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680601 Posts in 27601 Topics by 4068 Members - Latest Member: Dae Lims March 29, 2024, 07:10:57 AM
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26  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: What Was Motown's Best Period? on: August 11, 2017, 11:28:01 AM
I dislike Motown. Listened to famous names - boring. Is obscure artist who fans who read this thread could advise to hear?

To each their own, as they say!

If you dislike the main stars of Motown, there's certainly plenty of more obscure artists that maybe had a couple of hits before fading away.

As mentioned, Edwin Starr is good, but I forgot to mention that even some of his 70's disco hits like H-A-P-P-Y Radio and Contact are solid. His version of My Sweet Lord is also good.

The Undisputed Truth had the one hit Smiling Faces Sometimes, but did other songs too (including the ORIGINAL Papa Was a Rolling Stone).

Jimmy Ruffin has some nice music too.

Also dig deep into the catalogs of The Four Tops and Temptations, they're not obscure, but some of their later music is. They had some big flops that never scraped the Top 40 and you never hear talked about, but are still fantastic.

And of course there's a smattering of other Motown groups that had very brief periods of mild success (The Velvelettes, The Monitors, Shorty Long) that are worth hearing, if you want REALLY obscure.
27  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Entertainment Thread / Re: Favorite Comic book movies on: August 09, 2017, 11:02:27 AM
KDS - Interesting thoughts. I've always been a little critical of Nolan's Dark Knight trilogy. I've admired them at arms length, appreciated them, but never really embraced them as some of the very best comic books movies for the reasons you mentioned. I think Burton's films have the best 'atmosphere': Nicholson's Joker is perfect and is my favorite portrayal of the character, great mix of humor and sadism, Batman Returns is dark but has it's certain type of comic relief. But I can't deny it any longer, for now I feel that the TDK trilogy has the best plot and character development of the series, and overall they're more focused and have themes that stay with you after the credits roll (especially The Dark Knight). They're some of the best examples of the genre. 'Begins' is a great origin story, and 'Rises' I agree is a bit muddled but still solid.

I still feel Nolan and co. could've had more fun with the material, as you mentioned the movies are indeed relentlessly grim. I'm not saying to go 60's Batman campy, but for example, if you're into video games, I feel the Arkham series also nails the villains and style of Batman, as well as Batman: The Animated series from the 90's.

I kinda like Batman Forever, but you can see the stage being set for the terrible Batman & Robin. Tommy Lee Jones is a fantastic actor, but his portrayal is more like the Joker than Two Face and doesn't do the character justice, and Nicole Kidman's role is disposable. B&R is only enjoyable if you know it's going to be terrible and just laugh at it along the way, but I think Arnold and Uma Thurman could've done great if they had been given better written characters. They don't deserve the blame for that mess, neither does Clooney or Alicia Silverstone.

So I feel TDK films are overall the best, but I definitely don't think there's anything wrong with liking the Burton films more, as they are better in certain respects.
28  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: A little love for Mr. Love on: August 09, 2017, 10:44:07 AM

JL:

"Man, I was listening to Surfin' the other night.

How did Mike love think of the "Bom bom dit di dit dip" bass part? So creative. Really carries the tune, actually."

This predecessor came to mind (among countless other doo wop bass variations)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qq2XyiuarTw





Good catch. If you're going to be influenced, might as well be influenced by the best. That music savvy Mike Love.  Cool Guy
29  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: SIP Remaster on: August 08, 2017, 08:24:07 PM
That sounds cool. I'd listen to that.
30  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Entertainment Thread / Re: Favorite Comic book movies on: August 08, 2017, 08:19:50 PM
Batman vs. Superman was great on a weird interlectual level! 3D

Hmm. Interesting point.

I felt like it was not as bad as some people said and not as good as the makers wanted it to be. If anything deserves to be called a 'mixed bag' it's BvS. The action and effects were great, it's well cast, gets us interested in other DC characters and their future movies (not to mentioned the Justice League), and has some interesting themes. Then again, the action is a bit too loud and obnoxious (it IS a Zack Snyder film, after all), Henry Caville has some great moments but his Clark Kent portrayal is mostly dull, Batman is an idiot for his obsession to kill Superman and that plot point threatens to ruin the entire movie, the side characters aren't given much to do and the constant hints/cameos of other DC heroes are fun but don't really add to the plot of THIS movie. Then again, Wonder Woman has a huge impact in her limited screen time, Gal Gadot is perfect for the role. But this film, by itself, does nothing in terms of letting us get to know her character at all, so it feels like she's just there to be there without much character development (and to sell tickets). This is exactly why DC should've had at least 2 Superman films, a solo Affleck Batman film or two and Wonder Woman come out first, aka the Marvel route before having them team up. It just tells me that DC is just interested in making as much money as possible as quickly as possible. Which, Marvel is too, of course, but they do so with a better creative vision.

