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642928 Posts in 25674 Topics by 3648 Members - Latest Member: solarpanel January 22, 2019, 07:31:05 PM
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1  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Entertainment Thread / Re: Your favourite movie clips on YouTube on: January 07, 2019, 06:03:13 AM
Great idea!

Here's one of my favourite moments in a film. The video is good quality except for the sounds of someone turning up the volume in the first fifteen seconds:
2  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: The Beatles on: January 06, 2019, 11:37:17 AM
My song of the moment--and what a song it is too!

One of my all-time favourite Beatles song and my favourite song of George's with the band.
3  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: All I Wanna Do - What were The BBs trying to achieve with it? on: December 27, 2018, 09:04:00 AM
I listened to sitar version, it's better in the way it's less "dirge" like than the Sunflower. But it's not very interesting w/o vocs, way too distinct drums & Eastern vibe isn't anything special. Sitar doesn't even sound very Eastern, it's not quite yet authentic.
This is one of the things I noticed about '68 sets. I've heard of this sitar version long before the actual release of the song, and I expected something that sounds like sitar in Beatles' "Gettin' Better", or even "Carnival of Sound" album by Jan & Dean.

I don't know about Carnival of Sound, but I don't think there is a sitar on Getting Better. There's definitely a tamboura, which was discussed in this thread:,26270.0.html

4  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Smiley Smile Message Board Milestone - And General Words Of Thanks on: December 24, 2018, 06:26:25 AM
5  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Smiley Smile Message Board Milestone - And General Words Of Thanks on: December 20, 2018, 02:49:08 PM
While we are making confessions  LOL

I genuinely believe AGD should be allowed back, he's far too valuable

This question is not in the realm of inter-board squabbles, but is rather engaging on a topic about a Beach Boys historian. In what way do you consider him to be valuable? From someone who does academic research for a living, I genuinely don't understand why he would be considered a good historian and I felt that way even before he was discovered to be throwing around groundless claims.
6  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Smiley Smile Message Board Milestone - And General Words Of Thanks on: December 20, 2018, 11:51:46 AM
Looks like Filledeplage got suspended too, by one of the two mods. Hmmm. Too little too late? The backpedaling after the fact is a little frustrating, considering all of this was allowed to stand while others got scapegoated for doing far less or for doing nothing at all. The best way to stop that kind of thing (like Filledeplage) from infecting a board is to simply enforce the rules and step in when they're broken as openly as they were in this and similar situations, by the same person with a history of doing the exact same thing. Just sayin'.

So even though Watamushi falsely said I was there "solely to squabble about off-topic issues", the person who actually started the off-topic old-grudge bullshit who had done so repeatedly in the past and allowed to do so unchecked is now suspended too, retroactive or after-the-fact or something...

Perhaps when I replied to her bullshit and distortions in the middle of on-topic discussions, then went back to the on-topic discussions, I actually wasn't the one to blame for taking it off-topic?

Nice job guys, or guy in this case since it seems Watamushi was alone in putting the ban on Filledeplage and perhaps Dick found the whole thing too "draining" and didn't agree with banning a favored member.

A little honesty would have been nice, guys. As such, the credibility level is still somewhere around Rocky and Stan levels...Hope it's worth it to keep that shield around those favored members and/or benefactors and keep the 20 or so average readers content.
I'm pretty sure filldepage was suspended yesterday along with mikesbeard and SJS.

No, it came later, after the fact, and Watamushi even posted that he should have done it at the same time as the other bans but did not. And Watamushi specifically said it was done on his own accord, suggesting Dick either didn't agree with banning Filledeplage, or maybe he didn't want to step on the toes of the favored few over there who are perhaps above the board rules.

So that's a glimpse into the moderation over there under the two new mods. It's posted openly for all to see.

And what the mods posted earlier still stands as a bullshit excuse that doesn't match what actually happened at all. If it did, if their reasoning was solid, Filledeplage would not have been banned.

Clusterfuck of the highest order.

OK I almost never comment on the inter-relations between boards and as most of you know, I do not go out of my way to curry favour with anyone. Even Guitarfool and I have been on very opposite sides before on an several issues on this board.

But, my God, given the sheer amount of jibes about his "lengthy posts," alone, he should have been rewarded for his patience if anything, and that's not even taking into account the amount of times he had to defend himself on a topic that had nothing to do with the thread.
7  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: What are you watching now?/Favourite Movie of the Moment on: December 14, 2018, 10:14:13 AM

Love City Lights! I tear up just thinking of the ending .

