[Beach]

The late '70s Beach Boys always sounded like a karaoke band instrumentally. With the kind of money being thrown at them, you'd think they could try a little harder.

I'm gonna call this song trash. Not because it's necessarily bad, but it's about as rudimentary of songwriting as you could do. There are a million bands that could write a clunker like this. In fact, the bands at those rock & roll "camps" Brian always makes a cameo at have probably churned out stronger material.

Seriously, what's there to like? "Oh wow, they're capable of playing generic chords in time! Listen to that bass hammer away repetitively on the root note! Someone was able to get three of their fingers to plod on the keyboard all at once! And Mike managed to write a pedestrian melody!"

But ... but ... it's "Goin to the Beach," don't you see?  It has the word "Beach" in it.  "Beach" as in where people go surfing and spend their summers.  And the "Beach Boys."  Beach, I tell you.  So if you don't like this track, or you think it's a bad idea to market the box set with "Goin' to the Beach," or if you think they should be promoting that "arty" stuff, you're denying the group's history.  Don't be a denier.

Not sure what has happened to this place.  A name change certainly is in order.  No more "Smiley Smile," it should instead be Keepin' the Summer Alive or Still Cruisin' I guess.

The sad thing is that these marketing efforts and the insistence of so many "fans" that the Beach Boys are nothing more than a beachy novelty act makes it quite a bit harder for others to discover the band.  Even more sadly, in 20 years or so, the band is likely to be all but forgotten because the fun/sun crowd will be gone, and no one else will know any better.

What marketing efforts? Do you seriously think that Amazon giving one song away is going to change the image that the group has one way or another? And you honestly think the group will be forgotten in 20 years based on anything like this? 

Wasn`t Smile released only recently? Doesn`t the box contain a mix of fun in the sun stuff (which is an essential part of their career) and the more arty stuff?

Jeez...

I suppose all of that is true.  But it just seems like things have shifted.  With the Smile Sessions having been released, there is understandably a lot less discussion about Smile.  Bambu - same thing.  Many of the bands that were explicitly Beach Boys inspired, like Apples in Stereo, have moved on to other sounds.

And as Jim said, it's become difficult to say an unkind word about even the worst novelty lowpoint without people jumping to the defense of said song.  I've actually tried it a couple of times, and it's almost instantaneous.  A couple of weeks ago, I threw out Pitter Patter as a random example of a true lowpoint, and sure enough, its defenders jumped right in within minutes.

Makes it tough to be optimistic about the future.

It's a fun song with a rocking track and some good vocals. That's basically what I expected

Christ guys, it's called "Goin' to the Beach" by a band called "The Beach Boys" I don't think it was meant to be pure genius

I guess that depends on which Beach Boys version you like best. The Pet Sounds/Smile Brian genius or the Fun in the sun/Summer in Paradise Mike version.

So, Mike wrote this all by himself? Hey, I also remember a genius named Brian writing something called Some Of Your Love around that time frame. I don't get the smart ass remarks. Brian has written his share of repetitive lyric songs.

Hmmm.   Perhaps the smart ass remarks are from fans hoping that the marketing for a career-spanning box set would show the band as something other than the fun-in-the-sun equivalent of the Archies.

It looks like there’s a lot of good unreleased material on there, but for the first released track, they’re choosing a rejected song from a one-star album, probably because it was the only remaining unused song they could find with the word “beach” in it.

But then why would anyone be surprised?  The Beach Boys have always been marketed as lightweights, and there’s no reason to think that will stop now.

Sorry to wake you up, but you do know that a decent amount and most famous is what you call "Fun in the Sun" music. Why do some of you continue to deny this fact? It is what made the Beach Boys, well, The Beach Boys. It amazes me that you treat it so lightly. Brian wrote every single fun in the sun hit. Their biggest hits are fun in the sun. Their first and second Hey Days were due to fun in the sun hits. Even their biggest hits after their sun in the sun period, are now part of the fun in the sun hits at The Beach Boys and BAD shows. Look through Brian's set list the last two nights and see how many fun in the sun songs were played, and have been played since he started touring in 1999. I love all the eras or periods of music, but one thing I never do is dimiss the part that made me a fan in the first place.

Not sure what has happened to this place.  A name change certainly is in order.  No more "Smiley Smile," it should instead be Keepin' the Summer Alive or Still Cruisin' I guess.

