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620629 Posts in 24977 Topics by 3549 Members - Latest Member: HotAsIce November 20, 2017, 02:39:10 PM
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1  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Paley Sessions Discussion Thread on: Today at 10:27:16 AM
Good points.  But in 1996 Virgin did approach the group and wanted to sign them to their new V2 label.  Whether that was based on the Paley material, I don't know.

Yes, that deal was reportedly on the table. I'd have to go back and read the scant few reports detailing what V2 wanted and/or was offering. I'm sure they wanted Brian heavily involved (just like CBS in 1977 and Warner Bros. in 1970), but probably weren't looking at doing what Andy Paley termed in one interview as a situation where the BBs literally could have finished off a "Brian/Andy" album full of material "in two days." I don't think anybody would say that's an ideal situation, although in retrospect it's also easy to say that maybe they *should* have done that and just went with it so that they could get an album out there and get the ball rolling.
2  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Paley Sessions Discussion Thread on: Today at 10:24:59 AM
Looks to me like the video in question contains the unedited footage that EW producers gathered when putting together their Brian-Mike reunion feature. You'd want lots of establishing shots and other b-roll to fill space while someone narrated, for instance.

With precious few exceptions, video of BW in the studio is staged, and this was no exception. Brian, Mike, Mark, Andy and others are just hanging out to be filmed. No actual production is going on, regardless of how much or little any of the participants are saying.

Good points. Considering how Mike seems relatively unfamiliar with some of those in attendance and the studio in general (I believe at one point he asks Mark Linett if it's his studio), the barebones "listening" session may have also been a bit of an introductory situation for Mike in general, to hear how things were starting to take shape.

I have to wonder if this entire thing, the photo op and "news" item, was an attempt by Brian and Mike and whole operation to garner interest from labels or somebody out there. It just seems in retrospect a bit strange to start selling a "we're back together!" story before they've even done anything.

Contrast this to C50 where there wasn't (officially anyway) a peep until they had already signed the record/tour deals, started to record stuff, etc. And *even then* the thing was shaky and could have fallen off the rails.
3  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: Today at 10:20:12 AM
The big gripe, just like the C50 live album, comes back to the auto tune. I can not for the life of me understand why a professional studio can not hear what we rank amateurs hear first of all.

I'm pretty sure both Michael Lloyd and Mike Love are well aware this new album is soaked in autotune. They've made a deliberate decision to use it.

I'm guessing it's just a "Oh, that's what they do on albums now? Okay." sort of situation.

I could give Mike at least five very simple things he could have done to make both fan and media reviews a million times better for this album. Despite all my criticisms, I can easily see a solidly-produced and solidly-reviewed album buried in there somewhere, especially working from the circa 2004 recordings.
4  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Paley Sessions Discussion Thread on: Today at 10:15:54 AM
I think that without a record deal, and without a true "manager" (as in, someone steering their art and career and not just a "business manager") to steer anything, that's probably a big part of why the BBs seemed so scattered and aimless during the "Paley sessions" era. There wasn't anything firm to "turn down" or "reject", they just didn't continue working on stuff. It was all loosey goosey.

Look at how C50 developed. It was Joe Thomas bankrolling it (directly and/or indirectly), with Thomas and Capitol and the whole machine moving the whole thing forward.

Had a major record label swooped in and said "Okay Beach Boys, we want an LP produced by Brian and Don Was based on the songs Brian has written with Andy Paley and with Beach Boys vocals. So go do that and we'll give you X amount of dollars and a major promotional push and TV appearances, etc.", I would imagine they would have hashed something out. With a record label paying for and scheduling studio time, Carl would have gone in with the rest of the guys and either sang on the stuff or made specific points that he wanted addressed (re-cut backing tracks, etc.). I think, especially after SIP tanked, even Mike would have gone along with this. I think it would have been much like C50; everybody would have come in and done their thing even if they weren't the most enthusiastic they could have been.

And with a real "manager", they could have had someone with some smarts to create some marketing synergy, book Brian to do select dates with the band, etc.

Maybe all of this would have fallen apart with Carl's illness anyway.

But I think, on top of Carl's strained relationship with Brian, waffling musical tastes, and possibly finicky attitude towards some of the material, the fact that they were already by that point essentially a "Touring Band that might occasionally record something" meant there was no huge motivation for them to work their asses off to make a "Brian/Paley" Beach Boys album happen.

