I know this sounds loony, but what if Mike is holding this thing up because he wants to put "Big Sur" on his next solo album? Perhaps he doesn't want this out there at the moment so people could compare and contrast, as it's likely that the 1970 (right?) version would probably be of much higher quality.

Also, I do agree with hitting up Mike's Facebook nicely asking him if we could hear the set soon. I also suggest speaking Mike's language. That means that we should be peppering our posts with "fun, fun, fun" and "good vibrations" and whatnot. Obviously, I'm kidding, but I don't think it hurts. Lastly I think the worst thing is for people to attack him. I'm not sure what we are doing will make a difference either way, but I think being decent is always the better way.

Lastly, if we don't get the set believe it or not I understand. It is their music, and if the band themselves don't agree to release it, then we don't get to have it. As much as that stinks, I understand it. It's their art. Hopefully it all comes together though, because the few things we've heard about the set seem tantalizing.

Interesting post Josh. Much appreciated.

Now I hate to be that guy, and I think its been like 14 years since that piano clip leaked, but....um. Is it actually Brian on piano? Or is it Al? Did we ever find proof one way or the other?

[Unleash the Love]

Back to the music...

Did anybody notice that when talking about Mike's recording adventures as of late, Bruce pretty much said that he thinks Mike's albums worth of material  from early in the aughts was the one worthy of being released? Seems like he hears the same thing that a lot of us have. It's pretty plain that most of the recordings from that era were stronger than most of Unleash the Love and 12 Sides of Summer. At least Mike still used the same "Cool Head, Warm Heart" on Unleash the Love.

[Orange Crate Art]

Hey so I logged on here thinking there'd be some discussion of the reissue of Orange Crate Art. Guess not though.

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,27102.0.html

I dig you posting that. But I meant post release discussion. My bad.

[Orange Crate Art]

Hey so I logged on here thinking there'd be some discussion of the reissue of Orange Crate Art. Guess not though.

Well anyways, I listened to the title track and I think the remaster sounds nice, though I thought the original was just fine. I also listened to all three bonus vocal tracks and I'm glad to add all three to my collection. I think that having "Rhapsody In Blue" and "Love Is Here To Stay" from this era is cool. The arrangement on "Love Is Here To Stay" was a bit surprising for me I must say.

Here's the thing though, I thought there were a few interesting Brian tidbits from his essay in the booklet. First off, he says that they "talked about doing a tour to play the album but they never did." Who knows if it got anywhere beyond one of them bringing it up, but I thought that was neat.

But then in the same paragraph he mentions that he was "making the record with Andy Paley by then so I was getting pretty busy. I'd love to get back to those songs eventually, too." (emphasis mine, not italicized nor bolded in booklet)

That part piqued my interest. I wonder if maybe the Paley session material may be in the pipeline. Personally I think that if it was gonna be marketed as a new project, Brian should probably re-record most of the vocals, as I think he could do better on a bunch of them, at least on the ballads. But yeah, maybe we get a BW archive release? Or maybe seeing as there is another anniversary for The Beach Boys next year (or 2022), perhaps use the Paley material for what seemed to be it's original purpose, a new Beach Boys album. I mean who knows about any of this, it mighta just been a throw away line in the essay. I guess we'll see.

[No Pier Pressure]

Absolutely nobody on here needs my opinion, but whatever, I wanna throw my thoughts in.

First off, where is this horrendous autotune people are talking about on No Pier Pressure? I don't really hear it. Maybe I'm deaf. However, I also have to point out that I think a lot of Beach Boys fans (on both sides of Brian and Mike fandom) are much, much too obsessed with autotune or something that appears to be pitch correction. Off the top of my head, the only times I hear what my be termed "outrageous use of autotune"  I can think of on Beach Boys (or solo) albums is on TWGMTR ("Spring Vacation" for the most part), Unleash the Love (especially disc 2) and Twelve Sides of Summer. Oh, and the 50th tour live album of course. Besides those, I just don't hear it as this horrible thing that makes the music unlistenable. And on "Spring Vacation" it kinda makes me smile for whatever reason. Maybe even enhances the song, makes it even goofier. Perhaps if it was a real serious, epic track I wouldn't feel the same though.

