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634735 Posts in 25407 Topics by 3612 Members - Latest Member: mikeloveSTL July 21, 2018, 11:47:55 AM
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1  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Guitar Sound on \ on: Yesterday at 12:15:33 PM
Hmm...I was just reading today about the "baroque violin" - violins from the 17th century were set up differently than modern day violins, to the point where a "baroque violin" is considered an instrument unto itself...I wonder if the same is true of 17th century cellos?

It is--but many of the finest extant instruments from the "early music" eras have been altered to suit the needs of the modern performer.  Most existing Stradavarii and the instruments by similarly sought-after makers have been disassembled and put back together to accommodate modern strings and more vigorous playing.  Horoshevsky's cello would similarly been dismantled and adapted for modern use.  Interestingly, Celli were just starting to become commonplace in the 17th century, replacing earlier bass instruments from the related viol family.  Some have argued that the cello started life as an instrument played "da spalla", ie, on the shoulder, like a violin, and that it was that instrument that Bach wrote his cello suites for.

COMMENT:  Question for aeijtzsche. Would the older cello be more like a viola size? I can't imagine anything larger used da spalla. And by the way, I misspoke about Igor's cello. It was made in the 1700s, which would make it an 18th century instrument. Still had a beautiful bloom. ~swd







Also, watch this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XD4kNY34AoE

And here's a Brandenburg played with Celli da Spalla:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEbkxYfk0Go

Surprised that no one in the world of overly theatrical prog-rock and metal has tried to mount a pickup on that instrument and plug it into a massive rack and a Marshall stack just for the visual impact alone.  LOL

Or surprised that Nigel Tufnel didn't strap one of those on at some point...
2  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson - 2018 Tour Thread on: Yesterday at 12:11:59 PM
Brian has been touring on his own for 20 years at this point and is playing shows on the road as of this week, I'm pretty confident in saying anyone who still might try to push the "the poor man is too ill to tour" nonsense is either an idiot or a puppet.
3  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Vocal on 'Til I Die Tag on: Yesterday at 12:09:08 PM
I was more interested in who sings in the tag the complete "Until I Dieeeee". Listening to it yesterday on Serius, I too was wondering if it was Jack Reiley, as it sounds a bit like him and a bit unlike Brian or Dennis, the only 2 Boys it could possibly be.

If it's the line I'm thinking of, I discussed this once with Alan Boyd, and we believe it's Carl. It sounds a bit different than he would normally sound, but we think it's him. I don't believe Dennis is on this one - it was recorded while he was away filming "Two Lane Blacktop". Not that he couldn't have added a part when he returned, but I don't think he did.

c-man, this is very interesting.

Do you have a rough list of some other songs that are vocally missing one or more BB members? (Not referring to "solo" vocal songs like Caroline, No, but songs where there's a vocal blend, and where avid BB listeners might have assumed for years that all the group was singing, and it would be a surprise, like with 'Til I Die, that someone is missing from the blend.)


Well...Mike's absent from a few Friends songs like "Little Bird", "Friends", "When A Man Needs A Woman", and "Be Here In The Mornin'" (his spot on the latter was filled by Murry). And on the Sunflower album, all of the vocals on "Forever" were reportedly sung by the Wilson brothers initially (then Mike was added in a few spots for the final mix), while on "Our Sweet Love", I just hear Brian, Carl, and Al. 


Interesting. And all of those Friends songs without Mike's vocals are due to his India trip with The Beatles, right?
I wonder if Murry would have come into the studio to sing had Mike not gone to India.

A recent auction lot revealed a letter which Brian Wilson wrote to the Maharishi explaining how Mike was needed to come back to the states to work on the album. If I can find the actual letter or text of that letter, I'll post it.

But yeah, Mike was MIA studying meditation when the album was being worked on in the states and a letter exists asking the Maharishi to allow him to come back.