The sad thing is that these marketing efforts and the insistence of so many "fans" that the Beach Boys are nothing more than a beachy novelty act makes it quite a bit harder for others to discover the band.  Even more sadly, in 20 years or so, the band is likely to be all but forgotten because the fun/sun crowd will be gone, and no one else will know any better.

Agreed, Its a shame this box is being promoted by a freaking KTSA outtake. GTTB sounds like Mike wrote it in five minutes.

Realistically though what would be a better choice?

If they had picked Wouldn`t it be Nice to Live Again then people could have got it and cancelled their orders. As it is supposedly one of the most desirable tracks that woudn`t have been too smart. The same might be said for You`re Still a Mystery perhaps.

Most of the other unreleased songs are not very commercial.

I can`t see the big deal...

Yes, quite right.  The best way to market the set is to give people a track that no one really wants.  Brilliant.

Perhaps vendors of grocery products should do the same when they give out free samples.  Just offer people rancid or stale food for free, to make sure that no one takes advantage.

It's a fun song with a rocking track and some good vocals. That's basically what I expected

Christ guys, it's called "Goin' to the Beach" by a band called "The Beach Boys" I don't think it was meant to be pure genius

I guess that depends on which Beach Boys version you like best. The Pet Sounds/Smile Brian genius or the Fun in the sun/Summer in Paradise Mike version.

So, Mike wrote this all by himself? Hey, I also remember a genius named Brian writing something called Some Of Your Love around that time frame. I don't get the smart ass remarks. Brian has written his share of repetitive lyric songs.

Hmmm.   Perhaps the smart ass remarks are from fans hoping that the marketing for a career-spanning box set would show the band as something other than the fun-in-the-sun equivalent of the Archies.

It looks like there’s a lot of good unreleased material on there, but for the first released track, they’re choosing a rejected song from a one-star album, probably because it was the only remaining unused song they could find with the word “beach” in it.

But then why would anyone be surprised?  The Beach Boys have always been marketed as lightweights, and there’s no reason to think that will stop now.

I'm usually not one for half-assed material, but I'd still take it any day over proficient but overly sanitized tracks like I Can Hear Music or Don't Hurt My Little Sister...

The following are 2012 remasters.
Surfin' USA, Surfer Girl, Little Deuce Coupe, Shut Down Vol. 2, All Summer Long, Today!, Summer Days (And Summer Nights!!), Party!, Pet Sounds, Smiley Smile

Sunflower and Surf's Up were remastered in 2009 (but released on CD with the other remasters in 2012).

All of the other major Capitol/Brother studio albums were remastered in 2000/2001 except for the Christmas album which was remastered and released under the title Ultimate Christmas (with bonus tracks from the scrapped 1974 Christmas album) in 1998.  Still Cruisin' and Summer in Paradise have never been reissued since their initial release.

Check the downloads of those single albums (not the 2-fer versions) they say 2012. But as I said earlier, I don't know if that means remastered or not.

I know.  What that means is they started to be offered as singular downloads in 2012 rather than as twofers (I don't know why, I like the twofer format better because of the bonus tracks) but they are the same as the 2000/2001 remasters.

I couldn't hear a difference, but my hearing isn't as good as you young people.

Perhaps you spent too much time in your youth listening to Mike Love scream during Student Demonstration Time.

I just don't think it's realistic to believe that there will be a next wave.  Everyone on this site could buy five copies of a given release, but that would be a tiny, tiny fraction of what the record company would need to run a profit.

So it would have to be something with a larger audience, and what would that be?

I think this may well be the end.

There's lots that could be released, but it's hard to see what would make money.  We have the Pet Sounds Box, Smile Box, POB/Bambu, stereo remixes for what can be remixed, and now a number of additional outtakes.

Sure, they could do a nice 1-disc Party sessions without overdubs, or a live box, or a deluxe Love You with demos and Adult Child outtakes.  But the likely audience for that is tiny.

I could see a "Brian Wilson Sessions 1964-72" or something like that being successful.  But it would never happen as long as the other Beach Boys are alive, and maybe not afterward either.

I don't think it will be the end because Alan Boyd and Mark Linett have previously stated that they want to get more archival releases to the fans and have been diligent in doing so.  Beach Boys stuff is always going to move.  It's not going to fly off the shelves mind you but they are always going to have a niche audience that is going to gobble up archival releases.  This might be the last big box produced for a long while but there could be smaller releases devoted to specific time periods.  I guess a good place to start such a discussion would be the sales figure for Hawthorne, CA probably the most ambitious project we've gotten yet since it's an actual rarities package without any greatest hits attached to it.  It also didn't have the benefit of having a movie or mythical release attached to it like "Pet Sounds" or "SMiLE".