Secondly, I'm kinda with Nate on wishing the guys would put more out. It's a shame Bruce hasn't been able to stop complaining about the ills of socialism enough to release as much as a new song in nearly two decades. He teased something new from around the late 1980s through the first decade of the 2000s. And barely anything was released. Not that I believe that he has much of anything to release. I just don't think working on new music or recording interests him anymore unfortunately. Al is Al, and unfortunately he's probably working on a re-work of "Waves of Love" as we speak that might be released in 2030. And Mike, hey, I dig the fact that dude is trying a bit. I'm not saying the music he's putting out is good, but I'm glad that he's had the balls to go in the studio and put it out. It kinda seemed like he lost his nerve studio-wise after the embarrassment that was Summer In Paradise. And lastly, solo career wise, Brian's given us a lot. If he puts out another new one, then awesome. I'll be right there listening. If not, he's given us so much, and also has a lot of solo material in the vault (Paley sessions,  Usher sessions [though the quality of what we've heard varies] and probably some other good stuff from throughout his solo career). Shoot, even next month we are getting three previously unreleased Brian/VDP recordings.

Lastly, and this is a bit of nitpicking, but I noticed Nate called the tunes on disc two of Mike's UTL album "Love-Wilson" tunes. Hmm. I've never really heard them referred to that way very often. Except from Mike-centric sources. Still odd though. It's pretty much always been referred to as the "Wilson-Love" songwriting team so it took me aback.

[Rare Masters]

On M&M label from Japan if my memory serves me correctly.

O no, actually I know what you're speaking of, and that's Rare Masters which was issued in Japan on M&M as you said.

The album I'm talking about, The Best of Bruce & Terry, is from Sundazed and released in 1998.

[The Best of Bruce & Terry]

This is a wonderful song by Bruce & Terry and I've always wanted to know more about the track - it was apparently recorded 2/15/1966, the same day as That's Not Me (before or after? Bruce and Terry were both at that BB session). But what studio was it recorded at? What musicians play on the track? If anyone in the know could help me out, that would be great.

It's an unbelievably great song. I'd go as far as to say it's one of my very favorite Beach Boys related songs of that entire decade. I think it's in the neighborhood of please let me wonder and approaching pet sounds awesomeness, which is quite a statement to make, considering I've never heard anything else that Bruce put out which has anywhere near that same magic.

Disney Girls is quite good but nowhere near as good as this, in my humble opinion. That said, it's certainly very derivative of Brian Wilson songwriting, but I suppose that's to be expected. It's shocking to me that this has never been properly released in any type of remastered form.

It's very interesting to me, because this song came out in 1966, after Bruce was already in the Beach Boys. I don't know what the politics would have been with regards to that, and I've never heard it discussed. Brian Wilson of course had the Caroline No solo single released around this time, I wonder if this had anything to do with it. Not that it is a Bruce solo single, but I guess other than Caroline No, I think it's the earliest example of an actual band member of the Beach Boys stretching their wings to put out music released under their personal name while in the band.

I asked Bruce about the song in person in 2012, but it was a very fleeting conversation. Mainly I just wanted to see his reaction when I mentioned the song. He acknowledged it briefly but didn't seem to have much of a reaction. I just wanted him to know that it's a remarkably underrated song that he should pay more attention to himself.

I wonder what Bruce and what Terry contributed to the song, and also what part Mike is audibly singing. Without a proper remaster, it's hard to hear it clear enough to really make everything out as well as I'd like.

I've heard a poor quality instrumental version of the backing track, if memory serves it was on the Preuss tape boot.

I don't know about where or when it has been remastered, but it is on the album The Best of Bruce & Terry from 1998.

RIP to the great little Richard, whose influence in rock music is immeasurable.

Naturally as a Beach Boys nerd, I thought about "Happy Endings" upon his passing. And then it dawned on me that there's never really been much of any discussion with regards to the weird music video for this song.

People were excited to see rough draft sketches of a proposed BBs cartoon in the early 70s, with Carl eating a bunch of ice cream scoops… But nobody ever seems to talk about the only actual BBs cartoon music video that actually *was* released, with animated Beach Boys sitting in a goldfish bowl beside a bottle of goldfish food, and a cartoon Mike loves sitting on a lilly pad, singing about Easter bunny, as an animated bunny hopped into his lap.

https://youtu.be/lYxAqHIff2g

This is batshit crazy stuff.