Not sure if that lines up with tracks where Mike is not involved, but it wouldn't be surprising if that was the reason he's not on those tracks.
4  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Guitar Sound on \ on: July 19, 2018, 09:30:41 PM
For anyone interested, and my interest was stoked by a music history professor who had the unenviable task of lecturing for two hours at a 9am lecture class when half the class would either be absent or asleep (and he was *excellent* which is why I am recalling all this 25 years later)...check out the various attempts through the years to create a "period correct" orchestra to perform various works as they would be performed and heard in the era of the composers who created them.

The time before trumpets had valves, when materials used on familiar instruments was not as we know it, when sizes and scales of instruments could vary based on the region in which the orchestra was based, and in some cases the temperament or tuning standards in general, which also could vary by region and definitely by era.

So you'd have a very familiar piece as of modern times that might not sound the same if we traveled back in time to the period when it was "new" and when the orchestras in that composer's region may have had differences from an orchestra 500 miles away.

It's fascinating to hear, and with the power of YouTube and the internet it's as easy as searching for these types of orchestras and recorded examples.

But to my younger and developing musical mind, hearing that professor describe how different an orchestra playing a familiar piece may have sounded vastly different in their original era versus hearing the Philly Orchestra or whoever playing it in modern times, it was really something to think about.
5  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson - 2018 Tour Thread on: July 19, 2018, 09:21:02 PM
The whole issue with the wheelchair was that a TMZ cameraman/paparazzi named Charlie was staking out the airport that day for any celebrities who may come through arrivals or departures in the terminals. He happened to catch Brian in a wheelchair in the terminal, and they tried to blow it up into something. This is what the professional paparazzi are paid to do, and there are usually at least a dozen of them on the clock scoping out LAX, along with the "professional" autograph hounds with their ridiculous wads of memorabilia and handfuls of Sharpie pens trying to get these celebs to sign junk so they can flip the items to a broker who lists it for sale online.

So back to the wheelchair...If certain segments of fans who post online have not been posting garbage for 20 years about Brian's health, and stuff like "Oh, our poor dear Brian, he's too ill to tour!" in some attempt to do whatever they were doing, it would be a non-issue.

Because the most common-sense, everyday-life aspect of having a wheelchair at an airport available for people who either cannot walk 1.5 miles to their gate or who have medical issues of any kind is and has been standard practice for a very, very long time. If it's not a wheelchair, an attendant can be called and they'll bring a motorized cart to get the person to their terminal or gate or wherever.

Again, what blows my mind is that not only is this standard practice in nearly every large facility where people have to walk a longer distance from point A to point B...including museums, historical sites, transportation hubs of any kind, etc...

...But Brian in his book described the issues he's had with his back, a condition which he shared with his brother Carl too as it can be genetic, and yet people are making it an issue beyond what it really is and how it's been explained and even published in a book for all to see.

Just pointing this out, not reacting to anyone or any comment here, but at some point it reaches a point where it's been said so many times in the past it becomes like talking into a dead phone especially when it continues to come up.

And blame too goes to those in the past who have tried to play that angle with Brian's health to suggest he should not tour. A decision which I'm pretty sure A. Only Brian would make and B. A decision which would benefit certain parties who might not like the competition in the market.
6  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 11, 2018, 07:22:29 PM
Shall we raise the stakes, sweeten the pot?

Would the idea of a studio sessions or outtakes type of product be less objectionable if it were focused on the Sunflower sessions? Because that could easily be cobbled together, either in a more sequential run where possible or edited as in the PS or Smile Sessions releases.

Two quick points:

First: These "new" fans, let's say in their 20's and 30's who are currently getting the bug we all got and diving into the more obscure material, were not around when the initial Sea Of Tunes sets hit the underground market and trading circuits. That audience, right there, might just welcome more session-studio outtake material since for a lot of those ears, it would be fresh listening material.

And they may have the same reaction we did when we got our hands on them.

Somewhat knowing their tastes, the material from the late 70's and 80's that is in the vaults currently would most likely not appeal to their sensibilities and listening habits, and it may just have a negative reaction.

Second: I REALLY like Jim's ideas for the Brother material.

