gfxgfx
 
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
logo
 
gfx gfx
gfx
645499 Posts in 25815 Topics by 3678 Members - Latest Member: busydoinnothin April 18, 2019, 07:38:26 PM
*
gfx*HomeHelpSearchCalendarLoginRegistergfx
  Show Posts
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 ... 329
1  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson: Long Promised Road (2019 Brent Wilson Documentary) on: April 16, 2019, 10:41:13 AM
Obviously, first and foremost, I'd like to see a "Beatles Anthology" style multi-part BB documentary covering everything.

So would I, but I don't think there are enough lawyers in the world to deal with the mess that would ensue - too many sides to too many stories.  The Beatles had the advantage of far more documentation over the years so that facts could be confirmed.

I am quite excited at the thought of Brian singing these lyrics, with his band on the backing:

"Hit hard at the battle that confronted me, yeah
Knocked down all the roadblocks stumbling me
Throw off all the shackles that were binding me down"

And remember, we don't know the genesis of the song.  Brian could have been around when Carl was working on it, or maybe Carl's inspiration came from conversation with Brian.


As with the Beatles Anthology, the idea with a similar BB doc would be that it would be authorized and have BRI involved as a producer, as was the case with "Endless Harmony." The downside of course is that you rarely get the most warts-and-all information. The plus side would be easier access to some archival elements and *some* publishing clearances, more clout from BRI in approaching a partner (e.g. Netflix, HBO, etc.) to finance and air the documentary, and full access to interview the members at length. They could also of course contribute photos, film/video, audio, etc. from their personal archives.

As far as legal issues with entities/people outside of the band, BRI and/or the producing partner would vet all of that through legal.

Somebody should get some prime movers and shakers in the movie and film industry to pitch a long-form BB doc to somebody like Netflix or HBO or Amazon, all of whom are throwing TONS of money at programming right now. One of the biggest costs would be clearing rights to film/video footage (e.g. TV shows, etc.), and paying for sync rights to music outside of the stuff the band owns the publishing for (meaning most of the 60s material).
2  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Interesting anecdote about Beach Boys '71 tour on: April 12, 2019, 08:03:46 AM
As I recall, there's a really murky audience recording from the Seattle 1970 show with Brian where he sings stuff like "Do It Again."

There's an equally murky recording of a 1990 Ontario show where Mike is out and Al sings Mike's leads. Would love to have a good-sounding version of that one.
3  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Why does spotify keep screwing with the Beach Boys material? on: April 11, 2019, 06:55:58 AM
Unless someone here has worked on the IT/back end at Spotify, it's probably impossible to know exactly why some tracks or albums are messed up in one way or another.

I know there are fans who own all of the albums who also simply like to use Spotify or other services.

But for anyone who *doesn't* actually own all the albums, the occasionally (or often) wonky elements of these streaming services is the perfect reason to actually snag physical (or digital) copies of all the albums and rip to a portable or other device (or actually listen to the CD itself, crazy as it sounds!).

This isn't an "embrace old technology, not new!" rant, this is more of a "streaming services can't be relied upon in perpetuity, so if you actually like the Beach Boys, make sure you own all the albums and then you'll never have to worry" sort of situation.
4  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson - 2019 Tour Thread on: April 11, 2019, 06:51:00 AM
Regarding the shows notated as including an orchestra, it seems pretty self-explanatory. For those particular gigs, a local orchestra will be a part of the show. They're not on retainer as if they're tagging along on the whole tour. It's just a local orchestra added to the show.

I would imagine the BW tour operation still has all the charts from the 2000 PS symphonic shows, and in isolated cases where a local venue/promoter wants to integrate a full orchestra into the show, they can accommodate that.