At least DC seems to have learned it's lesson: I'm in the minority in liking Suicide Squad, but Wonder Woman was undeniably good and the Justice League looks excellent, the actors are perfect, which gives me hope for future movies (The Flash, Aquaman).
31  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Entertainment Thread / Favorite Comic book movies on: August 08, 2017, 07:54:08 PM
So who loves superhero movies?! I do. I've seen so many I lost count (and that's not really an exaggeration, either). I wanted to make a Marvel superhero thread at first but then I figured DC has a lot of good ones too, and there's some other comic book/superhero films not with either company.

As for the entire genre, top-tier superhero movies for me would be:

Spider-Man 2 (2004) - The Dark Knight - Captain America: Civil War - Iron Man - Spider-Man (2002) - Superman - Batman Begins - Marvel's the Avengers - Captain America: The Winter Soldier - Doctor Strange - Captain America: The First Avenger - Guardians of the Galaxy - X-Men: First Class - The Dark Knight Rises - Superman 2: The Richard Donner Cut - Deadpool - Logan - X-Men 2: X-Men United - Wonder Woman

Middle-tier (enjoyable but not that great) would be:

Batman (1989) - Batman Returns - Ant-Man - The Amazing Spider-Man films - Spider-Man 3 - Thor and Thor: The Dark World - The Avengers: Age of Ultron - Watchmen - The Hulk - Iron Man 2 and 3 - Daredevil  - Man of Steel - Suicide Squad

And the rest range from passable to bad but I've seen them anyway:

Batman and Robin - Batman Forever - Batman vs. Superman - The Blade Series - Hulk (2003) - Elektra - Fantastic 4 Films - a host of low budget 90's films based on Marvel superheroes (Captain America, Fantastic 4, Nick Fury) that were made largely in order to keep the film rights from expiring. I'm ashamed to have watched these and they've thankfully been buried in history by other, much more respectable entries into the genre.

There's others missing, I know. I'm not as familiar with the X-Men series, I've seen the movies, but don't remember enough about them. They'd probably fit into the first and second category mostly. I also haven't seen Superman 3 and 4 save for bits and pieces. I have high hopes for future DC movies, but they've been hit and miss so far.

Any thoughts? Or have I already geeked out enough for everyone?
32  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: What Was Motown's Best Period? on: August 08, 2017, 07:30:19 PM
While I love early Motown, the later (1967 through 1975 or so) appeals to me more. There's more variety with the songs, topics wise.
For hard hitting songs, in my opinion, recordings by Stevie Wonder (Livin for the City, among many others), Edwin Starr (War), Temptations (Papa was a Rolling Stone), Supremes (Love Child), Marvin Gaye (What's Goin On and others) hold up very well even now.
Love Motown.

Good post! I agree with you, even your favorite time period of '67-75. Motown wasn't the consistent hit machine it once was in the later years, but every artist flying off in different directions made for some great music.
33  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: The Zombies Thread on: August 08, 2017, 07:26:06 PM
That's cool that you got to see Argent live. Even though you don't remember much of it, but no doubt it was cool.

I was only introduced to O&O around this time last year. lol I had only heard Time of the Season, but some guys on a music review site gave the album 5 stars (which they rarely do for any album), so I figured it must be good. And I was blown away.

I agree about the Pet Sound vibes in the album. I still feel that it falls short of PS and also Sgt. Pepper (even Revolver), but it can stack up against any of those. It's too bad they managed only one masterpiece, but I can also say that their first album (Begin Here) and The Singles A's & B's are definitely worth hearing.
34  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: A little love for Mr. Love on: August 08, 2017, 07:16:39 PM
What in the flying f*** does that have to do with the topic being discussed? Take your predictable hate speech somewhere else.

Some of us who have been pushed over the edge by his latest outrage i.e. the ill-timed, solo(!) McGrath-blemished DIA, right on the heels of the glorious Sunshine Tomorrow, are reacting to this equally ill-timed thread with a NIMBY attitude. Yes, we could just refrain from comment and let you ML deniers pat him and each other on the back ad nauseum, or we can express a dissenting opinion. That is what some of us are choosing to do, here and now. If you don't like it, lump it.

