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634396 Posts in 25385 Topics by 3612 Members - Latest Member: mikeloveSTL July 15, 2018, 06:08:46 PM
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1  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: So what did we all do today? on: Yesterday at 09:14:37 AM
I went for a walk on my typical route to the nearest lake, only to see one or more races (there were runners, there were bicyclists) blocking my path. I rerouted toward a nearby creek, only to see my reroute blocked by the bicyclists again. I rererouted. It was moderately annoying, in that the lakes and creeks are substantially more pleasant than residential and commercial streets.
2  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Be Here In The Mornin' Question on: July 13, 2018, 08:38:08 AM
I just want to say that I am amazed at how much the boys can sound alike. I remember when I discovered that there are 3 different lead vocals on I know There's an Answer. I can definitely tell, now that I know, but never would have guessed. I probably picked up on Mike at the beginning with Brian on the higher Parts, but Al in there so seamlessly is amazing. Be Here In the Morning is another as well as many others. To my ears, Al sounds more like Brian than even Carl. They switch leads on Take a Load Off Your Feet and California Saga so seamlessly. Compare the lead vocals of Help Me Rhonda and Wouldn't it Be Nice! Also, I know Brian sings Winter Symphony, yet at times I swear it's Al!

Absolutely agree. And while it seems understandable enough that the brothers might sound similar, as you said sometimes it's Al, or Bruce, or even Mike who is sounding like one another or like a Wilson. Then when you add that they not only sound similar, but are often doubling one another or trading lines, it becomes almost an unsolvable puzzle sometimes.
3  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 13, 2018, 08:09:41 AM
Too bad he didn't shower.
4  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: New Politics Thread 2018 on: July 13, 2018, 07:34:58 AM
Here's what I posted at PSF after reading of his performance in the UK.

I guess our friends in the UK should have rolled out a glowing orb for the president. Perhaps then he'd have been sufficiently distracted so as to avoid speaking about things he doesn't understand (i.e., everything beyond the fun of looking at glowing orbs). Up next in Helsinki, he'll finally get to have a good time talking to the fella on the other end of our true "special relationship." I can see the glimmer of lust in the president's eyes as he first glimpses a shirtless Putin.

"Did you see what I said, Vlad?" he'll seek approval like the child he is, mentally. "I said May was ruining Brexit, was mean to the Muslim mayor, and said Johnson would make a good prime minister. I zinged 'em. Did you see it?"

The faux quote, of course, has been edited for coherence. His actual statement would presumably be something more like:

"Vlad, guys like us, uh, we strongly with, ahhhh, talking on, and a lot of people are noticing, I say to the guy, I say, um, the uh, lady isn't doing the, what's the thing, a lot of people are on my side with this one, very smart people and more and more every day, she's not, and here you've got the guy who's one of those, the banned ones, the names they have, it's not American and so a lot of people, you know, they are not so ... Boris, is this guy Russian? I said to Miller, I said, is this guy Russian or what? He'd be, I think, and many smart people are agreeing with me and they're saying, Donald, you are really on to something, that he could make a good, uh, a better, than that lady. Get 'er outta there! I was very strong in this. I can, you know, a lot of people, it's hugely the way I'm, um..." [at which point shirtless Putin patted him on the head and gave him a piece of well done steak with ketchup, which the president happily gobbled up].
5  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: What are you watching now?/Favourite Movie of the Moment on: July 11, 2018, 04:59:26 PM
A couple weeks ago, I began watching Game of Thrones. I'd only ever seen a few minutes of one episode before (not having HBO or caring to look into the show), but after so many people saying it was worth the effort, I did eventually, finally give it a shot. I'm well into season two at the moment. I must say, it is pretty good, even though I'm generally lukewarm on "knights-and-dragons" kinds of stories. But I wonder whether I'll still be interested after three, four, five, six, however many seasons.

I just got notification that Hulu has season two of Harlots online now, as well. I thought that was a very good show, and will get around to S2 sooner or later.
6  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 11, 2018, 04:36:32 PM
I'm afraid the most likely answer as to "what's really left" is the morbid one. The profile will be raised again when someone, and especially Brian, dies. That's when another trove will be released, the major outlets will celebrate the legacy, etc.
7  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 04:29:22 PM
I  just want to hear this unreleased stuff! I don't care if others hear it and either love it or hate it...I just want to hear all of it, every last second, every drum, every guitar, every fart, doesn't matter.

Ditto. Minus maybe some of the farts.
8  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 03:42:38 PM
And applying some deliberately simple-minded logic to ask a question:

If it were as inexpensive and as easy to open the vaults for fans to buy and access via an online download "shop" as is being suggested, wouldn't it have been done already?

Maybe the questions should be why hasn't it been done already even after it was proposed and planned roughly 15 years ago? What all is preventing it from actually happening?