Do it up similar to the two-fers, but this time give each album a freshening up from the previous re-releases, and also add a second disc full of demos, outtakes, and other rarities. NOT live cuts on these, but show the better material in the vaults that exists for each of the Brother era albums.

There is plenty of live material from this amazing era for the live band to do individual releases.

Boom - Money in the proverbial bank, right there.

Good call, Jim.

7  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Who was the second best songwriter in the Beach Boys? on: July 11, 2018, 07:37:49 AM
Dennis, no contest.

While some of his songs may not be as well-structured or constructed as his best examples, at his best he tapped into a unique emotional vibe that his older brother was a master at doing in songwriting (and performance). But above all, when you hear a Dennis song, you know it's a Dennis song. His songs and songwriting had a unique sonic identity, whether it's the chord progressions or the flow of his melodies, and that's something which (as good as Carl's songs could be) Carl didn't have to the same degree.
8  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 11, 2018, 07:34:00 AM
In a discussion last year that initially centered around "Sunshine Tomorrow", Howie Edelson said this:

I don't want to besmirch any other band, but as someone who's quite aware of what's in several other group's vaults, of the "majors" (and I'm not exaggerating), The Beach Boys are the ONLY one where if its unreleased material was finally released, the entire narrative changes and history gets a revamp. The BB's are the only band who can get a 10th life from what they left on the cutting room floor. The Grateful Dead definitely do not have five more "Sugar Magnolia's" tucked away in the vault -- The BB's have 15.

I don't want to speak for Howie, but I sense he was talking more about "Carry Me Home" and more Dennis material, and "Bedroom Tapes" type of material more than alternate session breakdowns and takes for "California Girls" and "Surfin' Safari" and "Fun Fun Fun."

Remember, especially when it comes to the 70s and 80s, there is TONS of stuff we've *never* even heard or maybe even heard *of.*

Maybe I'm just not understanding or getting what is meant by the term "game changer" or changing the narrative. Is it changing the game in terms of the general public opinion, or among hardcore fans of the band?

A few things come to mind. First, would "Made In California" as released with all the previously unheard tracks be considered a game-changer? Did the wealth of outtakes and unheard tracks cause opinions or perceptions to noticeably shift after people heard the set? Or if not, what archival/vault releases without the names "Pet Sounds" or "Smile" had such a game-changing impact outside the diehard fanbase?

(I'd say that '93 box set was indeed a game changer, but I also think the bulk of the reasons why centered around the Smile material)

And I cannot understand where there is appeal to anyone but the most obsessive completists and collector/diehards to hear ANYTHING languishing in the vaults from the late 70's or 80's. The released albums were ignored when they were released, and are still mostly ignored to this day. And I think a lot of it has to do with the songs themselves, and the sounds used in terms of the way they were making records at that time. I don't get the appeal.

And I surely don't see where KTSA or MIU or BB85 outtakes are going to cause a seismic game-changing shift in public opinion. But that's just my take.

9  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys 2018 Tour Thread on: July 06, 2018, 04:09:11 PM
July 15th show has been cancelled "due to logistical issues."

https://www.wane.com/news/local-news/beach-boys-cancel-fort-wayne-show/1286789993

That inspired me to check up on their schedule...which led me to this interesting discovery:

November 16th in Chattanooga, the 'boys' will launch their "Reason for the Season Christmas Tour"...I know Mike and Bruce have done Christmas shows before...but have they ever advertised a specifically themed Christmas tour...coincidentally at the same exact time Brian & Al are doing their own?

Maybe they had to cancel to hold emergency auditions to find a dancing Santa Claus to add to Mike's Christmas shows.
10  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 04:06:51 PM
And applying some deliberately simple-minded logic to ask a question:

If it were as inexpensive and as easy to open the vaults for fans to buy and access via an online download "shop" as is being suggested, wouldn't it have been done already?

Maybe the questions should be why hasn't it been done already even after it was proposed and planned roughly 15 years ago? What all is preventing it from actually happening?

Feel free to tell us.