I thought this thread was supposed to highlight positive aspects of Mr. Love and his contributions to The Beach Boys, not to start a new Love bashing thread.  We have multiple threads for that - see the "does Mike Love realize he's despised by millions" thread above.  Because this thread focusses on positive things about Mike doesn't mean anyone has forgotten or forgiven his bad behavior or past transgressions or personality faults.  It's more like, we all know Mike is a **** but for something different what good things can we say about him?  C'mon, it's a fun fun fun intellectual exercise - rack your brains and come up with something.  Something nice, if you dare.

Man, I was listening to Surfin' the other night.

How did Mike love think of the "Bom bom dit di dit dip" bass part? So creative. Really carries the tune, actually.
35  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Does Mike Love realize he is despised by millions of fans? on: August 08, 2017, 04:26:39 PM
I think we need two more movies and at least three more books to really get to the bottom of things.
36  Smiley Smile Stuff / Polls / Re: Discuss Every Beach Boys Song Day By Day on: August 08, 2017, 03:45:52 PM
They should've known better, alright!

Just kidding. It's alright.

3/5
37  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Glen Campbell 1936-2017 on: August 08, 2017, 03:41:44 PM
 Cry Cry Cry
38  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: The Beatles Survivor #11: The Beatles (the White Album part 1) on: August 08, 2017, 03:18:27 PM
Mmm. Tough choice. Ringo's song is nice, but it always seemed like a low point on the album to me. Just a pleasant country song, but nothing that great. Then again, as much as I like certain parts of Piggies (the harpsichord is lovely), it's one of the songs I listen to the least on the album as well, and given how strong George's other songs are, it always seemed like a disappointment. Just too lightweight.

I'll go with Piggies
39  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: The Beatles Survivor #11: The Beatles (the White Album part 1) on: August 07, 2017, 06:37:15 PM
Wild Honey Pie also for me. It's sort of interesting, but it barely even feels like a real song. It's just so....weird, which isn't unusual for The Beatles, but it's also not very good, which is unusual for them.

40  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Does Mike Love realize he is despised by millions of fans? on: August 07, 2017, 06:18:08 PM
To hear him say it:

"For those who believe that Brian walks on water, I will always be the Antichrist." - According to Mike Love's Good Vibrations: My Life as a Beach Boy

I think he knows. And that ^^ is a pretty condescending way of putting it, too, which kinda reinforces the idea of him being viewed as the 'bad guy'. lol I personally like him but he doesn't make it easy sometimes.

What he says isn't untrue. 

But, I do think that "despised by millions" is an exaggeration. 

Good point on both counts.

I think he is probably despised by a million fans, not millions, if that's any consolation to him.
41  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / The Zombies Thread on: August 07, 2017, 06:12:44 PM
A thread to one of the best and overlooked groups of the 60's.

They are mostly know for a few hit songs, including "She's Not There", "Tell Her No" and "Time of the Season". The latter, ironically, became a hit song in 1968, long after the group had broken up in 1967. Even more ironically, the group broke up due to a lack of commercial success and intended their masterpiece, "Odessey and Oracle", to be their swan song (which it was). The album flopped, predictably, but it didn't stop Time of the Season from going to #3 on the charts a year later.

It just so happens that Odessey and Oracle (the typo in the first word was unintentional: the artist misspelled the word on the cover and the band did not have the money to have it re-done) is one of the greatest albums ever made. I've always found most of The Zombies work to be darker, a little harder edged than most, and the album mixes that with elements of psychedelia, rock, and baroque pop, with a hint of Beatles and Beach Boys harmony/production. Listen to the pop symphony sound of Care of Cell 44, especially the acapella breaks, the sad Rose for Emily, which sounds to me like a mix of 'For No One' and 'Eleanor Rigby'. Maybe After He's Gone is heartbreakingly beautiful, reminiscent of the melancholy found in some of Brian Wilson's best work. The intensely psychedelic Hung Up On a Dream, haunting Beechwood Park and the sad but surprisingly mature look at the end of a relationship in Brief Candles. The beautiful, uplifting This Will Be Our Year is also a highlight. A few tracks are simply expertly done pop, and a couple are only partially successful experiments, but overall, the Odessey and Oracle's stature as one of the great works of our time continues to grow (ranked #100 on Rolling Stone's list of the 500 greatest albums of all time).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goDxhJl1UJE

Some other songs of theirs that I enjoy:

Whenever You're Ready: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olIJsQ6LiXQ

Girl, Help Me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ug40FLvNGhk

The Way I Feel Inside: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QG1frfRywc

Rod Argent and Chris White are both excellent songwriters and instrumentalists, as Colin Blunstone is one of my favorite singers as well. I'm not overly familiar with their solo catalog but the band 'Argent' (with songwriting and production help from White) had a huge hit with 'Hold Your Head Up' and Argent went on to record some apparently good solo albums. Maybe The Zombies weren't a revolutionary band, as they tended to follow trends rather than creating their own, they were still a top notch group, one of the best ever, and deserved better than a couple of hits before disbanding.

