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680598 Posts in 27600 Topics by 4068 Members - Latest Member: Dae Lims March 28, 2024, 06:42:16 PM
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126  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / Smiley Smilers Who Make Music / Tons of new stuff up! on: February 16, 2015, 06:52:07 PM
https://wolvez1.bandcamp.com/
127  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Intellectual Dishonesty Regarding SMiLE on: February 14, 2015, 10:03:03 AM
Out of all the Beach Boys stuff I've ever read & collected and seen online there isn't a single shred of credible coverage of SMILE as far as that project is concerned dealing with the insight and illumination & religious philosophy possible via LSD. I've never seen this stuff mentioned ever! Yet this is clearly the mind-set and goal of Brian Wilson during the SMiLE era (see Bri's quotes to Tom Nolan for proof).

Seems to me that it's high time for folks who write about SMiLE to get a clue and realize that Brian Wilson had it going on in a big way during that era. There needs to be a sensitivity to the religious acid experience applied to this art.

If you write about SMiLE and are clueless psychedelically (as I am) you need to state so (as I have) and you need to become acquainted in some way to speak on such topics (I read a lot of stuff). And in the future any point of view regarding SMiLE that is devoid of the influence & philosophy of the psychedelic experience should not be regarded as an informed view on the subject of SMiLE.
Bill - the "Intellectual Dishonesty" is a joke. The whole "myth of LSD" is rooted in "intellectual dishonesty" beginning with self-proclaimed expert Tim Leary using his undergraduate students at Harvard as a "cohort" to experiment on. It got him fired. Imagine sending your kid to Harvard, and having a "person, in a position of trust" give your kid LSD...

However,  I won't call him a "doctor" because he wasn't an MD, and the term infers a certain confidence, which he most brazenly breached, but a PhD who exploited students, inmates, and theological students.  It is a repeated attempt to give "credentials to study." He was a predator.  It was b.s. fifty years ago, and it is b.s., now.

And, I'm with Andrew.  

Ray Thomas is coming for your ass, Filledeplage, and he's pissed!


128  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Intellectual Dishonesty Regarding SMiLE on: February 13, 2015, 11:21:54 PM
Wow! You need to be commended on brass balls, at least,  for slathering yourself in honey and jumping into the bear cage ....

But here's the thing: LSD affects different people differently ..... When I used to do it in my early twenties, my acid-head friends would have all the classic experiences: strong visual hallucinations, seeing neon patterns/grids n such, while I experienced basically none of that. It was more mental with me. Like simple thoughts resonated differently and everything seemed deeper. Every stray sentence uttered took on gigantic meaning ..... I remember putting on Sgt. Pepper with headphones and feeling like FINALLY I get this album! It was like someone opened a doorway and I was able to experience the album from the inside and in candy coated technicolor .... However after putting on The Floyd's Umagumma and then SMILE (the triple colored vinyl boot) my nice trip when completely off the rails ....... Playing music (as in playing an instrument) is amazing on LSD. Repeated patterns, or "feels" as Brian calls them are pure magic, so I can see how the drug might have caused Brian's imagination to expand and how by simply playing the two "feel" chords of Heroes & Villains over and over and over and over could have set him on his course .... Lyrically, I don't so much pick up an acid influence. I mean, they certainly don't seem to be related to or about the LSD experience, though the imagery conjured up via the Surf's Up lyrics might likely be an exception .....But if Brian's compositions were LSD influenced, VDP's words certainly fit like a glove.... This is something that would probably take Brian or VDP expanding on in detail.
129  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: February 11, 2015, 08:47:47 PM
Thanks Micha.

The break was actually nice... I was able to listen to The Beach Boys and just enjoy it rather than having to rush over here and see what was going on. Also, this little exile saved me a couple months at least in data overages  Evil



130  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: February 11, 2015, 03:13:50 PM
I'm back and I would have something to add, but I'm not saying a gosh darn thing ever again for fear of the Brain Police!

Happy lurking kids Smiley

You were gone?  I thought you just changed your name

Nope, when you're sent to the cornfield here, you're gone like long pants in Bruce's wardrobe trailer .... You can't even lurk or get PM's.
131  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: February 11, 2015, 02:35:12 PM
I'm back and I would have something to add, but I'm not saying a gosh darn thing ever again for fear of the Brain Police!

