I'll tell you what will make you appreciate Carl's talents: get in a tribute band and try playing the "Sloop John B" figure while holding down a vocal part.

It's not shredding, but most musicians can't do that. Clapton probably couldn't (though maybe he could).

Same goes for the bass line on that track for that matter. I remember "being Brian" with some tribute band and reaching for that high F while holding that bass part down and I swear I teleported to Jupiter in so doing.

That's what I mean when I mentioned Al's acoustic guitar/vocal performance of "SJB" on that radio program in '83. It's been years since I've heard it, and the part he was playing might not have been the exact part that Carl played live, but it was definitely a picked arpeggio part, and he sang it while playing it. Maybe it wasn't the entire song, but not having noticed much guitar-wise from Al previously, I was definitely impressed that he could do that. EDIT: the acoustic guitar arpeggio on "Lookin' At Tomorrow" is Al, and presumably that on the intro to "Santa Ana Winds" is as well. Obviously he added his vocal parts to those after first laying down the guitar parts, so a little bit different scenarios - but still impressive picking!

Speaking of, any idea who's most likely to have played the marxophone? Daryl Dragon or one of the session guys?

Informed sources say it was Daryl on an overdub. Haven't heard that session tape myself.

I agree that the list is goofy, but thought it was cool that POB and BWPS were on it.

Yeah, that's VERY cool - just illogical that those two are there but Pet Sounds and other classic BBs albums aren't.

I might respect this list more if 5 of the Top 10 weren't by Led Zeppelin. Nothing against them, but geesh...talk about overkill.

I was just listening to the basic track of All I Wanna Do on those samples. Does anyone else think the drums on that might be an early drum machine? C-Man, do you know one way or another?

Definitely not; those are real drums. No drum machine could sound like that in 1969. The Rhythm King can be heard on tracks like "Lady", "'Til I Die", and "Big Sur", but is (to my ears) augmented by additional percussion in most cases. The original intro to "Lady" sounds like the raw Rhythm King, for example.

Yeah, it's Hal Blaine on drums and Gene Estes playing a shaker.

I think Carl’s guitar playing is underrated, and I think he underestimated his ability to play lead on later recordings. He did it well on It’s About Time, LPR, FF, Marcella (I assume), Sail On Sailor, Roller Skating Child (most likely), some of Dennis’ solo stuff (I haven’t really listened to a lot of it yet), and It’s A Beautiful Day (I probably still missed some, too).

The steel guitar solo on "Marcella" is Tony Martin (the studio version, that is - live it was done by Ricky Fataar). But Carl still played a lot of great, fuzzy guitar lines on that record! And yeah, I think you nailed the other ones. "Holy Man" is one of Dennis' with Carl on lead guitar.

I made a recording recently that I wish I could go back now and autotune one note. I know nothing about autotune, how to get it, how it's applied, etc.

What format did you use for recording? - if digitally, and with a computer recording program, it's quite likely the program includes a pitch correction feature.

I'll probably just re-sing that one line.

That works too!

Not exactly studio collaborations with the band per se, but...

Bruce played piano on three cuts from Roger's 1973 album self-titled album, and also sang backup on one of them, "Draggin'". The following year, Roger joined the BBs onstage in Michigan to sing that song (ironically, this was when Bruce was out of the band).

And, Roger and Wolfman Jack jammed with the band on "Rock And Roll Music" when they all appeared on the Midnight Special in '79.

Matt, there are four Beach Boys singing on the remake of "HCTN" (all but Brian and Dennis) - so in that respect, it has more of the guys on it than most of the other tracks from that album!

As far as what it is about the track that provokes such ire in the ears of many hardcore BBs fans, I'm certain it's the incessant, pulse-like kick drum/bass guitar beat, monotonous hi-hat rhythm, choppy rhythm guitar, and sweeping string arrangement - all of which scream "disco - beware!".

For the record, I definitely do not despise the track, and on any given day, actually enjoy it, overlong as it may be.

There are plenty of session tapes from the Sunflower era, and I've heard quite a lot of them. Some from 8-track, some from 16-track. They tended to lay down basic tracks as "live" as possible, but of course there were usually plenty of instrumental overdubs, as well as vocal overdubs. Carl's productions of his two self-compositions for the Surf's Up album, though, are another story - as he played all of the instruments on "LPR" and most of the instruments on "FF" (with the Charles Lloyd and Woody Thews contributions added later), there really isn't anything there in terms of session tape.