Feel free to tell us.
9  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 02:22:27 PM
I'll agree to disagree but you guys just didn't seem to get what I was saying.

No doubt there are things in those vaults for the hardcore fans.

But I ask this in all seriousness...Where is the market right now in terms of projected hard sales numbers and potential buyers for material dating from the period of albums which are at this point mostly unknown even though they've been reissued on CD a few times over? So Tough, Holland, Surf's Up...in the US these albums outside the kind of people that read these boards are not exactly sales powerhouses, and I don't say that as a commentary on the albums or the reasons why, but it's feeling like the hard truth at this point.

So a marketing pitch to release *demos* from an era where there is all but an ignorance of the albums that were released, as some seem to want, and demos that sound scratchy and low fi and full of wow and flutter at that...how is that a game changer for the band?

People want what's familiar.

I'm saying if you bank on the familiar to *prime the pump* for more to come, you stand a better chance of generating interest with that over releasing "The Bedroom Tapes" or whatever misnomer was applied to that non-existent collection.

That "Brother Rarities" material? Yes, some is stunningly terrific. Some is crap that only completists would want. Should it come out? I say a resounding yes. But I'd also say more of it needs to be trimmed off those original lists because it simply isn't that good.

But there are things in the vaults that ARE that good.

But you cannot expect fans who either don't own, don't like, or don't know "Carl And The Passions" to buy demos and outtakes from that or various alt mixes from 15 Big Ones if they don't even have a familiarity or a fondness for with the actual released material.

The best way to introduce this stuff is to start with the familiar music - almost to a fault.

Would people listen to the California Girls complete sessions? I think a lot would buy it to hear them once...and isn't that the idea? As long as they buy it.

Then see how many people would buy demos from 71-76 and beyond in comparison.

Live shows from that 70's era? Completely different situation all around. Different marketing too. A much easier sell.

And yes...the plans for an online "shop" of vault material was on the books around the early to mid 2000's, in fact if I recall they had a domain purchased for it. It still hasn't happened.



Speaking only for myself, I was in agreement with HeyJude not because of any real business plan, but based on what I want to hear most. (And I was just pointing out that it could be released for nothing, which is a bonus.) I wasn't saying that was the best plan for the band's success. Most of what you're talking about has to do with what you think would be the best for the band, for its reputation, for its popularity.

So, no, I "cannot expect fans who either don't own, don't like, or don't know "Carl And The Passions" to buy demos and outtakes from that or various alt mixes from 15 Big Ones if they don't even have a familiarity or a fondness for with the actual released material." But my response, anyway, has nothing to do with them. It was coming from a proper, luthercentric universe.
10  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The cancelled bonus disc for Made in California on: July 06, 2018, 12:13:01 PM
HeyJude, I agree with you completely. I'd personally rather--by far rather--have first-time issuing of still unreleased songs than sessions. (I'm fine with more sessions, too: they're interesting. But I don't listen to them for fun or repeatedly.)

Considering the virtual lack of cost associated with digital-only releases, it's absurd they haven't at least done that. The big box sets are great, but they don't have to go that route. The pure profit they could make off of online sales ... it's crazy they haven't taken advantage, even if they might only move a few thousand copies.
11  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: Pet Peeves on: July 06, 2018, 12:06:07 PM
Take care of yourself, Billy.

On a totally different note (but relevant to the thread), I really dislike the hyperbole-clickbait style of YouTube video titles, as well as headlines in some publications. For example, I enjoy watching debates on YouTube. But so many of them have titles like "[Person A] CRUSHES libtard [Person B]," or "Conservative DESTROYED IN FIVE MINUTES!" or whatever. Right now in my recommended videos is "Atheist Dan Barker Mutilates The Christian."

It's as if the typical YouTube commenter--which is to say, a hyperbolic idiot--titles them all.
12  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: Pet Peeves on: July 06, 2018, 10:25:21 AM
I don't know about being proud of my state, or thinking it's the best. I think it's good. I enjoy it a lot. But proud? Not exactly proud. And best, I don't get into ranking things (at least not seriously--just for silly purposes like "best songs" polls that don't count for anything). I've said many times, I've liked most everywhere I've been to some extent. The "grass isn't always greener," but there's usually plenty of green grass.

As for "do we believe that this poster thinks with concern for random people's welfare they never met?" I would absolutely hope so. If we can't have concern for other people, including people we've never met, we are simply animals, nothing more. It is exactly that kind of emotional imagination that raises us to the level of humanity. That doesn't mean we can't enjoy the good in our environments, but if we only do that, and if we don't show concern for the less fortunate, we don't deserve the good things in our lives anyway.
13  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: Pet Peeves on: July 05, 2018, 05:26:54 PM
California has the highest percentage of homeless population in the country, and is in the lower quartile of states for worst poverty rate, for example. As places like San Francisco and Silicon Valley in general become heaven for some, most are completely priced out of existence. Sure, it is--or at least its coastal cities are--a great place to be rich. But ask the homeless guy or the farm laborer (in what would be a desert--and has the sun of one--if not for irrigation) how luxurious it is.