Only if you reveal the recipe for your famous Bouillabaisse.
11  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 03:16:59 PM
It's a question of structuring releases to address (perceived) marketing strategies. If GF is right, then an approach that leads off with a disk with variants and session materials from more familiar songs, and follows with a series of outright rarities arranged by whatever theme the BRI folks/consultants come up with would be the way to go.

How well did Alan Boyd's late-90s compilations sell? That was the template for what I'm calling the "second disk" in a new "2-fer" series.

Of course an on-line resource with access to the Sea of Tunes materials would be extremely intriguing, fitting in well with how music is being delivered at this point in time, and creating it shouldn't require a great deal of expenditure, so (as others have noted) even a modest amount of sales should make the effort worthwhile (read: profitable).

Consider that everything that was on Sea Of Tunes (and more) exists and can be released with even more care given to the mixing and balancing of the tracks as well as more complete run-downs of the different albums' sessions (done chronologically for example), adding even more that has been found or acquired since the original SOT run...It would be an amazing, truly game-changing project to get it out officially.

And it would be familiar musical material that has a 50+ year track record of being popular and selling consistently versus unheard versions of less popular music that didn't sell.

Sounds like a no-brainer to me!  Grin

I think you have to get material with wide appeal to "sell" anything like this. In this case there is plenty of that to pull from, and it can be done well (if done correctly).
12  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 03:11:22 PM
And applying some deliberately simple-minded logic to ask a question:

If it were as inexpensive and as easy to open the vaults for fans to buy and access via an online download "shop" as is being suggested, wouldn't it have been done already?

Maybe the questions should be why hasn't it been done already even after it was proposed and planned roughly 15 years ago? What all is preventing it from actually happening?
13  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 03:06:05 PM
I'll agree to disagree but you guys just didn't seem to get what I was saying.

No doubt there are things in those vaults for the hardcore fans.

But I ask this in all seriousness...Where is the market right now in terms of projected hard sales numbers and potential buyers for material dating from the period of albums which are at this point mostly unknown even though they've been reissued on CD a few times over? So Tough, Holland, Surf's Up...in the US these albums outside the kind of people that read these boards are not exactly sales powerhouses, and I don't say that as a commentary on the albums or the reasons why, but it's feeling like the hard truth at this point.

So a marketing pitch to release *demos* from an era where there is all but an ignorance of the albums that were released, as some seem to want, and demos that sound scratchy and low fi and full of wow and flutter at that...how is that a game changer for the band?

People want what's familiar.

I'm saying if you bank on the familiar to *prime the pump* for more to come, you stand a better chance of generating interest with that over releasing "The Bedroom Tapes" or whatever misnomer was applied to that non-existent collection.

That "Brother Rarities" material? Yes, some is stunningly terrific. Some is crap that only completists would want. Should it come out? I say a resounding yes. But I'd also say more of it needs to be trimmed off those original lists because it simply isn't that good.

But there are things in the vaults that ARE that good.

But you cannot expect fans who either don't own, don't like, or don't know "Carl And The Passions" to buy demos and outtakes from that or various alt mixes from 15 Big Ones if they don't even have a familiarity or a fondness for with the actual released material.

The best way to introduce this stuff is to start with the familiar music - almost to a fault.

Would people listen to the California Girls complete sessions? I think a lot would buy it to hear them once...and isn't that the idea? As long as they buy it.

Then see how many people would buy demos from 71-76 and beyond in comparison.

Live shows from that 70's era? Completely different situation all around. Different marketing too. A much easier sell.

And yes...the plans for an online "shop" of vault material was on the books around the early to mid 2000's, in fact if I recall they had a domain purchased for it. It still hasn't happened.



Speaking only for myself, I was in agreement with HeyJude not because of any real business plan, but based on what I want to hear most. (And I was just pointing out that it could be released for nothing, which is a bonus.) I wasn't saying that was the best plan for the band's success. Most of what you're talking about has to do with what you think would be the best for the band, for its reputation, for its popularity.