The only thing I'm not sure about is if the orchestra will only play during the PS set, or during the entire show. I would guess mostly just the PS set, and then maybe a few other bits (I honestly can't remember where the orchestra came in on those 2000 PS shows beyond PS itself and the opening overture bit; the 2000 show I saw was one of the rare ones without an orchestra, and I actually thought PS sounded better without the orchestra honestly).
5  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Al Jardine - 2018/2019 Tour Thread - Postcards Storytellers Tour (& Other Dates) on: April 10, 2019, 06:17:28 AM
Added five upcoming shows for 2019. This includes the Rochester HOF induction ceremony (which will presumably feature a short set), two more "Postcards" Storytellers shows, and two "Family & Friends" gigs that he just announced for July that presumably feature a "reunion" of the 1998-2003-ish "Family & Friends" band including Carnie and Wendy Wilson. These shows would, I presume, include a full backline of musicians as well.
6  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thrasher Magazine Reviews The Beach Boys' July 13, 1982 Concert on: April 08, 2019, 01:59:13 PM
I’m willing to cut reviewers of the era plenty of slack; the idea of “rock stars” heading into their 40s still playing arenas and stadiums and amphitheaters was pretty new. The previous era of performer from the 50s and back, especially of the “rock and roll” era, were playing packaged oldies shows and low-tier gigs in Vegas/Reno, etc. around that time.

And some acts were doing a better job than others of proving that they could still do it. The Beach Boys in 1981/82 were not the best “reference quality” material for proving that aging rockers could still perform well and be relevant. I mean, they were *doing* it, they were proving that, technically, *a* touring band could remain out there. But certainly, if, say, Carl hadn’t returned in 1982, I don’t think a Mike/Al/Bruce lineup would have survived into the late 90s, at least not in the same iteration.

Once Carl returned, and then into the mid-late 90s, the Beach Boys proved, I guess, that they could be a well-oiled professional presentation. But, with some specific and short-term exceptions, they weren’t challenging themselves and were defaulting to the easiest, most lucrative option.

The era of the Beach Boys’ live show *consistently* being true art ended around 1975, and then made a quick return in 2012.

To be very clear, I very much enjoy all those in between years. I bow to nobody in my weird admiration for the 1980 tour lineup. I bow to few in my head knowledge of weird setlist picks and familiarity with every era of the touring band. I’ve listened to more 1996 concerts than anybody probably should.
7  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thrasher Magazine Reviews The Beach Boys' July 13, 1982 Concert on: April 08, 2019, 01:13:50 PM
To be clear, the Beach Boys in 1981/82 often sounded pretty shambolic. By the time of this Concord Pavilion review, Carl was back in the lineup. The shows did improve upon Carl’s return (not only due to Carl being there, but his supposed insistence on more rehearsal, and supposed insistence on changing up the setlist more), but even late 1982 (or 83 for that matter) was not peak Beach Boys.

I have no problem with reviews taking the live show to task; I think they often went on autopilot in the 80s and 90s. Sometimes they were still great, sometimes just okay. It wasn’t too often they were a 100% train wreck, but 1981/82 at times did veer in that direction.

The “Thrasher” review is amusing because it has little to do with rating the performance itself. Indeed, the reviewer actually seems to think this 1982 band is “just about the same” as the old days, and suggests their voices were *better* in 1982 than in the 60s. A clear indication (obviously) that the reviewer doesn’t care one bit about the Beach Boys’ music and isn’t paying attention much to it.

So it’s kind of cute and ironic that the most glaring justifiable criticism one could level against the 1982 band was *not* sounded in this review. Instead, they are annoyed the band’s management didn’t want to read a stack of issues of “Thrasher” nor grant an interview, and seem oddly confused as to why a then 20-plus-year-old band was servicing a middle-aged crowd.

Anybody from the Bay Area would have been well aware that Concord Pavilion is not a club venue for punk bands; it was a large outdoor amphitheater (my recollection is that, again ironically, the Beach Boys shot one of the “Summer in Paradise” promo videos at the Concord Pavilion a decade later) that would tend to host “mainstream” acts, catering not to 18-year-olds.
8  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thrasher Magazine Reviews The Beach Boys' July 13, 1982 Concert on: April 08, 2019, 06:34:27 AM
This pretty much shows how The Beach Boys were REALLY perceived at the time by the rock press. Sure, they were given polite lip service for the hit singles era, but this review sounds like what they actually thought of the BB, but would never have the balls to say out loud.

