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4826  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Party Gets No Respect on: February 11, 2015, 11:54:42 PM
I think it is widely overlooked because it's a sidestep in Brian's musical evolution that somehow does not fit between SD/SN and PS. However, it is the most fun album the boys did and spreads good cheer. It really stands alone. Personally I love it. Smiley It features the Brian lead vocal that I love the most, in Papa-Oom-Mow-Mow, figure this! Cheesy

That is a KILLER Brian vocal. Also the version from Concert.
4827  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Party Gets No Respect on: February 11, 2015, 11:47:41 PM
I'm 25 years old, my friends are all approximately the same age, and none of them care much for The Beach Boys. Oh sure, a few think "Smile" is a great album, but beyond that I cannot convince them to give the Boys a fair chance. It drives me crazy.

"Party," however... is a different story. One night I was in my room ( Smokin), listening to "Party," and one of my buddies popped in and was wondering who/what I was listening to. When I told him it was The Beach Boys, he reacted in surprise, and said "This is actually pretty good."

Bottom line, I don't think "Party" gets the respect it deserves (or The Beach Boys in general, for that matter, but that's a different story). It is an album that may appeal to many musical sensibilities. I go to a few festivals each summer, packed with hippies and Dead Heads. Lots of people bring stereos and what-not to play their music on when there are no bands performing. If there is one Beach Boys album I'd play for them, it'd be "Party," and this summer I likely will bust it out. They'll never know it's The Beach Boys until "Barbara Ann" plays, and by then it will be too late to stop it!

Definitely an underrated album.


If the Beatles released the exact same type of album, complete with lots of covers (let's say swap out the Beatles cover for a Beach Boy cover), party sound overdubs, and a handful of goofy renditions of Beatles songs, it would be heralded as much more of a classic than the BB album. Just because that's the way it always is with the BBs.
4828  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Smiley Smile = Party! Part II on: February 11, 2015, 11:43:46 PM
I wonder if Brian would have been able to release an album to "buy time" to help him finish SMiLE, if such an easy option were afforded to him. Not saying time was all he needed to finish it, but it was one of the things he needed.  As I stated in an earlier post, I theorize that maybe SS was an attempt at this in and of itself, if he had it in his head to maybe finish recording SMiLE at a later point (which of course, he did - mucccch later).

He was lucky that Party! filled that role when it did, but maybe it was obvious 1.5 years after Party! that the public wasn't gonna accept another record like that, due to the exponentially sped-up rate of change in popular music, and expectation from the public.

Was Lei'd in Hawaii almost another attempt at an album with the Party! mindset too, to get an easy-to-record album done quickly in order to buy time for writing more new songs?
4829  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Smiley Smile = Party! Part II on: February 11, 2015, 11:30:02 PM
Party
Pet Sounds
Smiley Smile


A party sandwich.  Party! is the top bun.  Light, airy, fluffy.  Pet Sounds the meat & veggies (or tofu for those with a hard-on for the lousy Beatles).  And Smiley is the bottom bun -- that absorbs all the burger juice.

 LOL

that's both hilarious and remarkably accurate. I can't think of many bands who have released an iconic record (which is not the band's 1st or last record), and to have that record bookended on BOTH sides by such unusual, drastically different (from the iconic record's sound) albums, especially all within a short time period. It's quite unique, AFAIK.

Of course, if you put Summer Days and Summer Nights (the last "proper" studio record), and have the Boys finish SMiLE and release it, it seems like a much more logical progression in a Pet Sounds sandwich. The only real reason the actual released album chronology is so bizarre as it is, is because of a stopgap-to-buy-time quickie record (are there any people here who really think Party! was conceived for any other reason?) and the unprecedented amount of unreleased SMiLE recordings (which show the natural, yet huge leap forward, artistic progression that was **supposed** to follow). Can someone please just invent a time machine and find a way to help get SMiLE completed in '67? Let's get on that, people.
4830  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: February 11, 2015, 11:28:54 PM
I'm back and I would have something to add, but I'm not saying a gosh darn thing ever again for fear of the Brain Police!

Happy lurking kids Smiley

You were gone?  I thought you just changed your name

Nope, when you're sent to the cornfield here, you're gone like long pants in Bruce's wardrobe trailer .... You can't even lurk or get PM's.