It's pretty sad that Brian and the BBs often were just in a "wrong place, wrong time" situation as far as wanting to work with each other. Landy pushed Brian into going solo when the BBs maybe would have had him. Then eventually Brian was talking post-Landy about wanting to do another BB album, and nobody (apart from Mike occasionally pointing out he wanted to write with Brian) was effusively and ardently pushing to do another "Pet Sounds" sort of deal where Brian does the whole thing with an outside writer and they just come in to do the vocals.

And *all* of this is separate from Brian touring. That's a whole other ball of wax. Brian indeed had less of a running track record for being hugely involved in live shows. Couple that with the live touring being the other guys' main (and kind of only) bread and butter, and you could imagine how they'd rather just go on autopilot and keep doing the same boring 28-song, 90-minute setlist instead of re-doing the whole show to change the setlist and have to actually work extra hard to integrate Brian into the shows.
5  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: Today at 10:14:06 AM
Interesting if nothing else that Amazon is locking down the reviews. They've done this on other products, usually things that have quickly sold out and thus see a bunch of reviews from people complaining that they didn't get it.
6  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 02:25:51 PM
https://www.allmusic.com/album/unleash-the-love-mw0003118014

As of yet, the only published review of Unleash the Love.

I'm surprised such a relatively scathing review still resulted in even 2 1/2 out of five stars.
7  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 01:16:56 PM
Once you get past the autotune and shitty production, the music is really good.

I'm not sure this is exactly the type of review Mike was hoping for.

I do feel like it's too easy to just dogpile on this new album. But even the most effusively positive reviews of this thing around the internet have like 27 qualifiers.

"I expected the worst, so I'm pleasantly slightly surprised...."

"Apart from the awful autotune....."

"Other than the poor production...."

"The cover versions (e.g. HALF the album) are pointless, but....."

"Mike sounds awful, but the guest vocalists are good...."
8  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The Beach Boys Touring Lineups on: November 17, 2017, 01:07:59 PM
One very minor update you can add to the top post: Phil Bardowell joined the touring band earlier than 1999. I know he was there in 1998 (he's on the May 1998 pro-shot video where Al is gone but Matt is still in the band).

I believe Bardowell actually joined at some point in 1997 while Carl was still in the band; I recall Bardowell doing interviews where he referred to playing with Carl.

Hey Jude, 'll definitely add that.  Thanks again.

When was Al's last concert with the touring band?


I believe he did one or two shows in 1998, mixed in with Mike's "California Beach Band" gigs. Al for sure did the May 9 American Cancer Society benefit in Detroit. I think there's one other possible January date in Carlsbad, CA that may or may not have been a "Beach Boys" show with Al.

I think the May 9 show in Detroit is probably his last gig.

I believe it was starting in July that Mike was able to get his (at the time) non-exclusive license and started touring again as "The Beach Boys."
9  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 11:22:26 AM
Not to my ears, I thought it was the best song on the whole set (well maybe a tie with Warmth of the Sun). The guitar solo on Wild Honey was really good too. It sounds out of place on the covers disc because it sounds that good.

That's pretty cool.   

Speaking of guitar solos, I'm really not a fan of the song, but each time I've seen Mike and Bruce (and once David) do Pisces Brothers, Scott Totten played a really good guitar solo.  Is there anything like that on the album version? 

Yeah, not sure if itís the same as what youíve heard in concert, but itís a tasteful solo during the middle eight.

Cool.   I'll definitely be interested to hear that.  For me the solo, in concert anyway, redeems the song.   Plus as a big fan of guitar based rock, there are relatively few moments in the BB universe for a nice solo. 

Not to get too off-topic, but what are your thoughts on Carl and the Passions? The main songs on there seem to be as rocking as those guys got (besides the amazing live at Knebworth album which feeds my ac/dc musical tastes).

"Lookin' at Tomorrow" from the 1983 tour is pretty hot; would love to have a soundboard of this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv77kR-l5mc

Whoa, that sounds phenomenal and so unexpected considering how chill the original is.