So, no, I "cannot expect fans who either don't own, don't like, or don't know "Carl And The Passions" to buy demos and outtakes from that or various alt mixes from 15 Big Ones if they don't even have a familiarity or a fondness for with the actual released material." But my response, anyway, has nothing to do with them. It was coming from a proper, luthercentric universe.

Cap'n...I was replying to this specifically:

I think it's time for numerous discs of mid-late 70s tracks. Releasing "Carry Me Home" will be much more of a game-changer and "cred" enhancer for indie/new fans and all of that than releasing more early-mid 60s session tapes.

Obviously, there can be *many* tiers to all of this stuff. Hits comps for the casual fans. Compiled boxed sets (whether digital-only or not) to give an overview of an era (e.g. a Brian-focused "Bedroom Tapes" sort of box, a group-focused 70s/80s box, a "Live" box), and then an online archive can delve into raw session tapes.

But the thing that's going to garner the most attention and be a true "game changer" for the band's reputation isn't going to be a release of the unedited "California Girls" or "Fun Fun Fun" session tapes. It's going to be the 87 Dennis and Brian (and Carl, and the other guys) tracks nobody has ever heard. It'll be the "'Til I Die" demo, the unedited take of "This Whole World", "Carry Me Home", all that stuff that hasn't come out that was on that "Proposed Brother Bonus Tracks" set of discs that guy found.


I fail to see how a longer take of "This Whole World" is going to be any more of a game-changer or reputation booster for the band than the song as officially released itself. Have the numerous releases and re-releases of "This Whole World" or anything similar in the released and remastered forms as the band intended done anything in terms of being a game-changer or boosting the band's legacy? I'd say no. If people hadn't been as familiar with it and happened to hear it on a reissue, and liked it, that han't translated into anything beyond that in terms of building or changing the legacy.

I'll go back to hard truths, at least as I see them: The early 70's material is and has been readily available. If people in numbers beyond where it would be a niche market had gravitated toward it or latched onto it to where we'd be able to see such a shift in popularity or recognition, we would see it as of 2018. It's all out there in multiple forms and formats, and if people haven't been noticeably embracing it since those first CD reissues, where is the logic that demos and rough mixes of that same material would change any games?

That's niche material, for better or worse. At some point in terms of marketing and projecting and sales and all that stuff, you can't force or hector people into buying something they're not into. Diehard fans will line up for it, but in terms of getting things on the legacy-boosting level?

Go for the material from this band that already created that legacy, go for the unheard and arcane surrounding that material, and prime that pump for the lesser known eras.

But I cannot see any market outside the diehard completists for anything this band recorded after 1976. The only interest might be what Brian was doing on his own and the Love You untouched demos (curiosity would drive interest in those perhaps because it was Brian), but seriously where is there a market for MIU or KTSA or BB85 outtakes or unreleased tunes when the albums themselves stiffed and are generally ignored by most outside the hardcore fans?

It may sound cynical, but if there are suggestions that unreleased material from the 70's and beyond is the golden goose just waiting to lay those golden eggs, I don't see it in reality because the material is more often than non sub-par and the released versions of said material simply do not sell or generate interest.

If people get a chance to hear a song they know and which millions love in a new way, or hear the process behind that classic, that element is what helps sell a pitch to release this kind of material. Not the chance to hear an alternate take from the MIU album or something.
14  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 01:56:44 PM
Did the Pet Sounds Sessions and Smile Sessions box sets sell enough to be considered successful?

Absolutely.

And those are comprised of mostly raw session tapes with the musicians running through takes, albeit edited and streamlined a bit.

I'd like to see as up to date as possible sales numbers in the US market of the following, if they even exist or if anyone has them:

GV box set from '93
Hawthorne CA 2-disc set
Pet Sounds Sessions
Smile Sessions
Made In California
Sunshine Tomorrow

If those sales number are anything resembling the notion that they sold well enough to be justified, then I'd say the pump has been primed enough times to start pumping out more material.

We can argue all day what kind of material that should be, whether it be another Loop De Loop demo or some sh*t that was left off Keepin The Summer Alive or a "hot mix" of Rock And Roll Music...but I think there is no doubt there is a market for something to exist.