Hey, wazzup Pinder. We have our differences sometimes, but nice to have you back.

When's the last time Bruce was spotted wearing pants at a BB show?
 
4831  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Party Gets No Respect on: February 11, 2015, 08:27:51 PM
I gotta admit, I rarely listen to the album. I should give it a new listen with fresh ears, especially after starting the Party!/ SS thread. I also need to listen to those SOT outtakes which may or may not be in my possession, which have the outtake cover of Satisfaction.

Do you guys think the party sound overdubs made the record sell better? If they hadn't done those overdubs, would sales have been affected whatsoever?
4832  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The Beach Boys/Byrds Connection[s] There are quite a few. on: February 11, 2015, 08:23:44 PM
Summer in Paradise (song), U.K. re-recorded version with McGuinn guitar, anyone? The pinnacle of both bands' careers, no doubt  Grin
4833  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Smiley Smile = Party! Part II on: February 09, 2015, 07:10:14 PM
I can see the validity of considering Smiley as a weird druggy version of Party - to a point. There is some truth to the view that each was a stopgap intended to buy time and/or satisfy Capitol. Party is sort of a roots project, an exercise in nostalgia in light of where rock n roll had progressed to that point in '66. And, stripped of the bogus party chatter is a pretty impressive recording in its own right - Devoted To You is a jewel.  

Smiley, though, could be, and has been, viewed as the logical summation of the Smile project.  It has been argued that Smile could never have been completed in the form in which it was eventually released for the simple fact that it was physically impossible in 1967 to assemble all the pieces - cut and paste.  

I don't know if it has ever been clarified as to why Brian went minimalist, other than that he began working at home rather than in a proper professional studio. The Hawaiian shows seem to reveal a conscious decision to go minimalist. A rock n roll show with nary a guitar in sight nor sound? WTF indeed! Both the rehearsals and the latter studio sessions recorded to salvage the live recordings reinforce the perception that minimalism was the chosen aesthetic in the summer and fall of 1967.

The release in 2012 of a remastered Smiley confirms, in my view, that rather than a sloppy throwaway, it was in fact a conscious artistic departure. Druggy? For sure, but the delicacy of effects reveals an artist in full control.

In the end, I have to wonder why it was released in the form in which it has come down to us? Why was the mastering so muddy as to obscure the subtle delicacies? Why is it sequenced as it is? And why, if it is the summation of the Smile project, are key pieces missing? Pieces that might have been completed with little additional effort? - Sit down to the piano and knock out a stripped down version of Surf's Up that would itself be a knockout in 3 or 4 minutes!!! A live, in the studio Good Vibrations? 4 more minutes!!! Finishing touches to Cabinessence? OK, maybe an afternoon!!!

Why, why, why???  

The other idea I had about the SS/Party! connections is this: the BW-penned original songs that were recorded on Party! were goofy renditions of preexisting songs (for which superior studio versions existed); obviously the BB (not cover songs, but BB songs) on Party! were not meant to be THE versions of the songs, only a sort of minimalist/goofy versions of them.

Consider, if (and it's a BIG if) BW had, at the time of SS's release, thought to himself that perhaps he'd go back and finish working on SMiLE at some later point (and I don't think this is out of the question, I think he may have considered this, but gradually avoided doing so), that the SS re-recordings of SMiLE songs were possibly filling that same role, in that they were minimalist/goofy (still totally rad) versions of the songs, but that eventually it may have been planned for the superior much-labored-over studio versions to be released. This would be the inverse of Party!, in that unlike Party!, the superior studio versions hadn't been released yet.

Just a thought. I may be talking out of my rear end, but I find it interesting to ponder/discuss this stuff.
4834  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Smiley Smile = Party! Part II on: February 09, 2015, 05:02:54 PM
Nah. I think any similarities to party were probably unintended. I don't believe it was a stop-gap. Those first two awful, unnecessary best-of releases imposed by Capitol probably filled that purpose in Brian's mind. I think Smiley was a legitimate attempt at a good, creative endeavor. I think the use of SMiLE songs that were the most finished was desperation because they didnt have time to write a whole album of new songs. The few new songs they did were throwing a bone to Mike. The singles were imposed by Capitol. The minimal production was what the SMiLE sessions had been leading to, the old recordings were scrapped because Brian lost interest, they'd be too tedious to compile, and he felt he had missed the moment. The goofy moments like laughing and talking were, imo, going to be included on SMiLE had it been finished. The Boys in a room feeling was a product of the minimal production and an attempt to get that close knit feeling back after all the tension the past few months.