It's a gigantic land mass. There are wonders everywhere, grand and subtle. There are problems everywhere, grand and subtle. To idealize is to blunder.
14  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: The What Are You Reading? Thread on: July 04, 2018, 11:05:19 AM
I might check out Singer's work, as I find stories about extended families particularly fascinating.

I can't recommend him highly enough. The Manor reminds me of great Tolstoy works in some ways, but where a Tolstoy or Dostoevsky often seems to be talking about grand affairs, somehow Singer usually comes across as about humble, everyday life ... which somehow feels even more grand and epic for it.
15  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: Pet Peeves on: July 04, 2018, 11:00:23 AM
I could not agree more. All arts, even if intended to be honest, are always through some lens that is either an intentional fiction (like 99% of all movies and TV) or a documentary, which still tends to be intended to show a perspective, or even if not, does so anyway.

Even nonfiction is fiction to some extent. If your concept of anywhere comes from fiction, you need to keep a very low degree of confidence in the accuracy of your concept.
16  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: The What Are You Reading? Thread on: July 04, 2018, 08:06:44 AM
I just picked up a used copy of Nietzsche's "Human, All Too Human." Haven't begun it yet, though, because:

I'm currently midway through Isaac Bashevis Singer's "The Manor," the first in a two-volume set along with "The Estate," which I picked up at the same time as the above. It's a big, sprawling family (or set of families) drama set in late 19th century Poland. As usual with Singer, I'm loving it. I know I mention his books pretty often, and unfortunately I'm almost done with his catalogue, so I won't be able to do it much more. But he really has been--along with Dostoevsky and Knut Hamsun--maybe my favorite author.

Simultaneously I'm working through the easy-to-read "A Brief History of Thought" by Luc Ferry on recommendation and the more challenging, but more interesting, A History of Christian Thought by Paul Tillich. (I might have mentioned the latter before, as I picked it up a couple months ago. But I've interrupted myself on it a couple times for other books in the interim.)
17  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: Pet Peeves on: July 04, 2018, 07:56:55 AM
You definitely should not consider what you see in American films to be an accurate portrayal of American life. Regardless of all the comments about the behavior itself--which would be considered at least slightly rude in my experience, as well--you should not conflate films with real American life or you'll be misled.
18  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: So what did we all do today? on: June 23, 2018, 12:38:24 PM
For anyone to take a single example of a person not recognizing a single work of art as “a symptom of “the anti-intellectualism growing in this country” is ridiculous! Anyone at any time could easily not know any single reference to art, however famous! (Since the guy was from Ireland, I’d wonder what country the New Yorker commenter had in mind, too. Calling out an Irish person’s failure as evidence of American anti-intellectualism?)

But as a fellow “flyover country” resident, I know what you mean about getting tired of the attitude. However I think the worst response is acknowledging the stupidity of the concept, much less being defensive about it, as unfortunately some people and publications try to be. It doesn’t take much thinking to recognize the contributions of people from everywhere. My state? Oh, not much, just F Scott Fitzgerald, Sinclair Lewis, Bob Dylan, the Replacements, Prince, Eugene McCarthy, Walter Mondale, Hubert Humphrey, Leif Enger, to name a few. And your Louisiana!? Too many to count. The pages of the New Yorker would be substantially less valuable without contributions from “flyover country.”

People ought not conflate being the center of the cultural BUSINESS world with being the generator of culture.
19  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: What are you watching now?/Favourite Movie of the Moment on: June 17, 2018, 03:23:47 PM
I just heard of and began watching The Man in the High Castle, which is on Amazon. It is based on a novel by Philip K Dick (which I have not read or heard of) in which the Axis won WWII and so the US was divided between Nazi Germany (East Coast and Midwest) and Japan (West Coast), with a neutral territory in the Rockies. The storyline begins in the early '60s.

After just over one episode, I'm really enjoying it. There are two seasons. I'm not sure whether it's ongoing or that's all there is. But based on just that first 75 minutes or so that I've seen, I highly recommend it.
20  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: NBA 2017 Topic on: June 17, 2018, 08:35:24 AM
Lebron: I think Cleveland and LAL are the most likely scenarios.