@KDS, I totally agree with you. I think had they shortened some songs, ditched some others that it wouldíve made a really powerful, but short, album. That guitar opening on a Mess Of Help is killer though, one of the coolest rock tunes Iíve heard.

I too prefer Holland, much more cohesive, and Steamboat is one of my favorites.

That "Lookin' at Tomorrow" performance is even more surprising considering the 1983 touring band wasn't exactly hard-rockin' or bluesy to begin with. I wish they would have done more 70s stuff with some nice organ work, because Mike Meros rarely got to show his chops.

For some reason, they were toying with a little hunk of the "Surf's Up" album during the 1983 tour, as "Disney Girls", "Lookin' at Tomorrow", and "Long Promised Road" all briefly dipped in and out of the setlist.
10  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: 1995 studio footage. Brian, Mike and Paley on: November 17, 2017, 11:19:36 AM
The raw footage is quite interesting, and weird.

For some reason, someone hired a freelance videographer to document Mike and Brian talking about possibly doing some stuff together? I'm curious who commissioned this.

Is the "studio" listening session more just staged for cameras? Didn't they have something more engaging to play back than a boring bass-and-drums backing track?

Mike seems to be meeting Mark Linett for the first time in this footage.

They all seem to be sitting around a bit aimlessly in the control room footage.
11  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 11:15:45 AM
A sort-of review of a recent show and the new album:

https://dailygazette.com/article/2017/11/15/proctors-filled-with-good-vibrations

The writer gets stuff wrong (Foskett is an official Beach Boys, and joined in 1972?). The title track from Mike's new album is deemed "sappy."
12  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 11:11:16 AM
Not to my ears, I thought it was the best song on the whole set (well maybe a tie with Warmth of the Sun). The guitar solo on Wild Honey was really good too. It sounds out of place on the covers disc because it sounds that good.

That's pretty cool.   

Speaking of guitar solos, I'm really not a fan of the song, but each time I've seen Mike and Bruce (and once David) do Pisces Brothers, Scott Totten played a really good guitar solo.  Is there anything like that on the album version? 

Yeah, not sure if itís the same as what youíve heard in concert, but itís a tasteful solo during the middle eight.

Cool.   I'll definitely be interested to hear that.  For me the solo, in concert anyway, redeems the song.   Plus as a big fan of guitar based rock, there are relatively few moments in the BB universe for a nice solo. 

Not to get too off-topic, but what are your thoughts on Carl and the Passions? The main songs on there seem to be as rocking as those guys got (besides the amazing live at Knebworth album which feeds my ac/dc musical tastes).

"Lookin' at Tomorrow" from the 1983 tour is pretty hot; would love to have a soundboard of this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv77kR-l5mc
13  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 10:46:59 AM
THIS. And also I love his passive aggressive negativity about Brianís potential autotune on The Right Time and then he makes this!? The hypocrisy is mindblowing to me.

I'm *sure* David Beard will do a follow-up interview with Mike regarding the new album where he takes Mike to task for his comments about autotune back in that 2015 interview. Right?.....
14  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 10:06:47 AM
Even this is a pallet cleanser (even with Mike miming the "gun shot" gesture on the "assassinations" line):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tRmBD1UnrA
15  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 09:59:33 AM
The audio mix of Mike's "Q&A" with Wink Martindale sounds more ballsy than these remakes.

So does this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RryIroTqs-k
16  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Paley Sessions Discussion Thread on: November 17, 2017, 09:57:29 AM
It appears Brian and Joe cut several "Paley" songs (backing tracks at least) during the "Imagination" sessions.

I think they often revisited the Paley *material*, but it appears they picked and chose which stuff would utilize elements of the original recordings versus re-recording from scratch.

Also, let's remember that Brian *re-cut* the lead to "You're Still a Mystery" in October of 1999. This is the lead vocal heard on the MIC set from 2013. I still haven't heard of a reason for why he did this (and it may well have had no particular reason beyond just messing around with the song), but it was done without Mark Linett (who apparently expressed surprise upon finding the new lead when compiling MIC), and was done *after* Brian and Joe split (presumably after the 1999 Japan dates and before or during the west coast tour in the Fall).

