Happy Birthday David Marks!!

The liner notes say that Carl sang on everything except “Long Tall Texan.”

Wow that’s awesome

Just the thought that Brian wanted to get it as a gift for Melinda is sweet and romantic. But I understand why she wouldn't have wanted a vintage car, they are lots of work and if not properly cared for become a giant decaying money pit.

Has Brian ever owned a vintage car? As in a car that in its day was an antique of some sort? I believe Dennis and Mike both did

...Ole Betsy?

She was born in ‘32...

According to one user’s post in the Sail On FB group, the M&B Wallingford, CT show has been rescheduled to April 17, 2021.

This might be a stupid question, but has anyone ever thought about asking Mike? Didn’t he do this live in 2015? Or maybe there’s a clip from 2015 that’ll help because there can’t be too many effects live, unless the mix and quality get in the way.

Bruce's keyboard is on. It may be quiet in the mix most of the time, or not be in the audiences mix, but Bruce will have his own monitor where he may hear it.

Even then, it's audible on Disney Girls and I'm sure people in the past have said it's audible on other songs, but I cba to trawl the forums for them.

Supposedly he’s also audible on Darlin, GV, and BTTYS since John Cowsill moved from keys to drums in late 2007.

A couple quick kinda related but still somewhat off-topic questions:

1. I haven’t listened to these three yet, but it was discussed earlier in this thread that at least three (obviously more but I’m curious about these) were rejected from MiC by one or more members of BRI: Thank Him, My Solution, and Carry Me Home. While I definitely understand as I know the lyrical content of Carry Me Home, what was wrong with the other two?

2. Other than Let Him Run Wild (plus the three above and probably Stevie), has there been anything else that Brian’s vetoed?

As the official BRI consultant, I was asked my opinion throughout and consulted with brains and heart.
I got the box green-lit by the label.
I saved it from dying on the vine TWICE.

Howie your wordplay makes Van Dyke Parks look like a grade-schooler - impressed with what you've done there.

How is this "wordplay"?
Who else is coming here and telling you about this box set and being as straight as possible?

We all appreciate your work, Howie. Thank you for the time you’ve put into the project. I interpreted the above comment as a compliment - dying on the vine is some nice writing.

Many happies, ASL. No doubt it will be a modest celebration in these strange times. Something sticky to start the day, perhaps, and a glass or two of some beverage to finish it off.

Go well, sir.

Yes 100% to it, ASL will enjoy the birthday tea, perhaps green tea with chocolate cake.
Everybody likes tea. It unites people.

While digging through the board, I just realized I never reponded to this months ago. Thank you both for the well wishes!!

That is indeed one of his best contributions to the BB's catalogue, together with Disney Girls and... ah... let's see, what else...

Personally I love "Deirdre."

Me too.

I use a couple of combinations. In the car, I use SiriusXM, Spotify, and/or CD’s. At home, I use Spotify, videos on YouTube (rare performances or songs that aren’t on Spotify), CD’s, and records. I need to use my records and CD’s more as currently (at home) I typically use them to play through a full album occasionally. My vinyl setup is really nice, so I’m determined to shift a little more away from Spotify to it.

Unbelieveably, two new confirmed dates for M&B:

July 30 -- Springfield, MO -- Ozark Empire Fair (face masks required)
Aug. 21 -- Cedar Rapids, IA -- McGrath Amphitheatre

Even holding a fair right now seems pretty darn risky to me, let alone playing one. Too many people together in one area, no matter how many precautions you take or require. (And no, I'm not going to Disney World anytime soon.)

Just some perspective on this: If I were to travel from my state to see either of these two shows, my state's health department recommends I quarantine for 14 days after I return home. Missouri and Iowa are among the 20 states currently on the "hot list".

Off-topic, but my state has 42 states on the hot list, of course including these two.

Does Dennis participate in this song in any way?

Yes, Dennis sings on it according to c-man and the new ESQ.