To me, that's Smiley. Aside from the off-putting, flow-killing singles (which wasn't Brian's doing) it's amazing we got such a cohesive, unique work of art out of all the chaos going on. I'd really love to know more about these sessions. What the Boys thought of it, if Brian was truly behind the new direction or heartbroken over SMiLE, how smooth the transition in direction was, etc.

So, no party. SMiLE. But not quite. Almost like a...Smiley Smile. Y'know?

I love Smiley Smile to death. I really do! But I think there's a difference in BW putting his heart into something, and PUTTING HIS HEART INTO SOMETHING (!!) - you know what I mean, Mujan? With Pet Sounds, SMiLE, Brian was bleeding for his art, trying so, so hard to make perfection. I feel an element of dejection on SS, even though he found it in himself to keep forging ahead. IMO, even though there's a careless element in both SS + Party, I think to a degree Brian was ultimately trying to make good product both times. One could argue the self-sabotage route with SS (this has been pondered for years by fans), but in the end, I think he wanted both albums to be good. Even Party!.
4835  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Smiley Smile = Party! Part II on: February 08, 2015, 11:36:17 PM
I've been thinking too that Smiley was an attempt to do the SMiLE feels in a "Party!" recording mode, a try to do it in a looser way (looser, not loser). I doubt it had to do with pressure from Capitol though.

I think if you take the pressure from Capitol part of equation out entirely, that changes things drastically; I can't imagine BW would have felt quite the same level of freakout to just get something done and released quickly. I believe that while Party! seemed to be a more concerted effort to make something more "commercial" and "relatable" to listeners, and SS seemed to give less of a f*ck (sans the inclusion of Good Vibrations + Heroes & Villains), both were in part a result of getting Capitol off BW's back. They both served that purpose, even though the latter was sort of a career killer.

But yeah, Micha - I also think that Smiley was an attempt to do SMiLE in a Party! type recording mode... just with more obviously bizarre results. And Vegetables was almost the enlightened, new age version of the promo Party! Potato Chips.  Grin
4836  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Smiley Smile = Party! Part II on: February 08, 2015, 10:20:35 PM
The more I think about it, it seems like Smiley Smile was just as much a quickly made record to appease the record company as BB Party! was, and there are many similarities between the two.

Consider:

The two albums were made because another more important record was going to (or in the case of SS, had already) take(n) up too much time, thus necessitating a stop-gap release. In the case of both albums, I find it obvious Brian would have had the mindset of not putting his true, true heart into the projects (and getting something done QUICK was the primary concern), but no matter what happened, in that era, even Brian slapping something together quickly like SS was still going to be rad in its own way.  Also in the case of both, there were some quickly-done re-recordings of other more properly recorded BB songs.

Plus, I think they both share an atmosphere of the guys hanging around a room. Obviously, Party! is a very specific attempt to feign that imagery, but Smiley Smile (with its stoned-out laughter and bits of odd talking/chatter) to me is somewhat of a psychedelic equivalent.

Lastly, I also think that listening to these albums (both being the immediately-released albums directly prior to and post Pet Sounds), had to both be a very similar WTF moment for listeners unaware of the history and reasons for the respective albums existences. If a 1960s listener (without our geek knowledge) were to listen at the band's released output at the time (minus SMiLE of course)... the experience of hearing Pet Sounds bookended in its chronology with these two strange, comparatively minor albums had to be very odd, yet somewhat similar. Or so I would think.

Do you think the band themselves ever saw things like that, and thought of SS as a sequel of sorts to BB Party? Or at least a rehash of a similar scenario?  I can't imagine this thought was lost on Brian or the Boys either. The parallels are there, IMO. It's kinda like the Lincoln/Kennedy coincidences, only with some probable actual intention behind the parallels. Not saying that Brian wanted any listener to actually think SS was intended as a Party! sequel, only that SS feels born of similar reasons. The SS stoner party vibe, however, makes me think there may have been a modicum of intention at parallels by BW.
4837  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: what was the first album to release the pre-capitol demos? on: February 08, 2015, 05:19:58 PM
I had a copy of this lp and a test pressing for it also. I remember I bought it in early 1970..right before add some music was released. don't know when it actually was released but that is when I saw and bought it.