To be honest though Beach Boys fans between the official and ahem other releases basically have gotten some of the best archival releases of any fanbase at their disposal.  As I mentioned they have Linett & Boyd both pitching for them in terms of getting officially sanctioned archival releases, the other not so sanctioned releases allegedly sound better than most non sanctioned releases by other bands and to put the cherry on the top there is evidence that words, comments and suggestions on this forum don't exactly go unheeded by those in the position to facilitate making some of those wishes come true in the future.

So at the risk of sounding like a fanboy...buy MIC, continue to support what the band releases and you'll probably get more of the same sometime down the line.  

But will Linett and Boyd continue to pitch archival releases after the box set?  I'm sure they have other things going on, and they may not want to spend time on things that are futile.

Wasn't Hawthorne considered a commercial failure?

I think this may well be the end.

There's lots that could be released, but it's hard to see what would make money.  We have the Pet Sounds Box, Smile Box, POB/Bambu, stereo remixes for what can be remixed, and now a number of additional outtakes.

Sure, they could do a nice 1-disc Party sessions without overdubs, or a live box, or a deluxe Love You with demos and Adult Child outtakes.  But the likely audience for that is tiny.

I could see a "Brian Wilson Sessions 1964-72" or something like that being successful.  But it would never happen as long as the other Beach Boys are alive, and maybe not afterward either.

Unless I'm misinterpreting, Doe's site says that When Girls ... was at one point planned for release as an instrumental (June 1970 / Reverberation).  http://esquarterly.com/bellagio/gigs70.html.  To me, this is the way to listen to it.

Regarding "I Do". I have the 1990 version but not the 2001 version. What's the difference in the mix? Lead vocal pushed up in the mix or you can hear the backgrounds better? What.

Ever heard the stereo version of "I Do"?

At very least, the 2001 version is stereo.

hiya....

in what way is the 1990 and 2001 mix different?..... I never knew this.....

I acutually have the 1990 copy but not the 2001...........

is it considerably different?


RickB

I just discovered the difference, but it was in a thread from four years ago.  One poster said that Capitol couldn't find the mixes it had done earlier.  Not sure what the differences are.

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,7268.msg117313.html#msg117313

I recently figured out that the 1990 version of I Do is a different mix than the 2001 version, but I haven't been able to find a place to purchase it.  All of the mp3 sites like Amazon seem to only offer tracks from the 2001 version of the Surfer Girl/Shut Down two-fer, and online sales of the CD either do not specify the year or specify 2001.

But I know there must be a lot of 1990 CDs out there, and maybe even a place to purchase the 1990 I Do mp3 or flac.  Does anyone know of any they could point me to?

There is nothing more bracing at the SS board than those threads which have a high concentration of "damning with faint praise." Based on an on-and-off backreading of the threads, it's clear that such behavior is one of the key defining traits of this board and its members, and the practice is deeply ingrained, often with hilarious results. I'd extrapolate about three quarters of a million posts that present an opinion or an idea in this fashion or are riffing on such a framework of expression. There was a noticeable dropoff of such posts last year (late summer/early fall), but when C50 got crumpled, DWFP quickly returned with a vengeance, with a fresh wave of it aimed at TWGMTR.

It's likely that DWFP will spike in September and October, in the wake of MIC. We just might make it to a million units of DWFP....in January! 

Ok, I'll rephrase my previous post: I really, really like Pitter Patter and I think it's a genuinely good song.

I like it, too. Best of the MIU songs that seems to have originated at those sessions.   

Well if that ain't damning with faint praise ...

I like We Got Love. I often hear people say they like the versions of various songs on In Concert better than the studio. Now when that comes to a pre 1975 song featuring Brian strongly, I have to say the studio version aces it by the strength of his voice in the blend period. Yet with We Got Love I do see the point. The live take is more musical and exciting. Yet, the studio cut is taking quite a beating here and that isn't fair. It is a very good cut that I would take over much of the Beach Boys material to come.

Not sure what's unfair about it.  It's boring.  Basically generic 70s AOR.  Sure, it's better than Pitter Patter, but that doesn't mean much.

I would listen to these songs first.  Most are available on youtube, for example.

A song being available on Youtube is not the same as a song being in your collection.
Youtube videos may come and go.. We shouldn't rely on anything like that.