I've mentioned this to Craig, and I don't think he's there. There are 5 vocal parts on those tracks and none are unique to Dennis, so unless he's in unison with Al or Mike (and I don't hear that being the case, those two are pretty weak in the blend) I'm pretty sure it's everyone but him. There's no tracksheet evidence for who is or isn't singing on the backing vocals beyond listening. Hopefully a vocals-only mix in the near future'll clear it up.

Edit: Far as I can tell, Brian's singing a high 'oooo', Al has a 'do-do-do-do' scat part harmonising above the guitar riff, Carl's got his mystery line, Bruce is singing the 'all I wanna do' refrain, and Mike is singing those same words beneath him with a different rhythm.

Extra edit: Isolated it a bit and now I'm starting to think Carl sings "if you get lonely in the night I'd wanna be with you [pause] oh"...? Full melody is virtually the same as "sure as the sun will come around again to start off another day."

Thanks Salty for the info. I’ll have to look at this when I listen again now that you’ve broken it down for us.

Does Dennis participate in this song in any way?

Yes, Dennis sings on it according to c-man and the new ESQ.

It might be the Mandela effect, but I swear I remember reading it being part of a comp of the same name along with different mixes of some tracks, in Andrew Doe's book. Course I no longer have it so I can't double check.

I’m going to guess Mandela because both versions of this set had different mixes/versions for various songs. Could that be what you’re thinking of, Billy C?

Packaging delays are not what's holding this up.

So what is?

The obvious implication is that there is the usual internal wrangling going on. Look Mike just sign off on the damn thing - the fact that you don't have as many songwriting credits as you were given earlier on in your career cannot be changed. Also, no good holding out for liner notes that cast you in a better light.

Wouldn’t Brian, Al, and Carl’s sons have a BRI voting majority here though?

Well we now know that he’s on Slip on Through and Got to Know the Woman, and both are overdubs. I think Jon Stebbins confirmed that he and John Hanlon (or maybe Alan Boyd) heard an isolated rhythm guitar part on a Dobro that they were convinced was played by Dennis on one of the POB & Bambu songs or outtakes.

There's no guitar on GTKTW played by Dennis, but I think it's been said that he played the unused Leslie'd rhythm part on Slip on Through that can be heard in bootleg mixes. The only parts audible on the finished song are Carl and Jack Conrad.

So the parts mentioned in the new ESQ weren’t mixed into the masters for both songs?

Well we now know that he’s on Slip on Through and Got to Know the Woman, and both are overdubs. I think Jon Stebbins confirmed that he and John Hanlon (or maybe Alan Boyd) heard an isolated rhythm guitar part on a Dobro that they were convinced was played by Dennis on one of the POB & Bambu songs or outtakes.

The problem is, once we "publish" info, additional info, insight, corrections, or additions eventually materialize, rendering the original version obsolete. A website is easy to update, but once something is out there in a book, it tends to stay out there, even if it's now deemed incorrect or incomplete. You could a second or third addition, but obviously that takes time (like years), and would a publisher be willing to do that? Maybe not. Brad Elliott encountered this problem shortly after the publication of his milestone tome, "Surf's Up - The Beach Boys On Record, 1961-1981". But he found an outlet to publish the corrections and additions, via a regular column in the "Add Some Music" fanzine.

Does that mean you’d be interested in eventually updating your website with more information?

EDIT: I’d hate to repeatedly annoy you with this; it’s just something that I (and hopefully a lot of others) would be really looking forward too.

These didn't used to be mislabeled but somehow were messed up over the last year or two. I could find no apparent way to notify Spotify.

Thanks for looking and taking the time. 

Happy Belated Birthday to Brian!!

oh wow.. that was fast.  thank you.

is there any place online with this kind of info or do we just ask here and cross the fingers?

i see this info isn't included in liner notes.

I try to take whatever I can from here, ESQ issues, c-man’s website, etc and post it to Wikipedia. There are a couple of editors there determined to remove it though. (I also have been saving as much of it as I can find on my iPad too.)

Do we know any more about who played on this track?

Drums, bass, banjo?