Presumably, Brian would have been doing this work with an eye towards releasing the song *solo*, as the "Beach Boys", such as they were at that moment, were heavily splintered. The idea that Brian would "Beach Boys" material solo is interesting in light of Joe Thomas's 2012 comments suggesting Brian and he (Joe) wrote stuff back in the 1997/98 that Brian earmarked specifically for the Beach Boys and refused to do solo (such as of course "That's Why God Made the Radio").
17  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 09:51:15 AM
Has anyone gone back, *after* listening to the new album, and tried the 90s stuff with Adrian Baker again? I'm thinking the "Salutes NASCAR" album might actually be easier on the ears than "Unleash the Love."

The "Looking Back with Love" album from 1981 sounds like a warm, organic festival of sound in comparison at this point.
18  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 09:39:41 AM
Oh my god... It's not like the "new" songs are bad, but the vocals... What happened to that Mike who wants to give a new take in the KTSA sessions video when some one syllable wasn't good enough? These songs sound like Mike woke up in a huge hangover and did the whole album on one take. Then some random dude threw the autotune on everything and pumped it to 110.

This has propably been discussed already, but why the hell there isn't a Kokomo remake on the second disc!?

Ironically, this "article" (I use that term loosely) suggests "Kokomo" is on the album, which I'm going to assume means the "author" didn't actually listen to the album:

https://parade.com/620133/stephaniestephens/the-beach-boys-mike-love-cmon-world-and-unleash-the-love/
19  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The Beach Boys Touring Lineups on: November 17, 2017, 06:39:50 AM
One very minor update you can add to the top post: Phil Bardowell joined the touring band earlier than 1999. I know he was there in 1998 (he's on the May 1998 pro-shot video where Al is gone but Matt is still in the band).

I believe Bardowell actually joined at some point in 1997 while Carl was still in the band; I recall Bardowell doing interviews where he referred to playing with Carl.
20  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Paley Sessions Discussion Thread on: November 17, 2017, 06:33:18 AM
But Carl never apparently nixed anything. It just kind of fizzled, which means I'm also not prepared to assume Carl wouldn't have been open to doing the material, perhaps re-recording some things, etc.

I agreed with the bulk of your post except this - The impression from published sources is that Carl did veto several projects during these years, centered around his concerns about Brian perhaps as much as the potential quality or success of the projects themselves. Maybe I'm mistaken but wasn't it Carl who was the catalyst behind scotching the idea of Pet Sounds live performances not just because he thought the music was too complex to play and sing but he also thought Brian wasn't able to perform it? Wasn't it Carl who was worried Brian would embarrass himself and the band if he sang too much at the Nashville Fan Fest gig? And wasn't it Carl who was behind the idea of bringing in a member of the High Llamas to "collaborate" with Brian in the wake of the Paley-Was sessions collapsing?

In each of those cases, and yes there is a fair amount of reading between the lines to be done, it feels like Carl's concerns were centered on his own issues with Brian, especially how he may have thought Brian wasn't able to do this stuff. The fact there is even a notion that Carl thought Brian might embarrass himself and the band if he performed live would seem to speak volumes on the dynamic. And it had to hurt Brian personally, and I'm guessing it did when he kept hearing "no" especially coming from his own brother.

It did seem to be Carl specifically balking at doing Soul Searchin, You're Still A Mystery, etc. to the point where he worked on the tracks but later decided he wasn't into them. That's kind of odd. But that was Carl's call.

And what can't be ignored is how a scant few years after all of these no votes from Carl, Brian was out on his own doing exactly what Carl wasn't supporting, including playing (and singing) Pet Sounds tracks on a live stage...to rave reviews. And releasing new music. And he's still out there doing it.

It makes me come back to the notion that there was personal stuff involved in this beyond just the music, and again suggesting maybe Carl was simply wrong on some of these points considering what did end up happening with both the band and Brian.

In terms of Carl not literally nixing something, I was only referring to the Paley recordings. He may have put up stronger direct opposition to other ideas like a "Pet Sounds" tour due to not feeling Brian was up to it. But I'm also not sure how ironclad of a project something like that late 90s PS tour was. Was it just an idea floated? It seemed to be enough of a plausible idea that at least Melinda and Al both separately discussed it and that Carl didn't want to do it.