  • Philadelphia was a sexy pick for a while, but I think for the good of the future of the franchise, they shouldn't go that route. Ben Simmons is a ball-dominant, generally non-shooter. Adding the equally (more?) ball-dominant Lebron James doesn't make a lot of sense, and while Lebron has become a pretty good shooter, he's far too good a creator to use off the ball in a spot-up shooting role or something.
  • Boston is a sexy pick in some circles now. This makes a lot more sense for some reasons, especially in that they have what it would take to work out a trade that Cleveland would find attractive (if Lebron were willing to do it as a sign-and-trade or opt in first). You could send Gordon Hayward, Terry Rozier, and a pick; or maybe move Jaylen Brown. You could even (hilariously) send Kyrie, Marcus Morris, and Brown. Whatever: Boston has a lot of options. And Lebron would be REALLY interesting in that almost positionless, ball-movement offense full of creators. And speaking of...
  • Golden State. Nope. They simply don't have the money, so unless it's done as a trade it is impossible. And would the Warriors REALLY be willing to break up the core of a multiple-title team for a possibly one-year Lebron rental? You'd have to move Klay Thompson AND Draymond Green, or some such thing. That or Lebron would have to be willing to sign for an exception or minimum. Ahhhhhh no. He's not going to give up money. Nor should he be expected to.

I disagree about the problem of players controlling their own futures though. If some 22-year-old is a brilliant programmer, does anyone say he ought not go work for Apple or Google because they already have too much talent? Do we insist he go work for some Ukrainian semilegal hacker? People deserve to have some degree of control over their own lives, including their careers. The rules in the NBA (and pro sports) are already set up in a way that would be illegal in every other industry: they have been given exceptions from antitrust laws, basically.

I also disagree that it's bad for basketball. Watching Golden State is the most fun I've had in decades. The last teams that even approached them from a fun standpoint were the early '00 Sacramento teams, which weren't anywhere near as good. And I think back to those Bulls teams of the 90s and the Lakers-Celtics rivalries of the 80s very fondly. Nobody really spends much energy complaining that the 80s weren't fair. But look at the Finals: only the Lakers, Celtics, 76ers, Pistons, and Rockets made it. Twenty Finals spots were filled by a total of five teams. The Lakers and Celtics filled 13 of those 20 spots.

And it isn't as if Golden State steamrolled its way to the title. Houston had a really decent shot this year, and both NOP and SAS each stole a game. It's just that Cleveland wasn't a very good Eastern Conference representative, Lebron notwithstanding. And he played with a broken hand. I think Boston would have won at least one, if not two, games. (And that's without their two best players.)

I think we're in a new golden (no pun intended) era of NBA basketball. The players are great, some teams are great and really good, and there aren't any massive scandals going on. Yes, the players are looking at their own "personal brands" (the most annoying, overused term on earth) and business, but it's not like the gang-culture-periphery of the 90s of coke-heads of the 80s and 70s. I'll take relatively professional, well behaved players putting on a great show night in and night out anytime.
21  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: What are you watching now?/Favourite Movie of the Moment on: June 07, 2018, 06:09:46 PM
I think with respect to the intro, keep in mind that the show was from the mid-1970s: the "cheap" look wasn't unusual for programs of that time, it was just a lower-technology time. And the theme song was one of female empowerment, which was a political issue at the time ('70s) and fit the plot of two single working women (rare in the '50s).

Re "big industrial city vibe," it was meant to be in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Which is to say that was a (somewhat) big, industrial city at the time the show portrayed, the postwar industrial era of the late '50s.
22  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: What if...? on: May 25, 2018, 06:27:15 PM
Then there would be message boards on which people got overly excited about questions like what if they hadn’t, what if it hadn’t, and what if it were.
23  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys Channel on Sirius XM on: May 25, 2018, 06:25:25 PM
It's fun, it's harmless, and it allows everyone here with satellite radio access (not everyone, but a reasonable group) to share in the songs that we love. It highlights more obscure tracks, solo work, and gives us something positive to chat about

I agree with that, too.
24  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Beach Boys Channel on Sirius XM on: May 25, 2018, 04:20:08 PM
Thanks, everybody, nice polite answers. But, I must say it doesn't thrill me as it does the others that this channel will introduce new fans to BBs & that it's "communal experience". Sure, it's good to see BBs getting exposure but it's not the thing I care about plenty like many of you. Just casually. Ultimately, Sirius isn't available here, maybe it would help to get what you exactly mean if I listened to it with my ears. As such, I shall leave you enjoying the channel & its discussion.

I actually agree with you 100% or thereabouts. (Except that obviously Sirius is available in my “here.”)
25  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / The Sandbox / Re: The What Are You Reading? Thread on: May 18, 2018, 11:39:18 AM
I think it might be unfortunate in some ways that Americans (and those from most of Canada, the UK, etc.) have had the "advantage" of much of the world learning English as the lingua franca. It's harder to convince people to learn another language when they know that many or most people outside their country already speak and understand English.

But I have to admit I'm just as lazy as the next guy: I had four years of Spanish in high school and two of Latin in college, but in both cases I've really let them slip. I am considering teaching myself koine Greek, but that's not really of much use in daily life.
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