Happy lurking kids Smiley
132  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 09:06:41 PM

You mean I should have just called him a fucking slimeball?


To keep repeating this, it's now been at least 6 times so far, is getting into baiting/provoking territory, and I'll repeat again it does not need to be reposted another time.


And of course you take issue with talking about it rather than any issue with the original statement itself....

Yeah, class again.
133  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 09:05:42 PM
Especially if they're perfectly capable of turning around and calling his cousin a fucking slimeball.

Ok, this has been mentioned enough times to suggest putting an end to repeating and reposting it. The point has been made, no need to keep hammering it into the ground.


If it's perfectly OK to post it in the first place, then it's perfectly OK to talk about it.

Wasn't ok in the first place, though.

But yeah, this going back and forth is getting tiresome,  and I'm *not* just talking to you, either.


People talk about mentioning that Brian created the reality that all Beach Boys are not required to be onstage at all times as some offense to class, yet everyone's just fine with someone calling Mike Love a fucking slimeball?

Yeah, our definitions of class most certainly differ.
134  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 09:01:00 PM
Hey, who do we have to thank for creating the original schism to where it's perfectly OK for all Beach Boys not to appear on stage together?

Way to keep it classy.  This is the second time you've trivialized Brian's debilitating problems, only last time you were quick to delete any evidence.  So when someone acts like an @ss publicly it is wrong to opine and call him out on it, but it's ok to criticize and blame Brian for things that were largely out of his control?  Oh that's right, as you said before (also deleted) you enjoy lashing out at Brian and his mental illness in order to get revenge on people for saying bad things about Mike.

Pinder, you are awesome.

EoL


You mean I should have just called him a fucking slimeball?

Brian's problems understood and respected: you think Mike Love doesn't have human feelings and emotions and tragedy in his history?

I'm not trivializing Brian's troubles at all. I simply pointed out that all Beach Boys not being necessary on stage at all times is a reality that was created long long ago.

Where did I say anything insulting about Brian? When did I call him anything that involved cuss words?

I did not.

As for "removing evidence" ..... You mean a poster on occasion realizing they went over the line and then edited their message ....... Wouldn't this be a good thing?

135  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:57:17 PM
Especially if they're perfectly capable of turning around and calling his cousin a fucking slimeball.

Ok, this has been mentioned enough times to suggest putting an end to repeating and reposting it. The point has been made, no need to keep hammering it into the ground.


If it's perfectly OK to post it in the first place, then it's perfectly OK to talk about it.
136  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:51:11 PM
The sarcasm was all over that post against BW's nervous breakdown.

But it isn't just Brian...it's almost all of them really. Actually, I'd go as far as to say it's all of them except Mike Love.

Alan was really the first to approach his involvement this way, of course, his was probably the most legitimate and/or honorable of all excuses.

Then David's quiet removal...Brian's breakdown...Dennis's drunken days...Carl's solo excursions.

The Beach Boys have always been a pretty faceless entity as far as live shows...EXCEPT, I think most people know that they're gonna see that nasal guy with the ball-cap front and center when they go to a concert.

So the problem occurs because people know the NAME: Brian Wilson (as they damn well should). Thus, you get the general public which I believe takes the name Brian Wilson without much or any history and associates that with the live show. However, I don't think this started at all because of C50 or the lineup changes to follow.

The Beach Boys did this to The Beach Boys from the beginning. That's it.


you put that much better than I could....

I don't think Brian requires or needs, or wants, his fans to be so overly sensitive about him that they can't withstand any mere mention of any of his problems and/or the effect they had on the band ...... Especially if they're perfectly capable of turning around and calling his cousin a fucking slimeball.
137  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:42:15 PM
Hey, who do we have to thank for creating the original schism to where it's perfectly OK for all Beach Boys not to appear on stage together?

If the circumstance for the schism is because the overly-stretched-too-thin brains of the operation wanted to take time off the road to write gorgeous songs for the group, thus funneling a bunch of super awesomeness right back into the group to make the group even better... then yeah, I'll give that schism-causer a pass.