I made a recording recently that I wish I could go back now and autotune one note. I know nothing about autotune, how to get it, how it's applied, etc.

What format did you use for recording? - if digitally, and with a computer recording program, it's quite likely the program includes a pitch correction feature.

I'm sure that would make Andy Paley very happy - and Joe Thomas less so!

Let's not forget Dennis' ability on piano - gosh, listen to "Piano Variations on Thoughts Of You"...or his piano and synth work on "Holy Man". Sure, these are pieces that he wrote, so it's easy to assume he just composed within his own ability to play, and it's a bit different from him sitting down and playing a similar piece composed by someone else - but reports from the time are that he sat at the piano and practiced, practiced, practiced. Hal Blaine praised his piano ability multiple times over the years!

As for Al - one impressive piece of guitar work from him, if you can find it, is when he sang and played an acoustic version of "Sloop John B." on a WNEW radio interview in 1983. Nice!

Not to mention Bruce's talent on the organ. Hal Blaine raved about that in his book.

Fantastic, thank you all for the discussion so far! Very enlightening.

he was leaving the stage for a few songs, including "Surfer Girl" and "Heroes And Villains", both of which he'd performed on the previous three years

Thank you for your thorough responses c-man, one follow-up related to this...

I have been watching/listening to some of the Heroes performances (particularly in 78), and for at least in the 2 shows for which there's video (Largo 77 and Perth 78), it seems he wasn't singing (actually he might be off-stage in the Largo video EDIT: apologies, he appears to be playing piano here; in the Perth one he goes to the back of the stage and sits on an amp while playing bass). Are these exceptions, or is this a song Brian would not participate in vocally when it was part of the live rotation? I don't have a good enough ear to pick Brian's voice out from the audio in the other shows.

With a few exceptions, Brian wasn't singing AT ALL on stage during those years...only lead on the few songs mentioned above, and no backgrounds. In fact, the C50 reunion tour in 2012 was the first Beach Boys tour since the '60s where Brian was singing harmonies and backgrounds pretty much throughout. His presence onstage in the late '70s/early '80s was limited to piano and/or bass, electric piano on "Rhonda", and two-three leads or partial leads on average, although more in '77 and '81.

On the circulating soundboard recording from Japan 1979, Brian can be heard quite clearly singing background on Darlin'. I think his involvement from night to night probably varied when the mood struck him, or depending on what he was on that night.

I'd say the nights in which he chose to participate in that manner were very rare.

Fantastic, thank you all for the discussion so far! Very enlightening.

he was leaving the stage for a few songs, including "Surfer Girl" and "Heroes And Villains", both of which he'd performed on the previous three years

Thank you for your thorough responses c-man, one follow-up related to this...

I have been watching/listening to some of the Heroes performances (particularly in 78), and for at least in the 2 shows for which there's video (Largo 77 and Perth 78), it seems he wasn't singing (actually he might be off-stage in the Largo video EDIT: apologies, he appears to be playing piano here; in the Perth one he goes to the back of the stage and sits on an amp while playing bass). Are these exceptions, or is this a song Brian would not participate in vocally when it was part of the live rotation? I don't have a good enough ear to pick Brian's voice out from the audio in the other shows.

With a few exceptions, Brian wasn't singing AT ALL on stage during those years...only lead on the few songs mentioned above, and no backgrounds. In fact, the C50 reunion tour in 2012 was the first Beach Boys tour since the '60s where Brian was singing harmonies and backgrounds pretty much throughout. His presence onstage in the late '70s/early '80s was limited to piano and/or bass, electric piano on "Rhonda", and two-three leads or partial leads on average, although more in '77 and '81.

How regularly was Brian touring with the guys 76-78? I always had the impression that it was sporadic, as was his onstage participation. I think it depended on how he was feeling day to day, or at least tour to tour.

He toured regularly with them from fall of '76 through spring of '82, but still missed some shows along the way. He was absent from a handful of shows in mid-January '77 while finishing up the Love You album, and (I think) a whole tour in early August of '78 (due to his personal issues at the time), but otherwise was a regular member of the live band those years.

