One thing I feel strongly about, though I have no proof obviously, is that had Smile been released in Dec'66/Jan'67, there's no way it would have been an out and out "flop".  I cannot accept that at that time, with the attention it would have recieved, songs like Cabin Essence and Surf's Up would have been ignored or been recieved with a "so what?", "big deal", "that sucks", "it's too weird".  attitude.  No way.   Maybe some of their audience would have departed, but I think it might have brought in a whole new audience to replace them.

But (my apologies) this is a thread about afterwards....perhaps he and Van would have continued working together, be it Beach Boys related or outside projects?   Who knows, the possibilities are endless.

I don't find the age appropriate thing an issue. To this day all four sing mostly non-age appropriate stuff on stage most of every year. What is the difference whether it is a new song or old song? It is still 69 & 70 year old men performing those songs. I don't really want to hear them singing about age appropriate things such as constipation, taking Geritol, prostate examinations, playing bocci ball and shuffle board, etc.. Know what I mean?

Well, as I said, I ddn't think I was expressing my thoughts very well,  however - do you really think I was meaning to say they should sing songs about Geritol, prostate examinations, shuffle board and constipation???   

I'm interested OneEar as to what you consider as "classy"? I hope it is something like Imagination, because I think that will be what it comes closest to. I'll be happy if it is just halfway decent.

I mean something age appropriate, not more of the same "we're 70 but we're talkin' 16" kind of thing, something just true, honest, "them", something that isn't about the "image" as much as the music and who they really are in relation to it (not expressing myself well, but anyway...) - I just think they could do something that would be awesome, even at their age, etc.  I want to hear these old friends get around a microphone and sing - as Murry would say - from their hearts.

I don't think trumpeting your purposeful ignorance of a band's catalog is really a good idea on a board devoted to that group.

I don't think it's about trumpeting ones ignorance.  It's just a question, which essentially is asking, "have you actually really listened to everything the band has put out or are there periods/albums that you have passed on."   One can be a fan of a band/performer and still not enjoy and/or choose not to take part in the purchase and listening of certain releases.   With the Beach Boys for me it was LA.  I heard certain songs after that upon their initial release - Keepin' The Summer Alive, Getcha Back, Still Cruisin', Kokomo (for example), but none of them particularly made me want to go buy the album.  Some of them in fact made me afraid to buy the album.   A lot of people liked those songs though, and some people bought the albums and I'm guessing enjoyed them.  Kokomo as a song was obviously a huge hit - many people loved that song.  I'm glad they enjoyed it, and in all honesty, it is a good pop song, just something about it makes me want to throw up (but that's my problem). 
I have been crossing my fingers that should they actually do a reunion album they will come out with something really classy, something that will cap off their career in a beautiful way.   I want this as much for them as I do for myself as a fan.

"Fresh zen air"? really? Not to sound like Mike, but what does that even mean? I don't know what the exact lyric is, but I don't believe for a second it's "fresh zen air" Your mind's playing tricks on you because you want to hear deeper meaning in a 30 second song about waking up, enjoying the day and having breakfast.

 

if it were "fresh zen air" there'd be more of a pause after "fresh" because you have to articulate the z in zen coming after the "zj" in fresh (freszj).

Who says you have to articulate that? 
To my ears I hear very clearly what I hear without any pause whatsoever and it's just fine and dandy. 
You "freshen", freshnin'" et al folks though, rock on with your own ears and just enjoy the music.   It's simply a matter of different interpretations, and somehow I don't think Van or Brian would be "horrified" by that at all.  It's Smile - it's your own trip.

This issue was settled for me when it was pointed out -- a year or so ago -- that agriculture can also be written as agri-culture, creating another Vege-Tables style pun.

Very Van Dyke, and very on point (i.e., the fact that European settlers' culture was displacing the Native American culture).

And "agri-culture" is how i always thought it to be - though absolutely could be mistaken about that, but I still think it's a better line.   To me the pun there in was that of being in great shape of the culture of the times, the then, the youth movement of that sixties generation, the enlightenment and revolution of peace and love that a lot of young people back then (or so I have gathered) really believed to be imminent.   I have never took the old west, americana, birth of a nation, "trip across amerrican", etc as simply being purely a literal thing in these songs - it's seemed more to me that they were using that as a mirror for current times, making a statement about their generation via a surreal history lesson.  
And I'm not saying any of this was the original intention of the creators or any other such thing - because I don't know that, but just that this is how I personally take it as a listener.

"Fresh zen air" makes sense to me. I guess it's all how you interpret the lyrics. For instance, 'over and over the crow cries uncover the cornfield' or 'she knew how to gather the forest' - it can all be meant in different ways - and we all perceive it in different ways. VDPs wasn't out to write literal lyrics, he was writing poetry - mixed words that would evoke emotion.