I give him a pass too, but, ya know ..... Brian could have put his foot down and said The Boys would only tour when he was ready ......

All in all, it created the reality where ALL Beach Boys were not necessary for The Beach Boys to tour and play live.
138  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:39:07 PM
Hey, who do we have to thank for creating the original schism to where it's perfectly OK for all Beach Boys not to appear on stage together?
And that was what I meant about anti-BW posts!

How is it an anti Brian post?

Did I call him a fucking slimeball and somehow forget in the space of 10 seconds?

I point out a simple fact ..... No judgements.
139  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:36:17 PM
Hey, who do we have to thank for creating the original schism to where it's perfectly OK for all Beach Boys not to appear on stage together?
140  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:30:49 PM
If one is to consider Mike the "producer" of Endless Summer, or if he at one point stated himself as such, it probably has about as much meaning as the "executive producer" credit on TWGMTR, meaning that it's a credit that doesn't ultimately mean very much.

I'll throw a genuine bone of empathy Mike's way in that he surely was (and will probably forever be) scarred from the injustice of being denied proper co-writing credits during the 60s, and that really messed up his brain. It damaged him somehow, and I can understand that.

The fact that Mike somehow kept those feelings inside (unless one could consider other actions of his as passive aggressive venting over the real injustice) must have set off something in him to want to actively pursue and inflate credits, like the "concept album" nonsense, in the future. This is a stark contrast to Dennis Wilson's "You Are So Beautiful" crediting omission, which Dennis seemed to more casually brush off in his lifetime (although one must wonder how the official crediting for that song would have played out if Dennis had lived... would a cleaned-up Dennis at some point have tried to pursue a credit, especially at a time of financial hardships?)


I agree with you completely regarding Dennis..... It even hurts to imagine what that sort of good break could have done for him ..... Though Dennis was thrown some pretty amazing good breaks in his life, as it was ......

"concept album nonsense?" ...... See this is where there seems to be a schism between certain cabals of posters here .... Some take a silly PR fluff piece (the kind there is no shortage of in show biz) and go onto hysterics over something like "Mike Love's concept album" and then toss out their opinion on such a statement being so horrendous as basically evidence that the statement is unequivocally false ...... And then there are others who will read such a statement but then take a step back and think past their own emotional reaction and admit that, though the statement IS something of a stretch, there are still enough traces of logic to determine that reasons for getting upset over it are quite slim to none....

Mike Love has every right to call Summer In Paradise his "concept album"; it's his baby, through and through, and it was apparently written and conceived from the onset as the perfect summer record, or something to that effect.

One cannot call a greatest hits package, or what amounts to a prehistoric iTunes playlist, as a "concept album".  One cannot retroactively compile a list of pre-released (and previously re-released, and so on) songs and call it a concept album. If they could, then the random, anonymous Capitol suit who inexplicably put Frosty The Snowman on a late 60s BBs greatest hits LP should be able to proclaim himself as a concept album creator. It's absurd (even if Mike co-wrote a bunch of the old songs).

How the project went from what Capitol had assembled and had plans to release as "Greatest Hits vol. 3" into becoming a "concept album" envisioned by Mike because he suggested a different title remains a mystery to me, at least. A Greatest Hits package is a Greatest Hits package, no matter what someone labels it. That's one of the points which I'd like to see at least expanded on a little, because at this point even the premise of the statement doesn't match what the album actually was or how it was created.

I suppose someone could take a 1/2 pound of raw ground beef, garnish it, put it on a plate and advertise it for $29.99 labeling it as "steak tartare", but that doesn't change the fact that it's still a 1/2 pound of raw ground beef on a plate surrounded by garnish and people would know the difference.


I've used a tiny sliver of spare logical reasoning to explain how (not to everyone, sure) Endless Summer can be considered a concept album, but you choose to ignore it and continue with the wide-eyed exasperation tactic.

I'm sure that the vast, majority of people, music fans, if you ask them what a "concept album" is, would not think this is a term that would apply retroactively to old songs being assembled together. I mean, you can call anything anything if you really want to, but what meaning does it have? You can call a burlap sack a dress suit, and why would I have the right to question you on that?

