I doubt he's doing much work these days. Would absolutely love a new Christmas song.

There are obviously many, many Christmas songs to mine, but Brian has essentially cut two albums' worth of Christmas songs in the last 20 years. The whole 2005 album, plus almost an album's worth of internet exclusive downloads and whatnot. I don't particularly need something new, unless perhaps he arranged something and had Al sing it (which might be better than the pleasant but innocuous Christmas tracks Al has cut in recent years: "Hurry Up Hurry Up Santa Claus" and "Sunshine to Snowflakes").

He should produce Blondie singing "Oh Holy Night" - that was a highlight of their Christmas tour two years ago!

It's actually soon BEFORE their appearance, as right after Dennis and Gage walk off, the interviewer asks Mike when they expect to go on, and Mike replies "Hopefully after this next group".

The lead guitar and vocals might give that impression, but the track itself underneath is all Brian. It's a poor mix that buries a lot of the arrangement.

Curt Becher spoke of how difficult it was to mix that track ("Shortenin' Bread") in an interview with BBFUN, published in 1980. He said there was just so much going on in that song. Not sure if his was the final mix or not, but obviously that one was a bit of a bear. Someone once said, "To mix is a bitch." Guess this track was proof of that!

The CBS contract reportedly included a requirement that Brian write or produce at least 80% of their recorded output - so in the end, they DID get "f**ked"! Warners didn't make such a specific demand, but they obviously wanted as much Brian as they could get - which was relatively little until the last three albums. 

As much as I love Love You and have a deep affection for parts of 15 Big Ones, they were NOT commercial records by 1976-77 standards (aside from the two singles on Big Ones), and only really marketable as curiosity "come-back" albums - no matter what Carl did to them. If you listen to tracks like "Chapel Of Love", "That Same Song", "Back Home", "In The Still Of The Night", "Mona", "Solar System", "I Wanna Pick You Up", "Let's Put Our Hearts Together", "Love Is A Woman"...it's clear that the vocal performances and arrangements were NOT going to be appreciated, understood, or enjoyed by the great unwashed masses. No matter what Carl did to make them more presentable in the mix, the only way they would've had a chance at mass appeal would have been to be completely re-recorded in a style that fit in with what was getting played on the radio in those days.

Again, I'm quite fond of both, but that's 'cause I (like most of us here) "get it" - but Joe Average Record Buyer back then definitely did not, and would not. I think Mike and Al and the band's management were banking on the "Produced by Brian Wilson" tag being enough to ensure big hit albums, and Carl and Dennis were supportive enough of their big brother to let him go for it - but after the dismal sales and/or reviews (mostly dismal reviews for Big Ones, mostly dismal sales for Love You, but certainly some of both for both), both factions of the band  - and their new label - said "Enough is enough", and decided from that point on to only make albums with more "mainstream" appeal. Let's face it, these guys came up in the business having big hit records, and to a very large extent, that's how they (including Brian) measure success. Having a series of "bombs" tends to humble you, and especially with a new label to please, they couldn't afford to release product that they knew wouldn't stand a realistic chance of success.

One more point - it was said at the time that Bruce had a two-album producer deal, so that's why he took the reigns for KTSA even though L.A. wasn't a hit. Again, it was probably the label who initiated that deal, with the band's support, of course. After KTSA bombed, the hope among the fanbase, of course, was that Brian would resume the producer role. But the band, especially Carl, were intent on having a "marketable" product - they had already let Brian run the show for a couple of albums, and the results were disastrous in their eyes, so that's why they decided to bring in an outside producer, with Levine eventually getting the nod due to Bruce's recommendation and his recent chart success with Culture Club.

Another big point regarding Bruce was that he was already working for CBS as a staff producer, and now that the Boys were signed to a CBS-affiliated label, that might have been a suggestion made by the label. They invited him down to Florida simply to sing on the album, but once there, it might have been the idea of someone at CBS, or possibly Guercio, to let him co-produce. As mentioned above, he was a recent Grammy winner (albeit for songwriting, not producing), so he had some commercial clout at the time. But the biggest reason was that he was an insider AND outsider at the same time - someone who knew them intimately, personality-wise and ability-wise, AND could still be objective. Regarding producer points - well, Desper later said that he made more money from KTSA than Bruce, since he was paid a salary, while Bruce was paid on points...