He was present for the opening night of their four-night March 1979 Radio City Music Hall stand, but was then absent from the rest of that run - otherwise, I believe he was at all 1979 shows. He missed their late July-early August 1980 tour due to illness. Other than their May 26, 1981 television shoot for the 4th Annual National Cheerleading Championships in Miami, I think Brian was pretty much there for all shows that year (but not always exactly "there", if you know what I mean). '82 was hit-and-miss, with Brian missing whole tours in June and July, all shows in November and December, and several occasional shows in other months. By '83, he was back under Landy's care, and mostly just played high-profile gigs on the west and east coasts, plus a few others around those dates. Likewise in '84, after which his appearances at non-televised gigs reduced to practically nil.

Oh, and Brian giving up the bass to return to the piano was reportedly Carl's doing...Carl vastly preferred Eddie Carter's bass playing to Brian's. So there you have it.

Brian DID resume playing bass again on a couple of songs for his sporadic appearances with the band in the summer & fall of '83. One of those was "Barbara Ann".

Brian did the 7/3 Anaheim show, as well as the Oakland show the day before. I don't think he was at the 9/1/76 Uniondale show, as they toured without him that summer. He did join them for the fall tour of the east coast, and most of the January '77 shows.

At the Oakland and Anaheim shows, he just played piano and sang lead on one song - "Back Home". By that fall's tour, though, he was playing bass on "Surfer Girl" and "Back Home", and singing lead on both of those, plus "Sloop John B." and "Love Is A Woman". Maybe a co-lead with Al on "Wouldn't It Be Nice", too. EDIT: And his part of "Airplane". End edit.  That was pretty much the trend through the rest of '77. At the end of that year, he started playing bass through most of the show, and singing those leads, before switching back to piano exclusively in '79. Interesting to note that by '79, he was leaving the stage for a few songs, including "Surfer Girl" and "Heroes And Villains", both of which he'd performed on the previous three years. By 1980 though, he was signing (the bridge only) on "Surfer Girl". And of course, in '81, he took the whole lead on, as well as "Don't Worry Baby" and Carl's leads on "GOK" and "GV", as well. Falsetto-wise, other than "Surfer Girl", he did it on "Hawaii" when they performed it in '79, and "DWB" in '81.. I think that's about it.  

Thanks! I knew it, haha - some of what's going on sounds too much like Brian had at least some influence in it.

Yeah, but remember the "Brian Wilson-like" production of Sunflower's "All I Wanna Do" is actually a Carl Wilson production. Not only could Carl sound quite like Brian when singing, by this point he could also sound like him when producing...

Methinks this story is either bogus or about another person with the same name. "Our" Bruce called in live to Billy Hinche's show last night -- it didn't sound like there's anything wrong with his memory.

Listen to the call here:
https://www.facebook.com/billy.hinsche/videos/5319187201440863

That was really cool! Thanks for posting that, Emdeeh!

I would find that hard to believe as he traveled with the band for the last 2 shows they had in Utah, interestingly Scott Totten was not there and Randell took his place.

Scott recently suffered a hand injury.

I have a question about the multitrack for "Ding Dang," which seems plenty insignificant for this thread:

If you listen to the first "dang" in each repetition of "ding (dang) dang (woooo!)," those "dang"s are very clearly on a separate track that's briefly unmuted. You can tell because the beginning and ending of each "dang" get clipped off.

It seems like there must have been other stuff on that track right before, and right after, each "dang," and someone wanted to keep that other stuff out of the mix. So what else is on that track? Perhaps Brian reciting the long-lost lyrics to "In My Childhood"? The backing track for the second movement of "Surf's Up"? Or, far more likely, is it just the Beach Boys screwing around?

Could be some naughty lyrics akin to the original version of "Ding Dang"...

When the 50 year reunion tour was held did the group use auto tuning during the live performances? -
It was used, at Joe Thomas' behest but without the group's knowledge, for the first couple of shows only. After that, the outcry from the fans and the band themselves forced it to be dropped.

Also who was responsible for selecting what sidemen toured with the group? -
Brian and Mike formed the production company that staged the tour, and the two of them (plus Joe) called all the shots. Hence, Brian's band and the two coolest guys from Mike's band were utilized (Mike's keyboard player was utilized as one of the tour managers).

Finally does the current Mike Love touring group use auto tuning in their live performances? -
I don't believe so.

The country singer Dennis Wilson had an album out in '79 called One Of Those People, and that was widely misidentified as being an album by Beach Boy Dennis Wilson. As stated, it would be weird indeed to represent the former as making an appearance on another artist's album "courtesy of Caribou Records", but stranger things have indeed happened.