I'm just saying that it's a big stretch to use the term, and for the term to be used would, in my estimation, be more geared toward less discriminating people who might read such a press release (ie. people who wouldn't fact-check what that album actually was/is), and would just read it and think it adds a layer of legitimacy to the person they reading about. And hell, I suppose that constitutes a large swath of the M&B crowd anyway (people who don't even really know/care about the names of the BBs onstage, past or present). It just seems like a paper-thin argument to call it a concept album, and under close examination, it feels a bit like false advertising.

Yeah, you're right. It is odd and rare and a stretch, but since someone DID call it such, then it's worth examining as such.

I remember David Gilmour referring to the "Echo's" double CD "best of" thing as something of a concept album since the songs had been partially re-edited and mixed to flow from one to another as a continuous experience.....

At the time I took it as the Floyd just being a bit leery of and generally disliking greatest hits albums, but I have come to consider the package as having something of a concept ..... I see no reason to be angry with The Floyd for this.


This is another example of something that never would have existed if Dennis or Carl were still here. I highly doubt we'd ever see a BB press release with the Mike Love Concept Album statement.

But hell, I suppose if M&B = the BBs, then Endless Summer can be Mike Love's Concept Album. I think the legitimacy level is about equal on those.


In the end it's just a silly press release.....

I tend to stay as clear as I can of such things ..... Even when I agree, PR fluffing just rubs me the wrong way most always ......
141  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:28:22 PM
If one is to consider Mike the "producer" of Endless Summer, or if he at one point stated himself as such, it probably has about as much meaning as the "executive producer" credit on TWGMTR, meaning that it's a credit that doesn't ultimately mean very much.

I'll throw a genuine bone of empathy Mike's way in that he surely was (and will probably forever be) scarred from the injustice of being denied proper co-writing credits during the 60s, and that really messed up his brain. It damaged him somehow, and I can understand that.

The fact that Mike somehow kept those feelings inside (unless one could consider other actions of his as passive aggressive venting over the real injustice) must have set off something in him to want to actively pursue and inflate credits, like the "concept album" nonsense, in the future. This is a stark contrast to Dennis Wilson's "You Are So Beautiful" crediting omission, which Dennis seemed to more casually brush off in his lifetime (although one must wonder how the official crediting for that song would have played out if Dennis had lived... would a cleaned-up Dennis at some point have tried to pursue a credit, especially at a time of financial hardships?)


I agree with you completely regarding Dennis..... It even hurts to imagine what that sort of good break could have done for him ..... Though Dennis was thrown some pretty amazing good breaks in his life, as it was ......

"concept album nonsense?" ...... See this is where there seems to be a schism between certain cabals of posters here .... Some take a silly PR fluff piece (the kind there is no shortage of in show biz) and go onto hysterics over something like "Mike Love's concept album" and then toss out their opinion on such a statement being so horrendous as basically evidence that the statement is unequivocally false ...... And then there are others who will read such a statement but then take a step back and think past their own emotional reaction and admit that, though the statement IS something of a stretch, there are still enough traces of logic to determine that reasons for getting upset over it are quite slim to none....

Mike Love has every right to call Summer In Paradise his "concept album"; it's his baby, through and through, and it was apparently written and conceived from the onset as the perfect summer record, or something to that effect.

One cannot call a greatest hits package, or what amounts to a prehistoric iTunes playlist, as a "concept album".  One cannot retroactively compile a list of pre-released (and previously re-released, and so on) songs and call it a concept album. If they could, then the random, anonymous Capitol suit who inexplicably put Frosty The Snowman on a late 60s BBs greatest hits LP should be able to proclaim himself as a concept album creator. It's absurd (even if Mike co-wrote a bunch of the old songs).

How the project went from what Capitol had assembled and had plans to release as "Greatest Hits vol. 3" into becoming a "concept album" envisioned by Mike because he suggested a different title remains a mystery to me, at least. A Greatest Hits package is a Greatest Hits package, no matter what someone labels it. That's one of the points which I'd like to see at least expanded on a little, because at this point even the premise of the statement doesn't match what the album actually was or how it was created.