A better-selected "Brother Rarities" would be a great one eventually, but imagine the industry buzz alone if people who have no clue what the "Sea Of Tunes" label is or was would have access to raw tapes of Brian producing some of the most legendary tracks of the past 50+ years presented in full, sequential order and in superb quality. Other artists have done similar, but not quite on the same scale. Yet all of those projects have gotten positive reviews as far as I know, especially among the hardcore fans of those groups.

Headquarters Sessions, anyone? It inspired Rhino to go even further and make deluxe editions of more Monkees material which also was pretty successful.

Consider how much "Headquarters Sessions" type material is in the Beach Boys vaults from the most well-known Capitol years which has not seen the light of day in terms of official releases.
15  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 01:44:32 PM
I'll agree to disagree but you guys just didn't seem to get what I was saying.

No doubt there are things in those vaults for the hardcore fans.

But I ask this in all seriousness...Where is the market right now in terms of projected hard sales numbers and potential buyers for material dating from the period of albums which are at this point mostly unknown even though they've been reissued on CD a few times over? So Tough, Holland, Surf's Up...in the US these albums outside the kind of people that read these boards are not exactly sales powerhouses, and I don't say that as a commentary on the albums or the reasons why, but it's feeling like the hard truth at this point.

So a marketing pitch to release *demos* from an era where there is all but an ignorance of the albums that were released, as some seem to want, and demos that sound scratchy and low fi and full of wow and flutter at that...how is that a game changer for the band?

People want what's familiar.

I'm saying if you bank on the familiar to *prime the pump* for more to come, you stand a better chance of generating interest with that over releasing "The Bedroom Tapes" or whatever misnomer was applied to that non-existent collection.

That "Brother Rarities" material? Yes, some is stunningly terrific. Some is crap that only completists would want. Should it come out? I say a resounding yes. But I'd also say more of it needs to be trimmed off those original lists because it simply isn't that good.

But there are things in the vaults that ARE that good.

But you cannot expect fans who either don't own, don't like, or don't know "Carl And The Passions" to buy demos and outtakes from that or various alt mixes from 15 Big Ones if they don't even have a familiarity or a fondness for with the actual released material.

The best way to introduce this stuff is to start with the familiar music - almost to a fault.

Would people listen to the California Girls complete sessions? I think a lot would buy it to hear them once...and isn't that the idea? As long as they buy it.

Then see how many people would buy demos from 71-76 and beyond in comparison.

Live shows from that 70's era? Completely different situation all around. Different marketing too. A much easier sell.

And yes...the plans for an online "shop" of vault material was on the books around the early to mid 2000's, in fact if I recall they had a domain purchased for it. It still hasn't happened.

16  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 10:07:20 AM
Forgive my rambling in advance, maybe this should be a separate topic post.

There was an old short film I saw about a guy wandering through a desert area dying of thirst. He found an abandoned pump connected to a water well. On top of the pump sat a bottle of water, with a note attached telling anyone who needed water to "prime the pump" by pouring the water down the well to get the pump flowing. And once that was done, the pump would put out all the life-saving water someone would need, provided they left that bottle full once they got what they needed, so the next people in dire need of water could access the well.

So the guy dying of thirst decided to drink the bottle first, instead of priming the pump with it as the note instructed, and then madly started working the pump to no avail. He died of thirst in that desert because he drank the bottle but didn't prime the pump, a simple act which would have kept the water flowing for as long as he needed it.

I guess I'm wondering two things: Hasn't the BRI vault pump been primed enough in order to somehow get the water flowing from the well in terms of full-on widespread releases of vault material? It feels like it's flowing to some degree, but it also feels like the bottle of water is being consumed instead of getting to the actual well.

And I'm wondering too what exactly it is that is holding it up. It has to be close to 15 years ago that an online Beach Boys archival website was actually on the table and in the works, for fans to download vault material. Then it just died.