Does anybody know more information about this music video? Did it actually air on MTV or VH1, or was it scrapped? I think the movie "The Telephone" barely got released. I have not seen it, has anybody on this board seen the film? This film must be the biggest trainwreck in Whoopi Goldberg's career other than the dinosaur buddy cop classic Theodore Rex.

One interesting thing about that movie is that was co-written and produced by one Harry Nilsson. I wonder if the appearance of The Beach Boys (and possibly Little Richard as well) on the soundtrack was a result of Harry being so heavily involved in the project.

Tony Asher has said before (the liner notes of the Pet Sounds Sessions box set) that when he and Brian were writing together, the general tone of the song’s theme was largely his, and Tony would put it into words. I suspect it worked in a similar fashion with Mike. I still think that Mike was capable of writing a good lyric on his own, like ‘Big Sur’ for example. When Endless Summer came along and changed the direction of the group for good, I think Mike wanted to attempt to write lyrics that were of a piece with their early output, as in songs like ‘Kona Coast’, which essentially cannibalizes ‘Hawaii’. That’s where he started to go wrong, since often he wasn’t writing closely with Brian as once before. Or, you know, I could be way off.

I get what you're saying Summer_Days, and I definitely think Mike's lyrics were more often that not getting worse as the '70s went on and into the present day. But I have to say, even something like "Kona Coast" (derivative as it was) or "Getcha Back" had a degree of professionalism to them. They sounded like a guy who had written some good, sturdy songs before. When I heard this new one or something like "Unleash the Love" it's jaw-dropping in how much it sounds like somebody's 50 year old uncle in 1993 writing "original" material for his bar band to record in a special weekend booking at a recording studio. And maybe even that is giving Mike too much credit.

[amateur]

Here's my take. I think the song is sh*t. I guess I'd say the only positive is that he's making the most of his voice with this kinda growly lead. He, like Brian and McCartney and Dylan and others doesn't have the voice he used to, but is making it work.

However, the lyrics....

I don't even know. For a while I've been searching for what it is about Mike's lyrics post-"Kokomo" and I couldn't figure out what it was. And I think it was yesterday after hearing this song that it finally hit me. Mike's lyrics are just very, very amateur. When I listento a lot of the stuff he has released from the '90s on, I just think of how a lot of those sound like if a fifth grader was tasked with an assignment in music class to make a song about achieving world peace ("Unleash the Love", "Make Love, Not War"), or environmentalism ("Summer In Paradise") or a historical figure from the '60s ("Pisces Brothers"). It's crazy, he knew George Harrison (though I don't think they were really friends), but the song reads as if all he knew of George was what he read on Wikipedia.

I really don't want to go there, but a "viral Super Bowl" is just mindblowingly bad. And you know what? Even though he's around 80, I think it's possible that Mike hasn't "lost it" as it concerns his writing abilities. I just really think his figurative "writing muscle" hasn't been worked out for so very long in a serious way, that when he tries something new you get slop like this. Perhaps its that most talented big players in the industry rightly or wrongly won't work with him, so he's stuck with what maybe would be a very rough first draft type lyric. Or maybe I'm wrong and that after, say 1974 (or maybe 1988) he just lost his mojo for writing either commercially or artistically pleasing lyrics.

Basically the real point of all this to me is that despite being the Beach Boy who has always been touted for his "professionalism" it's Brian and Al who put out the music that sounds like it was done by a professional, with Mike putting out stuff that sounds it was barfed out in an hour on GarageBand.

Why is anyone surprised this is the biggest pile of stinky $#it ever released, it's Mike Love. It's all he's capable of doing. Brian was, and is, the genius of the Beach Boys. I don't doubt he is using this time off to work on a freaking masterpiece that is going to blow us all away, and remind the world once again that Brian Wilson is a f****ing genius!

Cute. You're sticking up for Mike. I get it. And of course, we gotta stick it to Brian who is what, 77 years old? How dare he not be preparing new material to blow all our socks off! I love when my favorite artists put out new material, and I'm not one who thinks any of the guys will ruin the "legacy" by putting out garbage like this. However, it makes me embarrassed for them when people read articles on Mike and listen to stuff like this. In the big scheme of things is any of this important? No. And is the money going to a good cause? Yep, so that's great.

I will say, I really dig Carl's "Where I Belong." And while I definitely would be interested in Brian doing a version of it, I hope it's a BW original.