I suppose someone could take a 1/2 pound of raw ground beef, garnish it, put it on a plate and advertise it for $29.99 labeling it as "steak tartare", but that doesn't change the fact that it's still a 1/2 pound of raw ground beef on a plate surrounded by garnish and people would know the difference.


I've used a tiny sliver of spare logical reasoning to explain how (not to everyone, sure) Endless Summer can be considered a concept album, but you choose to ignore it and continue with the wide-eyed exasperation tactic.

I'm sure that the vast, majority of people, music fans, if you ask them what a "concept album" is, would not think this is a term that would apply retroactively to old songs being assembled together. I mean, you can call anything anything if you really want to, but what meaning does it have? You can call a burlap sack a dress suit, and why would I have the right to question you on that?

I'm just saying that it's a big stretch to use the term, and for the term to be used would, in my estimation, be more geared toward less discriminating people who might read such a press release (ie. people who wouldn't fact-check what that album actually was/is), and would just read it and think it adds a layer of legitimacy to the person they reading about. And hell, I suppose that constitutes a large swath of the M&B crowd anyway (people who don't even really know/care about the names of the BBs onstage, past or present). It just seems like a paper-thin argument to call it a concept album, and under close examination, it feels a bit like false advertising.

Yeah, you're right. It is odd and rare and a stretch, but since someone DID call it such, then it's worth examining as such.

I remember David Gilmour referring to the "Echo's" double CD "best of" thing as something of a concept album since the songs had been partially re-edited and mixed to flow from one to another as a continuous experience.....

At the time I took it as the Floyd just being a bit leery of and generally disliking greatest hits albums, but I have come to consider the package as having something of a concept ..... I see no reason to be angry with The Floyd for this.

If there's actually some new editing/remixing, etc done, then the argument I suppose could get a tiny bit better, but it still seems cheap. And coming from The Floyd, I'd also think that's a lame claim to make, seeing as they have other, multiple truly legit from the ground up concept albums under their belt.  I never said Mike Love isn't the only guy who can make a silly claim like that. If Gilmour did it too, then I think it's near-equally as hogwash a statement. Just my opinion.

Fair enough. I can fully accept that argument Smiley
142  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:22:59 PM
Keeping going Pinder, someday you will convince somebody.....

Man, really! Haven't you been sated for one day calling Mike a fucking slimeball?

I'll bet it felt good ...... Can it be enough for now?
143  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:21:59 PM
If one is to consider Mike the "producer" of Endless Summer, or if he at one point stated himself as such, it probably has about as much meaning as the "executive producer" credit on TWGMTR, meaning that it's a credit that doesn't ultimately mean very much.

I'll throw a genuine bone of empathy Mike's way in that he surely was (and will probably forever be) scarred from the injustice of being denied proper co-writing credits during the 60s, and that really messed up his brain. It damaged him somehow, and I can understand that.

The fact that Mike somehow kept those feelings inside (unless one could consider other actions of his as passive aggressive venting over the real injustice) must have set off something in him to want to actively pursue and inflate credits, like the "concept album" nonsense, in the future. This is a stark contrast to Dennis Wilson's "You Are So Beautiful" crediting omission, which Dennis seemed to more casually brush off in his lifetime (although one must wonder how the official crediting for that song would have played out if Dennis had lived... would a cleaned-up Dennis at some point have tried to pursue a credit, especially at a time of financial hardships?)


I agree with you completely regarding Dennis..... It even hurts to imagine what that sort of good break could have done for him ..... Though Dennis was thrown some pretty amazing good breaks in his life, as it was ......

"concept album nonsense?" ...... See this is where there seems to be a schism between certain cabals of posters here .... Some take a silly PR fluff piece (the kind there is no shortage of in show biz) and go onto hysterics over something like "Mike Love's concept album" and then toss out their opinion on such a statement being so horrendous as basically evidence that the statement is unequivocally false ...... And then there are others who will read such a statement but then take a step back and think past their own emotional reaction and admit that, though the statement IS something of a stretch, there are still enough traces of logic to determine that reasons for getting upset over it are quite slim to none....

Mike Love has every right to call Summer In Paradise his "concept album"; it's his baby, through and through, and it was apparently written and conceived from the onset as the perfect summer record, or something to that effect.