If you read the Rusten/Stebbins "In Concert" book, it was to the band's benefit that they largely *weren't* perceived at all by the rock press in that era. Hence they didn't get flak for awful decisions like playing Sun City in December 1981/January 1982, and went relatively unscathed doing wonky shows in 1981/82.

That being said, I wouldn't call the people writing for "Thrasher" in that era the "rock press." Sure, it sounds like they gained press credentials for their writers, but it's clear they didn't regularly review old, tired "classic rock/oldies" era bands, and the whole article was an exercise in finding something to make fun of.

I'm not even opposed to a witty, snarky lashing from a critic back in that era, when the band didn't deserve rave reviews and absolutely were phoning it in at times. This "Thrasher" review unfortunately wasn't it. I sense they would have given largely the same review to a tight-sounding 1975 era show or a relatively solid-sounding 1980 or 1993 show, etc. A large hunk of the review makes fun of the *audience* attending this 1982 BB show, and that middle aged, upper-middle class, baby boomer, Hawaiin-shirt clad demographic of BB fan only increased proportionately as the 80s wore on and into the 90s. It's funny how much this Thrasher article makes fun of a 1982 BB audience, as late 70s and early 80s BB audiences still had at least *some* in the audience that were more of the (vastly generalizing of course) hippy variety, Deadhead-type fans, the sort of fans that were going to Doobie Brothers gigs and that sort of thing.
9  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thrasher Magazine Reviews The Beach Boys' July 13, 1982 Concert on: April 04, 2019, 02:32:13 PM
I'd say Mike may have come out looking the coolest in that doctored photo.....
10  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thrasher Magazine Reviews The Beach Boys' July 13, 1982 Concert on: April 04, 2019, 01:22:12 PM
Ironically, while the gist of the article is that the band are old, bloated, and washed up, and clearly are not edgy and "punk" like other bands covered in the magazine, it's a bit ironic that a couple of the band members (and I don't say this proudly) could have probably snorted and drank under the table any of the punk bands appearing in the magazine.
11  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thrasher Magazine Reviews The Beach Boys' July 13, 1982 Concert on: April 04, 2019, 01:19:45 PM
If I didn't see the cover date and the photo used in the article, it would probably be hard to tell the precise date; the "review" of course doesn't address the musical chairs of the preceding year or two in the band.

But seriously, I'm trying to imagine someone with that much disdain going to a show. Disdain for the band and the audience. It's like, go see a show from a band you like!
12  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thrasher Magazine Reviews The Beach Boys' July 13, 1982 Concert on: April 04, 2019, 01:10:29 PM
This might be the audio of the reviewed show:


The Beach Boys Live In Concord 5/18/1981 Full Concert

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZKNRIKwjnw

The show reviewed is from the 1982 Concord show. I think that YouTube audio is from the 1981 show.

The issue is from October 1982, and it uses a 1982 band publicity photo taken after Carl's return in early-mid 1982.
13  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Thrasher Magazine Reviews The Beach Boys' July 13, 1982 Concert on: April 04, 2019, 12:31:09 PM
What a weird time capsule. Apparently Thrasher Magazine was running light on content for their October 1982 issue, and sent a skateboarding, punk-loving non-fan to a Summer 1982 Beach Boys show in Concord, CA. Ironically, while they have utter contempt for the band and the genre of music in general, they actually probably overly-praise the vocal performances, as 1982 was not exactly a peak for the band (though by this point Carl had returned).

14  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: How many of these 'unreleased' songs were complete and of LP quality? on: April 04, 2019, 07:06:16 AM
I would suggest snagging a subscription to Spotify, and/or checking for these tracks to listen to on YouTube, and you'll probably be able to hear most if not all of these tracks, and you can judge for yourself how enjoyable or interesting the tracks are, and how "finished' they sound to you.