Yes.  My point was that anyone thinking of buying the GV box set can listen to many of the songs on Youtube before deciding whether to buy it.  Otherwise, if someone buys the set expecting Games Two Can Play, H.E.L.P. Is On The Way and I Just Got My Pay to be "great," they're likely to be in for a rude surprise.

[real jewel cases]

So, I've been toying with buying the Good Vibrations box recently. With this set on the horizon, does it make buying the Good Vibrations set irrelevant?

Yes, Buy it -- you even get real jewel cases in th GV set.

Buy it for all the great tracks that won't be on MIC or available on any other BB comp that's still easily obtainable...I'm thinking specifically of San Miguel, Fourth Of July, Games Two Can Play, H.E.L.P. Is On The Way and I Just Got My Pay, but there are others.

I would listen to these songs first.  Most are available on youtube, for example.

While I agree that the GV box set is a good value, I strongly disagree that tracks like Games Two Can Play, H.E.L.P. Is On The Way and I Just Got My Pay are "great."  While it's probably the majority view on this board that they are in fact great, most non-obsessives probably would not think so.

Apart from this being on MIC, is there any evidence that the 1963 version was a Beach Boys track?

I am embarrassed for the BB every time I hear the lyrics to 'When I Grow Up to Be A Man'

This one surprises me.  Their albums are littered with embarrassing lyrics, but When I Grow Up is not one that I put in that group.  IMO, contemporaries like Don't Hurt My Little Sister and Salt Lake City are far, far worse.

Another one that stands out for me is It's OK.  And if lyrics had been written for The Nearest Faraway Place, they doubtlessly would have horrid as well.

--Brian Wilson was an absolute musical genius, but the rest of the band--outside of being good singers--had little talent (relative to bands of comparable prestige).  As a collaborative band unit, the Beach Boys can’t even be compared to 60s peers like The Beatles and Rolling Stones. A lot of Beach Boys music can stand proudly in the ring against the all-time pop/rock greats; but all of that music can be categorized as “Brian Wilson featuring The Beach Boys.”

Writing and arranging all or the basis of "Little Bird", "Be Still", "Be With Me", "All I Want To Do", "Let The Wind Blow", "Slip On Through", "Got To Know The Woman", "Deirdre", "It's About Time", "Tears In The Morning", "Lady", "Sound Of Free", "A Time To Live In Dreams", "Barbara", "All I Wanna Do", "Forever", "Feel Flows", "Don't Go Near The Water", "Long Promised Road", "Take A Load Off Your Feet", "Disney Girls", "Lookin' At Tomorrow", "All This Is That", "Make It Good", "Cuddle Up", "The Trader", "Big Sur", "Steamboat", "On My Way To Sunny Californ-i-a", "Holy Man", "San Miguel", "4th Of July", "(Wouldn't It Be Nice To) Live Again", "Only With You", "River Song", "Thoughts Of You", "Farewell My Friend", "Forever", "Angel Come Home", "Where I Belong", "Baby Blue", "Getcha Back", "Keepin' The Summer Alive", etc. etc. etc. etc. as well as numerous great production jobs = "little talent".

I realize the songs here vary in quality, but at the very least, I feel they all (as well as other songs written by non-Brians) have something worthwhile to offer. This isn't even including their numerous contributions to Brian's songs. SHEESH.

P.S. What are some bands of "comparable prestige" and why do they matter in this context?

Well put. Quite frankly anyone who is familiar with the Beach Boys full output and yet still believes (or pretends to believe) that 'Brian Wilson = the Beach Boys' is a fucking idiot. Sorry to be blunt, but its true.

The only aspect of your post I'd disagree with is when you say 'I realize the songs here vary in quality'. Aside from Getcha Back and Keepin' The Summer Alive, I would actually say that the above list is an utterly tremendous collection of songs; one in fact that most other groups would kill for.

(sigh)

I suppose one unpopular opinion I have is that many, if not most, posters on this board are way, way, way too emotionally invested in the supposed greatness of every band member.  I would never say that Brian is/was the Beach Boys, but he was far and away the main songwriting and composing talent.

And notice that a good portion of the above list is Dennis songs, while others ("Tears in the Morning," "Take a Load Off Your Feet") would be laughed at by most people outside this board.

If all of the pre-Holland Beach Boys' songs that were not primarily by Brian or Dennis disappeared tomorrow, I think I'd only miss Feel Flows.

[Then I Kissed Her]

To some extent perhaps. But there is still filler on here imo and getting this box would in way give the buyer all of the essential songs.