Me too! It was a real emotional experience watching it a few weeks ago.
8  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: What are you watching now?/Favourite Movie of the Moment on: December 14, 2018, 08:29:40 AM
Love both of those movies.
Do you have any opinion on The Gold Rush in its estate-approved 1942 version versus the 1925?

I've never watched the latter.
Tried to many years ago. Back in the VHS days.
 I rented many a silent film not realizing that there would be no synchronized soundtrack of newly composed, or recorded music.
 I've never been able to sit through that type of presentation !

You know what - I'm not sure exactly which version I saw. It was a long time ago but I think it must have been the 1942 version, given your description. I think I have both available to me now through Kanopy so I should give them a try to compare.
9  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: What are you watching now?/Favourite Movie of the Moment on: December 14, 2018, 05:44:32 AM
The transfers of City Lights and Gold Rush on the Criterion collection are great . Last two I watched were those. City Lights I feel foolish only now for having finally the clarity to discern that chaplin in the final scene does not get the girl. The sentimental decorations and my own youth in the past blinded me. Blinded me to many things. Filmic, or otherwise.

Love both of those movies. Saw City Lights just recently. I feel like the ending is more ambiguous - I'm not sure if he does or doesn't get the girl. What's even more intriguing to me is that if he doesn't get the girl. is that smile on his face an expression his naivetť or does he know and he's just trying to persevere in the face of crushing humiliation? Or is he genuinely about the embark on a great romance? The ambiguity of it is what makes it one of the great final shots in cinema.
10  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1968 Copyright Extension prediction thread on: December 08, 2018, 07:18:07 PM
Well You Know I Knew sounds like Neil Young trying to cover Last Train to Clarksville.

It's great.
11  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: Books you can't finish reading on: December 07, 2018, 11:00:09 AM
When I was 14 I read the first two chapters of thr first Harry Potter book. I absolutely hated it, don't really remember why, but I disliked it enough to swear off the rest of the books and all of the movies. I would probably dismiss it as a children's book if I tried going back to it now at age 33.

I've just finished teaching a three month university course on the book series!
12  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: So are we getting a White Album 50 year release/remix or not? on: November 14, 2018, 09:18:20 AM
I think they were able to integrate the mono mix on the Pepper set because there was more room. Less outtakes, no home demos, etc.

Whereas, with the White Album set, including the mono mix means two extra CDs. As it is, it's already 7 discs including the Blu-ray.

I was going to say it was already released in the "Mono" boxed set from 2009, but that set seems to be OOP and on the expensive side, and they don't appear to offer it as a purchasable download.

The mono mix *is* in the new deluxe set, but only on the Blu-ray disc. 

Absolutely agreed that spatial concerns are a big reason why there's no Mono CD.

Also, I keep forgetting that the Mono is available on the Blue-ray. I still have not received my copy in the mail though I can pick it up today. Is it the original mono mix or a new one? I suppose I could look this up for myself but were the 2009 mono mixes the originals or new, or some mixture of both? I'm becoming more and more of a Mono person as I get older, particularly for music made pre-1970 and would really like to hear more of those original mixes.
13  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: So are we getting a White Album 50 year release/remix or not? on: November 14, 2018, 08:44:01 AM
As for this "White Album" set, I have to say that most fans are rightly blown away by it, only in 2018 on the snarky, cynical internet could people seriously gripe about it. I'm not talking about tiny nitpicks, like mix preferences or how one version of a song should have been included instead of another.

Rather, on other boards, I've seen a very "meh" attitude about the set. From Beatles fans. It's nuts. Maybe it's mostly younger fans or something. But fans waited DECADES to get any substantial amount of outtakes, which came in 1995-96 with "Anthology", and then had to wait ANOTHER two decades or so to get any substantial additional amount of outtakes.

Fans and Beatles scholars have been calling for multi-disc deluxe editions of Beatles albums since, at least, the dawn of the CD era in the 80s and especially in the late 80s and early 90s when multi-disc CD boxed sets became more prevalent. It seemed a no brainer.

The fact that they released a *full disc* of White Album outtakes on "Anthology 3" and then, with little overlap, had FOUR more discs of outtakes/demos to issue over 20 years later shows have rich those archives are.

Yes, as has been known since the 80s when Lewisohn documented the archive, there are relatively few "new" actual compositions that they left off albums. And we know that, in most cases, they made the right choice to drop tracks like "If You've Got Trouble", etc. (I still find all those tracks immensely interesting of course). But hearing multiple discs of the band working stuff out in the studio, it's mind-blowing.