With that said:

"Fresh zen air around my head" - Zen is derived from a word that means 'meditate' - so feeling meditative around (or in) ones head makes perfect sense - especially if the person is in great shape (being in good shape is a centerpiece for being at peace with oneself).
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It's totally "fresh ZEN air", to my ears at least, never heard it as anything else.  IMO it's a way better line than "freshen air" or "freshnin' air"  or "freshman year" or whatever others are hearing it as.  The BWPS "fresh clean air" is okay, but I still prefer the zen air - I just like it. 
I also always heard the other line as "agri- CULTURE", and I'll always prefer that to "upper country."  That's just me though, you're all free to hear whatever you want and enjoy it thusly.   

I don't know anything about genius really.  Everyone is a genius and an imbecile - all of us belive it or not, or at the very least I believe we all have the potential there inside.  Everyone is, if you will, a dumb angel.   I see flashes of "genius" all the time in people (and yes, even sometimes in myself), but it rarely is something that lasts.   How many geniuses remain geniuses?  Does a moment of genius make someone a genius for the rest of their life?  Really all depends on who's looking at it and from what perspective I suppose.
Undoubtedly Brian Wilson was operating on a level  (for many years, not just 66/67) that one could call genius-like, brilliant, or any number of other labels.   How much of his position, timing, being in the moment had a hand in eliciting his genius/brilliance/et al?   I think one of the biggest things about this whole genius thing is that, essentially, the people who seem to have/have had true "genius"  are those that take a step way out of the box and create something new - whether they do so in music, film, science, or whatever.  They reach for something completely different.  Through history there have been many of these people in all fields and endeavors.  During the sixties Brian was one of them.   
That's simply a fact with or without Smile.  Had they been able to comlete the album back then this fact might be clearer to more people is all.

That sculpture that is pictured with the "Goodbye Surfing, Hello God" article, you know, the one with a paper mache likeness of Brian's head on top of a "modified" guitar body - where is that?  Who has that?  Does it still exist? 

Who has the Anderle painting?  is it possible to get a print of that?

Why is there air? 

i simply love bill tobelman.   

Heck no.  When it comes to Smile I'd say shuffling is part of the fun.

 This made me think there might be an element of actual truth in that.  Just maybe though.

More than that.  

Well, yes, but I was being cautious in how I stated this because I didn't want to be jumped on and accused of disseminating false information as the truth.  
I would love to hear this though, just to hear what it might have sounded like with Dennis on lead...ah well.  There was also, according to the book, a vocal session for Carl's Tune X that hasn't been located.  I really like this tune and it would be so cool to hear what they might have been doing vocal wise for it.   Any of this missing stuff would be cool to hear of course, though it's likely we never will at this point,.  I tend to agree with others who have stated that it is more likely tapes were lost or erased rather than  stolen or whatever, but who knows.

the vocal session for Look, and the book mentions a vocal take for GV early on that had (or so i interpreted them as saying) Dennis singing the lead.  That one caught my eye because I'd heard somewhere that he was supposed to have sung the lead originally, but was unable to when the day came.   This made me think there might be an element of actual truth in that.  Just maybe though.

I love "Dumb Angel" as a title, and i agree somewhat better suited to this music (imo) than "Smile".  "Smile" could have been the title of their next album, released in the Summer of Love just prior to their headlining gig at the Monterey International Pop Festival.   

I'd also be interested in a comprehensive list of evrything known for certain to have gone missing.  An exhaustive search has been done, I am assuming, for missing/stolen/lost tapes.  Some things were found (I guess), others were discovered, but what's been missing and remains so?  I can think of a few off the top of my head,  the book with the box mentions of few. 

I love me some Friends

Am I a bad person for singing the chorus of Kiss's "I Was Made For Lovin' You" to the bass line of DYLW?

Actually, there is also a part in the TSS H&V sessions where Brian, or someone, is playing a riff on the piano - and it is exactly the riff from "I Was made For Lovin' You" by Kiss.   I started singing that along to it and had me a big ol' laugh fest for several minutes.   

EDIT: Actually have come to feel the listing as was/is on the original album slick (tentative, though it may have been) is absolutely perfect.  I'm quite certain I may be the only person to hold this opinion, but that's okay. 

(Prayer)
Do You Like Worms
Wind Chimes
Heroes And Villains
Surf's Up
Good Vibrations
Cabin Essence

Wonderful
I'm In Great Shape
Child Is Father of The Man
The Elements
Vega-Tables
The Old Master Painter

For anyone who might have an interest in checking my crap out.   Transferring from tape to digital has been cool, though challenging soundwise as some of these recordings are as old as 20 + years.    It's been fun though. 


http://www.youtube.com/user/phippsicle#grid/user/0AA8640D938D74A0

i see, thanks for the help.  i'm excited to try this.

you mean the input levels into audacity?  make sure they are not too far into the red? 

i recently downloaded audacity - if i ran a line from the phones jack on my tape player and put the other end into the mic jack of my computer, would i then be able to transfer the recording on the casette into audacity?

thanks for any help.

Waiting for it to arrive (ahould be today), went out to f.y.e music store (the only music shop in this town), there was one copy of the 2 cd release, no box sets and no promotion at all on display.  The 2 cd was hidden behind the few other BB's cd's there.  I moved it to the front.