But in terms of the Paley sessions, apart from Carl apparently walking from one earlier session (I believe prior to the session for "Soul Searchin" and "You're Still a Mystery" documented by Berryhill) due by all accounts to "non-musical" reasons, I don't see any evidence Carl refused the material or refused to do a session. So he may have kinda done more like what Mike did with C50, which was to essentially put the kibosh by simply not doing any *further* work as opposed to outright canceling sessions or saying "I refuse to work on this material."

As far as the idea that Carl may have eventually worked on the material, I think it would have simply been the same sort of attrition that often led to BB projects being finished. Sometimes projects would just have enough natural momentum to get finished even if not everyone was on the same page.

Certainly, it's possible that had Carl lived longer to see Brian be able to spearhead albums and tours, his position on a lot of these issues may have changed.
21  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 06:23:42 AM
Oh my god... It's not like the "new" songs are bad, but the vocals... What happened to that Mike who wants to give a new take in the KTSA sessions video when some one syllable wasn't good enough? These songs sound like Mike woke up in a huge hangover and did the whole album on one take. Then some random dude threw the autotune on everything and pumped it to 110.

This has propably been discussed already, but why the hell there isn't a Kokomo remake on the second disc!?

I weirdly hadn't thought of that! It is a bit odd that "Kokomo" wasn't among the remakes. Who knows, he may have recorded it and not put it on the album.

Though not as glaring of an omission, I'm surprised he didn't include the 2004 remake of "Everyone's In Love With You"; I recall Mike back circa 2004 even performing that new "arrangement" of the song in concert. Assuming one can get past the kind of dippy lyrics and sing-song nature of the song, that remake was surprisingly one of the palatable moments on those 2004 recordings.
22  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love - Unleash the Love - Due November 17 - w/ 2nd Disc of BB Remakes on: November 17, 2017, 06:19:42 AM
One of the only tracks out of the 25 that isn't drenched in autotune is "Cool Head, Warm Heart", which makes total sense as it sounds like it's one of the only tracks that was lifted more or less untouched from the circa 2004 recordings. It's the same "take" released on the 2006 Hallmark CD. I can't say for sure if it's literally the same mix, as I haven't A/B'ed the two.

But it's the same version, with the same lead vocal, etc. I can't even say with 100% certainty that "Cool Head" is absolutely free of autotune, but it's the only song that doesn't sound like "robo Mike."

I'm loathe to make a sweeping statement one day in to the release of an album, but "Unleash the Love" may just have the worst-sounding lead vocals ever released on any Beach Boys-related product. The autotune really is *that* bad.

It also sounds like there has been some speed adjustment to some of the songs. He sounds a bit like an autotune chipmunk on "Too Cruel."

A lot of the actual performances, while hard to discern too deeply under all that autotune, sound rather tired and breath-ey as well. Some are better than others. Again, not surprisingly, "Cool Head" being at least 13 years old sounds better than most of the others.
23  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Paley Sessions Discussion Thread on: November 16, 2017, 09:51:39 AM
There are alot of interesting observations  one could make about the previous comments.  My opinion is that   maybe Carl just didn't like the Andy Paley  material!  SIMPLE AS THAT . Ive heard it, and while there are  a few cool lines and melodies here  and there, Im not sure i get it either. To call it retro seems a bit of a stretch to me. The production is very raw plain and simple. And not in a good way. While i get the Wall of Sound implications, the arrangements to me do not sound like Brian at all. Just because you have a bunch of Baritone saxes in the mix doesn't mean its a wall of sound. When I listen to the clarinets in Imagination, or even the saxes in Blueberry Hill from 15 Big Ones, I believe i can hear the genius of BW!  Also, Am i the only one that can't picture  Carl singing the line" I was a Bum " and comparing it to the feeling he had singing "I may not always love you" ? Maybe im being paranoid but i keep hearing references to Stars and Stripes ( mostly jabs) Is there a joke here that im not in on? I grew up listening to country, In the late 90's my parents loved L Morgan, Willie Nelson etc. They wore out the Stars and Stripes CD. The arrangements on Warmth of the Sun and Caroline No were amazing! I can see Jimmy Webb and Brian working together in some studio and inspiring the heck out of each other. Im not getting that same feeling listening to the almost two hours of you tube renditions of the Paley sessions. Everyone should have their own opinion but based on the fact that the Paley material has been available to the public for quite awhile, and given the fact that i have NEVER heard Brian mention that he was anxious to get back into the studio with Paley  maybe Brian himself wasn't all that proud of the stuff either, and maybe he didn't push it. I agree that    Carl and Mike probably didn't like the material, and thought that Brian or they could do better. Stars and Strips much like 15 Big Ones could have been their way to slowly get Brian back in to the studio without putting too much pressure on him. Who wouldn't want to work with Jimmy Webb and Willie Nelson ?  I will say that i do not to this day get the name Stars and Stripes, although the CD  to me was a great idea if it had 5 or 6 remakes and a couple of new Brian Wilson Beach Boy songs.