I don't think Steve Levine would've wanted to work with them again, based on his later comments, even if they'd asked him. The next obvious choice was Melcher, as he had just co-written their biggest hit in some time (the moderately-successful "Getcha Back"), and had also already recently worked with the band as producer (on the "California Dreamin'" cover, recorded in '82). When the reworked "CD" became a moderate hit in '86 - and since Terry, like Bruce, knew the band intimately and was respected by all of them - it was natural for them to keep him on as their go-to producer.

Had a listen to "Here She Comes" and now all I hear is how the drums are so loud...never noticed it before.....Thanks a lot guys   

Yeah, and the lead vocals - especially Ricky's lines - are not loud enough!

Does anyone know where Brian is actually singing lead on Goin’ On and Sunshine? I don’t know if it’s because my ears or bad or the thick vocal layering, but the only place I can hear Brian is his little answer vocal on Goin’ On.

Besides that, he's singing as part of a three-part harmony lead on both songs - on "Goin' On", I believe it's Brian-Carl-Mike on record, although live it was Brian-Al-Mike, as Carl covered the prominent background "doo-doo-doo" part like he did on record, and then of course Carl had his solo lead lines. "Sunshine" is also a three-part harmony lead, Brian-Carl-Mike, and Brian also sings the falsetto solo lines, like "Someone even half as sweet as my...". That last bit is one of my favorite Brian lines from post-1970, and shows he could still sing an acceptable, even nice, falsetto when he wanted.

I happen to love the sound of the drums on that track 🥺

So do i, and EVEN a certain Drummer called John Bonham loved the Drum sound on CATP

Cool...is there a particular interview you can reference? That might be fun to read!

That makes sense. The album sounds very disconnected. The songs for the most part are excellent, but they just don't flow together nicely. It's basically some Beach Boys songs, some Flame songs. They got it right on Holland though.

Yes, and Carl told Geoffrey Himes in 1982:  "I thought Carl & The Passions should have been three separate albums. Blondie and Ricky were going one direction that sounded a lot like The Band or Stevie Winwood. I thought "Marcella" and "Mess Of Help", two of Brian's best tunes ever, were another direction. If we had done eight tunes like "Marcella", it could have been a great rock album, almost a folk-rock album. I think Dennis' "Cuddle Up" was great; that direction could have been a real romantic side to an album. I wish Brian had been strong enough to produce the record, because it could have an ass-kicking, great record."

...I'm sure a selling point of "previously unreleased original stereo mix, like the producers intended"...

Thing is though, as Mr. Desper would certainly point out - the original stereo mixes ARE as the producers intended! Any new stereo remix would be for a different purpose, such as to serve as a compliment to the original, not as a replacement, and therefore should be marketed as such.

C-man, were Ricky/Blondie, and Carl chiefly the ones who worked on the mixing and production on this tune?

In the CATP/Holland twofer liner notes, Ricky is credited as the producer on the two Blondie/Ricky tunes. It's been said (by David Leaf, who got it from the 1974 BBC radio series on The Beach Boys) that the album was finished by Ricky and Blondie in one studio (likely The Village), Dennis and Daryl in another (likely Sunset Sound), and Carl, Al, and Mike in a third (probably the studio at Brian's). They were in a hurry to finish it , so I think that's how it was mixed.

I happen to love the sound of the drums on that track 🥺

The drums are perfect on that song. Yes they are loud, but the drum pattern is simple enough that the loudness only compliments the mood of the song. The drums mix with the bass perfectly, and both set a driving rhythm that makes the song unique yet absolutely listenable.

That’s probably my most played song from that album.

I don't mind the drums on this track, either, but have always noticed how loud they and the bass are. Being Ricky and Blondie's first BBs track, it's as if they're introducing themselves in a conspicuous manner - stepping right up to the album's listeners, extending their hand, and saying, "Welcome to OUR musical world".

"Here Comes The Night" is on Best Of The Brother Years? Not my copy...

IIRC there were different editions in Europe and the US. I only recently found that out and didn't remember it for the above message, sorry.



http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,16436.0.html

It also appears on disc 6 bonus disc Japan edition ?? of the 1993 box set

The U.K. edition too, I believe. Strange - was it a big hit in Japan and England?

Actually, it was in the setlist for four years initially: they played it when I saw them for the first time in '79.

I LOVE the mixing on Sunflower/Surf's Up but I think part of the reason those records weren't commercially successful is that the drums aren't very audible in the mix. I could be completely wrong (and no disrespect to Mr. Desper's incredible work) but that's my POV.