Also, I think if you took the '80s out of the song, I'm not sure it would stand up as wonderfully. That song, along with "It's Gettin' Late" are two Beach Boys songs that benefit from being recorded in the mid '80s.

[A-WHAT'S GOING ON!]

Hilarious that Linda Perry is used in the doc as a talking head.

Perhaps she'll be able to tell us A-WHAT'S GOING ON!



Regardless though, happy to see that maybe there's a new Brian written song on its way. Though the title once again sounds like it might be one of Carl's that we already know.

[Love You]

Hey aeijtzsche, I wasn't asked to pay for a thing.

Now about your experiment...

"Wouldn't It Be Nice" done Love You style was actually kinda eye opening to me. So thank you for that. I also kinda like when artists revisit songs done in the style of the current album. I think that's why the studio recorded Lei'd In Hawaii material interests me. It's the older Beach Boys classics done Smiley Smile style (obviously) and I dig it. Just like I like Dylan doing "Girl from the North Country" Nashville Skyline style long after releasing Freewheelin'.

"Kokomo" was a harder sell though. I don't think it's any fault of your own, but that one was tougher to try to meld it into a lightly folky early '70s pop song.

So, from that 3-year old thread, we get this range of opinions on the falsetto "Marcella, hey" part in the tag:

ForHerCryingSoul agrees with Salty that it's Carl
Jim V. thinks it's Ricky
Jay says Ricky sang it live (EDIT: could it be he took over that part after Blondie left, i.e. the '74 performances?)
Billy C remembers Jack saying it was Brian

Funny that I thought it was Ricky then. Don't remember writing that post. Anyways, anybody working on somehow finding out the truth of this matter (if that's even possible)?

I'm not being sarcastic, but honestly I thought maybe that "Marcella, hey" part was Ricky.

Now hear me out. It sounds a bit like the guy who sang part of "Here She Comes" and "Barnyard Blues" but maybe I'm wrong.

[Exile]

My feeling is that the surviving BBs are a lot less interested in what goes on these releases than we are.

Of course. I'd say nearly for sure. And I'd say the same for perhaps Bob Dylan and his Bootleg Series. Of all the major artists involved with their archival projects, I'd probably say maybe Pete Townshend is one of the few that would be super hands on. And maybe Mick Jagger with the Stones (at least Exile and Some Girls) as he actually went in and finished previously unfinished stuff for those projects re-issues.

Regarding all of the purported Dennis/Christine McVie recordings, I'm curious: A) How they've never surfaced for the most part, even though some pretty obscure stuff ("Cocaine/Hamburger Tape", etc.) has surfaced. and B) How substantive/finished the material is. How much is noodling/vamping, how much is backing tracks or just piano tracks with no melody/vocals, and what might be in even a somewhat "finished" state.

Also, C) Do they *really* exist, like multiple studio reels of completely unheard collaborations between the two?

The Dennis/Christine material to me, is something I'm filing under "amazing if true" but the thing is what could really be there? As a variation of what the poster above says, is there anything beyond noodling around? And if so, if they were cutting actual songs, were the actually finished. I assume whatever it is, it's not bells and whistles. So at best, hopefully some piano pieces with a decent vocal. And I don't see any duets. Is Dennis early '80s voice and Christine's voice even compatible? It'd be interesting to see what's up with all this.

[TWGMTR]

To generalize, I'd say Brian has tended to take musical riffs/motifs/bits from the past, usually of his own writing, and re-work them into something else. He has also of course remade his own finished compositions (e.g. the GIOMH album, etc.).

Dennis tended to do this sometimes as well (e.g. "Moonshine" vs. "Holy Man", etc.).

Whereas, Al has tended to workshop actual recordings sometimes for decades ("Loop de Loop", "Don't Fight the Sea", "Waves of Love") and then also has re-recorded old unreleased compositions ("And I Always Will", "Looking Down the Coast", etc.).

Meanwhile, Mike has often gone the route of just re-recording both BB hits and his own solo stuff over and over and over.

Carl has had so little output that it's hard to know much of what he may have reworked of his own.