Instead we do get the archival "copyright" releases, some online-only and others as actual CD product, but the vaults still contain a lot of extra takes and various sessions which I'm sure both the completists and casual fans would like to hear.

Instead it still feels like we cannot get certain releases without having to piggyback onto them another release of Fun Fun Fun or Kokomo, or whatever other hits get repackaged.

I guess I'm left wondering how much more the "pump" needs to be primed before we get the kind of comprehensive, catch-all sets AND live releases which other bands and artists have been offering now for 15 years or more.

And I still think one way to bridge the gap AND get more widespread media/press attention would be to release some sets to the public as a "The Making Of..." kind of series, where full session tapes exist for classics like California Girls or I Get Around or whatever the case...and put it out for casual and diehard fans to hear the creative process at work that went into the hits. I know I've said it before, but I think it's a money in the bank idea where fans wouldn't get edited or redacted tapes of these sessions but would be able to dive into the full deal.

If those get attention, if released the right way, the pump would be considered sufficiently primed for more.

I think having the most familiar hits given this treatment would get more attention than hearing some scratchy, half-assed demos of songs from 1973 that never went anywhere. But once the pumps are primed, that stuff can have more of a market too for the diehards.

And it's not like other bands have not proven by now that there is a market for fanbases to log onto a web repository and purchase audio of full live shows, untouched and unedited. Pearl Jam was doing this over 15 years ago. The Dead are still doing it, as are many others.

Done the right way, The Beach Boys could do it with archival material. It may be hard to separate Mike's 180+ shows per year touring activities from the original Beach Boys, but damn there has to be a market for untouched tapes of the old concerts.
17  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys 2018 Tour Thread on: July 05, 2018, 07:04:54 PM
I was actually surprised to see Mike kind of stumble over his acceptance speech when Stamos gave him that award. I like that Mike accepted it for and named his original bandmates, but I didn't expect him to A. need to read from a teleprompter (if that's what he was doing) for such a short thank-you type of speech since his everyday gig is an emcee/frontman, and B. have trouble delivering the speech. It happens to everyone but Mike seemed off.

I can't put my finger on what it was, but I thought listening live last night that the performance was enhanced, I also think I did hear multiple Mike vocals hitting the live mix simultaneously and perhaps one was corrected, and the instrumental mix sounded really, really full (and I don't mean the orchestra, I mean the core band). Compare that sound to some of the recent June 2018 concert clips on YouTube.

I thought it felt like the set was clipped a little too tight, as in it felt rushed especially cutting right to Fun Fun Fun in the middle of Kokomo, and it didn't feel like the group was given enough time in the set. These things always run long, but still...we got basically one full song from the band. Or 2 if you count Fun Fun Fun which is short anyway.

Jimmy Buffett...I don't think he added much if anything. Him being barefoot was a little odd, at least Bruce could have lent Jimmy a pair of his Docksiders to put on his feet.  Grin

Anyway - The songs are the legacy. People love them and always will. It's music that heals and makes people happy. A special tip of the hat as well to John Stamos for all the work he does for veterans groups and his other charities - A class act in that regard, and I mean that sincerely. Kudos to John Stamos.


18  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys 2018 Tour Thread on: July 04, 2018, 06:16:41 PM
Mike did accept the award "on behalf of Brian, Carl, and Dennis Wilson, Alan Jardine, David Marks, and Bruce and I".

Cool - As it should be.
19  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys 2018 Tour Thread on: July 04, 2018, 06:13:35 PM
Here is the stream on YouTube - Mike's set just ended around 9:10 EST, I Get Around, Kokomo (with Buffett) shortened that went right into Fun Fun Fun.

You should be able to rewind the stream to catch it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5HNFhzNdnI
20  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys 2018 Tour Thread on: July 04, 2018, 03:44:21 PM
Brian Wilson’s genius is “fake” news... Roll Eyes

Apparently - given the time Mike spent on it in this interview - discussing "I Write The Songs" is weighted heavier than mentioning Carl, Dennis, or the Beach Boys (pre-license) at all. Only a mention of "my cousin Brian" regarding songs he wrote with Mike.