I think we must be using different definitions of "essential". Obviously I'm the kind of person who can find value in a lot of the less objectively-good stuff, but realistically I'd say that at most there are a hundred or so "essential" Beach Boys records -- things that matter either artistically, for their value to the band's history, or commercially.

If I were to make a list of those hundred, *at least* ninety would be on the box. The only ones I can think of that I'd include on such a list but which aren't on here are Don't Talk, the Smiley Wind Chimes, Still I Dream Of It and Then I Kissed Her, She Knows Me Too Well, and if we're including unreleased tracks Carry Me Home. And most of those would be at the low end of the list, the more debatable ones.

The GV box was about Smile being released and the fact that some of those 70s songs were unavailable at the time.

Those things *among others*. Certainly I bought it (and apparently Jon Blum did too) because I wanted "to get all the good stuff" after I'd picked up Pet Sounds, Endless Summer, the Smiley/Wild Honey twofer and Brian's first solo album...

Did you mistype this, or did you really mean to say that Then I Kissed Her is essential?  I've never seen or heard anyone say that before.

On the contrary, Brian's solo career is a pale shadow of his work with the Beach Boys, and is frequently embarrassing and often outright appalling.

The only time he ever really re-captured the old magic is when he returned to Pet Sounds and Smile.

Otherwise it's almost all entirely lame. His debut album has a handful of decent songs, but even those are spoilt by the atrocious production.

Gershwin and Disney were both lazy covers albums. The Christmas album was breathtakingly dreadful. Gettin' In Over My Head was almost as bad. Orange Crate Art is boring.

That Lucky Old Sun is a rare bright spot, but even that is wildly over-rated by fans, their sympathy and goodwill towards Brian causing them to over-value what is basically a solid album, but nothing like a classic.

Touched a nerve there, huh, guys?

To me, the sound of Brian Wilson untethered to the atrocious production and marketing gimmicks of the post Endless Summer group is nothing less than hearing a modern American musical titan finally free. Free to express music that his band would never countenance. And free to attract an audience that enjoys his music for what it is -- modern American masterpieces -- rather than the lifestyle marketing ploy his cousin and assorted hangers-on want it to signify.

And of course his voice is reduced, and of course he turns to others for support. But that makes his accomplishments even greater and more precious. Here's the truth. I would trade the entire Beach Boys discography for Brian Wilson's four solo albums of original compositions. Brian Wilson (88), Imagination (98), Gettin' In Over My Head (04) and That Lucky Old Sun (08) are, to me, the truly canonical and irreplaceable creations of this timeless musical force. They have everything I like about Brian Wilson's music with precious little of the dross that so often accompanies it.

And that sounds like a joke, but it's actually not.

...

...

...

Well, actually it's a little bit of joke. I'd have to add the covers records, OCA, and the Wilsons albums too. And the Paley sessions.

Wow.  Talk about opposite ends of the spectrum.  I would bet that 95% or more on this board are somewhere between those two extremes.  But I think there’s good points on both sides.

On the one hand, you could certainly say that BW was “tethered” to unfortunate choices, especially lyrically, up to ’65 and again from ’78 to ’85.  It’s nice to see him lose some of those constraints.

On the other hand, from ’66 to ’77 he had artistic freedom like very very few musicians have ever had.  He was able to spend an extraordinary amount of money on Good Vibrations and the Smile sessions and make idiosyncratic albums like Smiley Smile and Love You.  No way those get released under most artists’ names.  I would also say that the BW of today (and since the 80s) barely resembles the BW of the 60s and early 70s.  He simply does not have anywhere close the same skills in composing, producing or singing.

So it’s kind of hard to understand preferring the latter-day “untethered” BW to the untethered BW of Pet Sounds, Smile, and even Love You.

Is it just me, or does Brian look like he's masturbating in your avatar?

Not just you!   

Definitely not just you.

I always assumed the poster with that avatar was trying to make some sort of bizarro statement, but didn't know what.

"Does anyone actually like that surf and cars sh*t they did before Pet Sounds?"

Seems like it's just not OK on this board to criticize the lyrics of the early songs.  People bend over backward to justify them -- some even claim that Brian was expressing spirituality, but masking it through analogies to cars and surfing.

But setting aside the surf/car/high school/summer fun songs, it's the lyrcis for a few others that were really inexcusable.  Wendy ("I can't picture you with him / His future looks awful dim"), Don't Hurt My Little Sister ("Why don't you love her/Like her big brother"), Amusement Parks USA, Salt Lake City, etc.   Horrible, horrible.

Lyrics matter, but you wouldn't know that from reading this board.