Bruce seems to fixate on old tracks too. It was seemingly partly if not mostly his idea to use "When Girls Get Together" on KTSA ten years after the fact. He even toyed with putting 1963's "The Lord's Prayer" on KTSA. He of course infamously re-worked "Here Comes the Night", and also revamped his own "Ten Years Harmony" as "Endless Harmony." He has messed around with "She Believes In Love Again" multiple times after releasing it on BB '85, recording a solo version that popped up on that weird CD sampler a decade or so ago, and supposedly working on it with Foskett during the TWGMTR BB sessions.

I've got nothing to base this on and I might be totally wrong, but I wouldn't be surprised if the version of "She Believes In Love Again" from the TWGMTR sessions is an overdubbed version of Bruce's solo version from the sampler.

Also to add onto Bruce's obsession with his small list of songs he's written, lets not forget his re-recording of "Disney Girls" as a solo track in 1975 (for some reason credited to Papa Doo Run Run), only to be re-recorded again for his 1977 solo album Going Public and then again in the '90s for his orchestral project. Gotta say, Bruce has written a few tunes and he definitely tries to wring everything he can out of them.

I agree with what is written in this last post almost to the T. And I do think it would have been really cool to see
Carl and Al go out in a unplugged storytellers type of show. They were really the two voices in the Beach Boys to me live in oncert that stood out. Tough to hear them singing at sixties and seventies years of age about be true to your school and cheerleaders. Carl Wilson and Al Jardine solo story teller show would have been something else!

I think a Carl and Al show would have focused less on cheerleaders, school spirit, surfing and woodies, and more on music from the more 'adult' or 'serious' part of their careers.

I know what you're getting at and I dig it, but I don't even think it's that the group had done so much of the early material live, but the way it was presented. Al still does quite a few hits on his solo shows, but the presentation is so much classier than the '80s and '90s Beach Boys, or Mike's group's versions.

Hi.  What an abomination of a cause to play for.  I just signed and contributed.  Despicable gig in my opinion. Glad to see so many signatures.  Ray

Hey there Ray. Hope you're well. I don't know if you currently have Brian's ear, but perhaps you could encourage him and Al to distance themselves from this garbage?

Dig the Memphis-style guitars on this alternate "Slip On Through" and the country-ish psych guitars on "I'm Going Your Way". According to track sheet notations, these were (Mike) Deasy and Eddie (Carter). These two tracks were recorded at the same session at Gold Star, July '69.

On "Carnival", the guys sang each of their vocal parts separately, then doubled them (except for the fifth part) - a rare modus operandi for them, and probably the first time they ever did this. This was recorded on 16-track, so the final tape has four parts doubled and a single fifth part, using a total of 9 tracks for vocals (I think all of them except Bruce were involved with the recording). You can really hear the individual parts much better on this new remix than on the original bootlegged mix.

Hey c-man, I understand if you don't want to (or can't), but who are the instrumentalists and vocalists on "I'm Going Your Way" and "Carnival"?

[1967 - Live Sunshine]

Which shows? Hmm.

I'd have liked to see the March 27, 1965 show at Arie Crown Theater in Chicago. You had Brian near the height of his powers, singing "Please Let Me Wonder" and the band really sounding great.

I'd say 1967 Hawaii shows would be great to see for obvious reasons. I know that for years some "insiders" had pushed this whole thing that they sounded like sh*t, but I don't hear it when I listen to the Hawaii material from the 1967 - Live Sunshine set. "Heroes and Villains" sounded awesome and crazily enough I thought that "Barbara Ann" truly rocked.

The February 28, 1970 show at the Seattle Opera House is of obvious interest to me as well, with Brian rejoining the live group since Mike Love was not there. Surely would've been interesting to see.

From there, well...a choice Blondie and Ricky era show in like 1972 would be nice. Any later '70s shows with an engaged Brian would also be cool. From the '80s on, I think Live Aid might have been cool to see the guys at. I also would've liked to see the 1995 Las Vegas performance where Brian sang "Don't Worry Baby" in the original key (if memory serves), with help from Matt Jardine. After that, I guess I'd have to say the final show of C50 in 2012 would've been amazing.

He mentions his friend Bill Johnston as the person he went surfing with. I thought it was Bill Jackson. I am starting to doubt this story.

No disrespect, but you ever believed the story in the first place? Bill Jackson sounds like one of the most made up names ever! However..."Do It Again" is great nonetheless.

Don't remember double posting, but I musta. Sorry!