To really get the full context for these tracks, it's best to snag CD (and/or digital) releases for these releases that include the liner notes that explain the tracks.

In general, I'd say once you get to the point of fandom where you're interested in unreleased tracks, then all of these releases (and others missing on your list like all of the yearly "Copyright Extension" releases, the Pet Sounds Sessions box, the Smile Sessions box, etc.) are worth picking up.
15  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: BB albums sabotaged by one song on: March 29, 2019, 06:14:26 AM
I mean, the '79 "Here Comes the Night" isn't literally the worst thing they ever released, and it is arguably the most harmony-intensive overtly "disco" song ever released.

But beyond all the obvious reasons it was a clunker (out of step with the BB style, too late for the peak "disco" era to be a hit, etc.), it's also not much of  *Beach Boys* song. Bruce and Curt Becher and their guys did most of the tracking and vocals, and then Mike, Carl, and Al supposedly came in and added one final layer.

I never realized that Curt and other non-BBs sang on that track.
Is it mainly the "dits" and the like?


I'm guessing during some other era of the band's career when they weren't floundering and desperate to not *completely* blow the new CBS deal and accompanying payday, maybe they would have told Bruce to toss out the 37-minute disco track. But they needed to not piss off CBS even more, they needed an album done, Brian was out of it, and Bruce was left semi-in-charge. Why they didn't just pull a third "Bambu" era song or something, I dunno.

Listen to "Full Sail." *That's* Bruce taking on his most effective latter-day role within the band, as a facilitator to getting stuff done and adding nice clean layers of backing vocals.

It's interesting, because the LA Light Album does have a backing vocal harmony sound that is pretty unique, and while I can tell that the album's backing vocals don't quite sound like other BBs albums (presumably because it's the only time that mainly Bruce and Carl did most of those vocals), I nevertheless can't really say that I can ID Bruce/Carl's voices in the backing vox and say "that's clearly a wall of Bruces/Carls" in the way that it's much more obvious when it's a wall of Brians on songs like Transcendental Meditation, or the Don't Talk unused intro.

Would be super duper interesting if backing vocals-only mixes could get created from this era. I hope we don't have to wait another decade for that to happen!

Regarding "Here Comes the Night", I don't know how much research/digging has taken place or AFM sheets uncovered in more recent years. C-man and others may have some newer info. But the "story" I recall from past years is that Bruce and Becher and their guys did the track, and then the Beach Boys (minus Brian and Dennis) came in mainly to add Carl's lead parts, Mike's lead/bass parts, and maybe one extra layer of backing vocals.

If you listen to the song, the backing vocals do seem to have that late 70s/early 80s anonymous sort of "Looking Back with Love"-sounding backing vocals.

On Bruce's backing vocals on the "LA" album, I'd say he's by far most prominent on "Full Sail." In fact, while Carl (and presumably Mike a bit based on extant documentation) are also on those backing vocals, they sound very much like stacks of Bruce. I think Carl might be a bit more noticeable on the wordless "aaaaah" sort of backing vocals, while the "Fuuuulllll Saiiilllll" backing vocals sound like a lot of Bruce, to the point where if we didn't have documentation that Carl and Mike are on it, I'd totally believe it's entirely Bruce.
16  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: BB albums sabotaged by one song on: March 28, 2019, 01:25:07 PM
I mean, the '79 "Here Comes the Night" isn't literally the worst thing they ever released, and it is arguably the most harmony-intensive overtly "disco" song ever released.

But beyond all the obvious reasons it was a clunker (out of step with the BB style, too late for the peak "disco" era to be a hit, etc.), it's also not much of  *Beach Boys* song. Bruce and Curt Becher and their guys did most of the tracking and vocals, and then Mike, Carl, and Al supposedly came in and added one final layer.