I think both the outtakes and the stereo remix on this White Album set are even more impressive than last year's Pepper set.

Some of the standout tracks include all the alternates for "Good Night", including the version with group backing vocals, and finally the unedited piano/Ringo take (which was crossfaded on "Anthology 3"). The alternate of "I'm So Tired" with backing vocals and some of those extra overdubs re-integrated is great.

And finally, the (more or less) uncut Esher demos not from Lennon's probably multi-generation mixdown (which still sounded good enough for all the years it circulated), but from the four-track master tape. I can't think of any band or artist that has genuinely *Home* demos from the 60s that sound this good in terms of sound quality.

Hear hear. We are so incredibly lucky to have a set like this - and so far I love what I have heard of the new mix - it's quite a nice revision.

This is not a criticism of the set at all, but one thing that I loved about the Pepper box last year was them giving us the original mono mix of the album. It made sense because of comments from people like Lennon who said the only way to hear the real Pepper was in mono, etc. That said, I have heard such great things about the mono mix of the White Album and I've never been able to hear it in its entirety. It would have been cool to also get the original mono mix here too but again, there are already so many discs of material in the deluxe set, it would be hard to imagine include another two - or justifying to listeners yet another two discs of the same tracks that are already part of the set. Still - I'd love a CD version of the original mono mix.
14  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: So are we getting a White Album 50 year release/remix or not? on: November 13, 2018, 08:55:09 PM
Just to finalize this, here is the Beatles youtube channel playlist of the entire deluxe set:
15  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: (suspended) on: November 09, 2018, 06:48:06 PM
But it is those among us who want to browbeat him with their point and want him to acknowledge their absolute correctness that has put this thread and his website in it's current condition.

I have mentioned this elsewhere but it bears repeating that this is not why his website is in its current condition.

Its in its current condition because Mr. Desper is concerned that a potential controversy over a long-held belief about who sang the song could lead to him no longer having the permission to use the music at all. If we dropped this whole conversation entirely, the music would go back up eventually.

Have you considered that maybe Mr Desper was told to take it down by BRI? 

No I haven't nor do I have any reason to believe that's the case.
16  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: (suspended) on: November 07, 2018, 08:00:18 PM
But it is those among us who want to browbeat him with their point and want him to acknowledge their absolute correctness that has put this thread and his website in it's current condition.

I have mentioned this elsewhere but it bears repeating that this is not why his website is in its current condition.

Its in its current condition because Mr. Desper is concerned that a potential controversy over a long-held belief about who sang the song could lead to him no longer having the permission to use the music at all. If we dropped this whole conversation entirely, the music would go back up eventually.
17  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson - 2018 Tour Thread on: November 05, 2018, 07:08:50 PM
I respect him as a musician but Wayne was way off base with that

I guess he's softened with age.

Yes, but that was clearly for the always bewitching American actor Brian Dennehy.
18  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson - 2018 Tour Thread on: November 05, 2018, 09:33:08 AM
Iím not into fence-walking and both-side-ism, but this was clearly a bungled situation on *both* sides.

On Brianís side, whomever not only granted the interview, but actively *sought* out doing an interview with a sports talk guy (assuming the host is accurate that Brianís camp sought out the interview) were just asking for problems. With even more sympathetic interviewers/shows, shows that regularly feature musicians and other artistic types, Brianís interviews have sometimes been tough. When you start entering the realm of ďtalk radioĒ (ugggh), and then ďsports talk radioĒ (extra ugggh), youíre just asking for trouble. And when that personality also posts crap on Twitter all the time, you then open up Brian to TONS of Twitter a-holes, the kind of simple-minded people who post stuff like ďSounds like, based on a hostís description of an interview, Iím now going to boycott this musical artist.Ē Wtf?

BUT, booking Brian on crap like this opens up all of these situations unfortunately. And Brian has bad days, no question. But by the time of a few minutes before airtime, they should cancel a booking if Brianís not feeling it. Easier on EVERYONE.

Yes, ideally these shows/hosts would do their homework on Brianís deal. But even some music-centric radio DJs donít. You canít count on that. At the very least, if they just HAD to promote this show, they should have either paired Brian with Al, or just sent Al to do the interview. EASY solution; Jardine is there and has regularly suffered through inane DJs and radio shows (and done some good ones, too, just as Brian has).