of course one can buy it rereleased from Canada here with a different cover:  http://www.discogs.com/Beach-Boys-Biggest-Beach-Hits/release/1802111

For the people who bought this right around the time when it came out... what were your thoughts at the time? Pre-internet, it must've been an odd, yet exciting experience suddenly hearing all these previously-unreleased very early BB tunes, songs that most everyone probably never knew existed. And did people wonder if this was a bootleg (since it almost seemed grey area anyway)?
4838  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Guardian: \ on: February 06, 2015, 08:18:39 PM
And perhaps there isn't much daylight between "killed Smile" and "berated my mentally ill cousin about how much I hated the music he was making until, for entirely unconnected reasons, he chose to stop making it."

Except that he did no such thing.

Those may be overly harsh words for Wirestone to say, but IMO even if Mike's intentions were not ill-intended and not meant to wound/in any way, shape or form derail or change the project's direction, I don't really doubt that Brian *felt* some degree, even a little, of those feelings from his cousin at the time, and I don't believe it's appropriate to underestimate, let alone completely erase that from being a possible piece (by no means the entire piece) of the puzzle. A fragile person's interpretations of another person's probable negative energy and vibe cannot simply be dismissed as nonexistent, even if one wishes to release Mike (and any other band member(s)) from any and all responsibility.
4839  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Saddest Song on: February 06, 2015, 11:18:27 AM
When I feel sad for Al wasting his awesome vocal talents on a tune like PT Cruiser, does that count?  Grin
4840  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Saddest Song on: February 06, 2015, 10:58:03 AM
She's Goin' Bald = follicly sad
4841  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Susie Cincinnati on: February 06, 2015, 10:55:41 AM
Tis an underrated track, IMO.
4842  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Individual Beach Boy voices inadvertently jumping out from the harmony stack on: February 06, 2015, 10:49:49 AM
I'm sure most people who've listened to lots of BBs music have heard many moments when individual Beach Boy voices jump out from the harmony stack. Sometimes it seems like it was an inadvertent occurrence where their individual voice is very audibly recognizable, not necessarily a moment where the particular member was purposefully given a chance to shine. Maybe they just sang louder or closer to the mic at a certain point.

Here are some that come to mind:

Denny – Cherry Cherry Coupe (especially on stereo version) (at 1:28 the lyric “…coupe now”)

Denny – Don’t Back Down (alternate stereo version from Keep Your Eye on Summer) (at 1:09 the lyric “Don’t Back Down”)

Mike – Little Deuce Coupe (at 0:07 the lyric “what I gawwwwwtt”)

I know there are many, many other examples, anyone care to add some more?
4843  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Guardian: \ on: February 06, 2015, 08:27:58 AM
Eh. I don't see much that's really inaccurate there. The owns the name bit is in the headline, not the article, which means that someone other than the author wrote it.

And for the general public, I doubt many folks would see significant difference between "owns the name" and "has an exclusive license to the name, one the people he licenses it from being himself, and controls it on tour."

Just like there being precious little difference between "fires Brian Wilson" and "consciously allows a contract to expire so Brian Wilson doesn't get to tour with me anymore, which he has stated publicly that he wants to keep doing."

And perhaps there isn't much daylight between "killed Smile" and "berated my mentally ill cousin about how much I hated the music he was making until, for entirely unconnected reasons, he chose to stop making it."

Just saying.  Azn

+1
4844  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian & Dennis on ADULT CHILD - UK 1977 on: February 05, 2015, 11:33:44 PM
If this is indeed about Love You then that's a real tragedy. We can't tell if it would've been huge with some big promotional effort backing it up and personally I doubt it. But still, this could've been the straw that broke the camel's back with regards to BW a) being willing to take the role of the group's actual leader and b) creating pop music of an experimental ilk.

What would have happened if Love You had been the '76 BW comeback album (in place of 15BO)? If it had the 15BO level of promo, and Roller Skating Child had been pushed heavily as a single, do y'all think it could have been a bit of a hit?
4845  Smiley Smile Stuff / The Beach Boys Media / Help Me Honda 1982 commercial on: February 04, 2015, 07:51:33 PM
Um... yeah.  Grin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qs6EgSoJBaM
4846  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: I Am Brian Wilson: New Autobiography on: February 04, 2015, 03:02:02 PM
Not really suggesting that Brian is happy about it Pretty Funky.  I''m just, as I have since 'it' happened, wondering WTF's 'up' with THAT?  Certainly NOT a "best friend" move.  UNLESS... ... ... Huh  Unless...it's OK.