What do you guys think? Any Zombie related thoughts?
42  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: What Was Motown's Best Period? on: August 07, 2017, 10:45:46 AM
Man, Motown was awesome! Motown's best period, that's a tough question.

Great post there, JL. We're clearly of different generations as for me Motown peaked in '66. ;=)

Lol thanks. Yeah, I've always loved Motown, the Temptations are probably my favorite group aside from The Beatles and The Beach Boys.

You really can't go wrong with any era of Motown. 1966 was a great year for the label too. Admittedly I'm not as big a fan of the late 70's-80's Motown, but there's some amazing stuff there too.
43  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thread for various insignificant questions that don't deserve their own thread! on: August 07, 2017, 10:36:49 AM
"When I look at other girls it must kill her inside

But it'd be another story if she looked at the guys...."



Maybe I'm just being dense, but what exactly is being implied with these lyrics? How would it be a 'different story'? Would it not kill him inside if she looked at other guys?

I'm not a lyrics person by any stretch of the imagination but I think the idea is that she keeps quiet (and suffers inside) when he looks at other girls but if she were to look at the guys he'd do everything but keep quiet. In fact he'd kick up a major stink. So she doesn't look at them.

They do love each other, you know.

Oh, yeah. That's what I was sorta thinking it meant, but wasn't sure at all. That makes sense. Thanks!

I love that song but those two lines had always made me pause.
44  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: What Was Motown's Best Period? on: August 07, 2017, 10:27:37 AM
Man, Motown was awesome! Motown's best period, that's a tough question.

I think the Tempts were at their best from 1967-1975. I love the early records and David Ruffin, and With A Lot O Soul is a fantastic album, but Cloud Nine and All Directions are two of their other masterpieces and came in the late 60's to early 70's. Norman Whitfield, as mention earlier, is a total genius and I could listen to his work for hours and hours. He wrote some of Motown's most iconic songs and was a true visionary: I'd argue he saved Motown with his consistently excellent work in the late 60's and early 70's. Barrett Strong was also a great lyricist.

The Four Tops were at their best from 1967-1973. Reach Out is great, as are H-D-H, but I LOVE their Frank Wilson produced work: Still Waters Run Deep and Changing Times in particular. Such a unique sound, and fascinating lyrics and production. Main Street People, their second post-Motown album, should be mentioned also even though it's not Motown. It's no surprise that he was a Whitfield protégé.

The Supremes were pretty consistent throughout, as were Smokey Robinson and the Miracles, but they too seemed to hit a stride in 1966/67. Plus, I love Edwin Starr's music from this period as well. His album '25 Miles' is quite good. My favorite songs of his are Soul City, Love Is My Destination and Funky Music Sho Nuff Turns Me On. Time is another good one.

So I'd say 1967 is when Motown probably peaked in terms of artistic AND commercial success, but a lot of their artists went on to do great (arguably their best) work in from '67 onwards and into the mid-70's. And of course I haven't even mentioned Marvin Gaye, Diana Ross, Stevie Wonder and the Jacksons, who obviously were incredibly successful in the 70's. David Ruffin and Eddie Kendricks also had some success as solo artists, especially Kendricks, or Jimmy Ruffin, who was big around the same time. So I'd say 1967-1975 is my favorite Motown period, and their best.

My top Motown songs (in no particular order, just ones I love), if I had to make a list, would be:

Mother Nature (Tempts)
I Can't Be Hurt Anymore (David Ruffin)
In These Changing Times (Four Tops)
Reflections (Supremes version or Tops version, either one)
The Agony and the Ecstasy (Smokey)
Runaway Child, Running Wild (Tempts)
Love Is My Destination (Edwin Starr)
Living for the City (Stevie Wonder)
The Onion Song (Gaye and Tami Terrell)
Love Woke Me Up This Morning (Tempts version)

Honorable mentions would be Right Before My Eyes by the Four Tops, Mercy, Mercy Me by Marvin, Tuesday Heartbreak by Wonder, Quiet Storm by Smokey. Wow, now I feel like I should've put those as my absolute favorites, and I could keep going. And this post is a lot longer than I'd thought it'd be.  LOL
45  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thread for various insignificant questions that don't deserve their own thread! on: August 07, 2017, 09:43:48 AM
"When I look at other girls it must kill her inside

But it'd be another story if she looked at the guys...."