Also, while Valvano, even after eventually *trying* to empathize or sympathize with Brianís issues on Twitter, still felt compelled to put the onus on Brian more than sympathetic friends and fans and colleagues would (itís *always* a dangerous area to start drawing an arbitrary line where someone with mental health/medical issues should be given a pass for their behavior versus when they should be held responsible), I donít think itís out of line to at least pose the question of whether Brian can or should ever be called out for being too, well whatever it is he was in this interview. Many fans of Brianís have (justifiably) called others out for suggesting that Brian canít do things for himself, or make decisions for himself, etc. Well, thatís gotta work both ways at least a little bit, right? If Brian is relatively independent, then if he does come across as lacking interest to the point of rudness in an interview, is it *ever* justifiable to at least point that out? The problem of course is that, while Valvano wasnít as crude and harsh in the aftermath as he could have been (and as other radio and sports radio personalities might be), he didnít help things with his reaction to the interview (a reaction which Iím guessing he ironically thought was polite and restrained).

On Valvanoís side, while it appears they went to some degree of lengths to steer the interview as well as they could, what he *should* have done is just finished the interview and then let it go. Hereís a news flash: It DOES take a pretty empathetic person to not just scoff at situations like this and say Brianís being a dick. The problem is that while it takes *very little* homework to know that Brian has issues and can be a tough interview if you donít know much about him or know him, it does take more homework to really get into the nuts and bolts of *how* Brianís intermittent oddness in interviews works. It isnít as simple as ďhe has had mental health issues in the past and those issues can still impact modern interviews.Ē His moods and idiosyncrasies do play a role as well. You gotta be pretty good to steer a Brian interview thatís starting to go off the rails, and a sports talk guy usually isnít the guy to do that.

Perhaps even more egregious and less professional was Valvanoís bits about essentially telling people to not go Brianís show because heís a dick. Indeed, many a sports personality is a dick too, and Iím guessing Valvano doesnít regularly call for boycotts of teams and leagues.

Bottom line, I do think Brian and his team made a bad decision to book an interview like this. But they certainly didnít mean anybody any harm, and had no ill intentions. Conversely, Valvano, even while apparently *trying* to sort of be empathetic, came off poorly and more ill-intentioned by actively calling for people not to see Brianís show, and for opening up a can of worms on Twitter which, ANYBODY who knows ANYTHING about Twitter, knows will immediately blow up into a cesspool of Twitter garbage who are going to say awful things about Brian.

I can understand what you're saying and I'm not one to ra-ra people just because I love their music. But I would guess that the Brian team doesn't have too much leeway in terms of who interviews him, especially in smaller markets like Louisville, Kentucky, which isn't tiny but is hardly New York and LA. If a promoter wants interviews (and I would imagine that many of them would openly prefer their headliner be the one to actually do the interview versus a lesser known member of the band, however important Al Jardine might be to all of us), I could imagine that it would be difficult to always find someone who suits Brian's requirements. I'm sure that this is something that Paul McCartney, Bob Dylan, Paul Simon, and Neil Young don't have to worry about but, unfortunately, Brian does.

I would agree that having him talk with someone like Al would be better. However, I can't imagine that even with them both being on tour together they'd both be always available at the same time. Again, ideally, it would be just preferable if Brian didn't have to do these types of things at all. And I don't fully think there is a connection between people who argue that Brian isn't being led around against his free will. I have no doubt that Brian has the freedom to do whatever he wants as far as his personal life is concerned but I also think that he's subject to the same insipid requirements of the industry that most other musicians are subject to.
19  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson - 2018 Tour Thread on: November 04, 2018, 10:35:09 AM
I haven't heard the interview but I can imagine how it went.

I have read this Valvano's tweet responses about the interview and find it problematic on several fronts.

One, he says this:  "I don't think that was the mental illness talking. Lots of folks who battle it are still able to hold a simple conversation, especially if you're coherent enough to perform 90 minute concerts."

His conclusion is that Brian's answers were not evidence of someone who is extremely socially awkward and affected by all sorts of issues but is instead just a jerk. Unfortunately, this is a trend that I see happening a lot these days, "I know lots of people suffering from x and they never do y, therefore the person who does do y can't use x as an excuse." This perspective on mental illness or even introversion really lacks nuance. Illness never pronounces itself in just one singular way. Lots of people react in very different ways to the issues that are plaguing them and to assume that all should by and large behave the same way shows a real lack of understanding of the topic, despite Valvano's scoffing at those giving him "mental health lessons."