Jim Gordon, Lyle Ritz, Al Vescovo

Interesting. I was hoping Al (Jardine) would have played banjo on this. Was this recorded in the home studio?

Anyone ever hear why Breakaway was not on Sunflower?

Because it had already been released by Capitol?

This raises an interesting point - Brother retained the rights to the albums Pet Sounds and following, but what about the singles which did not appear on an album in those '66 to '69 years?

The only single that didn’t appear on an album between 1966 and 1969 was break away. And I don’t believe that they regained the rights to their 1966-69 catalog by July 1970 when the first album for Warner Bros. was finally assembled. and if I am completely wrong on this, I apologize. But I think another reason that Break Away never appeared on an official album was because of the fact that it did so poorly on the charts. Also, it could be that so much time had passed that they refused to put an old song that had already been released on a new album. Obviously, especially with their late 70s catalog, they freely stole from their own archives of the early 70s material, but they never put any previously released tracks on a new album several years later, with the exception of Susie Cincinnati

Since 'Breakaway" wasn't on an album, Capitol retained the rights to it (and to "Celebrate The News", and to the single version of "Cotton Fields"). That's why Capitol was able to include "Break Away" on Spirit Of America six years later.

I just wonder why Cotton Fields wasn’t on Sunflower over either At My Window or Our Sweet Love? It has really every member prominently except Al. Hell, Bruce has two songs (three, if you count At My Window). Al has three co-writing credits (modifying It’s About Time (and guitar) plus AMW and OSL and partial lead on Add Some Music. But the record feels absent of Al. Other than that, the album’s pretty much perfect.

Because Reprise didn't own the rights to "Cotton Fields", Capitol did. Al produced that version in August specifically for release as a single, and the band didn't sign with Warner-Reprise until November. Overseas, EMI Stateside was able to put it on Sunflower because they owned the rights to that album (and the next one).

Thanks c-man. Didn’t realize that Cotton Fields was a Capitol single; I assumed Break Away was the last Capitol single and Cotton Fields was the first Reprise single.

I just wonder why Cotton Fields wasn’t on Sunflower over either At My Window or Our Sweet Love? It has really every member prominently except Al. Hell, Bruce has two songs (three, if you count At My Window). Al has three co-writing credits (modifying It’s About Time (and guitar) plus AMW and OSL and partial lead on Add Some Music. But the record feels absent of Al. Other than that, the album’s pretty much perfect.

Hi everyone, I just noticed this while scrolling through Spotify. I’m assuming the only way this would be fixed is if someone from BRI or Capitol intervened and put the correct titles in?

EDIT: Sorry if there may already be a thread about this.

I think the trajectory for the Boys continues relatively the same as it did go down.

Blondie and Rickey definitely added some spice, and their songs were good contributions for sure. But I don't count them as such a force internally and politically (band-wise) to have much of power to swing things in a direction. Do we really think they were given 'voting rights' to the inner band politics? No way.

They WERE Beach Boys at the time, but I doubt they had much power. Essentially, glorified backing band members.

Do you really think that they'd have kept both of them into the 90's? 2000's? I think from the start they were going to be used and dropped. I'm sure they knew that, too.

Ricky could have stayed until Carl died, especially after losing Dennis in 1983 assuming that still happens. Was there ever a debate about what to do after Dennis died, as in possibly bringing back Ricky?

They already had Kowalski filling in for Dennis half the time anyway, keeping him on was probably their easiest option.

Bobby was back in the band too, by that point. As Mike stated in the Boys' press conference following Dennis' passing, they were touring with two excellent drummers and were quite well-equipped for performances. Plus, I doubt Ricky would've been willing to join the BBs' travelling nostagia act at that point, given I believe he'd been playing with Bonnie Raitt by then, and I think he was producing other acts in Australia around that time?

Agreed, I never thought it was likely, but it seemed like the only option (pre-C50) of course if Ricky did return. Back to the Kowalski vs Figueroa debate, is there a reason that Carl didn’t intervene when the two drummer situation finally fell apart around 1988? Was he already caring less with “Kokomo” around the corner?