One cannot call a greatest hits package, or what amounts to a prehistoric iTunes playlist, as a "concept album".  One cannot retroactively compile a list of pre-released (and previously re-released, and so on) songs and call it a concept album. If they could, then the random, anonymous Capitol suit who inexplicably put Frosty The Snowman on a late 60s BBs greatest hits LP should be able to proclaim himself as a concept album creator. It's absurd (even if Mike co-wrote a bunch of the old songs).

How the project went from what Capitol had assembled and had plans to release as "Greatest Hits vol. 3" into becoming a "concept album" envisioned by Mike because he suggested a different title remains a mystery to me, at least. A Greatest Hits package is a Greatest Hits package, no matter what someone labels it. That's one of the points which I'd like to see at least expanded on a little, because at this point even the premise of the statement doesn't match what the album actually was or how it was created.

I suppose someone could take a 1/2 pound of raw ground beef, garnish it, put it on a plate and advertise it for $29.99 labeling it as "steak tartare", but that doesn't change the fact that it's still a 1/2 pound of raw ground beef on a plate surrounded by garnish and people would know the difference.


I've used a tiny sliver of spare logical reasoning to explain how (not to everyone, sure) Endless Summer can be considered a concept album, but you choose to ignore it and continue with the wide-eyed exasperation tactic.

I'm sure that the vast, majority of people, music fans, if you ask them what a "concept album" is, would not think this is a term that would apply retroactively to old songs being assembled together. I mean, you can call anything anything if you really want to, but what meaning does it have? You can call a burlap sack a dress suit, and why would I have the right to question you on that?

I'm just saying that it's a big stretch to use the term, and for the term to be used would, in my estimation, be more geared toward less discriminating people who might read such a press release (ie. people who wouldn't fact-check what that album actually was/is), and would just read it and think it adds a layer of legitimacy to the person they reading about. And hell, I suppose that constitutes a large swath of the M&B crowd anyway (people who don't even really know/care about the names of the BBs onstage, past or present). It just seems like a paper-thin argument to call it a concept album, and under close examination, it feels a bit like false advertising.

Yeah, you're right. It is odd and rare and a stretch, but since someone DID call it such, then it's worth examining as such.

I remember David Gilmour referring to the "Echo's" double CD "best of" thing as something of a concept album since the songs had been partially re-edited and mixed to flow from one to another as a continuous experience.....

At the time I took it as the Floyd just being a bit leery of and generally disliking greatest hits albums, but I have come to consider the package as having something of a concept ..... I see no reason to be angry with The Floyd for this.
144  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:17:33 PM
Hey, I have an idea!

How about we wait till Mike's book comes about and see if he talks about Endless Summer! I can't imagine he'll make no mention of it.

That Goldmine interview is decades old, and we all know how these Beach Boys can change their tune about things!
145  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:14:03 PM
*yawn*


if you're tired, PLEASE go to sleep ......

Or head over to the "who wrote what" thread..... Plenty of opportunity to call Mike bad words over there.
146  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:08:26 PM
If one is to consider Mike the "producer" of Endless Summer, or if he at one point stated himself as such, it probably has about as much meaning as the "executive producer" credit on TWGMTR, meaning that it's a credit that doesn't ultimately mean very much.

I'll throw a genuine bone of empathy Mike's way in that he surely was (and will probably forever be) scarred from the injustice of being denied proper co-writing credits during the 60s, and that really messed up his brain. It damaged him somehow, and I can understand that.

The fact that Mike somehow kept those feelings inside (unless one could consider other actions of his as passive aggressive venting over the real injustice) must have set off something in him to want to actively pursue and inflate credits, like the "concept album" nonsense, in the future. This is a stark contrast to Dennis Wilson's "You Are So Beautiful" crediting omission, which Dennis seemed to more casually brush off in his lifetime (although one must wonder how the official crediting for that song would have played out if Dennis had lived... would a cleaned-up Dennis at some point have tried to pursue a credit, especially at a time of financial hardships?)


I agree with you completely regarding Dennis..... It even hurts to imagine what that sort of good break could have done for him ..... Though Dennis was thrown some pretty amazing good breaks in his life, as it was ......