Maybe I'm just being dense, but what exactly is being implied with these lyrics? How would it be a 'different story'? Would it not kill him inside if she looked at other guys?
46  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Does Mike Love realize he is despised by millions of fans? on: August 06, 2017, 07:40:27 PM
To hear him say it:

"For those who believe that Brian walks on water, I will always be the Antichrist." - According to Mike Love's Good Vibrations: My Life as a Beach Boy

I think he knows. And that ^^ is a pretty condescending way of putting it, too, which kinda reinforces the idea of him being viewed as the 'bad guy'. lol I personally like him but he doesn't make it easy sometimes.
47  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: A little love for Mr. Love on: August 06, 2017, 07:28:19 PM
Who again?   Roll Eyes  The cheesy 'uncle' who's always trying to 'make it' with your wife?  Shocked  I want OUT of THAT family photo.  Seems Brian sent him packing too.  There are no pics of dirty Mikey over at BW dot calm on the one  and only page dedicated to Beach Boys music.  'Lovey-dovey' is gone.  Toast.  Struck from the register.  Can't say he doesn't deserve it either.

Is THAT  enough ''love' for ya?

KDS and I like 'Kokomo' and several other later Beach Boy songs written by Mike.

What's your favorite Mike Love song? So many to choose from!  Cool Guy
48  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: A little love for Mr. Love on: August 06, 2017, 04:11:12 PM
Just watched Love and Mercy again for the first time since soon after it became available on disc.  This movie is one Brian calls a pretty accurate rendering of what really happened.

With that in mind it would lump Mikey right in there with Murry and Eugene.  3 blind idiots.  See how they ran Brian into a deep freekin' hole?  A pox on their contributions.  

Murry was a jealous wart.  Landy was lost in the clouds of illusion formed only for himself and that 'love' character was just a sniveling, whining little beeyatch.  Ya Brian plummeted...pushed over the edge and left to wallow by deaf, dumb and blind.

Is THAT enough "love" for ya?

But he could grow a heck of a beard, though, right?

They all could back in the day.  Mike's the only one rocking facial hair these days.

Yeah, well, what about those hats? Ain't nobody who rocks a hat better than the Lovester (especially ones with his name on it).

Al had some pretty boss hats in the late 70s / early 80s.

Bruce and David Marks have followed Mike's lead in recent years with wearing ballcaps.

Yup. Mike Love. Always a trendsetter, a true pioneer.  Cool Guy

And just to show that I'm not just here to be sarcastic about Mike Love, I really do enjoy 'Kokomo'. lol
49  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: A little love for Mr. Love on: August 06, 2017, 04:02:56 PM
Just watched Love and Mercy again for the first time since soon after it became available on disc.  This movie is one Brian calls a pretty accurate rendering of what really happened.

With that in mind it would lump Mikey right in there with Murry and Eugene.  3 blind idiots.  See how they ran Brian into a deep freekin' hole?  A pox on their contributions.  

Murry was a jealous wart.  Landy was lost in the clouds of illusion formed only for himself and that 'love' character was just a sniveling, whining little beeyatch.  Ya Brian plummeted...pushed over the edge and left to wallow by deaf, dumb and blind.

Is THAT enough "love" for ya?

But he could grow a heck of a beard, though, right?

They all could back in the day.  Mike's the only one rocking facial hair these days.

Yeah, well, what about those hats? Ain't nobody who rocks a hat better than the Lovester (especially ones with his name on it).
50  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: Songs you are obsessing over. on: August 06, 2017, 01:54:39 PM
Was It All Worth It from The Miracle would been a nice swan song if Innuendo didnt exist.

That's a really good point. Obviously "The Show Must Go On" ends up being similarly great in its place as the actual closer (assuming you don't count Made In Heaven as a proper finale, but a posthumous collection). But yeah, "Was It All Worth It" would have been great, too. I wonder if that was intentional. Unless I'm mistaken, Freddie knew he had AIDS before The Miracle. So maybe they were thinking that way? (I hope you don't think it's crass to consider that viewpoint. But Queen were business-savvy, legacy-savvy to some degree, and absolutely had an eye for drama. I wouldn't put it past them, and that's no insult.)

Almost makes a person hope "Summer's Gone" can become "Was It All Worth It"...

I actually don't think that's crass at all. In fact I too think that it's correct, it seems the entire group was using his illness for not only creative inspiration but also for, as you mentioned, legacy. Not to suggest they themselves were crass, lol, because of course they were sad over the situation. But Queen was one of the smartest rock groups I've ever seen in many respects and no doubt they (Freddie included) wanted to make the most of the rather dire situation.
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