Well, what we do know is that "Stars and Stripes" was a critical and commercial flop. Apart from what hardcore fans thought, the album wasn't well received and was in fact barely on anybody's radar.

Further, in general I think albums of artists covering themselves is just less creative and interesting.

On top of that, I think "Stars and Stripes" was pretty awful. Trite, synthetic 90s country with mostly forgettable and grating singers. The Willie Nelson track was okay (worth it just to get footage of Mike trying to correct Willie and then Willie blowing Mike off and doing it the way he wanted), Junior Brown at least brought some enthusiasm to the table. I guess Timothy B. Schmit's track was okay, and not coincidentally barely "country" at all. The rest of the stuff on the released album was forgettable and bland *at best.*

The band didn't need to get Brian comfortable with the studio (he had just recorded like 57 tracks with Andy Paley and had released TWO solo albums), and "crossing over" into country wasn't going to get them any closer to doing what fans wanted (whether that was Paley songs or just another good album written by Brian and/or the rest of the guys).

Had "Stars and Stripes Vol. 1" succeeded, what would have happened next? Undoubtedly "Stars and Stripes Vol. 2."

So yeah, when they had "Soul Searchin'" and "You're Still a Mystery" and "It's Not Easy Being Me" and "Gettin' in Over My Head" sitting in the vaults (to say nothing of the gazillion other tracks they had in the vault, "Don't Fight the Sea", etc.), it's pretty sad that they felt compelled to do *THIS* instead:

https://youtu.be/RHiExb2SYOw?t=27s
24  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Paley Sessions Discussion Thread on: November 16, 2017, 09:41:21 AM
Clearly there were mixed feelings at best about the Paley material from the other guys.

I also objectively don't think the stuff is uniformly amazing. But a good album could have been molded from the best of the lot. Keep in mind there are some Brian/Andy songs we've likely never heard that may have been part of that whole cache of material.

But the problem is that everybody else in the band was either offering up bad idea or no ideas at all. If history indicated that Carl had an album's worth of songs that he was pointing to that he felt they could work on instead, then his *subjective* feelings about the Paley material would have more pull. Whereas, with Mike, he had a clear running track record of one fluke hit followed by massive failure.

It's not as if everybody in the band had previously had to sign off on *loving* every song on every previous album. Dennis clearly hated MIU. I somehow doubt Mike found "Love Surrounds Me" to be his cup of tea. I'd certainly hope Carl and Al knew the SIP material wasn't really amounting to greatness.

Some have pointed out that one of the only specifics (to some degree anyway) we have on Carl's take on the material was that he didn't like the *backing track* that Don Was had made for "Soul Searchin'." This Don Was backing track has never circulated, so none of us have ever heard it.

So Carl may have had more nitpicky, production-oriented issues with the song. But even on that front, nobody else in the band was really in a strong position to tell Don Was, who was an active, working, successful producer, that his stuff sucked.

But Carl never apparently nixed anything. It just kind of fizzled, which means I'm also not prepared to assume Carl wouldn't have been open to doing the material, perhaps re-recording some things, etc.
25  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson - 2018 Tour Thread on: November 16, 2017, 07:26:47 AM
I've said it before; Brian is unlikely to tour a full album outside of PS or "Smile", and even less likely to venture outside of the 60s where other members wrote and sang their own stuff.

I just don't see Brian (even with a backing guy singing it) doing "Tears in the Morning."

"Wild Honey" seems more likely than others, as it's at least mostly Brian-penned material.

As I've already mentioned as well, I really don't need to see any more albums performed in full. A wide-ranging, interesting setlist is just fine.
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