Oh, and suggesting the original run of DC 4th of July concerts was Mike's idea.

It shouldn't, but this stuff gets me fired up.

Mike: It isn't about you.

Well said Cousin Craig LOL

Thank you, Cousin Billy!  Grin
21  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys 2018 Tour Thread on: July 04, 2018, 03:39:00 PM
Brian Wilson’s genius is “fake” news... Roll Eyes

Apparently - given the time Mike spent on it in this interview - discussing "I Write The Songs" is weighted heavier than mentioning Carl, Dennis, or the Beach Boys (pre-license) at all. Only a mention of "my cousin Brian" regarding songs he wrote with Mike.

Oh, and suggesting the original run of DC 4th of July concerts was Mike's idea.

It shouldn't, but this stuff gets me fired up.

Mike: It isn't about you.
22  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys 2018 Tour Thread on: July 04, 2018, 03:35:08 PM
Haha!
23  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys 2018 Tour Thread on: July 04, 2018, 03:11:55 PM
Mike will be getting some kind of award at this event tonight too.

The National Artistic Achievement Award. Can't say I can find much info on it. It's had 4 prior recipients, including Stevie Wonder.

Yes, that's what it was, thanks for the clarification. I hope someone explained to Mike that The Beach Boys are getting the award, as in including the Wilsons and Jardine et al, and it's not just going to Mike & Bruce. If he delivers an acceptance speech when Stamos gives him the award, I hope he sees fit to name his original bandmates which he doesn't seem to do as often these days in his promotional press junket interviews.

If he does, it'll probably be to remind everybody that Brian is his cousin (which he only does when discussing Brian's many accomplishments)

I would not be surprised if that's exactly what happens! It's been Mike's M.O. in recent interviews to either go that route, or not mention the name "Brian" at all. As happened on an 8-minute long interview recently done on UK television.

Billy with the win in round 1! I don't know what this interviewer's credentials are or who he represents, but here are Mike and Bruce yapping away earlier today in DC...

https://youtu.be/4bDORIR2YzA?t=29s

Now were the original 80's July 4th shows in DC Mike's idea? He seems to suggest that in this interview. Legit question...is the credit for those shows really Mike's? Hmm.

24  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys 2018 Tour Thread on: July 04, 2018, 02:35:00 PM
Mike will be getting some kind of award at this event tonight too.

The National Artistic Achievement Award. Can't say I can find much info on it. It's had 4 prior recipients, including Stevie Wonder.

Yes, that's what it was, thanks for the clarification. I hope someone explained to Mike that The Beach Boys are getting the award, as in including the Wilsons and Jardine et al, and it's not just going to Mike & Bruce. If he delivers an acceptance speech when Stamos gives him the award, I hope he sees fit to name his original bandmates which he doesn't seem to do as often these days in his promotional press junket interviews.

If he does, it'll probably be to remind everybody that Brian is his cousin (which he only does when discussing Brian's many accomplishments)

I would not be surprised if that's exactly what happens! It's been Mike's M.O. in recent interviews to either go that route, or not mention the name "Brian" at all. As happened on an 8-minute long interview recently done on UK television.
25  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys 2018 Tour Thread on: July 04, 2018, 02:09:07 PM
Jimmy B. Is putting up a bit of the soundcheck on his Instagram. A great pic of Jimmy and Bruce, two guys who 'pray for waves' as the caption says.

Looking forward to watching this tonight. Hoping JB and BB do a tune or two together.  Happy 4th!

Prerecorded tracks or a 100% authentic live performance this time around?
Well it sounded like JB was playing a little guitar, but aren't these things always pre recorded?

If they are always prerecorded, it kind of makes a soundcheck unnecessary. Unless the soundcheck is more for camera blocking than actually running through a soundcheck for the musicians.

There was an issue in previous years with some fans (and posters here and elsewhere) suggesting some of these things Mike did were 100% live when they clearly were not. Just curious if this year would be a 100% live show.
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