His point about performing "90 minute concerts" seems fairly indicative of a person who has never seen a Brian Wilson performance and observed the kind of support that Brian gets at one to get through those 90 minutes.

The second point he makes, and seemingly his overriding point, is this: "the most significant thing is THEY CALLED US to have him on to promote his concert here. If they know he's going to be like that,  shame on them. If he didn't want to do it, he simply shouldn't have, shame on him."

Now in all honesty the whole business of concert tours is a terrible one, largely because it has been made into a business and an enterprise. If it were as simple as a band just going from town to town of their own accord and playing in some space where lots of people could hear them, then it would be less terrible. But that's not how it works. Promoters and venues want to make money and, as a result, make it a requirement for the talent to do publicity. And the fact is that Valvano should really know how this process actually works. Does he legitimately think that when most of the celebrities call him up to get an interview that they are doing it because they "want" to? I'm sure that Brian would love to not do 90% of the press he does and I don't blame him. Some artists probably have the clout where they can avoid it, others have the mastery of skill to be able to pull off the press despite loathing it, but Brian can't do either of these things and so he is for the most part forced to enter into these absurd and meaningless discussions so that, for the most part, other people can make a buck off of his talent.

Yes, ideally, it would be great if the whole institution of "the concert" as it exists today changed dramatically but it hasn't. Valvano knows this and to pretend as if Brian could just say no to all the press he doesn't want to do (which, surely and understandably would be most of it) is ridiculous.

20  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: New Politics Thread 2018 on: October 24, 2018, 05:53:50 PM
Anyone here who knows me knows that I am no fan of the Democrats or the Democratic party. But it is has always struck me that the arguments against the Democrats that emanate from the right range from conspiratorial to outright lunacy. Today's attempted attack against particular Democratic figures is a good example of this lunacy and, in my view, is highly encouraged by what is now mainstream extreme-right wing elements in the United States who have managed to propagandize a large community into actually believing that Democrats represent the country's greatest threat.
21  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: RIP Geoff Emerick on: October 22, 2018, 09:37:34 AM

And it's no accident Penny Lane shares a lot of similarities with the lead-off track on the album that Paul was spinning on his record player at Abbey Road during these sessions.  Smiley

Definitely. Lately I've been working on a song which when I first completed sound too much like Wouldn't It Be Nice so I tweaked it a bit and re-arranged some parts and then it came out sounding too much like Penny Lane. So I re-arranged it again and then it sounded like Care of Cell 44. Those three songs are not identical triplets but they are definitely brothers.
22  Smiley Smile Stuff / Ask The Honored Guests / Re: The Stephen Desper Thread on: October 21, 2018, 06:19:05 PM
There still seems to be a significant misunderstanding as to why the videos were taken down.

Did Mr. Desper appreciate being challenged on his thoughts about the vocals? No, probably not. But that's not the reason why he took the videos down.

He took the videos down because he was worried he would not be given permission to use the music anymore because of the controversy that he thought the videos were creating. It was not taken down simply because he was being challenged. Both sides in this argument seem to be missing that crucial point.
23  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys Easter Seals Show 1979 on: October 15, 2018, 06:36:50 PM
I remember Dennis being really disruptive on stage, as he seemed smashed. He knocked over a whole tray of beer as I recall, and he was the only one laughing about it. I was near the front of the stage and the band and especially the Lovester, were not happy.

"You're out of the band, Buckwheat!"
24  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love is in the white house on: October 14, 2018, 06:50:29 AM
Also, Trump gave Sam the pen he used to sign the bill.

Wow. Did he become an honourary White Panther as a result of this gesture?
25  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: FINALLY ! . . . . . . Part Two (suspended) on: October 08, 2018, 05:48:50 PM
Forgive me if I get any of this wrong because I actually don't have access to this exchange at the moment.

But I have been chatting with Mr. Desper and he makes the very good point that because of the nature of his project (namely, using Beach Boys tracks as courtesy of BRI and Capitol) that he worries that any controversy about it could have it shut down. I think that's the main reason why he has taken the videos down. In that respect, no matter where any of us stand on the topic, I believe that it be best for all of us if we just put this particular controversy and this element of the conversation to rest and - this is definitely my own point - that includes the pointing of fingers about who was right and who was wrong in this discussion. Again, I think that the best thing for all parties is to let it go. Please forgive the Disney reference as I have young daughter.  Smiley
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