudos to Greg and Matt for doing such awesome work with this.

Random, but does anyone here know where the "So Tough" subtitle part of "Carl and the Passions – So Tough" comes from and what its meaning (if any) is? The origin of the "Carl and the Passions" portion is well known, but I can't seem to find much info on the "So Tough" part. Who came up with it, and what, if anything, is it supposed to refer to?

I didn't watch Brian on Facebook, but I doubt the reason he said he didn't know anything about it is not because of Mike, but because of either...

1)  He didn't recognize the name of the box set.  Maybe if they had described it as a box set with Sunflower and Surf's Up albums on it he might have known what they were talking about?

2)  It's been months upon months, and almost certainly more than a year (or two?) since he was asked to give an interview for the box set, so maybe he's forgotten about it mostly, and maybe someone else has been doing most of the legal finagling for him on whether it should come out or not?

There's also a third option: Perhaps because the set hasn't been officially announced yet, Brian isn't sure yet if he's allowed to say anything about it and therefore he opted to err on the side of caution and claim he doesn't know anything about it. He did the same thing in early 2011 with the 50th reunion/TWGMTR, whereby whenever the press asked him any questions about a possible reunion his answers were that of “I have no interest in a reunion, I want to continue my solo career” or something along those lines.

Later we found out those were lies he purposefully fed to the press and that a reunion had been in the works for at least a year or two prior. I remember after the reunion album and tour were announced he expressed relief in one interview about how he was thankful that he didn’t have to remain tight-lipped about it anymore.

Also, I doubt this was in any way intentional, but you gotta love how Al literally said that "everyone knows about" the Feel Flows box set on Billy Hinche's Facebook show a few days ago, and only days later when asked about it Brian says "I don't know anything about that."