Yes CenturyDeprived...that sure is a BAD boot-camp 'look'.  And when I say "bad" I mean it in the traditional sense.   Although shaving his back sure worked.  Brian looks to be in pretty good physical condition as well.  bgas's pic, candid as it is, confirms for certain what many have debated, argued and pondered over for decades...ie:...that Brian actually named his 'pecs' Carnie and Wendy...after his daughters.  It's how he was able to tell left from right during that specific era.  The sweat-shirt confirms that I was, as usual, wrong.

It also confirms that 'the little fella' was NOT Al. Evil

 LOL
4847  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Land Ahoy scrapped and rewritten as Cherry Cherry Coupe - reasons? on: February 04, 2015, 02:28:11 PM
It was going to be on the LP until they got the rights to the original Surfin' and stuck it on there

If so, it seems to have been a "We Got Love" type of situation then. If a song had to get cut to make room for "Surfin'", IMO it's surprising that Land Ahoy was the one that got cut, since it's musically stronger than many others.  I'd think lyrical subject matter must've been a determining factor.
4848  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: I Am Brian Wilson: New Autobiography on: February 04, 2015, 02:07:17 PM
Finally, at long last.  Maybe we'll learn what kind of pizza Brian likes.  That information is way-LONG overdue. Wink

This struck me immediately upon seeing it in the text...  "Along with Brian's own words, his story is told through the people that know him best, including his wife Melinda;his best friend and band leader Jeffery Foskett;"

Now if Jeffrey Foskett IS Brian Wilson's "best friend" then Brian must have absolutely no problems with Mike Love or what Mike is doing with the Beach Boys and for 'BRI'.  I mean think about it.  A "best friend" would never just cut and run and sign on with the 'other side' .  It would demonstrate 'bad form'... a kind of betrayal if you will.

WAY TOO EARLY to suggest that some key players and components will not be included as sources for the book.  If THAT is the case though then the 'new autobiography' might not be all that most of us hope it will be.  It cannot be only a painting.  It has to be a series of 'candid photgraphs' examined.  [wink, wink]  Only then will we learn 'what it was like.' Cool Guy

OH!  Candid photographs!!  Here's another one of mine: 

   

With the exception of those teenage crew-cut shots, this has got to be about the shortest Brian ever had his hair in adulthood, right?
4849  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Capitol to Release Brian Wilson's 'No Pier Pressure' April 7: press release on: February 03, 2015, 06:39:42 PM
Exactly rab! Let The Beach Boys end the way BW originally intended it...With "Summer's Gone" on the album, and those live performances in London of it. The perfect place to end a documentary or book on them.

Remember when Mike mimed a gun to his listening to playbacks of it? Turns out he was kinda right and the bullet killed his bar band version of the Beach Boys stone dead and ended the story with a bit of class.  


If the gun miming incident happened in public, I can imagine that in a private one-on-one "room" scenario, you'd have more of the same, or worse, when creative differences were to almost certainly arise. Does anyone doubt this? Is this off-base?  One could generously call that dry humor, or IMO more accurately call it straight up uncool.  It's mocking, straight up, and it ain't a healthy communication style to say the least, especially with a person who is very, very well known for being sensitive on the receiving end. 
4850  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Going To The Beach Live on: February 02, 2015, 10:22:05 PM
How sick of playing Mike Love written songs must Dennis have been after pretty much sitting out MIU and literally having to save the L.A. Light album?

One must really wonder what would have happened to the band politics if the LA Light Album had been a success, because artistically (sans a couple of exceptions) it's pretty rad.  

I wonder if at any point in the band's history, there was ever serious talk in the band about the band never recording a new happy old-fashioned beach or surf-related song again. The lack of surf-related songs between "Don't Back Down" all the way to "Still Surfin'" (unless I'm forgetting any) has to tell me that there was a conscious effort to specifically avoid the surf topic, at least.

If "Do It Again" had been released with the original "Surf Again" lyric, I think it would have flopped.
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