Compare the BBs early-'70s mixes to their peers at the time (CSNY, Neil Young, etc.) — the drums are a larger part of the overall picture w/ a more "rock" sound.

I would be interested to hear a remix, knowing that nothing can replace the released mixes.

Interestingly, shortly thereafter on CATP, they went overboard in the opposite direction, with the comically too-loud drums on "Here She Comes" 

Well, that one WAS produced & mixed by a drummer, so...

"Here Comes The Night" is on Best Of The Brother Years? Not my copy...

Has anyone ever noticed that the intro of "Jackie Blue" by Ozark Mountain Daredevils from 1974 sounds nearly identical to the into of "Slip On Through" from 1970?

https://youtu.be/AtXdh2nKULw

Granted, it's brief, but the similarity is still somewhat jarring to hear!

Probably just a coincidence, but I wonder if Sunflower had subliminal inspiration.

Never noticed that, but I have noticed how similar that Leslie'd lead guitar sound is to that of Mick Taylor's in the solo on the Stones' "Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker)".

IMO the "Rock and Roll Music" single for it's rawness fits very well into that time when people were turning to such a sound. Wasn't this the time when Punk music began it's way? I remember reading reviews that criticized the single for being so unpolished, analogies like forgetting what they achieved with "Pet Sounds" for going back to "Surfin' Safari" come to mind. But I disagree with that. The early surf-rock records are just as much a part of the Boys greatness as Pet Sounds.

Almost nobody in the U.S.A. was aware of punk music yet in the first half of 1976, aside from some very hip people in N.Y.C., L.A., and maybe Detroit. The vast, vast majority of the AM radio-listening and record-buying American public were either into the Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, Elton John, ELO, and the Doobies, or into sounds even more polished and softer-sounding still. So if the BBs wanted big radio hits, those are the sounds they were competing with.   

Probably Brian's last real attempt at producing a hit single for the band? Love the vocal arrangements and that bass riff is pretty spectacular too. Definitely one of my favorite BB songs from the 70s; the single version sounds like the synth bass was mixed a little more up front, which is great. They should have completed this song and put it out as a single on the heels of Endless Summer in 1974 or '75. Could have been a bigger hit this way I guess but it's always hard to say with these guys.

Could the seemingly louder synth bass in the single version be the result not of a remix, but the fact that the track was sped up by 2%?

I agree that "It's OK" should have been a much bigger hit, at least Top 10. And I often think that "Keepin' The Summer Alive" could have been a hit single, had it been recorded and released five years earlier than when it was...another "summertime smash"-sounding tune, but with a more contemporary feel - exactly what their audience would've hoped for in the summer of '75.

I think it should’ve been the single personally.

Truthfully, had it been a properly-promoted single, it could have been at least a moderate hit. Same with "She's Got Rhythm". Of course, the record company didn't give a rat's ass about them by then, so they threw out "Peggy Sue" as the single, probably because "Rock And Roll Music" had been a hit for them, and this was another golden oldie cover, so why not.

Or they could have done a disco version of "Drip Drop!"

With Brian's "mother-f**s" line mixed out of the album and 7" mixes, but left in the 12" club dub mix! With reverb added, and repeated a couple of times throughout!

Stephen Desper called it "the big cricket." I'm curious about its genesis...is it on the track from the get-go or was it added later in the production process?

It was added later...but, there is also a cowbell on the original, previously unreleased track recorded at Gold Star three months or so before the final version.

I was just listening to the basic track of All I Wanna Do on those samples. Does anyone else think the drums on that might be an early drum machine? C-Man, do you know one way or another?

Definitely not; those are real drums. No drum machine could sound like that in 1969. The Rhythm King can be heard on tracks like "Lady", "'Til I Die", and "Big Sur", but is (to my ears) augmented by additional percussion in most cases. The original intro to "Lady" sounds like the raw Rhythm King, for example.

Yeah, it's Hal Blaine on drums and Gene Estes playing a shaker.

A belated thanks for your reply, C-man. Interesting, I don't think I hear a shaker on that basic track, but my ears could be bad. And there are definitely additional drums on the final track. But I agree that such a realistic snare sound was way beyond the capability of any drum machine in 1969.

I never noticed the shaker in the final mix, either - until I heard the basic tracking session. Now it's quite obvious to me in the final mix! As for extra drums being overdubbed - I think that's the effect of the echo/delay applied to the original drums.