"concept album nonsense?" ...... See this is where there seems to be a schism between certain cabals of posters here .... Some take a silly PR fluff piece (the kind there is no shortage of in show biz) and go onto hysterics over something like "Mike Love's concept album" and then toss out their opinion on such a statement being so horrendous as basically evidence that the statement is unequivocally false ...... And then there are others who will read such a statement but then take a step back and think past their own emotional reaction and admit that, though the statement IS something of a stretch, there are still enough traces of logic to determine that reasons for getting upset over it are quite slim to none....

Mike Love has every right to call Summer In Paradise his "concept album"; it's his baby, through and through, and it was apparently written and conceived from the onset as the perfect summer record, or something to that effect.

One cannot call a greatest hits package, or what amounts to a prehistoric iTunes playlist, as a "concept album".  One cannot retroactively compile a list of pre-released (and previously re-released, and so on) songs and call it a concept album. If they could, then the random, anonymous Capitol suit who inexplicably put Frosty The Snowman on a late 60s BBs greatest hits LP should be able to proclaim himself as a concept album creator. It's absurd (even if Mike co-wrote a bunch of the old songs).

How the project went from what Capitol had assembled and had plans to release as "Greatest Hits vol. 3" into becoming a "concept album" envisioned by Mike because he suggested a different title remains a mystery to me, at least. A Greatest Hits package is a Greatest Hits package, no matter what someone labels it. That's one of the points which I'd like to see at least expanded on a little, because at this point even the premise of the statement doesn't match what the album actually was or how it was created.

I suppose someone could take a 1/2 pound of raw ground beef, garnish it, put it on a plate and advertise it for $29.99 labeling it as "steak tartare", but that doesn't change the fact that it's still a 1/2 pound of raw ground beef on a plate surrounded by garnish and people would know the difference.


I've used a tiny sliver of spare logical reasoning to explain how (not to everyone, sure) Endless Summer can be considered a concept album, but you choose to ignore it and continue with the wide-eyed exasperation tactic.
147  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:05:51 PM
Quit derailing the thread, it's three pages and counting. Roll Eyes


Oops sorry! Should I get back to calling people I don't know fucking slimeballs?
148  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 08:02:25 PM

And GF, the debate about Endless Summer was not about any fact, but rather if the album could be considered a concept album or not.... but nice try.


Case in point. I asked you directly if Mike produced Endless Summer, you said this: "No..... But the title and sequencing and jacket do lend a coherence to the whole package.... The title is a good one....Who cares." Yet it was published as such: "Brian Wilson went onto a solo career, Dennis Wilson drowned and Carl Wilson died of lung cancer, but Mike Love, who produced the “Endless Summer” album in 1974"

And Mike himself said of the so-called "jacket" : "It was awful".

Who cares if something is published that doesn't agree with what you yourself said through a "no" answer? Then post 'who cares' in response to anyone on the board who steps in to correct anything, like, say, an erroneous concert date or even a news article that credits Hal Blaine for a drum track Dennis played. Since it's all "who cares" in the long run, right?

Example: Someone says "Glen Campbell played lead guitar on Help Me Rhonda", another corrects them by saying "No, Carl played lead on that song", then you can say "Who cares! The song is a good one." See how that goes over.

Case in point: It was published as such "In 1974 Mike Love’s concept album Endless Summer ignited a second generation of Beach Boys fans and stirred a tempest that rocked the music world."

Your reply to that was, quote: "The title IS the concept!", suggesting because Mike offered the title to Capitol, that means the whole album project in general was his concept, even though the songs and the greatest-hits package itself was already assembled by Capitol before Mike offered the name. And as another poster pointed out, by that logic Mike can take credit for the "concept" for Pet Sounds too because he suggested that title. Or is there a way to nuance that logic to fit however you want it to read?

Another case in point, this exchange:
Pages 1 and 2 do *not* predate Carl's passing, and if you think they do, it's simply not correct. And that can be proven. But what are you basing this on to say they come from the years before Carl passed away?