I'm guessing during some other era of the band's career when they weren't floundering and desperate to not *completely* blow the new CBS deal and accompanying payday, maybe they would have told Bruce to toss out the 37-minute disco track. But they needed to not piss off CBS even more, they needed an album done, Brian was out of it, and Bruce was left semi-in-charge. Why they didn't just pull a third "Bambu" era song or something, I dunno.

Listen to "Full Sail." *That's* Bruce taking on his most effective latter-day role within the band, as a facilitator to getting stuff done and adding nice clean layers of backing vocals.
17  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The 'Caribou' Album (1973-1975) Compilation Mix on: March 28, 2019, 01:17:40 PM
I dunno, while again I think it's always fun to throw out theories, trying to formulate a 1975 BB album is sort of like trying to figure out what a 2004 "Beach Boys" album would have been like by cobbling together Brian tracks from "Gettin' in Over My Head", Mike's 2004 solo material, a couple Paley tracks, some Al demos, and so on. In both cases, it's not reflective in any way of what an album would have sounded like.

We just don't have enough recorded material to do anything but a compilation of scraps that circulate from the era. This is due both to some extant tapes not circulating, and also because the band never undertook a full-blown recording of an album during that time. Like most any era of the band, especially in the 70s and 80s, they were always recording something somewhere. There's enough post-KTSA, pre-BB'85 material to cobble together a "1983 album" too, but it wouldn't at all reflect an actual album that would have been released.

So for stuff like a "1975 album", you end up with a nearly Mike-less album. Even "Love You" featured Mike more prominently.
18  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: BB albums sabotaged by one song on: March 28, 2019, 01:10:21 PM
There's nothing different about the CD compared to the vinyl, beyond the difference between any CD and vinyl version of an album, and between any alternate masterings of an album.

Certainly, especially if one has been listening to thrashed vinyl, a nice clean CD will sound better, and can offer an opportunity for reexamination.

The only actual difference I can think of on "LA (Light Album)" is that the 2000 "MIU/LA" two-fer CD from Capitol featured a new mastering for "LA" that included *longer* fades on the songs compared to the old 1990 Sony/CBS CD or the original 1979 releases.
19  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson: Long Promised Road (2019 Brent Wilson Documentary) on: March 27, 2019, 02:47:28 PM
Or, those two things are nothing alike in any way, shape, or form.

We now know Brian recorded the song for the documentary. The song and the film's title (remember, BriMel and Jean Sievers are producers, so they presumably would have a say in the film's title) clearly mean something to Brian. This isn't like some third party confused non-fan directing a film with no involvement from anybody related to Brian or the Beach Boys.
20  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thread for various insignificant questions that don't deserve their own thread! on: March 27, 2019, 02:43:21 PM
While any Mike/Bruce dates *could* be bought off/rescheduled/rebooked, etc. in the event of a reunion tour, shows being booked into next year certainly makes it even less likely any reunion would be in the offing for that same year.

I do recall that at least one "symphonic" Mike/Bruce date for 2012 was nixed once the reunion started.

Mike and Bruce *did* play at least one private/charity gig in April 2012 *right* before the reunion tour started. A relatively little known tidbit is that Al sat in for that show, making it one of only three or so times that Al has played with the "Mike & Bruce" version of the band after his departure in 1998. (The other instances being that Reagan gig in early 2011, and the "Ella" thing in early 2014).
21  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson: Long Promised Road (2019 Brent Wilson Documentary) on: March 27, 2019, 11:56:06 AM
Back to the documentary, while it'll likely never happen, it would be interesting to see the same team of Jason Fine and Brent Wilson do a Mike Love documentary next. I'm not trying to be funny; Jason Fine seemed to be able to strike up a good back and forth with Mike on his 2012 C50 article for Rolling Stone.

I recall Mike mentioning a few years back he wanted to do a documentary on himself and/or was looking into it, so I think a Mike-focused doc is possible, but I would imagine he'd use his own people.