So someone in the post Carl touring Beach Boys camp SMOKES!!!!!! OMG!!!!!!! NOOOOOOOOO! ;o

Completely unrelated to what was being discussed, completely unrelated to the documents or pages in question which don't even mention this, completely unrelated to anything at all, but anyone reading this is welcome to scroll through both this thread and the previous related thread which got locked down, along with any number of others, and maybe they'll notice an M.O., a pattern, a common thread. Or maybe similar pure coincidences that have seen any number of threads spin off in wild directions and side-bar topics leading to arguments and statements which had nothing to do with what was being discussed or who was discussing them, and they might be able to pinpoint it. And it won't be hard to find, they're almost all similar to this one in subject matter and participation and they often end in shouting matches, which I have to think is the desired result. Old news, though.

 


Mr. Guitarfool ...... Sir..... I don't care what Mike said about producing the album. It's a non-issue ....

What I was speaking to was the "can Endless Summer be considered a concept album?" debate ...... and I offered my reasoning as to why my opinion is, sure it can.

You can call anything whatever you want. What rule is there that a packaging of old hits can't be considered a concept album? Who wrote that in stone? No one..... And in the case of The Beach Boys early hits and the entire Endless Summer package being something of a conceptual whole, ESPECIALLY with the title being what it is...... Yeah, it works, if you want it to..... So, in my opinion, the PR release, though silly, is a non-issue.
149  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 07:50:23 PM
If one is to consider Mike the "producer" of Endless Summer, or if he at one point stated himself as such, it probably has about as much meaning as the "executive producer" credit on TWGMTR, meaning that it's a credit that doesn't ultimately mean very much.

I'll throw a genuine bone of empathy Mike's way in that he surely was (and will probably forever be) scarred from the injustice of being denied proper co-writing credits during the 60s, and that really messed up his brain. It damaged him somehow, and I can understand that.

The fact that Mike somehow kept those feelings inside (unless one could consider other actions of his as passive aggressive venting over the real injustice) must have set off something in him to want to actively pursue and inflate credits, like the "concept album" nonsense, in the future. This is a stark contrast to Dennis Wilson's "You Are So Beautiful" crediting omission, which Dennis seemed to more casually brush off in his lifetime (although one must wonder how the official crediting for that song would have played out if Dennis had lived... would a cleaned-up Dennis at some point have tried to pursue a credit, especially at a time of financial hardships?)


I agree with you completely regarding Dennis..... It even hurts to imagine what that sort of good break could have done for him ..... Though Dennis was thrown some pretty amazing good breaks in his life, as it was ......

"concept album nonsense?" ...... See this is where there seems to be a schism between certain cabals of posters here .... Some take a silly PR fluff piece (the kind there is no shortage of in show biz) and go onto hysterics over something like "Mike Love's concept album" and then toss out their opinion on such a statement being so horrendous as basically evidence that the statement is unequivocally false ...... And then there are others who will read such a statement but then take a step back and think past their own emotional reaction and admit that, though the statement IS something of a stretch, there are still enough traces of logic to determine that reasons for getting upset over it are quite slim to none....

The idea that the "did Mike produce Endless Summer?" debate is a tale of one team standing on the side of hard facts and hard facts only, and another side grasping at the straws of opinion is false ...... The question "did Mike produce Endless Summer?" was put out there as if the obvious "No" answer would somehow settle something that the facts themselves would prove ..... Again, false .... The question was put out there to support an opinion and to somehow nullify further discussion...... A tactic seen at play often around here .... I presented logical reasoning to where the mere title offered by Mike somehow encapsulated the entire Endless Summer package into something of a (loose loose loose) concept album, aided by some clever sequencing ..... only to be ignored, and the tactical question repeated ...... as another tactic ....... Frustrating and silly.....
150  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike and Bruce Tour 2015 on: December 08, 2014, 07:32:50 PM
Yeah, yeah! It's OK to call Mike Love a fucking slimeball because knuckle draggers all over the internet do it!

"Knuckle dragger". Isn't that a derogatory racist term directed toward African Americans? Last time I checked it was.

To me, that's much worse than calling somebody a fucking slimeball.  Tongue

Um, no, it is not ...... It's a term to describe less intellectually evolved people ....... in other words ..... idiots....

If it is used as a racist term, I was not aware, and therefore apologize for my ignorance .....

..... Now, what about the point I made?
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