Obviously, first and foremost, I'd like to see a "Beatles Anthology" style multi-part BB documentary covering everything.
22  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson: Long Promised Road (2019 Brent Wilson Documentary) on: March 27, 2019, 11:45:52 AM
Brian has used all sorts of techniques through the years. But I do think there's a difference between altering the speed of a recording (e.g. "Caroline, No", the single mix of "It's OK", etc.), and using a synthesizer or digital plug-in to take a flat or sharp note and "fix" it.

I'm not saying the latter is problematic, and I think many years ago the idea/debate regarding "authenticity" of the vocal was sort of dropped; it isn't really about that anymore. When it truly is done in a sort of spot-checking fashion, it's not obtrusive at all. But the deal where an entire vocal is run though intensive autotune from beginning to end (TWGMTR, C50 live albums, Mike's last two solo albums) is where it becomes grating, not even so much because it's a way to "cheat" at singing or anything; it just *sounds awful.* When a vocal starts sounding robotic, or sounds so synthetic that people debate whether it's being run through an old school vocoder, *that's* when it's problematic.
23  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson: Long Promised Road (2019 Brent Wilson Documentary) on: March 27, 2019, 11:25:01 AM
Regarding pitch correction and other forms of vocal engineering work, I'd say there has been some level of electronic pitch/vocal stacking help happening since probably the BB '85 album, and then on to the '88 BW album and into the 90s. Varying degrees at varying points, depending on the era, the technology, the ethos of the production at hand, which engineers and producers were working on the project, etc.

Check out this thread from an engineer on "Orange Crate Art":

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/so-much-gear-so-little-time/25857-brian-sandbox-wilson-tonite-show.html#post252354

On "Orange Crate Art", in addition to recording multiple takes and comping/punching-in (which is of course *not* a pitch-altering task and has been done for many, many years), they also ran his vocals through a synthesizer (folks on this board suggested a Fairlight or Synclavier was most likely) to correct the pitch on segments. They essentially used a pre-autotune, pre-DAW form of electronic/digital pitch correction all the way back then.

I'm thinking something similar was done to varying degrees on the BW '88 album and possibly the BB '85 album.

I think some form of pitch correction was used on later Brian projects, and prior to TWGMTR was done with skill and restraint and subtlety. I've always guessed some of those long, held notes on something like "Midnight's Another Day" had some digital help to hold those strong, high notes out so smoothly. Stuff like that. 
24  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: BBs members sharing outfits on: March 27, 2019, 10:57:49 AM
Re: Al on the crate; I figure Al was plenty used to it. They actually had a functional reason for doing this during vocal sessions:



I've never heard he had any complex about his height, which I've always found refreshing.

Re: Carl and his outfit and glove, the only thing I can think of is that it's some sort of get-up for driving or something. Did Carl ride motorcycles a lot by this era in 1977?

Here's another 1977 shot with Carl wearing the same thing:



Here's are a few 1976 or 77 shots with Carl wearing the same type of suit, only a different color:











Another photo shoot:





Back to the lighter color one, this time in what appears to be a rehearsal:



And more shots back from that same '77 photo shoot:





25  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian Wilson: Long Promised Road (2019 Brent Wilson Documentary) on: March 27, 2019, 06:57:39 AM
It will indeed be interesting to see if they compile a "soundtrack" to the documentary. It of course could simply be the new recording of LPR (possibly a few other new things) mixed with back catalog Brian solo tracks.

But it would certainly be a great opportunity to do a full disc (or two!) of unreleased Brian stuff. It would be great for them to go back all the way to the 70s and even late 60s, but supposedly this doc focuses on Brian's last 20 years as a solo artist, so I'm not sure what sort of unreleased stuff they'd pull out. He certainly has plenty of unreleased material from the last 20-25 years. There's the Beck stuff, other NPP outtakes, perhaps those TWGMTR album outtakes, and other hunks of sessions going back to the 2000s and late 90s. If they wanted to backdate a bit before the 1998 era, they could indeed work in more 90s Paley material.
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 ... 329
gfx
Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Page created in 0.221 seconds with 21 queries.
Helios Multi design by Bloc
gfx
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!